A small, but growing, group of activists seeks to reform the funeral industry.
Comment: Find out more and the real story of the funeral business by reading the book,"Does This Mean You'll See Me Naked, A funeral director reflects on 30 years of serving the living and deceased". This book by Robert D. Webster tells the whole inside story and includes ways to save money. Highly recommended reading. BOBBB32
Comment: There's another longer article, by the same author, about the death-care industry up at www.thestranger.com.
Comment: There's another story up about the funeral business, by the same author, at www.thestranger.com.
Comment: There was a very thought-provoking documentary put out in 2003 entitled *A Family Undertaking* regarding the subject of home funerals. I viewed it through Netflix's instant download, but a DVD is also available. Look at your local library or video store also. I'd prefer this option, but hubby and kids won't agree. www.ehomebody.com/blog
Comment: Posted by: dorry@circleoflifeceremonies.com
Comment: I am proud to say I am a Funeral Celebrant colleague of Donna Belk mentioned in the beginning of this article. Besides, her training as a life-cycle ceremonies specialist she is also an expert on home funerals. My comment is about what funeral celebrancy offers. Celebrancy is a 30 year Australian tradition which places special attention on personalizing the experience of ceremony with words and rituals. We create funeral and memorial services for the families that choose to work with us in a way that is meaningful and significant for them. We spend hours meeting with the family and then handcraft the service with the prayers and readings which honor and celebrate their loved one's life, personality, beliefs, wishes and most of all their truth. The family sees every word beforehand and enters this threshold (where hardly anyone wants to find themself) with support, comfort and understanding. After the last words are spoken, I believe the family and friends depart in a space that allows the next stage of mourning and grieving to begin -- but with a sense of care and comfort surrounding them. The Celebrant Foundation & Institute has educated and certified over 400 celebrants throughout North America. The training is demanding and the curriculum is excellent. We appreciate the opportunity to serve and collaborate with funeral homes, or to officiate where-ever the family desires. We feel it's important for all of us to engage in this conversation about death and dying: funeral homes, the deathcare industry, caregivers, hospice, babyboomers, seniors, the home funeral movement and the funeral alliances. As in any industry, most perform their jobs with dignity and integrity. As funeral celebrants, we are dedicated to providing funeral celebrant services to any and all who resonate . www.celebrantusa.org
Comment: I worked in the mortuary industry for two years as an apprentice funeral director and embalmer. Like any competitive industry, it brings the faithful and unfaithful. It pays to do your homework and find out which mortuary in your home town is not owned by one of the "big fours" mentioned in the article. I advise that you go with a family owned business for best results. But even then there are the unfaithful, so do your home work and listen to other people in your community for recommendations. By state law, you have the right to go in to a mortuary and pick up a printed price list, no obligations. Consult with your state mortuary board and find out what is mandated by your state law in regards to embalming and other funeral professional services. I know that for Oregon and Washington, emalming is not required by state law unless there will be a open casket for {public} viewing. For obtaining a casket, yes, there are many alternatives to purchasing a high priced one from the morturary. Costco sells burial and cremations containers at reasonable prices. When my father passed on, my brother and I built his casket. There are individuals out there that build beautiful hand made wooden caskets between 700 hundred dollars on up. Again, do your homework and find out what is available. Even go visit several mortuaries in your home town and talk with funeral directors to see what is repetitive and what stands out as peciluar. I know for many that is unthinkable due to the nature of talking death and the business, but this is reality. And it is important to know what is a neccessity and what is optional so you don't get taken advantaged. I like the article in the fact that it brings awareness, but it exagerates in some places. One option to save cost on your funeral or loved one is to purchase a Pre-Plan Funeral. This allows you to purchase a funeral package at todays prices and that price is secured at your time of death. So please, I would like for everyone to have a pleasant experience in a rather difficult time; do your homework and be educated so you are prepared and in turn can educate others.
Comment: I worked in the mortuary industry for two years as an apprentice funeral director and embalmer. Like any competitive industry, it brings the faithful and unfaithful. It pays to do your homework and find out which mortuary in your home town is not owned by one of the "big fours" mentioned in the article. I advise that you go with a family owned business for best results. But even then there are the unfaithful, so do your home work and listen to other people in your community for recommendations. By state law, you have the right to go in to a mortuary and pick up a printed price list, no obligations. Consult with your state mortuary board and find out what is mandated by your state law in regards to embalming and other funeral professional services. I know that for Oregon and Washington, emalming is not required by state law unless there will be a open casket for {public} viewing. For obtaining a casket, yes, there are many alternatives to purchasing a high priced one from the morturary. Costco sells burial and cremations containers at reasonable prices. When my father passed on, my brother and I built his casket. There are individuals out there that build beautiful hand made wooden caskets between 700 hundred dollars on up. Again, do your homework and find out what is available. Even go visit several mortuaries in your home town and talk with funeral directors to see what is repetitive and what stands out as peciluar. I know for many that is unthinkable due to the nature of talking death and the business, but this is reality. And it is important to know what is a neccessity and what is optional so you don't get taken advantaged. I like the article in the fact that it brings awareness, but it exagerates in some places. One option to save cost on your funeral or loved one is to purchase a Pre-Plan Funeral. This allows you to purchase a funeral package at todays prices and that price is secured at your time of death. So please, I would like for everyone to have a pleasant experience in a rather difficult time; do your homework and be educated so you are prepared and in turn can educate others.
