As the Tibetan crisis continues, Buddhist monks in neighboring areas are resorting to extreme measures. An on-scene report from a monastery town.
Comment: one hundred years ago those countries invaded China , stole/robbed treasures out of China and killed Chinese. 100 hundred years later, when we Chinese are leading a far better life than before, when those countries have lost their control over China, they struggle to do damage to China. What we chinese are doing have nothing to do with other countries, we don't need you to tell us what we should do.
Comment: China's human rights abuses are "staggering": the detention of hundreds of thousands of people, including political activists, for "reeducation" programs, and forced labor camps; and the liberal use of the death penalty in China -- including for political prisoners -- which makes China the site of 8 of every 10 government administered executions carried out in the world!
It is clear that the Communists can't be trusted at all and they have a bag full of tricks to fool not only Tibetans but the people of China with a state-controlled press. The solution is a free Tibet. There is no doubt that a sovereign Tibet would be a savior state not only for Tibetans but for all ethnic groups of China who have nowhere to go if they disagree with the CPC. A free Tibet would be such a free democratic heaven and haven.
Comment: Chinese American: On what basis do you believe that Tibet is a part of China apart from having invaded it? We have a different spoken and written language - we have alphabets & vowels not characters . We have a different culture and religion. We have a different diet and dress. I grew up tibetan not chinese.and even at the subconscious level I am a Tibetan never a ;Chinese - never was and never will be.
Comment: I believe you know India well, there are many many of different ethnic groups in different provinces of India, they all speak different languages and have different habits and customs, but they all are Indians. If Dalai Lama says Tibetans only seeking autonomy not the independence, then you the followers of him should admit yourself are Chinese. If you don't agree with him then why should we need talking to him if he doesn't have power on you?
Comment: The definition and meaning of Human Right are changing every second, every minitue and very hour. Do not be fooled by what Politicans called " Human Right" . Tibet is just a tool used by Western country to play with China. China and Wstern countries are playing a game named "Tibetan's Human Right"! Nobody really care about you tibetans. Politic is politic, which is changing every second, every minitue and every hour. Make sure think about an issue from different perspectives.
Everything in this world is changing during every second, every minitue, and every hour.
Comment: Both Tiban and Han are Chinese. Just the same as Indians, they are Indians in ethical sense, but they are also Americans in national sense. As a Han nationality, we respect cultures of other 55 nationalities but each of them is a member of Chinese.
Comment: Obviously, you do not understand political issue. Acutally, not only you, but also all the politicians in western world do not understand what' human right is and what Tibet Independence is. Tibet independce is not equal to tibetan human right.
language, culture, diet , dress, religion, whatever you talked about, are not the decisive factor to regard Tibet a country. Think about Quebec in Canda, etc!!!
If you understand what a country means, what a country is, you wont say these!!
Comment: Although I was not born in China, and never been to Tibet, as a Chinese American, I firmly believe that Tibet is part of China, as firm as I believe that the west of Missisippi is part of the United States. The recent conflict between non-Tibetan Chinese and Tibetan Chinese is a tragedy. While the Chinese government may not be handling this perfectly, I do want the activitists around the world to stop using this issue to hurt the people in Tibet over and over again. The most harmful thing they can do to Tibet is to support this so called 'Tibet independence' movement. China is a big country, and has her own problems and priorities that are different from the Western world. Personal and Religious freedom in China is not as large as in places like United States. But it doesn't mean that people cannot worship and have deep religious devotion in China. As long as the religious activities don't infringe the government and national sovereignty, there is still a lot of room for the very devoted religious people. But what the separationists doing is to use religion as a camouflage, in order to achieve political goal. This is degrading the religion that they claim to revere so much. Isn't it another way to destroy the Tibetan Buddhism? It seems like the activities and separationists are destroying the Tibetan culture faster than the Chinese government can do!
Comment: The Olympic torch was lit today in China, but it isn't the torch the Chinese people wanted. Their torch was held aloft by their Statue of Liberty, the one that they built. That torch was torn down, and the people were attacked and killed or jailed by the "People's" army in Tiananmen square in 1989. Young adults in China today know nothing of this, because the Chinese government propaganda machine has vilified the patriots who demonstrated for freedom that day, and dismissed them as a few anti-social hooligans. This process is, of course, taking place today in China, only it is currently directed against the Tibetan demonstrators. If the Tiananmen Square demonstrators had been successful in reforming the Chinese government, I doubt if there would have been the demonstrations in Tibet, because the people of Tibet would probably have had far fewer grievances.
See: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiananmen_Square_protests_of_1989">Tiananmen Square Protests of 1989 </a>
Comment: I really disappointed that I once loved to read your magazine. I once think newsweek is a serious media. NOW I KNOW I WAS WRONG. NEWSWEEK IS NOT A RESPONSIBLE MEDIA. It has so many lies! Don's say you were on-scene. I doubt you don't know where Tibet is.
DON'T CREATE, TELL THE TRUTH. THIS IS A DISCIPLING OF BEING HUMAN.
LET YOUR GOD PUNISH YOU BECAUSE YOU ARE LYING.
