Attention Must Be Paid

« Return to Article

Discuss

Member Comments

  • Posted By: lamm01 @ 06/16/2008 12:36:21 PM

    The press still assumes that the majority of Clinton supporters are Democrats. We're not. We're independents who have no intention of voting for Senator Obama. Yes, McCain may be against many women's issues, however, one must look at what is best for the country overall and not just a segment of the population. I want someone who is ready on Day 1, and that isn't the senator from Illinois....

    • Posted By: Core Democrat in Texas @ 06/16/2008 1:22:00 PM

      I agreee.

      • Posted By: freethoughts @ 06/16/2008 2:09:35 PM

        Lam, a candidate is ready on day one to do what? None of them have every been president, so none are really qualified for the position. With that said, why would you vote for a candidate that can't financially run a campaign, needs someone by his side to constantly remind him who the players are in the Iraq war. Admits that he doesn't understand the economy, and says (on nationaly TV) that bringing the troups home isn't really important. Well, I beg to differ. If your son, daughter, husband, wife, grandchild, or uncle is over in Irag, it is damned important when they will be home. And you wonder why the impression is that women are emotional.

        • Posted By: tracyruns262@netscape.net @ 06/16/2008 4:31:24 PM

          You have to have relevant experience!!! Obama would not make the first round of interviews for ANY Corporation Executive position!

          • Posted By: elizabethpaige @ 06/16/2008 8:38:52 PM

            What's 'relevant' experience? Did Harry Truman have it? Anything to fault about his presidency?

            • Posted By: Core Democrat in Texas @ 06/17/2008 2:36:08 PM

              Yes, Truman had miltary experience with a glowing record and amazing success.
              And he had cleaned up the finances and imposed strict financial accountability on government contractors.
              And he had spent years in the Senate, learning, without any accolades, until he developed legistlation for cleaning up federal government contracts and imposing financial accountability. It was the respect he had garnered for this work that caused the Democratic Party Convention to nominate him as vice-president. He succeeded to the presidency after FDR's death, and he spent nearly 4 years in office before he was elected president.
              He is not comparable to Obama, not at all.

              • Posted By: elizabethpaige @ 06/18/2008 12:35:05 AM

                I guess you recently informed yourself while watching the documentary about President Truman so you'll recall that President Roosevelt didn't have the time of day for Vice-President Truman. It's an important lesson. Truman was a terrific president. You underestimate Obama.

        • Posted By: citron16 @ 06/16/2008 4:53:26 PM

          Hillary Clinton and John McCain would be ready on day one to run this country. They have been in politics long enough to have a real good idea!! OIbama is not !!! I have a nephew in Iraq. Even he understands that once we went into Iraq we could not just leave until we finish what we went over there to do!! How would the world look at us if we just leave now before we make sure things will be ok for the people there!! I think we need to get other countrys over there involed in helping get peace and order and then we can start pulling out. Why would we vote for a candidate who knows nothing and has done nothing. Obama's record speaks for it's self, since he became Senator of Illinois he has done nothing. His choice of friends tells us even more. And if you wanted the troops brought home quickly Hillary was the one cendidate who said she would start pulling troops out of Iraq in the first 90 days of being president !! Obama has said he would start pulling them out by 2012!!! NOOBAMA!!!!

          • Posted By: mystic88 @ 06/16/2008 11:11:48 PM

            Your post is circular and nonsensical; go back and read it. First the Troops can't leave because we aren't finished, but Hillary would be better because she will get them out in the first 90 days, Obama not until 2012. Which is it? Your rant is showing. Poor, bitter citron!

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/16/2008 8:17:34 PM

      Luckily, you guys do not represent the majority.
      The polls tell us so!

  • Posted By: bellcalif @ 06/16/2008 2:13:59 PM

    When I said I may write Hillary in instead of voteing for Obama in a political blob I was called a Kunt! This is no way of getting votes for Obama. The Tshirt that read Bros before Hos was the main reason for my decision. We women got the vote before the blacks and I think we deserved a Woman President before a inexperienced Black Man.

