He's Not as Smart as He Thinks

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  • Posted By: oceancalls @ 01/27/2008 12:45:31 PM

    I must be one of the many women of my generation (58 yrs old) who think men are idiots - they may be more dishonest, self-serving and conniving, but not smarter.

    • Posted By: techjunkie @ 01/27/2008 2:24:54 PM

      Age has made you angry but not wise.

    • Posted By: techjunkie @ 01/27/2008 2:24:51 PM

      Age has made you angry but not wise.

    • Posted By: Maria57 @ 01/27/2008 1:37:59 PM

      your forgot self-rightious, dominating, con-artist, etc. i dont want to bash men cause we do need them from time to time.

  • Posted By: alankent64 @ 01/26/2008 5:08:14 PM

    women actually view men as FOOD ie the body and blood of christ....here is another ..her MAJESTYS SECRET SERVICE ....OO7 that means asleep its all a sort of psychological mind game played out with so called womens wisdom in modern terms telepathy just ask some gay guys about it for some strange reason a high percentge of them are telepaths .......sound waky sound off in left field HA IF YOU ONLY KNEW ..............thats why they are called the fairer sex the old term for telepathy is radio fair from the rune symbol rado.......the ego of men HA try the ego of women who actually think they are the CREATOR GOD

  • Posted By: techresmgt @ 01/26/2008 4:54:28 PM

    The women are loving this, no? That illustrates one very important point. They just love to bash men every chance they get, substantiated or not. This so-called study proves nothing. There are as many women that think they are smarter than they really are, so what is the point? Women are just as capable of sexist behavior towards men, except they think it is somehow justified and makes them heroes. It only makes them sexist. People are people and intelligence in humans exists on a sliding scale. Women that claim they were somehow "forced to act stupid" only show their stupidity and weakness. Nobody forces anyone to do anything against their will, women have been shoving this idea down men's throats for the last thirty or forty years. "It's our bodies and we will do with them as we see fit", is the battle-whine. In those days, the battle whine was "we don't want to be viewed as sex objects, we want to be respected for our minds". Pu-lease. Look at the way many women generally act and dress themselves these days; sex objects to the MAX, and now manipulate weak men to capitalize on it. Women love to be viewed as sex objects, but claim they don't; in order to appear chaste and pure. It took me a long time to do it, but I finally figured out women; it is NOT rocket science guys, they play on what they view as our weaknesses. When they don't get their way, they cry. When crying does not work, they play victim and act out in other ways. This does not make men or women smarter or dumber when compared to one another. The comments that "women risk abuse" for showing their smartness? Maybe that is not the issue; you are probably with the wrong partner. Anyone that brags about their money or their intelligence, usually lack both. This article is as much about sexism in our society as it is about intelligence; or the lack thereof.

  • Posted By: globalexec @ 01/25/2008 5:30:02 PM

    Time magazine published some 35 or so greatest inventions of the last century. There was only one woman. Case closed. (author was a female)

    • Posted By: enoughalready @ 01/25/2008 5:46:27 PM

      Sorry, case not closed. There were many inventions created and submitted by women which never saw the light of day because a bunch of cowardly male gatekeepers were afraid to be shown up by women, so these findings never saw the light of day. Even Einstein gave the bulk of credit for his scientific findings to his wife. As did many of the great male scientific minds. Look, guys, I'll admit, I feel "empowered" when my woman makes me feel big and strong ans brilliant, but even I know that the truth is the truth, whether it is brought to light by a woman or a man. In my ever so humble opinion, both men and women are stupid when we waste our time on this sexist crap when we should be trying to educate ourselves to solve world problems. Get over it!!!!

      • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 4:03:57 PM

        Not to mention those that were stolen, either with or without consent (some women would consent because they thought the invention should at least see the light of day).

    • Posted By: littlelawyergirl @ 01/25/2008 5:51:59 PM

      This author, also female, feels embarrased by globalexec's jump to a conclusion and pronouncement of "Case Closed." Intelligence is but one of the circumstances, resources and events that lead to an important invention. Another is the confidence to pitch the idea to get the money to develop it. It takes a grand ego to convince people to invest millions of dollars in a new product. In my own legal career, I have been shocked to see that the amount of money invested in products that never pan out. Then I meet the man behind the failed idea, and he (always he) will be ultra-charismatic, hyperbolic and egotistically grandios. He will also already be getting more money from someone else. Even tough I have a genius IQ, I am not a pitch man, and I would never be able to raise the funds to develop a major invention. (Unless I hired a pitchman). BTW, did you see Gene Simmons on the Celebrity Apprentice-he is an ilustration of my point.