Comment: I was born in Qinghai Tibetan plateau, and I grow up with Tibetan children. I know what???s going on in Tibet. Their lives there are not inferior to Han people, in some aspect they even have some priority than Han people, for instance when they have CEE (College Entrance Examination) they will get extra scores than Han students. Every year the central government invests more money to Tibet. And when the Qinghai -Tibetan railway built, there are more people to visit Lhasa, their tourist income are increased, the life there is better and better. And also there are no restriction on Buddha religious at least none I have been seen. I really wonder why the rioters claimed they are no freedom, they are not satisfied. And I really hope the foreign reporters can shoulder more responsibilities to tell the innocent people what is going on in Lhasa.
Comment: I was born in Qinghai Tibetan plateau, and I grow up with Tibetan children. I know what???s going on in Tibet. Their lives there are not inferior to Han people, in some aspect they even have some priority than Han people, for instance when they have CEE (College Entrance Examination) they will get extra scores than Han students. Every year the central government invests more money to Tibet. And when the Qinghai -Tibetan railway built, there are more people to visit Lhasa, their tourist income are increased, the life there is better and better. And also there are no restriction on Buddha religious at least none I have been seen. I really wonder why the rioters claimed they are no freedom, they are not satisfied. And I really hope the foreign reporters can shoulder more responsibilities to tell the innocent people what is going on in Lhasa.
Comment: I was born in Qinghai Tibetan plateau, and I grow up with Tibetan children. I know what???s going on in Tibet. Their lives there are not inferior to Han people, in some aspect they even have some priority than Han people, for instance when they have CEE (College Entrance Examination) they will get extra scores than Han students. Every year the central government invests more money to Tibet. And when the Qinghai -Tibetan railway built, there are more people to visit Lhasa, their tourist income are increased, the life there is better and better. And also there are no restriction on Buddha religious at least none I have been seen. I really wonder why the rioters claimed they are no freedom, they are not satisfied. And I really hope the foreign reporters can shoulder more responsibilities to tell the innocent people what is going on in Lhasa.
Comment: I was born in Qinghai Tibetan plateau, and I grow up with Tibetan children. I know what???s going on in Tibet. Their lives there are not inferior to Han people, in some aspect they even have some priority than Han people, for instance when they have CEE (College Entrance Examination) they will get extra scores than Han students. Every year the central government invests more money to Tibet. And when the Qinghai -Tibetan railway built, there are more people to visit Lhasa, their tourist income are increased, the life there is better and better. And also there are no restriction on Buddha religious at least none I have been seen. I really wonder why the rioters claimed they are no freedom, they are not satisfied. And I really hope the foreign reporters can shoulder more responsibilities to tell the innocent people what is going on in Lhasa.
Comment: Western media are irresponsible and shameful for their biased reports: http://anti-cnn.com/
Comment: Whatever wrongs and new oppressions introduced by the Chinese after 1959, they did abolish slavery and the Tibetan serfdom system of unpaid labor. They eliminated the many crushing taxes, started work projects, and greatly reduced unemployment and beggary. They established secular schools, thereby breaking the educational monopoly of the monasteries. And they constructed running water and electrical systems in Lhasa.
Comment: he Tibetan serfdom system of unpaid labor. They eliminated the many crushing taxes, started work projects, and greatly reduced unemployment and beggary. They established secular schools, thereby breaking the educational monopoly of the monasteries. And they constructed running water and electrical systems in Lhasa.
Comment: Whethe one takes the Chinese side or the Tibetan side. The reality and the truth is that Tibetans need freedom, thats what the protest was all about. And so long Chinese government rules Tibet the way they do now, this kind of protest will happen again no matter how much force they use. Lots of those in the free society does not even understand it.
Comment: Seethetruth, all human beings need freedom. In the western countries, the rich and powerful (5%) of them control 95% of the total wealth. They have family trusts to pass their fortune from generation to generation. These special interest groups invent the term "democracy" to anesthetize and fool the poor and the middle class to protect their wealth. Look at what they did at Iraq. They are very clever to divert the attentions of the general population to other part of the world; do you really believe that you have the same "freedom" as these rich and powerful people? Unless you are so powerful and rich and would bother to write articles in this blog? I think you should really dig a little deeper about the Tibet history, Indian, British and western countries influence, who are supporting dalai lama, why they are supporting him and who are paying his finances and who are behind the current riot instead just saying that "this is the Tibetans who are trying to gain their freedom" This is not the only cause, Tibet issue is a very complex problem. I have searched some the links below but they are not inclusive and maybe biased, you should read them and study them yourself and also search more links yourself and reach your own conclusion. Just believing the disgusting regurgitated press junky and the Shangrila and romaticized "democracy" does not help you at all. BTW, the German press and the Wall street journal (all these are not the Chinese presses) have admitted the errors that a lot of reports are false, for example, mislabeled ambulance as the military trucks, cut the riot picture of mob throwing stones and only use part of the picture, use the police picture to help the wounded as police "arrests," using Nepal police arrest as the Chinese police violence etc, etc, As a professional courtesy, The western presses should really check their sources carefully before publishing these junk stuffs to fool and mislead the public. My only advice is to urge people to use caution to believe anything the press says nowadays. I read a news today that China is now allowing western reporters in Tibet and we are expecting more truth will come out soon.
Comment: whether there is a chinese side or Tibetan side of story. The fact is that Tibetans need freedom and that was what all the protest was for. And so long as Tibetans don't get that freedom, these protest will go on irrespective of how much force is used. Lots of people who live in free society don't understand it.