    • Posted By: elizabethpaige @ 06/18/2008 12:22:36 AM

      A tad more graphic than necessary, Bell. Intelligence trumps gender or color.

    • Posted By: News and Notes @ 06/16/2008 4:04:54 PM

      Strangely, many the Obama supporters are hostile towards Hillary supporters, and neutral towards McCain supporters. I don't understand it. What happened to democratic unity?

    • Posted By: vakosh @ 06/16/2008 3:42:55 PM

      Very well said, I couldn't agree more.

    • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 2:35:50 PM

      Actually, race-based suffrage was passed first.

      An us vs. them mentality never solves problems; it does, however, worsen them. It is not a question of who deserves what first, it's a question of progressive politics. Barack Obama's nomination is a victory for all those who have ever bore the brunt of racism, sexism and all other -isms and those who reject such divisive doctrines.

      • Posted By: nmcalpine @ 06/16/2008 3:29:46 PM

        1869, the 15th Amendment guaranteed the right to vote to black men;19th Amendment to the Constitution, granting women the right to vote

    • Posted By: nmcalpine @ 06/16/2008 2:45:28 PM

      Actually black men legally obtained the right to vote before the woman did. The black man was just discoraged, threaten, cheated and/or mislead out of voting especially in the Jim Crow era. That is why I don't understand why more women and blacks (and others) aren't aligned on issues. We all should be fighting together to make things happen for each other. Together we could be so strong and break many barriers instead people are divided and are not seeing the bigger picture. Unity people is the cure to this cancer called bigotry! I am a man and I do agree that there are many prejudices against women. I am also black and see prejudices aginst blacks but if we unified in our efforts to stop the biasis against ALL we probably would get somewhere. We are our greatest obstical. How can one be born of a woman, nourished by a woman and taught by a woman and not appreciate that women are the brain and spinal cord of this great society? All women should stand up and fight and not stand for any bigotry against anyone no matter the gender or ethnicity. At least the Democratic party has offered up a woman and a black as its party candidate. What has the repulican party offered? More of the same. Hillary didn't win but in her defeat she has brught women to the forfront of the political scene which is where they should be. Brarrack Obama has inspired the black community. This year is about change. We must come together. We will overcome.

  • Posted By: Otto-the-wise @ 06/14/2008 5:34:21 PM

    Just curious if the spin of the Clinton bloggers is true or if the spin is actually being posted by Limbaugh's people.

    The question is, are CLintons supporters merely in love with a former First Lady, or are they really feminists?
    If they are feminists then they would support Claire McCaskill, since Sen McCaskill has actual experience, not First Lady time. While Clinton was first lady, McCaskill was Governor of Mizzou, State Auditor with a great record, multi-term legislator, and chief prosector for Kansas City. Barbara Boxer was in the House of Representatives whiile CLinton was First Lady, and Boxer had an important career in California poiitics before that and has been US Senator while Clinton was. The difference between Boxer or McCaskill is that they won several elected offices, like House and Governor, while Clinton's only prior accomplishment was being married to a president. It isnt really a personal accomplishment, but women fall in love with First Ladies.

    • Posted By: dreffein @ 06/14/2008 9:22:33 PM

      Otto-the-wise: I would NEVER support Claire McCaskill. When she ran for the Senate, she turned to Emily's List (women supporting women...). I was asked to contribute to her campaign and did so (although I do not live in MO). Her payback to women was to support a man, rather than the first woman with a real chance to win. I cancelled my Emily's list participation.

      In terms of Barbara Boxer - I like her but she is considered very liberal even in CA. I don't think she would be a good balance for the ticket.

      Finally, most of the Clinton supporters I know are wanting to ensure that the treatment that Hillary received, never occurs again. We talk (in these blogs) so much about how great it is that a black man is the Democratic nominee (it is). Blacks represent ~10% of the population. Women represent over 50%. I guess we thought it was our turn as well.