  • Posted By: whatev @ 01/25/2008 7:41:58 PM

    And why isn't this study and article title - SHES not as DUMB as SHE thinks. can you see the bias of the article right in the title.

    • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 3:40:55 PM

      Interesting point. There is the premise that men are the default when it comes to talking about people, and what THEY think is more important. Thanks for pointing that out. I think the title should be what you came up with.

  • Posted By: grammasusan @ 01/25/2008 11:59:50 PM

    What I remember most about the Larry Summers incident was one female participant saying she had to leave the room lest she lose conciousness. As a woman I felt demeaned by HER reaction. Within 24 hours I received phone video of a woman being stoned in Tehran. My first reaction on viewing the video was perhaps we should send that whining crybaby to Tehran so she can really take a stand for women.

    • Posted By: desigrrl @ 01/26/2008 12:20:26 AM

      or perhaps Larry Summers needs to go to such a stoning to see what odds women are against.

      • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 3:34:00 PM

        Exactly! Women sometimes risk their lives or at least are abused if they show they are smart. I had that happen when I was younger - being threatened for showing smart I was and that I could figure things out. That was here in the good 'ol USA too, about 30 years ago.

        I learned quickly that it could be harmful to my health to show my brains.

      • Posted By: ombrahma @ 01/26/2008 3:05:07 PM

        Desigirrrl, I second it.

  • Posted By: techjunkie @ 01/26/2008 3:28:46 PM

    More fodder for the male bashers and many of you guys (girls) eat it up with vigor. Look at the posts and the hostility towards men. Many of you with that tone are hateful, sexist and risk the relationships with your fathers brothers and husbands if you persist. How can you complaint about sexism and participate in it at the same time? Just say no to male bashing even if our culture currently encourages it.

  • Posted By: techjunkie @ 01/26/2008 3:26:40 PM

    More fodder for the male bashers and you guys (girls) eat it up with vigor. Look at the posts and the hostility towards men. Many of you with that tone are hatefull, sexist and risk the relationships with your fathers brothers and husbands if you persist. Just say no to male bashing even if our culture currently encourages it.

  • Posted By: ombrahma @ 01/26/2008 3:16:13 PM

    Comment: The Hindu Pundits of India had known thousands of years ago the current research that you have reported. Therefore, every form of women is worshipped as a diety in Hinduism. A woman can use her superior emotional strength (and emotional IQ) combined with superior intellectual IQ to punch a devastating hole in men's peace of mind, mostly by the dreaded silent treatment. It stirs up all the male insecurities. During that period, a man feels women are so invincible, mighty and powerful. The men feel helpless, which inspired men to depict a woman as Kali (please view it by googling it), a diety they worship. Women in India behave like Goddesses. They enjoy the labor of their men while staying behind at home, and controlling every aspect of the family and social life. Those who did not grow up in India think that women in India are helpless. What do they know?

  • Posted By: ombrahma @ 01/26/2008 3:11:47 PM

    Comment: The Hindu Pundits of subcontinent of India had known thousands of years ago the current research that you have reported. The intellectual and emontional superiority of women was indisputable. Therefore, every form of women is worshipped as a diety in Hinduism. A woman can use her superior emotional strength (and emotional IQ) combined with superior intellectual IQ to punch a devastating hole in men's peace of mind, mostly by the dreaded silent treatment. It stirs up all the male insecurities. During that period, a man feels women are invincible, mighty and powerful. The men feel helpless, which inspired men to depict a woman as Kali (please view it by googling it), a diety they worship. Women in India behave like Goddesses. They enjoy the labor of their men while staying behind at home, and controlling every aspect of the family and social life. Those who did not grow up in India think that women in India are helpless. What do they know?