Comment: I recently read a great article that said that we, as a society, have been uncomfortable around the subject of death for a long time. For something that is absolutely certain in life, it's important to try to find comfort and peace around this topic, since there's no escaping it.. Shine On Brightly is a new company that offers beautiful objects to help us celebrate the spirit of those whom we have loved. For a comforting, aesthetically wonderful experience, visit www.shineonbrightly.com
Comment: In Response to yugrac...These Funeral Folks who helped with your father in law took advantage. Many Funeral Directors and others are working very hard to change things. The truth is known by the general public and it will change
Comment: I have to post after reading some of the comments from the funeral directors. What a sham you have created. My father in law recently passed away and it made me sick how much we were charged for some of the services. I am not against anyone making a living but the whole thing is rediculious. He died in Hawaii but was to be burried in Arizona. Yep you guessed it we had to pay 2 funeral homes to handle him. The first one in Hawaii charged us $2,200. Anyone want to guess what they did? The picked him up at the morgue and drove him to the airport that's it nothing more. No enbalming, no mignight run to pick him up, no dealing with the Dr. or the CDC, no death certificate, just a ride to the airport in a nice car. Lets compare that to some other industries. We get outraged when an attorney (yep that's right I think attorneys are more honest)charges $150 per hour. Don't anyone tell Magari but they went to school too. How about a $100 doctors office visit? He's not very important he is only the one trying to save you from death. What about the car dealership? If a car dealer makes $300 over invoice on a new $25,000 car the public screams to high heaven. Look at the charges $350 to drive my father in law to the moselum that was 1000 feet from the service, $175 to rent the golfcart to drive the staff to the same location $550 to open and close the crypt this process consists of removing 4 bolts sliding the casket in sealing it with latex caulk and putting 4 bolts back in and the charges go on and on. So all you funeral directors can take a leap when you insult us about just trying to make a living.
Comment: First, you paid so much for services because you had 2 funeral homes involved. The funeral home in Arizona should have been the only one contacted and you would have avoided paying the $2,200 cost in Hawaii. The funeral home in Hawaii would have been contracted by the one in Arizona and performed what are called "trade services". Second, we don't control airline prices, cemetery prices, or any other cost through a third party, these costs shouldn't be marked up, either. Third, do you know how much it costs to run a funeral home? Salaries, car payments, mortgage payments, insurance, overhead (heat, electricity, etc.). I have a bachelor's degree, take great pride in what I do and in being able to educate people when they come into the place I work, and take great offense to people who complain about things, just because they didn't do their research and contracted with a funeral home who only cared about the bottom line. Finally, a $100 doctor's office visit? Yeah, with insurance picking up the rest. It is amazing how people in our society react to caring for a deceased loved one, but have no problem shelling out $20,00+ for, say, a wedding, that is likely (~50%) to end in divorce. People need to do their research, learn how to talk about death, and get a clue.
Comment: Yes the $2,200 in Hawaii is high - but so is the cost of living in Hawaii. I am sure the $2,200 included embalming because it is state law for airline transportation. If he was not embalmed it is required to be place in a special case for shipment. I am sure the funeral home filed a death certificate in Hawaii so it had to be typed and taken to the doctor to be signed to get the necessary permits. did the $2,200 include the flight to Arizona - we all know the cost of flights with the gas situation. A funeral director/embalmer attends college for 4 years in most states, attends mortuary school for 1 year and then serves a 1 year apprenticeship. This person is then on call 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, 365 days a year. They are exposed to all types of health risks. When you walk into a funeral home you are given a general price list - you know what you are going to pay! With an attorney - you have no idea what you are going to pay!!
Comment: Make your wishes known. For me it will be cremation, I have told my family I dont want people parading past my dead body saying i look good when I am dead.
I am delighted that there are people out there who are willing to save me from myself. I dont know how i came up with anything on my own.
Comment: Yeah, I'm really sure that there's going to be a huge change in this totally corrupt and despicable industry! What a joke. There's always some group of "activists" that are gonna change the world, but it just keeps changing for the worse.
Comment: Nins - your comments have no relevance to the discussion of people who have no need of health care, but have moved to another level. Regardless of the merit of your argument, it is in appropriate for this discussion. Thank you
Comment: Funeral homes do a lot more than most people realize. ???They want full-time pay for part-time work.??? Really? Do you realize that funeral directors are on-call 24/7, work holidays, weekends, and have virtually no chance at family vacations? They have no unions to protect them, and unless they work for big companies, usually have no benefits. They do this all for YOU???to be available to you in your time of need, when you have all those questions that you never thought you???d have to deal with.
Or how about this: do you even know how to fill out and file for a death certificate in your hometown? Do you want to spend your time and fuel getting a doctor to sign it? What if he goes on vacation the day after death? What if the health department rejects the causes of death because they are not in line with the CDC and you have to do the whole process over again? What are you going to do then? Wait with the dead body in your living room?
Or how about if your dad or husband dies unexpectedly, say in a car accident? Are you going to go pick them up at 3am and bring them back home? Do you think the police does this for you? Do you think your local morgue (in a hospital) or coroner is going to keep that body in its cooler for free until you decide what to do?
And let???s pretend for a moment - for the sake of simplicity - that you don???t want a ???viewing??? or visitation, that you don???t need any bathing, restoration, or special preparation of that person you love so much, pretend you just want a simple burial or cremation. Do you know how to secure a burial permit? Do you feel comfortable, in your time of grieving, to negotiate a time and date with your local cemetery? Are you going to place an obituary? Do you know the local paper???s submission deadline? Do you know where your local crematory is? Do you know how to prepare an authorization for cremation that the crematory will demand? Are you going to transport your mom or wife to the cemetery or to the crematory in your own car or truck?
Are you even the legal next of kin? What if you have sisters or brothers that don???t want the same disposition of your mom as you do? Did you know the crematory might legally be able to refuse to cremate? Then what are you going to do? Keep mom - again - in your living room on dry ice until you all come to an agreement?
These are only a few examples of what funeral homes and funeral directors know and do to make death easier to deal with FOR YOU. Unfortunately, the above examples are not exaggerations of the complexity of death???they just scratch the surface of what funeral homes deal with every day. I???m all for people being more educated and aware of their choices???but that must start with people truly understanding what funeral professionals do for them.
Comment: Crooks! It's amazing how they've been able to get away with the things they have. If you look at all the laws in country for the process of death, you'll see that they've almost all have been set-up to benefit the funeral home owners and serve no purpose but to put more money into their pockets. Where is the government oversight? Ooops i forgot, they're always worrying about elections and this stuff probably doesn't get good press!
Comment: You people who keep saying the funeral industry is full iof crooks don't have any idea what you're talking about. Of course there are a few bad seeds, just like in any other industry! There are police officers who bribe and steal (dirty cops), there are doctors who charge too much or give out wrong perscriptions. Of course there are bad people out there, but not all funeral homes are like that! I've grown up in funeral homes. I'm a 4th generation. We've moved all over the country with my dad working for various companies, including the big corrporation in Yakima. Every place i different. I know that in our family business, we try to keep prices as low as possible. A "Sincere and Sympothetic Service, Within the Means of All" is our motto. We often are willing work with people who may have financial difficulty. I don't think people realize how many families never pay off a funeral. They leave us with the tab. Everything is getting more expensive, I don't know why anyone would think the funeral industry would be any different.