Comment: In old Tibet there were small numbers of farmers who subsisted as a kind of free peasantry, and perhaps an additional 10,000 people who composed the ???middle-class??? families of merchants, shopkeepers, and small traders. Thousands of others were beggars. There also were slaves, usually domestic servants, who owned nothing. Their offspring were born into slavery. 15 The majority of the rural population were serfs. Treated little better than slaves, the serfs went without schooling or medical care, They were under a lifetime bond to work the lord's land--or the monastery???s land--without pay, to repair the lord's houses, transport his crops, and collect his firewood. They were also expected to provide carrying animals and transportation on demand.16 Their masters told them what crops to grow and what animals to raise. They could not get married without the consent of their lord or lama. And they might easily be separated from their families should their owners lease them out to work in a distant location.
The Tibetan serfs were something more than superstitious victims, blind to their own oppression. As we have seen, some ran away; others openly resisted, sometimes suffering dire consequences. In feudal Tibet, torture and mutilation--including eye gouging, the pulling out of tongues, hamstringing, and amputation--were favored punishments inflicted upon thieves, and runaway or resistant serfs. Journeying through Tibet in the 1960s, Stuart and Roma Gelder interviewed a former serf, Tsereh Wang Tuei, who had stolen two sheep belonging to a monastery. For this he had both his eyes gouged out and his hand mutilated beyond use. He explains that he no longer is a Buddhist: ???When a holy lama told them to blind me I thought there was no good in religion.???21 Since it was against Buddhist teachings to take human life, some offenders were severely lashed and then ???left to God??? in the freezing night to die.
Whatever wrongs and new oppressions introduced by the Chinese after 1959, they did abolish slavery and the Tibetan serfdom system of unpaid labor. They eliminated the many crushing taxes, started work projects, and greatly reduced unemployment and beggary. They established secular schools, thereby breaking the educational monopoly of the monasteries. And they constructed running water and electrical systems in Lhasa.
Comment: http://www.michaelparenti.org/Tibet.html
http://www.tibetinfor.com/tibetzt/tibet50-en/tomorrow/tomorrow_menu.htm
Some good articles to read.
Comment: Communist governments are fear / control based and thats why they dont work. If people do not have a certain amount of freedom , eventually the system will fail because people would rather fight and die than be controlled to that degree. The Tibetans had peace for a thousand years , what other system can claim that? Anybody beleive the Chinese will be communist for the next 100 years???
Comment: At first, let me clarify that I am not a communist and I am a Christian. If you define the communism in the classical sense (marxist-lennin) and I would agree with you. But the fact is that nowadys the current Chinese government is not a true classical communist system anymore. It is a hybrid system with capitalist economy and special political power group using "ommunism" as a banner to continue their special previledge status. Frankly speaking I think that is the reason behind its rapid grwoth rate (more tahn 10% per year for almost 20 years). Whether or not it can continue another 100 years? The answer is no, China is rapidly converting to a Christian contry. As a matter of fact, China has more Christians than the US. if you don't belive me check with your pastors. My prediction is that China will become a unique democrcy system not similar to the west within 10 years.
Do you belive that Tibet is the ideal ShangriLa as the novel romaticizes? Don't be fooled by the satanic spirit loving Buhdda religions in India and in Tibet. You will invite evil idol spirits in your body by admiring them. If you don't believe me, please ask your Chrstian pastors if you are raised by a Chritian family. You probably are still brainwashed by the western presses, aren't you?
The incident was a bunch of Tibetan jobless thugs who were hired by special interest group to commit beating, Killing, arson and looting of Han and Hui Chinese people. I only wish the Chinese police could react a little quicker and instead of letting this happened for a few days until so many innocent infants, young girls and bystanders were beaten, killed and burned alive. Where is your consience to side with the mobs and thugs?
Comment: Then what Bible says Red Dragon is not China anymore, do you think USA will be the evil red dragon? Now I understand why the Pope wants to go to China so bad, China will save the world from all evil, believe in China you will win.
Comment: Gold Stars, I think that you are a Chinese, but allow me to give you a little Chinese terminolgy clarification:
Concern the term "red dragon". In the bible this is a symbol for Satan and devil, an antichrist. In Chinese term, there is no "dragon" per se. The mythological Chinese creature very similar to the western dragon in appearance is called "loong". This is a symbol of power, peace, prosperity and good luck. The western religious "red dragon" is not the same as the Chinese "loong". The reason why westerners connects China to "red dragon" is because in Bible the last book of revelation mentioned that at the end times, there will be 200 million soldiers from the east to battle at Armageddon, hence the Chinese threat was mentioned. However, India also has the power to produce that many soldiers, therefore only mention China has the capability is not correct. Besides, China with a rapidly increasing its Christian population; it could not possibly become the satsan "red dragon". It already has more Christians than the US. That is the reason why pope is very interested in China. But this just my own thought and opinion as many years of study of the bible. Regarding the current Tibet incident, there are simply too many factors and reasons for the westerners and the world to be afraid of China's rise. The Tiananmen Square incident did not help China's image at all. This is because once you are caught for stealing, you will always to be labeled as a thief. China's leaders have realized this and tried very hard to promote "harmonious world", but the current Tibet incident does not help, The Tibet incident is extremely complex, I found an article you may want to read it. There are western powers and Indian government are currently supporting Tibet's independence for very obvious reason to try to split China, here is the article link, enjoy it:
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/JC26Ad02.html
Comment: I feel a little bit surprise that some Christians in theses forums here support China. Chinese like red colour but Chinese don't like red dragon because red dragon is fire dragon that means burning himself or too aggressive, each culture worships the good right? Chinese like golden dragon and green dragon, you know that gold colour represents power and wealth and green is nature and peace, green dragon is powerful but also peaceful.
