MEDICINE

New Docs on the Block

According to medical lore, July is the worst time to be hospitalized because that's when inexperienced med students start clinical training. But is summer really riskier for patients?

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  • Posted By: zuzuglo @ 07/11/2008 9:18:53 PM

    it has become a huge problem for persons coming down with illenss during summer months, as this is holiday time. doctors and nurses are off for the yearly vacations, leaving the hosp and patients in the hands of interns and newbies. when they are not gone vacationing, they sit around making phone calls and talking to fellow workers about the trips, cost, destinations, others experiences and suggestions. and the rest of the year they are caught up with trying to cash in on their "sick" days. if they are not used they do not carry over. so it is difficult to keep the same doctors or people who are familiar with your case around, leaving you to have to go thru expensive unnecessary proceedures because the new people are lost. it would be so much better if hosp staff could stagger their vactions so someone is running the store so to speak.l it frightens me, and has caused me extreme discomfort and fear. and sick days????? people can't get their medical bills paid for while the workers are off using up their deserved days off. what a shame.

  • Posted By: Nins @ 07/06/2008 11:42:36 PM

    Did you know that if McCain is elected you will have to pay income tax on the value of the medical insurance that your employer gives you? Worse still, he is offering a tax break for people who pay their own insurance, BUT only $2,500 for individuals and $5,000 for families.

    Let's say you have a family of four. Your insurance policy costs would be at least $1,500-2,500 per month under a self-pay plan, which cost more than employer group plans. So, you pay $18,000 -$30,000 per year for insurance, and you get to deduct only $5,000 of that. If you paid $25,000 for you insurance, you would be out of pocket $20,000 per year. This is FAR WORSE than the current system, where if you are self employed you can deduct 100% of you medical insurance costs.

    So, if you're not self employed, you would stick with your Employer's plan. Employer plans for a family of four have a value of $900-$1,500 per month totaling 10,800-$18,000 per year. Surprise! On April 15th, you owe tax on all of that as INCOME to you. Say your bracket is 25%, and the value of your Employer medical plan is $14,000. You will OWE THE IRS an additional $3,500, and that's ON TOP of whatever monthly premium you already pay to your employer for your insurance.

    Many analysts say that McCain's new rules would encourage employers to stop offering health benefits. If that happened, then far fewer Americans would be insured than are insured today, because what family of four can afford $18,000-$30,000 out of pocket per year for self-pay health insurance?

    Furthermore, McCain's plan does not require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions of people who self-pay their insurance. People under employer group plans have all of their pre-existing conditions covered. This is a hugely unfair aspect of the current system. Insurance companies can afford to cover the pre-existing conditions of the much larger pool of people with group insurance, but they refuse to pay the pre-existing conditions on the smaller pool of self-pay customers. They have been allowed to price gouge the self-pay customers, which is a form of market manipulation that should be illegal.

    So let's say one of your kids had diabetes and you have high blood pressure, then your employer stops offering insurance. You now have to buy your own, but you and your child are INELIGIBLE due to pre-existing conditions. Oh, yeah, they will let you buy the insurance, but you can't use it for any pre-existing condition until you have paid on time every month for two years. And you know what happens at one year and 11 months? You get a letter saying your policy has been cancelled. I have many patients this has happened to.

    McCain's plan SUCKS.

    It does nothing to help middle class working Americans afford or obtain medical insurance. In fact, it makes the current system WORSE.

  • Posted By: C. MacLean @ 07/02/2008 1:15:13 AM

    Maybe there are checks and balances in place during the day, during the week, in the ICU and on the high-profile surgical floors, but as a former night shift nurse with many years' experience, I can tell you that in the middle of the night and on weekends on many medical floors, it is the first year resident, period. And in July, it is an inexperienced first year resident.

    Yes, they can always wake up their chief resident, but few do. The smart ones rely on the nursing staff, as the article points out. The ones that don't have a clear idea of their limitations make mistakes, sometimes dangerous mistakes - there is no 'system of checks and balances' until the morning, and over the weekend, sometimes not until Monday morning.

    The article also fails to point out that in July, most new graduate nurses are just coming off their orientation, so the nursing staff in a big teaching hospital, particularly on the night shift, may also be new.

    Regardles of what this article claims, I personally advise my friends and family members to avoid admission to teaching hospitals in July. In fact, I generally advise the people I care about to avoid big teaching hospitals in favor of smaller community hospitals any time of the year. My rule of thumb is: only go to a big teaching hospital if you have a rare condition, or have severe trauma; you'll get the physician specialists you can't get any where else. For more routine surgeries, chemo therapy, and medical management, go to a smaller community hospital, it is the superior nursing care that will pull you through.