      • Posted By: anon1234 @ 06/18/2008 12:17:34 AM

        Dreffein, I think people???s life experiences and their race preclude gender in choosing a candidate. In my case, I am a woman from Asia who comes from a region with women heads of state, but all were the wives, daughters or widows of previous heads of state. Some were accomplished, others were not. Everyone???s accomplishments were exaggerated. Family loyalty was put over the good of the country and everyone whom they had ever given a post in the government, did a favor etc was expected to be loyal to the family for life or else risk being berated by their minions.
        I never thought such a situation would happen in America until the campaign of Sen. Clinton. When her experience was exaggerated like the mythical 35 years by Mark Penn etc, when James Carville called Gov. Bill Richardson a Judas for choosing Sen.Obama I was reminded of my third world homeland.
        I am all for women presidents. It is appalling that this country which is a melting pot of races has had 43 white men as presidents in over 200 years. I can understand the anger and disappointment of the women who had hoped to see a woman president in their lifetime. What I do not understand is the bitterness and the threats and demands. People like me all around the world, who come from countries especially in Asia and Africa identify much with Sen. Obama because we come from countries where our ancestors were either colonized or made to be slaves of Europeans and Americans who were white. So in the most powerful country in the world, one with a history of slavery and segregation, the rise of a black man to become the nominee of a major political party with a 50-50 chance of actually becoming President and leading the country and yes, the world is a thing of marvel. That is why people all over Europe especially minorities in countries that have had or have women leaders who were white, countries like Germany, Finland, England etc see something special in Sen. Obama???s nomination because it means that some door has been opened. Sen.Clinton being nominated frankly would not be so exciting to me because I have seen it happen again and again in the region I am from. Any other woman white, black, brown would have truly represented a breaking of a barrier for me.

      • Posted By: summer1216 @ 06/14/2008 11:06:04 PM

        You don't vote for people because it's somebody's "turn." Especially you don't choose a President because it's somebody's "turn."

        • Posted By: dreffein @ 06/14/2008 11:12:38 PM

          Summer - you missed my point. I was responding to Otto's post above mine. Maybe that will put it in context for you.

          And you're right, you don't vote because it's a turn. But given the same positions, I would have much preferred a women.

  • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/17/2008 1:16:55 PM

    What does John McCain have to do to secure the votes of white women? It would seem that voters, Anna Quindlen in particular, expect much more from Barack Obama than his Republican counterpart. After all, McCain has laughed off comments about Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama that were respectively sexist and racist--possibly isolating women and African Americans. What exactly makes McCain more desirable to those groups?

    • Posted By: pcooney @ 06/17/2008 4:24:11 PM

      Good question nicsea, "what makes McCain more desirable to those groups?"....He's white.

      • Posted By: elizabethpaige @ 06/17/2008 11:58:34 PM

        Liver spots white.

  • Posted By: Pittsburgh @ 06/17/2008 2:42:35 PM

    I DO NOT want to go back and undue all that Hillary has done thats for sure. McCAIN - Backwards and completely out of touch with the issues. I WILL vote for OBAMA and fight to make my wonderful country better. I KNOW he's a good man. When people are afraid and desperate, they get mean. Not listening to that.

    • Posted By: monyneen @ 06/17/2008 10:28:41 PM

      Please speak only for yourself . I will vote McCain in 08 . The way Hillary was treated is burned into my very core . Imagine if you were her , how would you feel right now . Pretty sad to see women claim they will now vote for obama . Hillary was double crossed by the DNC , obama , the Kennedys and slamed by CNN , msnbc . Do you still want to vote for obama . Not me . We women will remember in November . Vote McCain in 08 and give obama and the DNC what they deserve . To lose in 08 .

  • Posted By: monyneen @ 06/17/2008 10:16:52 PM

    This woman does NOT speak for me . She is a traitor to all women that fought so hard for our rights . This woman wants her 15 minuites of fame . I don't believe she ever supported Hillary . Hrta a life lady and speak only for your self , not for the rest of us .