Comment: How do you know they were jobless thugs? Did you get a chance to interview these people or you have some inside link into chinese government or you personally know these people.
Comment: http://www.chinaview.cn/
I read news from all sides (see above) not just the MSNBC or BBC. Then I get a complete picture.
Comment: I don't see you use any information provided by MSNBC or BBC in your discussions. That means as you said, you use information provided by www.chinaview.cn, a site which claims it provides news from "The state-run Xinhua news service which distributes news approved and controlled by the Chinese government.". Do I need to say any more about your postings. You compromised your discussion yourself.
Comment: You are strange, we are discussion Tibet issues in the MSNBC/Newsweek site, aren't we? Do I need to say further about your bias thinking?
Comment: Another cheap shot. I said I used all information from all sides to reach the conclusion. But you said that I only used the Chinese site, that is fasle.
Comment: http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard/uploads/1962war.htm
http://www.gregoryclark.net/redif.html
Some documents for the India's China war in 1962
Comment: It is all about power, Tibet has been a part of china for hundreds of years, the difference was that for hundreds of years, chinese empirers let Tibet keep the government structure simiilar to medival euorope, that religous leader was also government head, there was serf system, the monks were ruling class much like catholic church in euorope when it was called dark age. When the communist took power, they changed that structure, the monks lost power and priviliage and for serfs it was kind liberation, although the government is not democratic, but I think it is better than old serf system. That's why Dalai Lama took uprising in 1959, because he realized that without old serf system (in which religion has to go through him, the middleman just like catholic church, religion became a mean to control and govern and source of power and wealth). That's why monks led riot. I wonder what US called black people riot in 60's in many big cities(which i think black people had legilment grievence), did US moblize national guard to put down riot? no government will tolerate beating, looting and arson. By the way do you know there is chinese version affirmitive action in china, Tibetians are not subject to "one child" restriction, can get into colleges with much lower entrance exam scores, etc. I live in US and know many white people *** about affirmtive action here, just put yourself in that shoes. This article just show western media bias and they have little creditibilty. Please show some journilist professionism.
Comment: It is all about power, Tibet has been a part of china for hundreds of years, the difference was that for hundreds of years, chinese empirers let Tibet keep the government structure simiilar to medival euorope, that religous leader was also government head, there was serf system, the monks were ruling class much like catholic church in euorope when it was called dark age. When the communist took power, they changed that structure, the monks lost power and priviliage and for serfs it was kind liberation, although the government is not democratic, but I think it is better than old serf system. That's why Dalai Lama took uprising in 1959, because he realized that without old serf system (in which religion has to go through him, the middleman just like catholic church, religion became a mean to control and govern and source of power and wealth). That's why monks led riot. I wonder what US called black people riot in 60's in many big cities(which i think black people had legilment grievence), did US moblize national guard to put down riot? no government will tolerate beating, looting and arson. By the way do you know there is chinese version affirmitive action in china, Tibetians are not subject to "one child" restriction, can get into colleges with much lower entrance exam scores, etc. I live in US and know many white people *** about affirmtive action here, just put yourself in that shoes. This article just show western media bias and they have little creditibilty. Please show some journilist professionism.
Comment: "not to spit" on Roots of evil, suppression and totalitarianism"....slavery in Africa anyone???
Comment: disgusting love affair with the pompous china as YALE geographers; including miss hillary, allow the subversion of freedom...disgusting...why must America my beloved, be the only Nation, the only Republic to stand for constant Diversity? In doing so we allow the Children of FIDEL, MAO, and Breznev, and all of Islam
within the realm of the United Nations even to spit on Roots of evils elsewhere...no offering of freedom and true self representation, only a phony Olympics to mock Tibet and a bloody square in BeJing. Regional government does not mean supression of a preamble for People, a guarantee of disappearance. The UN should be moved to Iceland and Protugal...out of our Bastion of freedom till it lives to the beacon the UN has never been.
Comment: This reporter mars the subject by his obvious ignorance. But then, Newsweek is little more than Entertainment Weekly with editorials on polititcs.
Comment: "Congressional Medal of Honor?" This award goes only to military personnel serving above and beyond the call of duty in combat. Poor reporting.
Comment: The Dali Lama was not awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor. This award goes only to American Military personnel serving in combat. Poor reporting.
Comment: Racism is at the heart of the problem. It starts with North Caulvanism of the redneck Beijingerss who divide the country in half; sweat cuisine south. (Hunanese, Hubeiese and Chiongqing food are sweat? ) To the uncivilized Anhuiese cavemen and Henen cheats who claim to be the father of Chinese cilivzation. and the Yellow River being the origin. The Yangtze is the mother of China; birth place of literature (Li Bai etc.), the nation psychi (the 3 Kingdom, Qi Yuan etc.) and the divide between temperate north grain lands and sub- toprical rice lands in the south. Then it gets worse even the Fuehrer (Hu Jin Tao) talked about civilizing the west.. Even the Dai have express hate of the carpetbaging China racists.
Comment: The Dalai Lama did not recieve the Medal of Honor, he recieved the Gold Medal. They are completely different decorations.