  • Posted By: olderdoctor @ 07/01/2008 7:06:10 PM

    I thought this was a balanced, revealing look at both the benefits and disadvantages of using teaching hospitals for medical care. Narsule, Ms. Ellison's description of the training process did not imply that medical school graduates are not doctors; she made the fair distinction between those doctors who have and have not finished training. I certainly don't think it's unreasonable to think of graduates from medical school, who haven't completed their internship (or the first year of residency) or the Step 3's, as partial doctors. They cannot, after all, legally practice medicine without supervision. Furthermore, if you had bothered to read the second two pages of the article, you'd have seen the quotes from several physicians. One of these doctors points out the system of 'checks and balances' (was the last time you took a class in the humanities like 3rd grade by the way?) that you mentioned. It's narsholes like you that give doctors a bad name, and I hope I never see you in the hospital.

    • Posted By: narsule @ 07/01/2008 7:44:22 PM

      Dear Olderdoctor,

      In third grade, the advice I received... "Sticks and stones may break your bones, but names will never hurt you," was pretty darn practical. So, there are many great things that come from a well-ground elementary school education.

      Still, the article implies that inexperienced med students take over patient care in July. That is very misleading (not to mention fear-provoking) to the layperson. Interns and residents may be inexperienced, which is why they train. But to not acknowledge that there is no difference between an intern (who has graduated medical school) and a medical student (who hasn't) is very insulting, not only to new interns but to all physicians who have worked 80+ hours a week over many years to be, as you suggest, "full doctors."

      Educating patients about these differences is important. When patients are informed about the types of providers caring for them, however junior they may be, a true therapeutic relationship can be developed, even on July 1st..

      As an olderdoctor, I hope you know the difference. But if you don't, I truly hope I never see you in the hospital, either.

  • Posted By: narsule @ 07/01/2008 4:55:33 PM

    This article is totally wrong and misleading in it's description of the advancement process for medical trainees. For starters, medical students do not replace interns. Rather, students who have graduated medical school... the last time I checked, we called them "doctors" or "physicians"... replace interns. The interns, who are physicians in their first year of training, replace residents after their training period is up. Most importantly, resident physicians who finish training (or residency) don't become full doctors, since they are full doctors already. Rather, they become board certified doctors, or they go onto fellowship training and attain board certification thereafter.

    Furthermore, whatever the initial marginal costs are to medical training, care provided by a resident team supervised by an attending physician (or licensed doctor) has always been proven to be superior to private care, administered by private doctors without residents, because the interns and residents (who in the US are pretty well supervised) provide a system of checks and balances that ensures optimal care for patients.

    It would be interesting to read a column by Ms. Ellison that suggests otherwise. However, for that article, I recommend that the author actually speak with a physician before writing about one.

  • Posted By: narsule @ 07/01/2008 4:55:13 PM

    This article is totally wrong and misleading in it's description of the advancement process for medical trainees. For starters, medical students do not replace interns. Rather, students who have graduated medical school... the last time I checked, we called them "doctors" or "physicians"... replace interns. The interns, who are physicians in their first year of training, replace residents after their training period is up. Most importantly, resident physicians who finish training (or residency) don't become full doctors, since they are full doctors already. Rather, they become board certified doctors, or they go onto fellowship training and attain board certification thereafter.

    Furthermore, whatever the initial marginal costs are to medical training, care provided by a resident team supervised by an attending physician (or licensed doctor) has always been proven to be superior to private care, administered by private doctors without residents, because the interns and residents (who in the US are pretty well supervised) provide a system of checks and balances that ensures optimal care for patients.

    It would be interesting to read a column by Ms. Ellison that suggests otherwise. However, for that article, I recommend that the author actually speak with a physician before writing about one.

  • Posted By: jfp325 @ 07/01/2008 4:43:43 PM

    Doctors being embarrased to ask a nurse or take advice from a nurse is hardly a new thing! 25 years ago in July while working on a pediatrics unit I asked a new intern to please recheck a medication order. I asked him again after he bit my head off...........he had ordered ten times the correct dose of a medication on a 2 month old with cardiac problems. Most nurses I have worked with in my 32 years in the field are willing to help new doctors. The ones who accept it learn and grow. The ones who ask "And where did you go to medical school" don't get nearly as much help nor do they learn as much or become as good of doctors. For the patients' sake it has to be a team effort.

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