  • Posted By: anna43019@yahoo.com @ 06/17/2008 9:13:33 PM

    Thank you, Anna. I am 44 years old and have been a Democrat since 1992 when I first voted for Bill Clinton. I am also very dissapointed on how Mrs. Clinton was treated by the Media and Obama supporters. They believe that Obama will win without the 18+ million voters who supported Hillary. I had read some very hateful blogs coming from the Obama supporters and feel that the DNC doesn't care about me. I am angry and will not be voting for Obama because I do not believe he's ready to be our next President. Anna, you have always being or our side and I want to thank you for making my day.

  • Posted By: vakosh @ 06/17/2008 9:08:57 PM

    The headline of this article describes only the picture of the woman who wrote it.

  • Posted By: Savannah @ 06/17/2008 9:04:09 PM

    Thank you. You have succinctly voiced the feelings of many Hillary voters who are feeling frustrated and very sad at having seen just experienced deja vu from our careers with Senator Clinton's campaign -- we have come so far and yet still have so far to go!!!

  • Posted By: anon1234 @ 06/16/2008 6:41:00 PM

    All the boomer feminists who are mostly wanted women to vote for Sen. Clinton simply because she was a woman and claimed 35 years of experience for her including Bill Clinton's years of Governor and President among them. Now suddenly, Anna Quindlen is claiming Michelle Obama and her generation have all these opportunities because of a 'new wave of feminism'. When? Sorry to bring race in, but even in the days of Obama's grandmother being female and available opportunities meant what the color of your skin was. Women of a darker color simply did not have the choice of not working because it was their economic situation and not their gender that dictated whether they worked or not. And mostly in the lower economic sectors. Add segregation and Michelle Obama's grandmother's life exprience is not the same as Barack Obama's white grandmother.
    Even during the early parts of Barack and Michelle Obama's mother's lives, their skin color must have dictated the opportunities available to them. Barack's mother was extraordinarily open minded, whch if we are honest will acknowledge that it was the exception and not the rule then. Our country has become more equal now, but it must be acknowledged that for Michelle Obama to be a Ivy League student was harder than someone who was a woman and in her exact same economic situation, but white. Even now the percentage of minority women to white women in Ivy League colleges is not the same. And many are due to economic reasons.
    So, Ms. Quindlen, unless the anger of women of your generation sorry to say has mostly been among white women who have been threatening to write Sen. Clinton's name in the ballot like small petulant children, have no sympathy among the majority of other democrats. Sen. Obama should be inclusive of all groups irrespective of race, gender or economic situation if he is to be President of America. He does not owe women of your generation and acknowledgement of 'anger or frustration' just because his opponenet was a woman of your age neither is he a stand in for the 'younger men, women in the assistant's seat have watched promoted over them'. . It is unfair. Will you apologize for slavery and segregation because you are a white woman ? And I am not a black woman, but an Asian immigant woman.

    • Posted By: mystic88 @ 06/17/2008 12:38:55 AM

      As another Asian woman, I don't get it. The white woman complain about disrespect by their men. They birth them, they raise them, they marry them, they are daughter, mother, sister, aunt of them. The white woman has every opportunity to correct any ill conceived notion by white men. They share their beds, fix their meals, tend them when they are young and old. Perhaps, white women would be better served to look at themselves and see what their men see. Perhaps a change is needed.

      • Posted By: dreffein @ 06/17/2008 7:12:52 PM

        Mystic 88 - WTH are you talking about?

  • Posted By: Pittsburgh @ 06/17/2008 4:08:34 PM

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:19:42 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

  • Posted By: Jack999 @ 06/17/2008 9:43:15 AM

    Mr. McCain???s biggest challenges as he faces a general election contest with Senator Barack Obama : a continued wariness toward him among evangelicals and other Christian conservatives.Because the Republican brand name is less popular and the conservative base is restive, McCain has special needs to reach out to independent and moderate voters, but, completely neglect by evangelical and conservative base.because of John McCain Lies,Prejeduice,Hypocrites,..IF we to compare Obama words and his character as Man of truth evangelical ,we all have see thru his actions during nation wide Campaign, While John MCcain adopted to and ACTS as being Christian conservatives are NOT his truth evangelical values that teachs by Jesuis Christ.

