'Practically All of Us Were Hawks’

Israeli President Shimon Peres, 85, is the last remaining founding father of the Israeli state still in office. A hawk who helped build Israel's military-industrial complex, in recent years Peres has been a leader in the search for peace with the Palestinians. As part of Israel's 60th-anniversary celebrations, Peres is hosting a conference this week titled "Facing Tomorrow," which will be attended by President George W. Bush and other dignitaries. Last week Peres looked forward as well as back in an interview with NEWSWEEK's Lally Weymouth in Jerusalem. Excerpts:

Weymouth: Is there a realistic chance of peace with the Palestinians?
Peres: I think we have to follow a two-track approach—one political, the other economic. We have unbelievable economic proposals as to how to make accommodations between us and our neighbors. In the political negotiations, the gaps are not very great, but they are highly emotional. It will be extremely difficult to put them on paper because each party looks to its own audience and will be very careful not to appear as losers.

So do you think you should be focusing on improving the day-to-day lives of the Palestinian people rather than trying to achieve a political agreement?
Both. The economic coordination depends upon three [parties]—the Jordanians, the Palestinians and us … What I think can be done is to take the whole length of the border between us and the Jordanians and the Palestinians and convert it into a free-trade zone. We can create close to a million jobs, change the standard of living, solve the water problem which is becoming catastrophic for the Jordanians, Palestinians and us, and build a new era.

What should be done about Gaza?
I think the ones who will change the situation in Gaza will be the people of Gaza. They are getting tired of Hamas. They say, "What the hell are you doing to us?" They are looking for a ceasefire.

As a young man, you were head of manpower under Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion. Your assignment was to purchase arms for Israel, but the United States had imposed an arms embargo on your country. Sam Bronfman in Canada helped you. How did you meet him?
I went to his office without an appointment.

You just rang the bell?
Yes. I was in my 20s and was head of our mission in the United States.

You persuaded Mr. Bronfman to help you?
I told him that we wanted to buy surplus guns from the Canadian government. So, being a businessman, he asked me how much they were asking. I said, "Two million dollars." He said, "It's too much. We can cut it." Then he called up the minister of Commerce and Industry, C. D. Howe, in Ottawa and started to yell, "Two million dollars? Haven't you any shame? I want to see you." So Bronfman took his Cadillac and the two of us went to Ottawa. In Howe's office, he started to argue. My God! The poor Howe said, "OK, we shall halve it. Instead of 2 million, 1 million."

Then Bronfman asked me, "Where are you going to get the other million?" I said, "From you." He wanted to kill me. He called up his wife and told her, "Tonight at 8 o'clock we will invite 50 people. Everyone will pay $20,000. We need a million dollars." In the evening we had a million dollars.