Comment: Did you know that if McCain is elected you will have to pay income tax on the value of the medical insurance that your employer gives you? Worse still, he is offering a tax break for people who pay their own insurance, BUT only $2,500 for individuals and $5,000 for families.
Let's say you have a family of four. Your insurance policy costs would be at least $1,500-2,500 per month under a self-pay plan, which cost more than employer group plans. So, you pay $18,000 -$30,000 per year for insurance, and you get to deduct only $5,000 of that. If you paid $25,000 for you insurance, you would be out of pocket $20,000 per year. This is FAR WORSE than the current system, where if you are self employed you can deduct 100% of you medical insurance costs.
So, if you're not self employed, you would stick with your Employer's plan. Employer plans for a family of four have a value of $900-$1,500 per month totaling 10,800-$18,000 per year. Surprise! On April 15th, you owe tax on all of that as INCOME to you. Say your bracket is 25%, and the value of your Employer medical plan is $14,000. You will OWE THE IRS an additional $3,500, and that's ON TOP of whatever monthly premium you already pay to your employer for your insurance.
Many analysts say that McCain's new rules would encourage employers to stop offering health benefits. If that happened, then far fewer Americans would be insured than are insured today, because what family of four can afford $18,000-$30,000 out of pocket per year for self-pay health insurance?
Furthermore, McCain's plan does not require insurance companies to cover pre-existing conditions of people who self-pay their insurance. People under employer group plans have all of their pre-existing conditions covered. This is a hugely unfair aspect of the current system. Insurance companies can afford to cover the pre-existing conditions of the much larger pool of people with group insurance, but they refuse to pay the pre-existing conditions on the smaller pool of self-pay customers. They have been allowed to price gouge the self-pay customers, which is a form of market manipulation that should be illegal.
So let's say one of your kids had diabetes and you have high blood pressure, then your employer stops offering insurance. You now have to buy your own, but you and your child are INELIGIBLE due to pre-existing conditions. Oh, yeah, they will let you buy the insurance, but you can't use it for any pre-existing condition until you have paid on time every month for two years. And you know what happens at one year and 11 months? You get a letter saying your policy has been cancelled. I have many patients this has happened to.
McCain's plan SUCKS.
It does nothing to help middle class working Americans afford or obtain medical insurance. In fact, it makes the current system WORSE.
Comment: Let's separate fiction from fact. This harkens back to ancient Egypt. Fantasy trying to achieve a false reality of immortality. Embalming became popular during the Civil War so soldiers bodies could be returned to their homes for burial. My Mother, father and Grandparent's were brought back for the visitation and private family service to their home. That is what they wanted. I want green burial. I have watched an embalming. Desecration of a body. We are shamed into honoring our dead ones. Didn't they look natural? What beautiful flowers. How big is the tombstone. How many cars in the funeral procession. I ask: Did they die peacefully in their own beds? Do you realize they will return to dust even if it is delayed. Read "Tract" by William Carlos Williams. The body is a shell for the spirit that exists in all of us and makes us alive. Treat the human being's shell with respect, but do it naturally without increasing the carbon footprint for them or their loved ones. Return them to the earth and keep your memories to pass on to others. Village smithies and buggy whip manufacturers had to adapt to the marketplace. Perhaps some others need to adapt also to a greener, more realistic world.
Comment: Completely untrue:
"Alas, funeral prices have rocketed because so many funeral directors no longer have a part-time other job--like the livery stable or furniture store or ambulance service. About 70% of the U.S. funeral homes are doing only 50-100 funerals a year--one or two a week on average. But they want full-time pay for part-time work. Unlike in other businesses, the prices stay high in the areas where there is a glut of funeral homes. Funeral prices are lower on the west coast where the supply and demand for funeral service are in better balance."
Funeral directors with smaller numbers of calls work together generally. Even 50 calls is a lot for a single director to handle. You obviously have no direct knowledge of the funeral industry. In my town we have one independent funeral home (the one with the lowest prices) which has 5 licensed directors and does about 225 calls a year. They are very busy.
Comment: When my infant daughter died... I took her home, bathed her, dressed her, and burried her the next day. She was not embalmed. There was not a funeral home involved. My brother's built the tiny casket, and dug the grave. My minister sister-in-law did the service. It was a beautiful display of love and affection on this child we all would never know. It was a healing experience. We have let the mysteries of death belong to funeral directors for too long. I think in a lot of circumstances, not all, it will be very helpful and healing for families to be involved.
Comment: Although I am only a Mortuary student at this point I am offended by the remarks in this article that suggest all funeral directors are out to soak those who are grieving and in shock. I've met many people in the business since I began my schooling and none of them have ever taught me to try and take advantage of someones grief. As a matter of fact tyhey have taught just the opposite. In any field there are those who reflect negativly on it but I think for the most part the field of Funeral service is filled with men and womwn who really want to help a family when they have lost a loved one. Of couse Funeral homes want to make money and for some reason people see that as a negative thing but they dont see the local grocery store wanting to turn a profit as a bad thing or the local mechanic or the town care wash and so on and so on. Anyone who enters the Funeral service field wants to make money but our first and foremost goal is too help those in need and to try and make a very bad time into less of a bad time if we can. I hope those readiong this will keep an open mind and see that we are mostly good people who care about the families we help very deeply and that a few bad apples are in fact bad but please dont let them be the rule, let them be the exception.
Comment: I'm responding to several posts. At 70 degrees or less, a body is not likely to create a smell problem for the first two or three days. Yes, as one person said, each situation can be a little different. But typically the body starts to shut down about three days prior to actual death and may be quite dehydrated when death finally occurs.
On a trip to the Netherlands three years ago we visited a funeral home that had about 20 private family viewing rooms, the size of a modest bedroom. Families were given their own key card and could visit at any hour of the day or night. Two of them were double rooms with kitchenette and sleeper sofa. No embalming is done. By law they have up to five days before burial or cremation is required. No rampant health problems there.