Comment: The medal was a highest civilian medal nontheless.
Comment: I really don't think either side of the crisis (the Chinese goverment and the monks) did point out the REAL problem. I believe the real problem is economy reason to creat this riot. The mops distroyed the shops, restaurants, all belong to the Chinese form east part of China.
The local people couldn't keep up their business oppotunity with these "outsiders".
Comment: Reasons of the current riot and previous riots: 1) Dalai Lama's secret organization and support, 2) western countries secret financial support to the riot, 3) Indian government support for dalai lama, 4) Han and Hui Chinese economical success in Tibet provoked Tibetan's jealousy, 5) historical animosity between the Han, Hui and Tibetan races, 6) the subversion of outside forces to boycott the Olympics, 7) the strategic anxiety of the Qinghai-Tibet rail road by otuside world, especailly India, 8) the western countires' fear about China's quick rise. 9) the historical oppressive impression of China communism on the outside world, 10) the successful public relation campaign of dalai lama to gain western world and hollywood sympathy, 11) the hostile press of western world to China.
Human right is the the real root cause. The above are the reasons and tools of China opposition, fearers and haters to try to thwart China's rise.
The human right issue is an excuse. It is not the true reason.
Comment: hello, guys.Just look at the hypocritical faces of weastern medias.
http://bbs.news.sina.com.cn/treeforum/App/view.php?bbsid=68&subid=0&fid=137562&tbid=296&ismain=
the pictures are in English.
Comment: where is my comment
Comment: was probably censored by the chinese government.
Comment: Good afternoon.
Comment: Posted By: zxl01 @ 03/22/2008 22: Remember the American civil war????????? What happened when the south wanted to secede from the union?
Comment: Guys, Dailai Lama was installed by the Chinese Government. The 14th (current) Dailai Lama was installed by the National Government of the Republic of China in 1940. The 13th was installed by Emperor Guangxu on March 19, 1879. As people debate over Tibet and China. I found this book, "A Collection of Historical Archives of Tibet" (ISBN 7-5010-0876-0. It contains emporor edicts since the Yuan Dynasty 1277 or 1289 to early parts of the PRC (before the 14th Dailai Lama left Tibet). I quote a few related to the 14th Dailai Lama here, you'd be the judge.
Comment: Reply to the National Govenment from Lhamo Dongrub regarding hist being confirmed as the 14th Dalar Lama:
"Urgent
President Lin of the Chongqing National Government,
I wish to express my humble thanks to you for the instructions issued by the National Government approving Lhamo Dongrub, the Holy Child from Qinghai, to become the 14th Dalai Lama, for the grant of 400,00 yuan to cover the expense of holding the enhronement ceremony, for the gold seal and for the Class II medal conferred on me by Chairman Wu of the Committee for Mongolian and Tibetan Affairs on February 15 of the national calendar.
In addition to expressing my gratitude, I also would like to express my desire to see our country prosper and our people able to live in peace, with the Han and Tibetan peoples maintaining friendly relations.
With best wishes, the 9th day of the first month"
The Decree of the National Government Confirming Lhamo Dongrub as the 14th Dalai Lama: (page 89):
"The National Goverment decrees:
The Holy Child Lhamo Dongrub from Qinghai is profoundly intelligent and an extraordinary person. Now that the 13th incarnation of the Dalai Lama is no longer with us, the drawing of the lots is to be done away with and special approval is granted for you to become the 14th Dalai Lama.
The Ministry of Finance, in line with instructions form the Executive Yuan, is allotting 400,000 yuan to you to cover the expense of the enthronement ceremony. February 3, 1940."
Comment: Should this issue not be decided by the Tibetian people. Let them have a voting under UN and what ever they decide should be followed. Chinese government or anybody else including any western power has no right to decide this issue.
Comment: What issue to be decided? Did you read the message before posting? The message was quoted from historical documents showing the Chinese government's (Republic of China) decree on granting Mr. Lhamo Dongrub, the Holy Child form Qinghai, to become the 14th Dalai Lama on February 3, 1940. And his reply to President Lin (Republic of China).
Comment: The Chinese government has tries to compromise and bring the Dalai Lama back several times throughout the years. The problem is timing. At first, China wanted to offer Tibetan autonomy if the Dalai Lama will return, but in those days, the Dalai Lama and the government in exile was still for full Tibetan Independence. What seemed like a compromise would have been reached during the search for the Panchen Lama, when the Chinese government contacted the Dalai Lama and asked him oversee the process and if he approved of the proper rites taken, to announce the new Panchen Lama at the same time with the Chinese government. The Dalai Lama, however, due to unknown reasons, announced the candidate before the agreed upon time, which greatly embarrassed the Chinese government, who has since then accused the Dalai Lama of behaving in bad faith, and no longer seriously considered dealing with him. In recent years, the Dalai Lama has said he would forego full independence in favor of autonomy so as to preserve Tibetan culture. But this all comes too late it seems.
Comment: Dailai Lama did not forgo full independence. Go to his website at http://www.tibet.com and read up yourself. People can argue blindly all they want. Here is "His Holiness the Dalai Lama's Vision for a Future Free Tibet" http://www.tibet.com/future.html. Read it, and you'd be the judge. The document was written with the first person, "I". Some quotes:
"...However, by the middle of this century, Chinese occupation forces marched into Tibet through its eastern border regions of Kham and Amdo. Soon after, the Chinese intensified their military repression in Tibet, driving our political situation to a crisis point. In the face of this, I had no alternative, but to comply to my people's request to assume full responsibility as the head of state of Tibet, although I was then only 16. ..."
