Listening In

If the Feds follow the FISA law the telecoms have nothing to fear. Simple.

So let me get this shiit straight. An unnamed source tells us of an unnamed telecom company that says they may not be as willing to help violate the law. And the down side of this pussie fest is...?

Actually Jimbo, the reigning member of said Bush family was NOT on duty for the first 30 minutes or so of the attack on America - the first 6 minutes of which were spent on the reading of "My Pet Goat" ; while our leader could have, and should have, been addressing the issue of intercept and possible shootdown of hi-jacked airliners. A situation which was left to flounder and fail while our Commander in Chief stopped to "shoot the breeze" with local teachers for even another 20 minutes or so beyond the completion of his reading assignment! Why was he so unconcerned while Americans were jumping from the WTC to their deaths?? Sleep well fellow citizen.....

Actually Jimbo, the reigning member of said Bush family was NOT on duty for the first 30 minutes or so of the attack on America - the first 6 minutes of which were spent on the reading of "My Pet Goat" ; while our leader could have, and should have, been addressing the issue of intercept and possible shootdown of hi-jacked airliners. A situation which was left to flounder and fail while our Commander in Chief stopped to "shoot the breeze" with local teachers for even another 20 minutes or so after his reading assignment! Why was he so unconcerned while Americans were jumping from the WTC to their deaths?? Sleep well fellow citizen.....

"The Bushco Crime Family was on duty when 9/11 happened" wow, what a deep and intellectual statement. Of course, following this stellar logic (from our self-professed legal scholar, no less), then FDR is responsible for WWII, Lincoln is reponsible for the Civil War, and on and on. Oh, and I know I'll sleep better tonight knowing that self-appointed guardians of the constitution such as yourself are on guard to protect my civil liberties. How can I thank you enough?
Be sure and check in with moveon.org so you can share more left winger tidbits like that pearl of wisdom!

Correct they were calls (expanded to emails, internet usage) to or from U.S. Citizens. Tat's the crux. U.S. Citizens cannot be spied upon with a warrant. The Crime Family and the Telecomms didn't have 'em, and spied anyway...damn a small thing like the law. If the wiretapping was not illegal, then why not let the Courts decide that? Why provide immunity to Corporations who have million dollar legal departments? Did they break the law or not?

Go rub one out to LiLo, like I said, put your head and the monkeys back in your butt and leave the protection of the Constitution to the adults.

If Bushco has its way, we'll never know if FISA is unconstitutional because they don't want it to go to Court!
The Church Commission created FISA - a bi-partisan commission created in response to that other terrific criminal Richard Nixon. The monkeys have already flown out of your butt. Did you read the information on the Greenwald site? Or just dismiss it as left wing? Figures, if it isn't on the Drudge Report or if Rush doesn't tell you what to think then it has no merit...always remember that is was the 'manly men' of the Bushco Crime Family who were on duty when 9/11 happened....

Its fun getting you self-righteous lefties all spun up and with your panties in a bunch.
OK genius, if F is for foreign, and the wiretapping took place on international calls (let me explain for you, that means to a foreign country), then what the heck is the problem? These were not calls from the US to the US. they were calls to outside the country. Ipso facto (I honestly don't know what that means but I love the sound of it), the wiretapping was not illegal.
I can't take you anti-American types anymore, I'm going to go do something more useful like look at nudie pics of Lindsey Lohan on the NY Magazine website. She's an all-American hottie - or maybe you'd like to argue that also? Oh, that's right, she's American and therefore inherently evil in your eyes, no?

I stand corrected, the F in FISA stands for FOREIGN...the I is for intelligence, of which this Administration and others are sorely lacking....