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:16:41 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

  • Posted By: Jack999 @ 06/17/2008 9:23:53 AM

    Right everyone to his Opinion,We have been talking about Church and pastor all months,Are we going to select a Leader base on Who's their pastor or Doesn't matters how does they leads their Real Lives?
    Jesus Christ said,Christian dont Lies they only speaks the truth ,they dont be Prejudice but Justice,will not be hypocrites, a man of his words...Sadly they still prefer John MCCain of live even his the most opposite side of what Jesus had preached to christians if we to compare to Obama words yet many white evalangical church goes againt Obama for this John Mcain live style .

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:16:05 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

  • Posted By: lordmi @ 06/17/2008 1:31:00 AM

    if you want to be equal - do not scream
    If you want to have a vote in Politics - think and make Your choise NOT based on Gender, but on Issues.

    Women are screaming tooo much, like Kids.
    Clintonists women did NOT demonstrate Adult approach.
    Whims are NOT acceptable in Politics.

    Linda, Typical white, pretty old , 55, woman.

    • Posted By: citron16 @ 06/17/2008 2:31:26 AM

      When someone goes to vote they decide which is the best candidate. Who has the best character and who they think they can trust to run this country. McCain is the better choice!!!

      • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:13:37 PM

        Yes, McCain is the better choice.....
        For fools!

  • Posted By: timrogers @ 06/17/2008 12:44:07 AM

    Women will vote for the candidate who supports womens issues if that candidate happens to be black. If he is, many will not choose a President at all. They will still vote and they will support womens' issues. They just won't vote for the black guy for the big job. Hillary masked alot of this prejudice because she was a woman. It was easy to say you were not against the black man because you were for a woman. Now the choice is between the stone age values of the white Mr. McCain, or the new age values of the black Mr. Obama. The women will not like only a black or white choice on these terms so they will refrain. Enough women will choose to not make a choice , at least among democratic type voters. They will insure that a poor choice is made in favor of McCain. Woe to Rowe vs. Wade thereafter!

    • Posted By: citron16 @ 06/17/2008 2:28:51 AM

      Women will vote for the best candidate and that is McCain!!!! NO OBAMA!!

      • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:11:34 PM

        Only stupid folks will vote in the GOP this time!!
        They have done enough damage!

  • Posted By: formerobamarobot @ 06/17/2008 12:26:31 AM

    That Rush Chaos plan was started by Nobama as Democrat for a day in Nevada. The republicans took it over and voted for NOBAMA, not Hillary.

    They felt Hillary was the strongest candidate so they chose the WEAKER one. That would be NObama. This meant nothing to NObama as he just wanted to knock Hillary out and then they stole it fromher.

    Look at the polls, if Hillary runs without the empty suit, she wins a landslide. Against McCain, she wins and with Nobama we are back in Republican country for 4 more years.
    We have to convince Hillary to run as an independent so we can have part of what we need for the country.

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 06/17/2008 1:03:50 AM

      Can you point to the polls that suggest Hillary would have won a landslide? Thanks!

      • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:06:21 PM

        "former" is a frustrated mercenary.
        Hillary has endorsed Obama!

  • Posted By: formerobamarobot @ 06/17/2008 12:20:23 AM

    Well, Sweetie, you must be someones footstool, but MILLIONS of us are not.
    We are going to McCain. You saw that the nobama did not get that bump of new voters they were expecting when they stole the election from Hillary. We owe the Democrats nothing. This is not OUR party, this is a criminal club now. Why don't you do some real reporting and tell us how NOama voted for the patriot act, why the democrats voted with the republicans for more funding for the war when the war could have stopped MONTHS ago due to lack of funds. What about Pelosi, he could have stopped as Speaker of teh House, BUT NO. What about the N'cobra site that had BO's for Pres site as the link for more information...yeah, we don't want too many women seeing that as WE may change this country and vote for the better person. One who has not lied as Nobama lies, The best is Hillary, next is McCain.
    So nobama filled some sandbags, McCain could not do to his disability from being a POW.
    So Nobama spoke in church about men who do not support their children, BUT FIRST he has to say they have ben treated badly but that is no excuse. Such a HYPOCRITE!
    We can see the emperor with no clothes is NAKED, can't you?
    WAKE UP, Missy!