"...Once Tibet regains its freedom and the Chinese forces are withdrawn, there will be a transitional period before the adoption of a new constitution...."
"...Future Tibet will be a peace-loving nation, adhering to the principle of Ahimsa. It will have a democratic system of government committed to preserving a clean, healthy and beautiful environment. Tibet will be a completely demilitarised nation..." "...In our international policy, Tibet will not align itself with the policy and ideology of any other nation. It will remain neutral in the true sense of the word. Tibet will maintain harmonious relations with its neighbours, based on equality and mutual benefit. It will renounce hostility and promote friendly relations with all nations...."
http://www.tibet.com/glance.html
Comment: To: newyorker,
Actually, he has forgone independence. Following from his webpage, as you suggested, and also as quoted by USA Today.
"On the future of Tibet, let me take this opportunity to restate categorically that I am not seeking independence. I am seeking a meaningful autonomy for the Tibetan people within the People???s Republic of China. " --His Holiness' Speech at the Congressional Gold Medal Award Ceremony
http://www.dalailama.com/news.171.htm
"The whole world knows Dalai Lama is not seeking independence, one hundred times, thousand times I have repeated this. It is my mantra ??? we are not seeking independence," he told reporters in Dharmsala, the seat of Tibet's government-in-exile. ---USA Today
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-03-20-tibet_N.htm
Comment: I WONDER, WE WOULD BE WORRIED ALL OF A SUDDEN, OF TIBET AND HER FREEDOM , IF WE FOUND, THERE WAS OIL DISCOVERY IN TIBET !!!!!!!!!!!
Comment: monks and Tibetens are tortured and being killed.
in taiwan, communist party wins.
and the great leaders of the united states are covering their faces with a weil.
I DON'TSEE ANY THING HEAR ANY THING OR SPEAK ANYTHING AGAINST THE CHINESE OPPRESSION.
TRUE FOR OBAMA, OR CLINTON, AND THE BRAVE BILL CLINTON WHO RUSHED TO FREE KOSOVO,OR BUSH TO FREE IRAQ !!!!!!
ALL LOOK LIKE cHAMBERLAIN OF THE ii WORLD WAR. APPPEASING HITLER.
BRAVO TO NANCY PALOSI "A TRUE FLAGBEARER OF AMERICAN SPIRIT", FOR SPEAKING UP THE CONSCIENCE OF HERS AND THE FREE WORLD.
HERE IS HOPING SHE IS ONE WE WISH WE HAD A CHOICE FOR THE NEXT PRESIDENT.
BABUBHAI PATEL
Comment: Mr Patel, you should follow your leader Mr. Singh to be friends with China. The 1962 war was provoked by Nehru and supported by western contries and Russia and he lost it. Imaging if China and India would form "Chindia" that will be a geopolitical entity of more than 50% of world economy, military and political powers. You are very naive to be friends with the western world, over 100 years of submissiion to British colonial rule, you still did not learn the lesson?
Comment: McLIman, is this how the Chinese government intend to suppress the people of Tibet - by distorting the truth. Just like you are grossly distorting the truth that Nehru provoked the 1962 attack by China on India. China is proving to be the most ruthless and a liar. The world will regret when a country like China dominates the world. It is time for freedom loving people of the world to wake-up and see how the Chinese suppress people and totally disregard human rights.
Comment: ajykma
You are very wrong, if China would like to destroy India, all they have to do is to create an avalanche in the Himalaya. Don't call someone's name and please don't provoke China if I were you. China has no desire to dominate the world. Read your history book. China in the 13th and 14th century already had sea faring navy which had reached India, SriLanka and africa. His name is ChenHo. At that time China did not attack India, what makes you to think that China would like to dominate the world? I think you should read the truth about how Nehru provoked China in 1962. You are vey wrong and misinformed. Another thing is that don't call someone's names in this blog it is called abuse. you could get abnned by the moderator. Just a friendly warning. I will report you the next time you absue people again.
Comment: it looks like you know all the truth in the world. You tell that the other person is misinformed like you have some inside knowledge of everything. Is not possible that you may be misinformed. History is what is written and it depends on who writes it. You may have read the one written in chinese text books, and ajykma may have read the one written in Indian text books.
Comment: No, I don't know all the truth only God Jehova knows the truth and this is not the truth of your indian indol Gods. The history books were written by people, yet if the authors are not either Indian or Chinese, then their credibility is more in my humble opinion. Even more why the Inidan government banned a lot of these books? Are they afraid the truth to be told?
Comment: ajykma
You are very wrong, if China would like to destroy India, all they have to do is to create an avalanche in the Himalaya. Don't call someone's name and please don't provoke China if I were you. China has no desire to dominate the world. Read your history book. China in the 13th and 14th century already had sea faring navy which had reached India, SriLanka and africa. His name is ChenHo. At that time China did not attack India, what makes you to think that China would like to dominate the world? I think you should read the truth about how Nehru provoked China in 1962. You are vey wrong and misinformed. Another thing is that don't call someone's names in this blog it is called abuse. you could get abnned by the moderator. Just a friendly warning. I will report you the next time you absue people again.