  • Posted By: wanderer @ 01/26/2008 2:26:23 AM

    The blatant and overt misandry in the title and presentation of the article aside, how do we use this? The IQ bell curve does exist, contrary to the previous post, regardless of how we try to manipulate it, the top end of the bell curve has more males- across all ethnicities, including asians. What I am more concerned about is that too many young students, primarily boys, who test from the top to the bottom of this bell curve are withdrawing and becoming disaffected to the education system en masse. The greatest disengagement is disproportionately dictated by race and income. So many posts here citing past discrimination and patriarchal attitudes holding women back turn around and endorse the same treatment towards the male posters. We are complaining about how myths about IQ create a stereotype about us poor women, yet to read the posts- they are rife with sexist, anti-male stereotypes- just like the title of the article- ahh hypocritical. I am ultimately less concerned about IQ, and more concerned about how to change the education system that is not failing girl's IQ and self-esteem, it is failing boy's IQ and self-esteem. I wonder how many Einstein's and Mozart's are quelled and ruined by ritalin, a school environment that is not boy friendly (I would go so far as to suggest hostile), and a culture whose content is geared and dictated by the female IQ and EQ, that is demeaning and degrading to boys/men/fathers. The IQ is irrelevent, we are all about equal- great- now can we get beyond the gender feminist inspired anti-male hysteria, and focus on education. Just once this year it would be my wish that Newsweek would actually write and present an article that is empowering and complimentary to men.
    -a concerned mother of two boys

    • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 3:08:24 PM

      I have to say, do you REALLY think that most or even many of the females have been tested, let alone been allowed to really study as much as the boys in many countries? I'm thinking that there is no difference between males and females if they are allowed the same opportunities and encouragement. That is the point, the SAME opportunities and encouragement. If the boys were being failed, then they wouldn't think so much of themselves. You are forgetting that point completely.

      I do want you to have the same opportunities for your boys that girls have. If you look at the stats when they are in the work force they will have better opportunities. Doesn't that count for something?

    • Posted By: asteroid77 @ 01/26/2008 2:57:37 AM

      Concerned mother, you did not read my comment thoroughly. The data say that immigrant Chinese females (NOT males) dominate the far right hand side of the bell curve in the most recent data that I have analyzed. And you clearly did not understand my logic: if IQ determines greatness in one case (males vs. females) why does it not determine it in another case (Asian vs. Caucasian)? To me this points out the silly logic that pervades our culture, and your comments echo the embedded assumptions the author suggests many of us hold.

      Further, I sincerely doubt that today's Einsteins and Mozarts are "ruined" by ritalin, as these sorts of children would be reasonable enough to sit still in class. Also, Einstein failed math and didn't get into college, yet he still succeeded. This points to our society's acceptance of late-blooming males.

      You also provided no proof that education is anti-male. Indeed, the evidence shows that boys do worse in all male classes, on average, while girls do better in all-female classes. Maybe the supposed "civilizing" effect of women is a symptom of their superior aptitude?

      Finally, excessive bolstering of the male ego is a terrible thing. It cleverly masks unreasonable expectations for men, e.g. that they should basically hold up the sky while women self actualize at home or pursue less stressful careers. Men are not appreciated for their intrinsic qualities, but rather for their wallets and outside trappings of success. Now is that not a bit biased? Sometimes I wonder if women like you are scared of not having the so-called strong men in the future to support your lifestyle choices...and I find that to be awfully suspicious.


      • Posted By: wanderer @ 01/26/2008 3:46:01 AM

        Yes I did read your comment thoroughly, I was pointing out the assertion you make that the recent data you have analyzed show that Chinese females dominate the right half of the bell curve. That is not accuate unless you take the bell curve to its highest point (the midway point)-then you would be correct; however the top 5%, that part of the bell curve furthest to the right has more males, and the top 1% is predominately male. I do take as valid the assertion that the cross cultural analysis is of value.
        Thank you for making the point about Einstein, I would submit that today, those exceptional children who do fail in the current education system while possessing a great gift or unique intelligence have less of an opportunity to escape the codified, and yes, feminized education system.

        Your statement that boys do worse in all male classes is patently false. The federal government relaxed restrictions on single gender classes in 2006 because of the success of public school districts experimenting with the idea. School districts in Seattle, Atlanta, Baton Rouge, and the Bronx realized the most success. There were also school districts that did not see an improvement, so it is not a sure fire approach, usually related to socio-economic factors. Boys and girls (usually from middle/upper class background) attending single sex private schools score higher overall compared to public school systems. But to state that boys fare worse in single education is patently false. I had to chuckle at "civilizing" comment. Carol Gilligan and Kim Gandy have been on record recently lamenting the lack of the civilizing effect. There concern that girls are not showing boys how to be more like them. I think therein lies the problem.

        We disagree about the value of ego. I agree that the current education system and societal influences lead to an unhealthy manifestation of ego, particularly among boys. I think this is another example of a structure that does not focus on their needs, and respect their strengths.

