Obama’s No-Brainer on Education

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  • Posted By: RexC @ 07/14/2008 9:24:13 PM

    The long-term strength of the U.S. school system comes, in my view, from our early realization that we need to teach children to think independently and be creative as opposed the historic trend, in a large part of the world, where education meant learning rote answers to a set of standard questions. Does Jonathan Alter want to have some education Czar list the questions that every child must know without thought of individual differences and without sufficient resources?

    Who better to assess a child's progress than well-paid teachers motivated by feeding individual children's interests, working in small well-supplied classes, and receiving great continuing education and thoughtful mentoring by their peers?

    No Child pins everything on external assessment and punishment for failure. Instead we should be fostering individual creative learning and putting resources into teachers' success.

  • Posted By: willnotvoteobama @ 07/14/2008 9:07:12 PM

    ALL OF MY CHILDREN WERE HOME SCHOOLED AND ALL WENT TO COLLEGE AND 4 ARE IN THE MILITARY JUST LIKE DAD WAS!! A PUBLIC SCHOOL IS A GOVERMENT SCHOOL AND DEPENDING ON WHO'S IN OFFICE THATS WHAT THEY WILL LEARN AND BOY HAVE WE HAD SOME REAL WINNERS! WINK WINK BUT MOST OF THEM WERE DEMOCRATS !!! P.S I DID NOT GO TO COLLEGE I WENT TO WAR HOOORAHHH!!!!!!!!! AND LOVED FIGHTING FOR MY COUNTRY AND NO I WAS NOT WILLING TO DIE FOR MY COUNTRY BUT WAS DAMN SURE WILLING TO KILL FOR IT !!!!

  • Posted By: nate31 @ 07/14/2008 8:39:56 AM

    As a fairly new member of the teaching community I will tell you that it doesn't take long to figure out many of the teachers are not good, and in some cases terrible. Higher pay may help to recruit a larger pool of talent to chose from. However, the problem is larger. There is a contempt for teachers among parents. They hate that the teachers have the audacity to assign homework and make their kids work hard. At the same time it is the teachers' fault that their kid is acting up in class or that they didn't pass. America needs to wake up! Hard work is a good thing!
    I agree that teachers should be let go for poor performance, but I also agree that standardized tests aren't the answer. Tough call on this one but an article that spurs debate is always a plus!

    • Posted By: loriw @ 07/14/2008 8:44:12 PM

      Parents should be let go for poor performance. Teaching is hard work and even harder now that so many kids are undisicplined. School administrators don't make teachers' jobs any easier when they say that it is ok for kids to have and use cell phones in class. Heck, lets let Jane and Dick bring their video gaming systems in too... So before we bash all the teachers let's take a good look at the kids and the learning environment.

  • Posted By: pearsoncrz @ 07/14/2008 3:23:39 PM

    Sounds like Alter is pandering to all those just graduated teachers who can't get jobs because the older more experienced teachers already have them.

    Fire the old, hire the new, because new has to be better, doesn't it?

    No. New is not always better. And standardized texts only lead teachers to teach the test, not teach students how to learn.

    Usually the best teachers are given the worst students precisely because those students need the best teachers to learn anything at all. Punishing the best teachers because they are working with the worst students, the ones with learning problems, because those students can't score well on standardized texts is just plain stupid.

    If you want the schools to improve, the parents have to be more involved, It isn't about testing, it's about interaction and support and getting the whole community involved in educating the next generation.

    What was it Hillary Clinton wrote?? It Takes a Village???

    Too bad we don't have the best candidate running for the job of President. Senator Clinton would know how to get this kind of thing organized. Obama hasn't ever done anything of this sort before. He only knows how to spend unlimited amounts of money in campaign, how to manipulate the system so that the person with the most votes doesn't win the nomination. He has divided the democratic party on the basis of race, sex, age and educational status - and now Alter is working to help him do the same thing to the country as a whole.

    • Posted By: loriw @ 07/14/2008 8:37:36 PM

      No thanks on having the Clintons back in the White House. Bill Clinton taught our young people that having oral sex is not sex but if you get caught not having sex just lie about it. Is it any wonder that we have kids as young as middle school having oral sex right in the class rooms now? I raised 2 kids during the Clinton years so I know what I am talking about. Hillary lied about sniper fire. I don't want the Clintons teaching my grandchildren that Presidents lie. The Clintons seem to think it's OK to steal too. Great lessons.

  • Posted By: raywat @ 07/14/2008 3:50:42 PM

    Alter overlooks the insidious campaign to lower salary expenses by pushing older, veteran (more expensive) teachers into retirement. Tactics such as bad scheduling, overloaded or lopsided class assignments of disciplinary, learning disabled, or special education students can quickly overwhelm even the best of them. Ridding the school of the higher salary but costing the school the expertise, enthusiasm, and mentoring capabilities of the veteran.