    Get with the program.
    As my mama always said, if you run with thieves, you are thief.

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:03:31 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 06/17/2008 12:44:49 AM

      I find it funny that you know millions are switching over to McCain...show me the evidence, show me the statistics of your assertion. You forget one issue regarding funding..who has the power of VETO and tell me how many Republicans would also endorse a stopping of the funds for the war....NEXT

      • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:02:50 PM

        " What Senator Obama and I share
        is so much greater than our differences;
        and no matter who wins this nomination,
        I will do everything I can to bring us together
        and move forward!"
        Hillary Clinton

    • Posted By: citron16 @ 06/17/2008 2:22:55 AM

      Your comment is great, I totally agree!!!

  • Posted By: NewHamster @ 06/16/2008 11:05:18 PM

    The only way he can really prove it to me is if he chooses Hillary as his running mate - especially in light of the fact that he didn't win enough elected delegates to cinch this and the superdelegates are the ones choosing him over the woman who more people voted for than any primary candidate in the history of this country, in spite of being outspent more than 2 to 1. Otherwise I won't believe one word of his unity schpiel.

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 5:00:26 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 06/16/2008 11:56:15 PM

      I wrote this in another blog, and I may be paraphrasing myself....my concern with Hillary is that she has Bill. Now according to CNN analyst which his or her name slips my memory said the following words....If Obama is finding himself pulling out and away from McCain, the need becomes less likely for a Obama/Clinton ticket...However, if Obama is finding himself slipping in certain swing states, than there will be more of a chance for Hillary to be his running mate.

      We will know in August...it is fun to speculate....lets see how the polls pan out over the next couple of months,,,of course the polls are as accurate as people want to be honest...so we wait...

  • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 10:14:26 PM

    What does John McCain have to do to secure the votes of white women? It would seem that voters expect much more from Barack Obama than his Republican counterpart. After all, McCain has laughed off comments about Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama that were respectively sexist and racist--possibly isolating women and African Americans. What exactly makes McCain more desirable to those groups?

    • Posted By: hotstuff @ 06/17/2008 4:59:51 PM

      " What Senator Obama and I share
      is so much greater than our differences;
      and no matter who wins this nomination,
      I will do everything I can to bring us together
      and move forward!"
      Hillary Clinton

  • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 1:45:36 PM

    Delegates are needed to win presidential primaries. Barack Obama earned the most delegates because the people of these United States voted for him--thus, ensuring his nomination.

    To be fair, the nomination was not handed to Obama nor was it snatched from Hillary Clinton. Both candidates ran formidable races, but there could be only one.

    • Posted By: bellcalif @ 06/16/2008 2:24:29 PM

      He didn't earn them! He was awarded them by the Rules Commitee and Howard Dean! There won't be a role call in Denver because Obama would loose to Clinton!

      • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 3:17:15 PM

        Initially, all Florida and Michigan delegates were stripped. Both candidates realized early on that both of those states would not count. So, did not the Rules Committee award delegates to Hillary Clinton as well.

        • Posted By: Core Democrat in Texas @ 06/16/2008 5:12:08 PM

          NO. As punishment for holding early primaries, they cut the vote of all delegates from both Fla and Michigan from one vote to one-half vote for each delegate.
          In Florida, they then seated all the delegates according to the primary vote.
          In Michigan, they seated all the delegates, and awarded Hillary delegates to Hillary and all undecided votes to Obama. They they went further, they took away 4 pledged delegates from Hillary and gave them to Obama.

          • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 5:29:36 PM

            Yes, initially both Florida and Michigan were stripped of there delegates. Later, the Rules Committee decided to grant half-votes.