Comment: I don't think China wants to destroy India, but it also does not want India to be strong. Their continuous support of Pakistan specially militarily is intended to keep India always occupied and side tracked. And by the way, China does not have to capacity to destroy India in present day. 1962 was over 45 years ago.
Comment: I wonder why India supported Dalai Lama all these years? It is becasue India wants to side track China? I think India and China should really seriously thinking to form "Chindia" or they both are the victims of western countries' "divide and conquer".
Are you sure the current Tibet incident is not supported by India? Why all the indians care about Tibetan's "human rights" all of a sudden on this board to support the Tibetan mobsters who killed the Han and Hui Chinese?
I agree with you that China had no intent to destroy India since the 13th century at the peak of China's military might. Even in 1962, China had no intent to invade India, Nehru thought that China could be kicked around and used the "move forward" policy to inch in to the land claimed by China. Chou Enlai begged at least three times with Nehru not to fight and wanted to give the best land to India to exchange for the western part of barren land, but all these requests were turned down by Nehru.
Comment: McLIman, are you a n agend of the Chinese government? That is a total distortion of the truth.
Comment: ajykama
I am nan American Christian. I have no connection with the Chinese government. I am not distorting the truth, I urge you to read your history books, You are brainwashed by your Inidan government and media. The truth is that Nehru provked the 1962 war with China. China begged Inida not to fight and called India as brothers. But Indians at that time was supported by western countires and Russia and had superior arms. They thought that Chinese had no chance and would be defeated. But the result was a total surprise to Indians and the wrold even up to this day. China after the war withdrawed their army, returned all of the captured weapons and tried to make peace with India, but Indians such as you are still very belligerant. You should learn from history and if "Chindia " is a reality, then 50% of world economic, political, military and brain power will be theirs, unfortunaltey people like you are the one who blocked the effort.
Comment: As I remember history, I think it was China which invaded India. Well, you say that Nehru provoked China. That explanation can be used by anybody for starting any war, just like USA says that Iraq provoked it. So in the Iraq war, you do agree then that it is a justified war, and so was the war in Vietnam, and in Korea. Also it will be justified if USA attacks Iran. USA can always claim that these countries provoked it..
Comment: You only read the Inidan texbooks. I have talked to my Inidan cowokers and they all said the same thing. All you guys were brainwashed by your government about the truth. I had posted some of the websites, you should read them. Whenever I had a chnace I alway preach Nehru's "Chindia" to my indian friends. I think even though Nehru provoked the unfortunate war, but he did have some good insight that China and India should form some kind of alliance or both of them are going to be finished eventually.
Comment: NOTE: Commentor Correction = URL Address
http://www.dandelion7771958.spaces.live.com/
Comment: http://www.dandelion7771958,spaces.live.com/
These are my thoughts and comments.
Charles EagleHorse
Comment: ChristianAmerican is a hate-mongering idiot. The world will become a slightly better place once you leave it.
The Tibetan people deserve their country back. China was wrong to take it. And Chinas current actions will only hasten it's demise.
Comment: Call someone an idiot does not make you look smart. On the contrary, if you think the Tibetan thugs who got paid by unknown sources are deserving to be independent, there are a few possibilities: 1) you are wroking with one of the agencies that financed the riots, many inocent han and Hui Chinese were slaughtered and you have no sympathy to them, 2) you are a western China hater, even thought China supported one trillion dolloar of your debt, 3) you are an indian,who provoked and lost the 1962 war and is trying to get even, 4) you are a Tibetan who got paid and had to do whatever was told, 5) you pea brain got brainwashed by the biased western media, 6) you are one of these politicians with an IQ of 80 and could not decern what is right and wrong. If I were you I will keep my mouth shut up and pretending to be smarter.
Comment: To McLiman, You don't like to be called Idoit and I agree with you that it is a language which should not be used on this kind of forum. Then the discussion degrades to a lower level which becomes unpleasant. How come you call the Tibetian people thugs. You need to control your language so that other people don't start using language which you don't like
Comment: When a Tibetan that killed the Han or Hui people, I was kind enough not to call them murderers or killers or something like that. I think that I am kind enough to call them thugs.
But I like your polished indian or Tibetan style. I would like to continue my dialog with you until you show your true color.
Comment: Things don't look good for either the Tibetans or the Chinese. No formal authority wants to be the first to encourage boycotting the Olympics, but the momentum has begun, and calls for boycott will become louder and widespread in the weeks to come. And even if the Olympics take place as planned, there will inevitably athletes who make open public gestures and/or statements in support of Tibetan independence. That will turn the Olympics into a nightmarish debacle for the Chinese.
Sadly, I doubt the cause for Tibetan autonomy or independence will be helped at all. The Chinese will almost certainly not back down from their intention to completely dominate Tibet, and will likely become even more heavy handed in their repression of human rights there in light of recent events.
China is in a no-win situation. For them to capitulate to the Tibetans and critical world opinion would be to lose more face (in their minds) than they could possibly endure. For China to continue on their present path of repression and total dominance of Tibet will effectively destroy the positive image they have worked so hard to project to the rest of the world.
The only way out of this dilemma is for the Chinese to engage the Dalai Lama in a dialog genuinely focused on achieving positive results for all parties. Opinion: It'll never happen, not so long as the Chinese government has their collective heads shoved so far up their collective asses.
Boycott the Olympics? I'll start with me. I won't watch a minute of it, and will encourage everyone I know to do the same. I don't imagine Tibetan independence or autonomy to be coming any time soon, but damned if I'll support the opposition.