Home funerals are a logical extension of the hospice idea and the other end of the spectrum from natural childbirth. I had two natural childbirths and one C-section. I was grateful for the knowledge of medical science for that. For recent deaths in our family, three were handled entirely by the family and for two we were grateful for the help of funeral folks.
Alas, funeral prices have rocketed because so many funeral directors no longer have a part-time other job--like the livery stable or furniture store or ambulance service. About 70% of the U.S. funeral homes are doing only 50-100 funerals a year--one or two a week on average. But they want full-time pay for part-time work. Unlike in other businesses, the prices stay high in the areas where there is a glut of funeral homes. Funeral prices are lower on the west coast where the supply and demand for funeral service are in better balance.
Comment: I'm responding to several posts. At 70 degrees or less, a body is not likely to create a smell problem for the first two or three days. Yes, as one person said, each situation can be a little different. But typically the body starts to shut down about three days prior to actual death and may be quite dehydrated when death finally occurs.
On a trip to the Netherlands three years ago we visited a funeral home that had about 20 private family viewing rooms, the size of a modest bedroom. Families were given their own key card and could visit at any hour of the day or night. Two of them were double rooms with kitchenette and sleeper sofa. No embalming is done. By law they have up to five days before burial or cremation is required. No rampant health problems there.
Home funerals are a logical extension of the hospice idea and the other end of the spectrum from natural childbirth. I had two natural childbirths and one C-section. I was grateful for the knowledge of medical science for that. For recent deaths in our family, three were handled entirely by the family and for two we were grateful for the help of funeral folks.
Alas, funeral prices have rocketed because so many funeral directors no longer have a part-time other job--like the livery stable or furniture store or ambulance service. About 70% of the U.S. funeral homes are doing only 50-100 funerals a year--one or two a week on average. But they want full-time pay for part-time work. Unlike in other businesses, the prices stay high in the areas where there is a glut of funeral homes. Funeral prices are lower on the west coast where the supply and demand for funeral service are in better balance.
Comment: In Europe, grave sites are recycled with a new burial taking place in an existing grave every few decades with simple natural decomposition. The concept of a "Green Cemetery" with the land remaining forever wild is a mathematically unworkable model. There simply is not enough land to do that with in the US. The idea of each body having a permanent burial space is uniquely American and only because of the vast undeveloped land our ancestors stumbled upon here. With growing population and greater density, cremation is the only viable alternative to traditional ground burial for the masses.
For the last several hundred years, permanent cemteries and cemetery monuments have eliminated the faceless-ness and historyless-ness of the mass of humanity on earth. To return to simple cremation and memorial-less disposition is to return humanity to a faceless and nameless future.
Traditions are borne and evolve for reasons that often escape us in our narrow present view.
Take some time to contemplate that and not dwell just on the economics of present cost.
Comment: This is a response to Embalmer09's post.
To be an honest funeral director is a great calling. The sad reality is that Funeral Directors do not promote the Funeral Rule, the law. In the 5/2007issue of the Director Magazine ( the magazine of the National Funeral Directors Association. the NFDA admits their goal in Congress to eliminate the Funeral Rule-consumer rights.
Comment: I'm so glad to see someone looking into the funeral industry. Yes, there may be honest ones, but few and far between. I know how they can take advantage. At the young age of 20 I decided to be cremated. I am close to my 51st birthday, and my husband knows,..If your going to spend money on me, you're going to do it while I'm alive, NOT DEAD!
Comment: It's the state laws that the "fair honest and decent" use to their advantage.(See comment by Embalmer09). As long as they're within the law they can remain blameless. I agree that everyone wants to be paid for their services but the funeral industry is dealing with people who are particularly vulnerable. It's just too easy to sell them unnecessary goods and services. The grieving family member may want something that both they
and the funeral director know they can't afford. Wouldn't it be better to discuss this, gently and respectfully, before the fact? I've seen a family member jump in way over her head and the funeral home just smiled. The family came to her rescue before any papers were signed.
Comment: I work in the funeral industry now. Please understand that Funeral Directors do the work that very few others want to do. Like other professionals they go to school for about four years in order to do this work. Why shouldn't they garner a decent wage? Don't pre-plan unless your state requires that your money goes toward the purchase of an insurance policy with a reputable company (a few exist for this purpose alone). And interview the funeral homes in your area so you know you're getting what you want. Putting your money into a savings account at today's interest rates is not a viable alternative to today's rate of inflation. PUT YOUR OWN HOUSE IN ORDER . . . pre-plan.
Comment: I am a student studying to become a Funeral Director. Just a few things to keep in mind. 1)We all work to make money, why should the funeral industry be any different. The law prohibits funeral directors from suggesting that every case must be embalmed; in fact, the law states that it is the responsibility of the Funeral Official to tell the family that unless it is their wish, the body need not be embalmed. Most people want a viewing (this REQUIRES embalming). Basically what I am getting at is, unless you want to have a closed casket funeral, direct burial or direct cremation-- you have to have an embalmer. As discussed earlier, items aren't forced upon the families.... the families pick their merchandise and can simply say no to merchandise deemed unnecessary or unaffordable. There are a wide variety of caskets and outer burial containers that are within anyone's budget. Deciding what merchandise and product to purchase for your loved one who has expired is not for the benefit of the funeral home or the deceased. Actually going through the motion and planning the perfect funeral helps the survivors begin the healing process. Having said this, I must admit that my father passed away nearly three years ago. He was directly cremated. We had a very nice memorial service, but his body was not present. Everything went smoothly and I, to this day, am happy with the decisions made by my father. My mother plans on being cremated as well. I support her decision fully. 2) How come is it that the funeral industry as a whole are considered to be 'crooks', but each and everyone of you have your goto guy, your funeral director who you feel is fair and honest? How can we all be crooks as a whole, but as individuals we're all fair, honest and decent?
Comment: I'm sure not all funeral homes are bad, but I think it's "buyer beware" when it comes to the funeral industry. One can end up paying twice as much for the same casket depending upon where you get it.--I read about two sisters who coincidentally purchased the exact same casket for their husbands three months apart and one sister paid significantly more than the other. In regard to pre-paid plans, I've also read stories about funeral homes dipping into this money and later becoming insolvent so that what someone thought was pre-paid turned out not to be. (It would seem a better option to put the same money in an interest-bearing account.)