Hey Genius, the I in FISA stands for International and it requires a warrant. period. They spying law breakers can even get a warrant after they are done spying, to cover their butt. Again if these Companies didn't violate the law, then as you wingnuts are fond of saying, "they have nothing to worry about." The Electronic Frontier Foundation is hardly a for profit enterprise and they are the plaintiff in a number of these suits...they are about protecting the rule of law and even the internet that allows people like us have this thrilling debate....
Somewhere, deep down, you wingnuts are hoping for another attack to justify your characterizations of lefties and dems as 'weak', etc....that would 'prove' your point right? Your ignorance is appalling...criminal court, civil court, at this point any court would be fine....the Bushco family is trying to provide retroactive immunity for ILLEGAL spying. period.
Bushco started this illegal wiretapping in Feb 2001 - and ignored the Bin Laden (remember him?) memo in August...he was busy playing cowboy at his ranch...7 years later, no Bin Laden, 1 trillion pissed away in Iraq, and 4000 brave soldiers dead...It is part and parcel that you are a part of the ignorant sheep crowd that believe that might is right and citizens should not question their Government...put your head back in the sand or better yet grab a rifle and man a post at the border or in Iraq....

Jimbo, I'm a "lefty" that has put my interests of my country over my own by actually serving my country. 13+ year vet here, and I believe that the administration and telecoms should be accountable and responsible for any crimes they may have committed. Laws are laws, and besides the administration hides behind "executive priviledge" to protect themselves, American conversations should be held to the same standard....

No trial lawyer has ever defended my right to free speech, Mr. Left-Wing, that was given to me by the founding fathers. Besides, there is no money in it for them so they wouldn't be interested. And nothing in the FISA Act of 1978 prevents wiretapping of international calls. No criminal law has been violated. The issue is that you left-wingers are attempting to move this from a criminal court to a civil court in the interest of lawsuits and money...and you are putting that ahead of the security of the nation.
If and when (and I pray to God its never) there is another terrorist attack that could have been prevented but wasn't because of these types of legal actions, you on the left will have blood on your hands. But I'm sure that in your narrow mind, it will all be 'America's fault', 'George Bush's fault', etc. Its clear that you are part and parcel of the always blame America first crowd.

I guess jimmy can't stand facts - fear mongering is easier...facts are a stubborn thing as they say...

Everything you need to know about this FISA mess is here:
http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/

It is those same trial lawyers who defend your right, jimmy, to spout your gibberish under the first amendment and those same trial lawyers that pumpkinhead Rush turned to when he was caught with too many prescription pills...so again, I ask - did the Telecomm companies break the law when the provided information to Bushco without a warrant? That was the law in place at the time...let the court decide...why should Congress or Bushco decide a legitimate legal question? Isn't that why we have Courts? The relevant law was the FISA act of 1978 that was amended right after 9/11 - but still required a warrant to listen to American citizens, regardless of who they were talking to. What do they have to fear from letting these cases go before a judge? The telecomm immunity provision is one of the sticking points holding up the law...DNI McConnell said it himself on CNN - the immunity and protection of these Corporations is the real issue...the rest of your stuff if fear mongering...How can you be so sure that those were "the only calls that were subjected to wiretapping." I guess you are willing to take the Leaders word for it....after too much lying, I am not willing. Let the Courts decide...

There are some good protective measures you can take. EveSurf.com
has some great proxies you can set up if you don't want your
surfing and emails monitored by uncle sam.

Perhaps the brilliant legal scholar 'TSop' can quote for us the law that says that a call between the US and a foreign nation cannot be intercepted, because those are the only calls that were subjected to wiretapping. And such wiretapping is not illegal. How ironic that the same lefties that are always in favor of more lawsuits are hiding behind their lofty concept of civil liberties, etc, etc., ad nauseum. Oh, but that's right, you also want to extend American civil liberties to the potential terrorist on the other end of the phone, to illegals crossing the border, etc. Just once I would like to see the left-wing put the best interests of their country first.

I'm still wating for someone to actually ANSWER these questions!

Comment: Why is it necessary to listen to the phone calls of "FELLOW AMERICANS" to stop Al-Queda?

What do the phone calls of Americans have to do with fighting foreign arab/muslum terrorists?

Did American citizens have anyting to do with 911? Was a single American citizen flying one of those planes?

Why is it necessary to wire-tap the American population to stop terrorists in Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia?

Why is the old FISA law that let the government listen, then go to a judge "after" to explain why the listened to the phone call of a fellow American insufficient?

Why don't they just "wire-tap" foreign terrorists that plan to hurt us and leave the American people alone?

Is everyone asleep?