            The Committee's vote represented all those who voted, all those who wrote in their candidate of choice, and those who stayed home under the impression that their vote would not be counted. Obama was ahead by more than 150 delegates. His delegate lead was far too great.

            • Posted By: Core Democrat in Texas @ 06/16/2008 5:53:50 PM

              Wrong again. Rules Committee has authority to vote on punishment for holding early primaries, but not on seating delegates. Seating delegates is within the authority of the Credentials Committee. They voted on the punishment, which was counting each delegate's vote as one-half. They then decided to monkey with the pledged delegate count from Michigan, and hoped that no one will challenge their "awarding" of delegates at the Convention.
              Hillary just decided to drop it and accept their "solution". But if any delegate from Michigan wants to challenge it, then it will go to the Credentials Committee. And if 20% of the convention delegates decide they want a vote on it from the floor, then the full convention will vote on the seating of those delegates. That's what the Rules say.

              • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/16/2008 6:05:28 PM

                I believe that we are at odds about a nonissue. Thank you for the clarification, but did you understand my point in regards to Obama's large delegate lead?

                • Posted By: Core Democrat in Texas @ 06/17/2008 2:17:15 PM

                  Yes, and you are correct with respect to his lead in pledged delegates.
                  However, the actions of the DNC permitted him to declare in the first week of June that he had wrapped up the nomination, by combining his pledged delegates superdelegates, and the delegates given to him by the DNC on the prior Saturday.
                  Without the action of the DNC, he would not have had enough delegates at that point to declare that he had won. Perhaps he would have picked up a sufficient number of superdelegates to clinch the nomination before August, maybe not.
                  The actions of the DNC may be a non-issue to you, since he won the nomination.
                  However, the actions of the DNC in ensuring the nomination for him in early June is obviously an issue to some democrats.
                  I think the outcome would have probably been the same; he would have gotten the nomination when everyone voted at the Aug convention. But It think the actions of the DNC should not have been the deciding factor in who got the nomination --- they should be neutral. In any event, I think the DNC alienated some democrats by its actions, and it is costing them in terms of financial support.

                  • Posted By: nicsea @ 06/17/2008 4:53:04 PM

                    The nonissue to which I referred was about semantics, not the DNC's decision.

                    Yes, the delegates awarded to Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama increased their delegate counts. After this increase, however, neither candidate had enough delegates to claim the nomination. Obama's vast delegate lead couple with the the DNC's decision and superdelegate endorsements secured the nomination. Per the Rules Committee's initial punishment, both candidates were awarded delegates that neither of them should have received.

              • Posted By: mystic88 @ 06/16/2008 11:29:40 PM

                I think giving Obama the undecided vote made perfect sense. If they had the opportunity to vote for Clinton (she was on the ticket) and didn't, obviously they were looking for someone else who wasn't on the ballot. Even if they gave her every delegate, the smarmy way way she complained after stating "We all know the votes in Michigan won't count for anything" (except my nomination if I really need them), the Superdelegates would have still swung to Obama and she would have lost that way as well. SHe was just done folks, get over it and step to the light!

        • Posted By: citron16 @ 06/16/2008 5:05:32 PM

          If they wanted this election to be fair then all the votes from all 50 states should have been counted!!! Who cares if they voted early, maybe all states should vote in January from now on and not drag it out so long, and this was one of very few primarys that every state got to vote in. When I listened to the DNC explian how they decide what states vote early and which don't I was appaled. Look it up !!! This entire election prosess the democrats have should be changed for good!

          • Posted By: mystic88 @ 06/16/2008 11:24:17 PM

            Hillary had her boy on the Board when the decisions were made prior to the primary season, rules, regulations, who;s on first...she still could pull off the big wrangle. Each election, each state gets to vote, this wasn't the first time. It may be this is the first time the nominee wasn't a forgone conclusion after Super Tuesday, but all states vote. Michigan and Florida would have been better served staying put; their votes would have been much more relevant later in the primary than moving up. That's what happens when you get greedy. The seniors in FL need to learn that they can't have the early bird special with everything!

Reply

Report Abuse

Enter comments if any for reporting abuse