My mother worked for a funeral home for a short time many years ago and ended up quitting because of the callousness she witnessed. The funeral director she worked for offered pre-paid plans and made tons of interest off of this money, which is why she was almost pushy with people to get them to sign up for pre-paid plans. This particular funeral director also appeared warm and caring to grieving family members but then would make fun of them behind their back and say awful things about various people as they cried over their loved ones. In addition, my mother was forced to eat her lunch where the bodies were prepared, and this seemed both disrespectful and just plain wrong. I've only seen my mother cry once over a job and this was that job. I have never looked at funeral homes/directors in the same light after I had the inside scoop on the local funeral home in our town.
Comment: Mr. Slocum stated, "ordinary people from every walk of life who are returning to a tradition that even your American ancestors participated in". My great grandmother died at home during the depression. My grandmother, who is now 94 years old, was 14 at the time. My great grandmother was prepared (embalmed) at home, as well as layed out in the living room. To this day, it has left horrible images for my grandmother. Funeral directors did the work, not my family. During the Civil War, Wild West, all through history back to the Egyptians, there were professionals who took care of the dead. It is hard enough to lose someone you love but then to prepare them? I am sorry Sir, your ways will never catch on in my opinion. I recently know of a family that lost their son at the age of 32 to heart failure. Last month he was on vacation with his family, and now he is gone. While hospitalized, his body swelled due to fliud and his body was in bad physical condition at the time of his death he wasn't even viewable at his service. . The family is so shocked by his passing, let alone prepare him themselves for his funeral. You make it sound like its a loving thing to do, and it very well might be, but I feel it is too tramatic on the loved ones left behind.
Comment: rcd11blue, let me know if you'd like to learn how to get the swelling down (at least in the face) of a person who has been on sustained life support.
Comment: I am glad to see so many fine funeral directors commenting on this board. I also think Mr. Slocum has some fine points to make, but keeping a deceased loved one at home is the reason funeral homes evolved in the first place. Funeral homes can be the first step in the grief process, letting go of their loved one. They are not held as a possession. A dead body cannot be held as replevin. Does anybody remember the scene from Gone With the Wind when Bonny Blue was in repose upstairs? How hard it was for Rhett to let her go? Do you think people today are really so different? Most people who die at home today are under the care of hospice, or pass at a hospice facility. Why? Most people simply do not want to face mortality and cannot provide on their own all the care required. How could one think it would be any easier for them when their loved one dies? Also, Mr. Slocum has made no mention of the many micro-organisms and diseases that have evolved and mutated today in response to all the medications that are used. How many people are aware or MRSA, C. Difficille, E. coli and the clostridiums? Do they know what changes to expect when a person dies? Do they know the state laws governing the care of deceased persons. So many variables Mr. Slocum. Colorado has laws governing the funeral industry, but no licensees. Funerals can and are still held in homes, either a traditional type service or memorial services. Churches are also grand establishments for helping families hold meaningful services. But as far as keeping a deceased person at home until you can make all the necessary arrangements for disposition Mr. Slocum, people should be prepared for the unexpected. No two deaths are the same. No two bodies undergo the exact same changes at the exact same rates. I've seen many families want to keep their loved ones warm when death has occurred and wrapped them in several blankets, Tell me Mr. Slocum, do you really think people are going to take the time to learn all they have to know before the time of need or will they wait until after the fact. Yes, an educated consumer is the best customer. A person who walks through the door and knows exactly what they want done makes it much easier for everyone. Those who preplan their funerals make it easiest for those left behind, but even these wishes may change and they are not written in stone. So Mr. Slocum, before you start condemning an entire industry, you really should take time to visit different states, different establishments and see how funeral homes have evolved and why so many people entrust the care of their loved ones to them. Remember, the Hilton had its roots in the upstairs of a saloon or a boarding house somewhere. Many funeral homes started out as furniture shops. It is the people who have driven the evolution of the funeral home out of their need, not vice versa.
Comment: Bravo FCA! Chalk up another bold action to re-empower average Americans in the much needed reformation and open rebellion against our own contrived, corrupt, lobbyist controlled, organized-racketeering, corporate-cratic United States-government. We need more of this type of thinking. Meanwhile, got guns?
Comment: Bravo FCA! Chalk up another bold action to re-empower average Americans in the much needed reformation and open rebellion against our own contrived, corrupt, lobbyist controlled, organized-racketeering, corporate-cratic United States-government. We need more of this type of thinking. Meanwhile, got guns?
Comment: My father went the pre-arranged route three years before he died. I was with him at the time he made the final arrangements for both himself and my mother who was in a nursing home with someone else taking care of her needs since she was unable to take care of herself. That was one of the best things my father ever did and it removed the burden of wondering the rest of your life if we did it the way he would have wanted it done. My father was very much a take charge man among men. He did it his way and my sister and I will forever be greatful. I do not think my family could have done a home funeral, some things are better left to the experts. When a loved one passes on most of us are in no mental state of mind to take care of the final arrangements. I do think the funeral industry needs a watchdog group looking over their shoulder to make sure they are not charging more than a fair amount for their services. As for my wife and I we are thinking about cremation since we have no children or grand children that would want to come to a grave site. If you have not seen the movie "The Bucket List" watch it, great movie and it will give you something to think about.
Comment: Mr.Slocum,
I would like for you to spend one week with me and i will change your vision on the funeral industry. There are alot of so called "funeral directors" in the industry that are just in it for the almighty dollar, but that is a small, very small percent in the industry. There are, like myself, funeral directors who truely care for the families they serve. Yes, I am in business to make a profit just like any other business owner in the world. I am tired of hearing that funeral directors prey on families at their worst time in their lives. No one demands families to buy merchandise that is not needed and that they cannot afford. I tell all of my families not to buy with their hearts, but what they can actually afford to spend. Please come stay with me one week and you will have a completely different outlook on this business.
Comment: One question to ask yourself is, "Would I do this for my child". Many are stating, just toss me away, burn me up, and even flush me down the toilet? Why would you chose such a disposition for yourself? Funerals provide an outlit for your loved ones and the community to grieve together and to pay their last respects. Actions speak lounder than words.