Craig
Comment: Between a sport game and their national security, which one you are going to choose?
I agree that you should boycott Olympics. It only cut yourself off from the games, to see if anyone would care!
I don't understand your logic. The paid Tibetan thugs killed Han and Hui Chnese and you propose to boycott the Olympic games? Are you a person who support terrorism.
Comment: How do you know that the so called Tibetians were paid. It seems that from recent news reports by the Chinese media that the riots and demonstrations have spread outside Tibet. So do you thing all these people were also paid by Dalai Lama? Looks like Dalai Lama is very rich king living in exile for the last close to 50 years.
Comment: How do you know that the incident are spreading outside? You seem to have all of the inside information. From the comments that you made from this board, you seem to be one of the organizers of the riot?
Comment: Haha, Now you start blaming anybody who does not agree with your views.
Comment: This is the same tactics that you used in this board to attack all these people who disagreed with you. I just want you to taste your own medicine. It does taste good, doesn't?
Comment: Spiral is a desperate Tibet cultist. Spiral, are you aware of your food stamps are financied by Chinese?
Comment: Please be aware that half the chinese have jobs because of USA.
Comment: Spiral is an Indian.
Comment: I love Tibetans because
1. They hate Jesus Christ
2. They love to mingle with Hollywood junkies and under-employed, pot-smoking, liberal art majors
3. They are "spiritual" (code word for welfare, laziness, and incompetent)
4. They believe personal hygiene is unholy therefore one or twice bathing or showering in their life time is sufficient
5. They (males) all carry long knifes in a country with knife regulations
6. They (some of them) can legally own rifles and shotguns in a country with stricter gun control than Japan (I saw a photo about the Tibetan nomads with SKS rifles in remote area of Tibet on National Geographic)
7. They have more generous affirmative action programs than those enjoyed by Native Americans and Blacks in the U.S. (of course, the downside is you can only hold ceremonial positions - you can never be Colin Power or Condi Rice in China)
8. They are less likely in prison or trouble if there is communal conflict between Tibetans and Han Chinese ("white" people in China) regardless whose fault is as long as no "independence" or other "unpatriotic" things involved
9. They are living fossils from the medieval time
10. You got to love Iranian style theocracy, serfdom and cult of personality in Tibetan unique "culture" and "religion"
Comment: Nancy Pelosi is out of touch with people in her district. Yes, people knew that she was a fan of Dalai Lama and put Tibet problem within the broad religion freedom issue. Now current rioting in Tibet has all the hallmarks of a racially driven ethnic cleansing against Han Chinese (the "white" people in China) and Hui Muslims who had past violent conflicts with Tibetans outside Tibet region. It is even worse than L.A. riot in 1992 because it has more racial targeting than criminal looting as in L.A. riot.
People in Pelosi district are liberal but liberals have racial issues like the general public as evident in Obama vs. Hillary match. Ms. Pelosi will not get re-elected and she will go down the history as the second Speaker of House loses the seat while holding the powerful leadership position. I can even see a recall election if there are some kind of scandals (all politicians have skeletons in their closets) popping up. There is a large Asian American voting block in her district.
Dump Pelosi! Yes we can!
Comment: Pelosi is not a Christian. All Christ loving Americans should know that the idol worshiping religions are all from originated and controlled by Satan. If Pelosin is shaking hands with a cult leader, I wonder what kind of country she is going to lead us into? Dump Pelosi, she has no clue what she is doing. You can not worship the devil and God at the same time!
Comment: The Chinese scum do not have a right to be in Tibet. Tibet is a country unto itself, yet we (USA) suck up to the Chinese and further their barbaric efforts by importing their junk. If it's "made in China" and you buy it, you are guilty of aiding them. Would you give aid to Osama???????
BOYCOTT CHINA!!!!!!!!!!
Comment: You have used all these low class bad words and the moderator allowed them to be posted?
Comment: Just return the money the US borrowed from China. Then you don't have to boycott China, you don't have money to buy anything!!!!!!
Comment: Maye the Americans should stop buying chinese products.
Comment: Well, out of $1 total profit, chinese workers get 1 cent, chinese factories get 9 cents, and big US companies get 90 cents by marketing, distributing and sell chinese-made goods. And cheap chinese goods keep inflation low in the US. Who will be hurt the most?????
Comment: In my opninion the Chinese government is nothing but a gang of barbarians.
BOYCOTT CHINA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Comment: Why you keep posting the same message?
Comment: Another despotic Goberment? The Dalai Lama is a religious question not a country business, like the Pope in the Vatican, he is walking all the globe looking for money to be able to keep his glamorous religious life, C'mon the same as the support against the Soviet Union, then the religious radicals turn against owr Continent, here in this american Continent we do not believe in Kings or Queens, or Despotic or Dynasties, Why we have to support them against the free and equal. In latin America even in the USA they try to imposse theirs way of life, as the muslim that religios is a way of life and include the despotic goverment
Comment: He did not have to do this if the chinese did not kick him out of country and occupy his country by force.
Comment: Again you are missing your history knowledge. Tibet was the China's sphere of influence and land for centuries. Tibetans are one of the five major races of Chinese nationality, they are Han, Manchurians, Mongols, Huis amd Tibetans. Dailai Lama was used by Indian, Britain and Western special interest groups in 195