        As for your disparaging assessment and character assassination of myself, and my ability to be an independent thinking woman, I offer the following about you. You read like an indoctrinated baby boomer. white woman feminist who has spent to much time on the NOW website. You spout tired old gender feminist notions that fail to be accountable for their own failings, and manipulate facts to mold into your pre conceived paradigm. Hardly a honest execution of your high IQ.

    • Posted By: morgynmacnicol @ 01/26/2008 2:36:10 AM

      I'm guessing you are referring to asteroid77 as I did not mention anything about a bell curve???

  • Posted By: John in the South @ 01/26/2008 9:14:26 AM

    I enjoyed reading tho ongoing discussion, having posted a comment yesterday. The issue regarding Asian intellect and higher test scores is best understood in terms of selection. Most high-performing asian students are the children of recent legal and highly selected immigrants. There is very little "ilegal immigtation" across the Pacific ocean, so Asian immigrants often are the most intelligent and most educated among those selected for US visas. The children of these highly-educated Asian immigrants are not representative of the Asian population anymore than the children of US university professors are at representing US studints. The average Asian intelligence, would be lower, as evidenced by their fewer contributions to modern mankind.

    Democracy itself, equality of the races, equality of the sexes -- these are American/European/white ideas.

    • Posted By: cantthinkofanametouse @ 01/26/2008 2:34:52 PM

      That comes off as ethnocentric. The Chineese invented gunpowder and made fireworks and rockets; us wonderful europeans rip off the invention and kill millions of people with it. Indians have the credit for starting the 1st and 3rd oldest major world religion, and, contrary to what you said, an indian ruler, Asaka, was the first documented ruler of a multireligious empire to activly support religious tolerance. We whites invade and Christianize them. Who's more "advanced"?

      • Posted By: Maria57 @ 01/26/2008 3:00:56 PM

        excuse me ITS not about advanced nor race of origin its MALES EGOS IS OFTEN LARGER THAN HIS ACTUAL IQ. people stay on the topic. Men are not as smart as they think, they just think they are but not necessaryly true. I found this which i found interesting------In modern-day society, ego has many meanings. It could mean one???s self-esteem; an inflated sense of self-worth; or in philosophical terms, one???s self. However, according to the psychologist Sigmund Freud, the ego is the part of the mind which contains the consciousness. Originally, Freud had associated the word ego to meaning a sense of self; however, he later revised it to mean a set of psychic functions such as judgment, tolerance, reality-testing, control, planning, defense, synthesis of information, intellectual functioning, and memory.

    • Posted By: cantthinkofaname @ 01/26/2008 2:36:24 PM

      That comes off as ethnocentric. The Chineese invented gunpowder and made fireworks and rockets; us wonderful europeans rip off the invention and kill millions of people with it. Indians have the credit for starting the 1st and 3rd oldest major world religion, and, contrary to what you said, an indian ruler, Asaka, was the first documented ruler of a multireligious empire to activly support religious tolerance. We whites invade and Christianize them. Who's more "advanced"?

    • Posted By: cantthinkofanametouse @ 01/26/2008 2:29:33 PM

      That's only a little bit ethnocentric. Ancient China makes Europe look like barbarians. The Chineese invent gunpowder and used it for fireworks, but europeans steal the invention and use it to kill millions of people. Who's more "advanced?"

  • Posted By: asteroid77 @ 01/26/2008 3:22:00 AM

    Marilyn Savant, billed in the Guiness Book of Records for highest IQ in the world (228) is a woman ...

    • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 2:58:02 PM

      Good point! There is also the history of IQ testing, where at first the girls were doing much better than the boys and they had to adjust the tests so the boys did as well. One of the problem was they were testing for verbal, math, and reasoning abilities and left out things like spatial abilities.

      Of course there are always individual differences. Personally, I think many of the differences are due to environment. If you are outside doing sports and working on machinery, you will be better at spatial abilities. If you socialize more, your verbal abilities will be better. The fact that most societies steer girls and boys into different areas of behavior may account for a lot of the differences in mental abilities.

      For instance, I hung out with boys mostly when growing up, and have high spatial abilities. Many females don't, but they aren't allowed to spend all their time with boys outside riding bikes and doing sports.

  • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 2:49:04 PM

    If women let men know how intelligent they are, they can risk abuse from those men. I remember when I was younger being physically threatened by some men if I let them know I knew things. I were supposed to shut up and let the men run things, without mentioning what I knew about what they were doing. It was frightening.

    Women are forced to pretend they are not smart.

  • Posted By: splashy9 @ 01/26/2008 2:46:32 PM

    If women let men know how intelligent they are, they can risk abuse from those men. I remember when I was younger being physically threatened by some men if I let them know I knew things. I were supposed to shut up and let the men run things, without mentioning what I knew about what they were doing. It was frightening.

    Women are forced to pretend they are not smart.

  • Posted By: Mind_reader06 @ 01/26/2008 8:59:40 AM

    I have never, ever thought that my father is smarter than my mother, or that my grandfathers were smarter than my grandmothers. I find anyone would think such bull to be absolutely absurd. I am the youngest of four children, not to mention the only female. My father and my brothers are very intelligent men, as my mom and I are intelligent women. We all have areas were we thrive more than others, but it has nothing to do with gender, unless of course we are comparing putting on make-up to shaving a mustache. Let's get real here people...

    • Posted By: Piano Player 2008 @ 01/26/2008 12:56:24 PM

      This article didn't comment on how you perceive your father/grandfath, but how your father perceives himself, or how your grandfather perceives himself. In general, intelligence is usually perceived accurately by others - it is when you have to think about your own intelligence that you become biased one way or another.

  • Posted By: asteroid77 @ 01/26/2008 1:36:27 AM

    Looks like the author has struck a nerve with the men--wow!

    At any rate, the following has been my experience:
    1. If a person has to outwardly claim something repeatedly (e.g. superiority of intellect) it's probably not true.
    2. Fear-based posturing, as displayed by some of the males on this page, is generally evidence of a lack of intellect.
    3. According to the data I have worked with, the highest scoring individuals on IQ tests were not white males. Rather, they were Asian immigrant females, specifically immigrant Chinese females. They dominated the right-hand of the bell curve in the most recent studies I have seen. No one seems to mention this, interestingly enough.

    Further, it should be considered that in the specific areas of IQ tests noted by most experts (like mathematical reasoning), Asians score a few points higher than whites. It is not a huge difference. It's similar to the patterns seen on the male vs. female bell curves--there are more Asians than whites that are extremely high scorers in these areas. Why do the white profs. not bring this up? Further, if one uses the same reasoning that men use against women, mainly, that this difference produces scientific field excellence and/or dominance, one would obtain much higher numbers of Asian scientific field dominance than those observed (despite the fact that they are a small minority). Why is this cutesy IQ score logic only used against women? Maybe the aforementioned selective logic is really more evidence of male psychological problems than female scientific incompetence...

    • Posted By: John in the South @ 01/26/2008 11:58:15 AM

      Comment: I enjoyed reading tho ongoing discussion, having posted a comment yesterday. The issue regarding Asian intellect and higher test scores is best understood in terms of selection. Most high-performing asian students are the children of recent legal and highly selected immigrants. There is very little "ilegal immigtation" across the Pacific ocean, so Asian immigrants often are the most intelligent and most educated among those selected for US visas. The children of these highly-educated Asian immigrants are not representative of the Asian population anymore than the children of US university professors are at representing US studints. The average Asian intelligence, would be lower, as evidenced by their fewer contributions to modern mankind.

      Democracy itself, equality of the races, equality of the sexes -- these are American/European/white ideas.

  • Posted By: thylacine @ 01/26/2008 11:18:23 AM

    A lot of women pretend to be "dumb," simply because they know it's very attractive. Sad, but true.

  • Posted By: Maria57 @ 01/26/2008 10:36:16 AM

    ok clean slate-male ego is often larger than his IQ which equals errogance-and the contrary is that women are just or more intellegent but we keep it to ourselfs so the other half doesnt feel threaten, or perhaps react violent to the thought that she is more or better than him and that would crush his ego, which equal to chovanist.

  • Posted By: Mind_reader06 @ 01/26/2008 8:53:22 AM

    I have never, ever thought to myself that my father is smarter than my mother, or that my grandfathers were smarter than my grandmothers. I am the youngest of four children, not to mention the only female, and I find anyone who would think something like this to be absolutely absurd. My father and my brothers are very intelligent men, as my mom and I are intelligent women. We all have our areas were we thrive more than others, but being male or female has nothing to do with it unless we are comparing putting on make-up and shaving a mustache. Let's get real here people...

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