Comment: One would choose such a disposition for oneself because it is JUST a dead body. There are opther outlets for people to grieve if they need to. I would prefer that people celebrate my LIFE not mourn my death. Luckily my friends and family understand the simple straightforward fact that death is just a part of life, and not something to freak out over. Now if someone wants a funeral that is fine but it is a personal choice.
Comment: I'm not saying that you must have a funeral, but what ever disposition you chose, it should be a dignified one. Human life is something to be valued, and when a death occurs it is a serious situation. It's the end of a person's life. You won't ever see them alive again. I'm sorry but I couldn't imagine flushing my own mother down the toilet or anyone for that matter.
Comment: One question to ask yourself is, "Would I do this for my child". Many are stating, just toss me away, burn me up, and even flush me down the toilet? Why would you chose such a disposition for yourself? Funerals provide an outlit for your loved ones and the community to grieve together and to pay their last respects. Actions speak lounder than words.
Comment: My father went the pre-arranged route three years before he died. I was with him at the time he made the final arrangements for both himself and my mother who was in a nursing home with someone else taking care of her needs since she was unable to take care of herself. That was one of the best things my father ever did and it removed the burden of wondering the rest of your life if we did it the way he would have wanted it done. My father was very much a take charge man among men. He did it his way and my sister and I will forever be greatful. I do not think my family could have done a home funeral, some things are better left to the experts. When a loved one passes on most of us are in no mental state of mind to take care of the final arrangements. I do think the funeral industry needs a watchdog group looking over their shoulder to make sure they are not charging more than a fair amount for their services. As for my wife and I we are thinking about cremation since we have no children or grand children that would want to come to a grave site. If you have not seen the movie "The Bucket List" watch it, great movie and it will give you something to think about.
Comment: I apologize for the insertion of question marks where there ought to be apostrophes. Apparently Newsweek's site has some problems when one cuts and pastes from a MS Word document.
Comment:
allergictostupid wrote:
???Comment: Mr. Slocum,
For goodness sakes you have no idea how many people have been found dead and decomposing. You are a loon. Tell me how would feel if you had to clean your son or daughters body after being ran over by a tractor? There's nothing left. They are flat...literally. You tell me you would pick up their body and clean up waht was left of it and bury him or her without losing your mind???????????????????
Oh honestly. I can???t figure out what you???re so upset about, but it???s clearly not about any of the things funeral consumer advocates have said. No one has suggested that families would want to scrape their loved ones??? bodies off the road after a gruesome accident. Where did you get this idea? If you???d actually read the article, and visit some of the Web sites we???ve suggested, I think you???d see that you???re railing against something none of us have ever said. Families that care for their own dead at home are not ???loons??? - they???re ordinary people from every walk of life who are returning to a tradition that even your American ancestors participated in. There???s no need to hyper-ventilate about this; no one is suggesting any of the macabre things you???re writing about.
Josh Slocum
Executive Director
FCA
Comment: Who cares about a dead body. If it was legal and someone close to me died I'd go pick up the body, wherever it was, in whatever condition it was in, burn it, and spread the ashes around a growing tree. Now, that's Green folks.
Comment: y r these companies selling out to these corps? MONEY.
Comment: Google "SCI"
Comment: Mr. Slocum,
For goodness sakes you have no idea how many people have been found dead and decomposing. You are a loon. Tell me how would feel if you had to clean your son or daughters body after being ran over by a tractor? There's nothing left. They are flat...literally. You tell me you would pick up their body and clean up waht was left of it and bury him or her without losing your mind????????????????
Comment: If you really want to read what's going on Google "Funeralgate" and follow all the links. You WILL be shocked.
Comment: Or here's one...you get a call that your son or daughter has been killed in a car accident and you need to pick their body up.
You get there...the steering wheel has crushed their chest and theleft side of their face is is now on their right. Okay, you are going pick them up and hurl them into the ground? Yeah. Sure. I don't work for a funeral co but some of this stuf is beyond stupid.
Comment: And and oh yeah, please remember rubber gloves so as to keep any Hepatitis from spreading and getting any fluids or goo on you.
Hey why even have the ambulance come. Dead is dead. You can wrap them in a natural cotton sheet and oh,no..no...just leave them natural and let nature take care of your loved-ones body. Fooey on all this glitz and glam of those silly caskets as a final farewell and so what they look ten times bigger than when they were alive and smell...that's natural.
Well, what killed them? HEy who cares...death is natural. Right?
Comment: I would reserve the casket for "Newsweek."
Comment: I agree!
Comment: I would reserve the casket for "Newsweek."
Comment: Oh God here we go. WHo picks up grandma from the hospital? Who picks up the a dead son or daughter killed in a car accident? Where do they put them? Where? How about you pick them up-your family member, Just put a sheet over your car seats cause sometimes it gets bloody and messy. What killed them? Was it foul play? Eh? Who knows? We can't be having all that forensics stuff. Then you can put grandma or little Bobby in a large paper box and bury them in your backyard.
Comment: Oh, how I agree!! Who would pick up Great grandmother at the nursing home after she has been in a fetal positon for over a year? Or someone who died of an infectious disease? Or a car accident? This whole article is from a make the earth green fairytale! Not a deaths are peaceful folks!
Comment: I "planted" many papier-mache coffins in pine rough boxes while in high school in the 60's. Isn't that green enough? My Dad was caretaker of the cemetery.
Comment: Hear Hear put me in a box Frigerator size is fine and bury me in a good old manure pile thank you very much. The cheaper the better i say my wife will need the money for other things.
Comment: Why waste $$$$$$ on pimped out metal coffins with liners and gold trims when the dead wouldn't know, nevermind feel the difference?!? Oh, and embalming? What a joke and a waste! The dead is going to rot anyway. Just stuff me in a pine box, hurl me into the ground and I'm good to go!
Comment: Why waste $$$$$$ on pimped out metal coffins with liners and gold trims when the dead wouldn't know, nevermind feel the difference?!? Oh, and embalming? A waste! The dead is going to rot anyway. Just stuff me in a pine box, hurl me into the ground and I'm good to go.
Comment: If a person has "PREPAID" for a funeral and cost rise (as stated in the comment from mallieb) the family DOES NOT make up the different. There some things that can not be prepaid for and must be purchased at the when the time comes. That is the why you would want to prepay. It is totally against the law to do this. You should get your receipts and contracts and have them reviewed. Now if the person "PREPLANNED" then that would be different. Prepaid is just what it says you have paid for goods and services. Preplan would be making your wishes know and no money changes hands. As for sulldog30 I would anything I would think your Grandmother would be disgusted by the fact a business that was your family for more than 100 years was sold in the first place. You come down on SCI when you clearly do not have all the information that you need to make the statements you are making. SCI does many good things for the areas they are in. They also do allot of outstanding work around the world. Do they have problems? Yes. They are a corporation and as we all know all corps have there good and bad points. But make the statement you made was very irresponsible of you. Get the facts then speak....
Comment: omg this is what I have hopeing would happen as it cam close to my time to die. I have all ways kinda wanted to be eat by wolves and *** over a cliff and push up real flowers. I hated the idea of greed fallowing me all the way to my grave... thank you the Widow
Comment: omg this is what I have hopeing would happen as it cam close to my time to die. I have all ways kinda wanted to be eat by wolves and *** over a cliff and push up real flowers. I hated the idea of greed fallowing me all the way to my grave... thank you the Widow
Comment: My family sold to SCI 11 years ago. Since then prices have tripled and service has suffered. Families that use to patronize our home are now seeking services at less expensive homes. My grandmother would be outraged to see this god rest her soul! Someone in SCI's corporate office will know who I am! I challenge you to call to discuss! what is going on is a disgrace to what my grandmother and father built! Steve S.
Comment: How much was a gallon of gas 11 years ago? How about a loaf of bread or a gallon of gas? Why did your family sell out to SCI in the first place? Why didn't you take over "What your Grandmother and FAther built"?
Comment: Our family owned a funeral business for 100 years. We were purchased by SCI 11 years ago. Since then prices have tripled and service has suffered. The large corporations are the reason why prices are so high. Locally owned funeral homes police themselves with prices. Large corporations with large market shares do not care! My Grandmother would be disgusted at what is going on in the funeral industry. If anyone in upper SCI management sees this, you will know who I am! Steve S.
Comment: y did you sell out? MONEY!!!!!!!!!!
Comment: Owning a funeral home means being on call for work 24-7 365 days a year. You NEVER get a break. Imagine your work calling you at 1 a.m. 3 nights in a row to come into work and you HAVE to go in? How much would you want to make for living a life like that? For missing out on your children's birthdays, your friend's weddings, family Christmas's?
Comment: How much was a gallon of gas, milk or a loaf of bread 11 years ago? Also, if your "Family Owned for 100 years" that your grandmother and father built was important to you, why did your family sell to SCI instead of continuing the family tradition of serving families? $$$$$ would be my guess.
Comment: Yes better educations will eliminate high cost. However, when a funeral is prepaid and preplanned and the cost rise, The family must pay the difference. That's just fair business in any business. For example my great aunt paid for her funeral 60 years in advance. Now, is it fair for the Funeral Director to absorb the increase? No, consumers must be knowledgeable and fair.
Comment: The family DOES NOT pay the differnce. You need to have a knowledge of the preneed industry BEFORE you make comments.
Comment: The family only pays the difference if the prepaid funeral is Guaranteed. Meaning, the funeral home is guaranteeing that the funeral is paid in full for the future funeral. Guranteeing is a sketchy idea. As always, buyer beware
Comment: You are wrong! The Funeral Director had your Great Aunts money for 60 years and if he had invested as he should have he would have two or three times the current cost. Believe me when I say they never lose anything, I have buried all of my family and am just waiting my turn next.
Comment: yes it is fair to expect to get what you paid for. They should not take upfront money as pre pay if they do not wish to shoulder the cost to hold some ones money for 60 years has got to net you some intrest at the bank and match that by 1,000. who have done so... Yes they should fulfll thier oblagations that the reason someone pays in advance for so thier kids or grandkids wont have to try to pull moneys out of their arsses while greaving
Comment: That means that the funeral director has your great aunts money for 60 years. Put into an interest bearing account, I think that the interest earned would be enough to cover the inflated costs.
Comment: mnewco - please tell me you're joking!! How can a person remain alive after being embalmed???
Comment: I worked for 15 year as a minister in Switzerland conducting hundreds of funerals and working closely with a funeral director whose mission statement was "Give death back to the family". Here simple wooden caskets are common, embalming and vaults are outlawed. The funeral industry stateside is a big business which has taken death and a whole lot of money away from grieving families.
Comment: fer
Comment: I worked for 15 years as a minister in Switzerland working very closely with undertakers who mission statement was "Give death back to the family". in Switzerland there is no embalming, vaults are illegal, caskets and urns are wooden and simple. The U.S. funeral system and it's players play on a culture of denial and take advantage of people at a vulnerable moment in their lives and funelled money into lobbying efforts which have produced ordinances and laws which are shameful, disgusting, ecologically damaging as well as morally questionable. The goodness people are starting to think and question and report on this abuse.
Comment: I noticed most post here are by people in the bussiness.Well I was shocked when my father and sister died just months apart.The family didn't have enough money to pay cash for the $10,000.00 funneral .Their budget deal.But planning for the future Dad had a $100 thousand life insurance policy.The funeral home charged 5% of the total amount of the policy for us to use it to bury him.That was $5,000.00 the funeral home got for "fronting us $2,000.00 " for the part of the cost we did not have on hand.Then when my sister died a couple months later ,They where very upset that we could pay cash for her funneral and they could not get tier 5% of here life policy.
Comment: 5% of $2000 is a hundred bucks! You were fronted the full amount of the policy. You could have waited the usual 90 plus days for the insurance company to pay on the policy. Don't slam the funeral home, they have bills to pay too. Will a car dealership let you drive off the lot with a new car and you send them a check 90 days later? I don't think so. You didn't mention that your family recieved the entire amount of the policy (100K) in a very short of amount of time, similar to a rapid refund on income tax refunds.
Comment: Maybe you should learn to read!The funeral home wanted the whole 10 grand paid up front or no funeral!We had 8 grand on hand.That wasn't good enough.It had to be the full amount.For them to use the life insurance as collareral for the 2 grand balance they said it was company policy to charge 5% of the total amount of the policy.= 5 grand.We had to sign the policy over to them.After 90 days we got our money in the form of a check from them minus the 7 grand.THE 2 GRAND OWED ON THE FUNERAL AND 5 GRAND CUSTOMERY CHARGE ON LIFE POLICY.
Go put yourself in a coffin of your own morron, if you can afford one.
Comment: I am a teacher at career college. One of the classes that I teach is an elective one on death and dying. Most of the students have never dealt with any one that was dying much less having to deal with end of life decisions for a loved one who has passed away. I take my class to a mortuary and the funeral directors do a fantastic job of not only allowing the class to learn about the end of life decisions, but also to see a compassionate business who provides a service that not many people are willing to be associated with. The class is allowed to ask pricing questions, burial questions, observe a cremation in process, and if there is an embalming with permission from the family they are even allowed to observe that. This is all done with compassion, respect, and honesty for the deceased and the family. My students come away with the knowledge that the end of life is not always what we want, but if we prepare, it can be what is affordable for our family that is left. Burial, cremation, cryogenics, or donation are all very personal decisions concerning the end of our life here on earth. Although we do have some very dishonest people in the funeral business, we have some very good, decent honest people who are just trying to make a living doing what most people do not have any idea on how to handle the details of the most devasting event of their lives. All facets of our lives have dishonest providers. We need to be savy consumers, and prepare for that final decision before it happens. Doing so makes those few days after the passing so much easier for those left behind.
Comment: I have been a funeral director in several states and have authored a book for families helping them with their funeral cost. Eventually all funeral directors will be cooperating with folks on home funerals and green burials. Just as in any profession there are good and bad. The FCA and articles like this do everyone a great service. It will happen just like cremation happened.
Comment: As a former funeral service professional, I want to thank you for encouraging this debate. In a rapidly changing world such as ours, tradition, ritual, and meaning are evolving as quickly as the means available to communicate those changes. Secondly, I would like to take this opportunity to recognize Mr. Slocum for his long-standing dedication to providing sound, thoughtful, and fair information to the funeral consumer, and the industry. He has performed a great service in his career. I would also like to point out that the death care industry has it's good and bad characters, just as any business or profession does. For the most part, family owned funeral homes have a fine, and enviable reputation in the communities they serve. Funeral directors are neighbors, civic leaders, and volunteers in every town and city in the nation, and they have a long history of giving to their communities. The recent conglomeration of the industry by several major international corporations seems to has somewhat sullied that fine reputation, likely due to the conglomerate's first responsibility to their shareholders, rather than their customers and neighbors. Every funeral director I have ever known has been willing to forego profit when the family could not afford the most basic service, and infants, civil servants killed in the line of duty are most frequently buried at cost, or at no charge whatsoever. Lastly, when Jessica Mitford wrote her so called expose of the industry in the 1960's, the average funeral was about $1,000.00. Today, it is true, that cost has risen to nearly $5,000.00. But, a large portion of this rise is due to the Federal Funeral Rule, which requires funeral directors to itemize every service and every item available for purchase in their establishment. No other business is dictated to by the Federal Trade Commission at the level the funeral industry is. What other business must provide you with a price list even before you step foot in the sales room? Just to compare, when funeral were a thousand bucks, automobiles were between two and three thousand, a hamburger was fifteen cents, and a new top of the line color television was about two hundred dollars-go figure!
Comment: That was an incredibley unfair article. Althought it certainly doesn't surprise me of Newsweek, considering how liberal and one sided Newsweek has gotten of late.
By and large, by a very great percentage, the funeral business is honest and supportive of whatever the consumer wants to do. The funeral business provides cremation, green caskets and any kind of alternative service the consumer wants. It's annoying to have every funeral home tarred for one or two bad apples, which there are in every industry. The funeral business provides it's own licensing watchdogs to look for just such instances of dishonesty. Misbehavior is dealt with very effectively to keep just this kind of thing under control and regulated, and this system works very well.
I have been a licensed funeal director for more than 25 years. Over the years I have seen the funeral business change itself to provide for the changing desires of their customers. The one major desire of almost every single funeral director that devotes his or her life to this business is that the the consumer be happy and that their loved one gets whatever kind of service that the family wants. It's not up to us to decide what they choose. We provide whatever the cunsumer wants.
One more thing. The article provided an example of the dishonest funeal business by pointing out the actions of an uneducated hospital staff. That isn't the blame of the funeral home. Most states allow the family of a deceased person to handle the dispositon themselves and funeral homes are well aware of this fact. It's not the funeral business's fault that it came into exsistance, and continues today, because by and large most people absolutley do not want to do this for themselves. The funeal business provides what the customer wants, and when that changes the funeral business changes too. This assertion of rampant dishonesty is unfair and untrue. The real truth is that funeral homes are by and large honest and funeral directors efforts on behalf of grieving families are received gratefully. The extremely rare instance when the family desires to take a larger role in the disposition of the deceased is supported and assisted.
Comment: I already made my funeral plans. I have stated that I wish to be cremated, then flushed down a toilet, with everyone saying, "there he goes!" with my best freind saying, "ops, I have to use the toilet!
Comment: To the fellow that wants his ashes flushed down a toilet---I have a related story for you. Some years ago an elderly woman died and wanted her ashes poured into center stream of a remote stretch of the Missouri River. It was decided that the best way to honor her request would be from the air. They took the door off a small aircraft, flew low over the exact spot in the river, and poured. Unfortunately, the vortex from the prop wash caused about half of the ashes to swirl back into the plane---into the eyes and hair of the passingers and all over the instruments.
The lesson to be learned here is---make sure you have someone who knows what they are doing in charge. In your case, might I suggest you invite a plumber to your "ceremony". Good luck.
Comment: Please see http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/side/5709726.html
for another aspect of green burials.
Comment:
??? If there is no risk involved, why does my husband need hepatitis shots? Why does he need to wear protective clothing????
REPLY FROM JOSH SLOCUM: You are confusing occupational risks with at-home, family practices. Your husband is dealing with numerous bodies of unknown provenance. Just like hospital workers, he has no idea what sort of germs the person had, and often doesn???t even know the cause of death. In ad