  • Posted By: mionshe @ 07/14/2008 3:49:42 PM

    I think that Alter is a little out of touch, maybe he should go sit in a fifth grade inner city classroom, not just for a day or a week, he should sit in for a month and see how things really are.

  • Posted By: raywat @ 07/14/2008 3:45:10 PM

    Alter focuses on the insignificant number of teachers fired for incompetence. Mostly overlooked is the insidious campaign to push older teachers into retirement thereby reducing their high(er) salaries. Often it is precisely those veteran teachers who most strength teaching corps and standards in their respective schools.

  • Posted By: mionshe @ 07/14/2008 3:45:08 PM

    I think that Alter is a little out of touch as to what really goes on in these schools. Maybe he should sit in a 5th grade inner city classroom for a year?

  • Posted By: pearsoncrz @ 07/14/2008 3:39:01 PM

    I wonder if Alter is simply trying to get the number of posts to his article up by writing this piece if nonsense, which is clearly intended to piss teachers off enough for them to write a response here.

    No response is worse than criticism in today's infotainment news environment.

  • Posted By: collie5280 @ 07/14/2008 3:27:57 PM

    If you want good teachers, then you need to help them with the discipline. Students are out-of-control and teachers don't get support from anyone. They just try to survive; the students run the schools and the administration lets them.

  • Posted By: pearsoncrz @ 07/14/2008 3:14:50 PM

    Alter is so worshiping at the alter of Obama that it is sickening. The federal government can't grant teachers pay raises, that is something left to each state. And each state has its own way of measuring qualifications, performance, and criteria for tenure.

    Voters who want change in education, who want things to improve, should get involved with school board elections, and state funding legislation, and the school's PTA/PTO, and volunteer in their children's classrooms.

    Education is a non-issue, except for Obama's pandering to the young who want to go to college without having to pay for it. Let the old folks pay for it with their taxes, twenty-somethings shouldn't have to work while they are in college, and they shouldn't be expected to make the grades that would qualify them for scholarships either. We should jsut give it to them in return for two weeks of volunteer work.

    Right.

  • Posted By: Photogal @ 07/14/2008 2:53:46 PM

    Mr. Alter's implication that standardized testing somehow is essential to measure teachers' performance in the classroom is nothing more than a strawman argument - at best. The only thing that standardized testing measures is any given student's willingness to regurgitate facts. It doesn't come close to gauging the teacher's performance in the classroom.

  • Posted By: Finnigan @ 07/14/2008 1:58:18 PM

    Christy:

    I think that an IEP is an "individual education plan", if the term is used in the same way as here. Generally they are used for students who are encountering difficulty in school for various reasons.

  • Posted By: ImaTeacher @ 07/14/2008 7:55:39 AM

    One other thing - someone PLEASE tell me how I am supposed to make my students care what their scores are?
    A child's standardized test score is not included in his or her grade (they come in over the summer after students have already been promoted) and there are no consequences for the child who chooses to "Christmas tree" a score sheet. How am I supposed to change the attitude of a child who looks me straight in the eye and tells me that he does not want to make a high score because then he will be placed into a harder class that will require more attention and homework than an "easy" class?
    A local high school announced to its faculty that because of NCLB and its stance on graduation rates, no student will be given a score of below 70% in any class until the child has had the ENTIRE SEMESTER to make up everything missing homework to failed exams.
    Can you please tell me how I am supposed to fight this? Oh, and please, tell me again the part about it's the union's fault my school system vacuums! I just *love* a good story!

  • Posted By: cbinpa @ 07/14/2008 7:44:25 AM

    Please, Mr/Ms Conservative. Would you please stop blaming the nasty "liberals" and start educating your self? The truth is, a high standard of living, including low unemployment, occurs when taxes are HIGHER, not lower. Learn some history.
    Now, about education. Good teachers leave the profession year after year because of parents who demand but don't contribute, parents who refuse to hold their children accountable and the administrators who fear lawsuits. Let teachers do their job and support their efforts. Are they all great? Of course not. But many are, and the good ones are frequently giving up in the face of an impossible job. More money? Maybe. How about fewer students, more support, and parents who work WITH their children's teachers instead of against them. Oh yeah, and it will cost. Sorry. Give up your luxuries, your junk food your entertainment habit and your big cars, America and start investing your time and your money into your children's education.

  • Posted By: estherk32 @ 07/13/2008 1:44:42 PM

    Please allow me to clear your misconceptions about charter schools. I worked at a KIPP school in Houston, Texas. At that time, KIPP was not required to provided any services to special needs students and could ask them to leave the school, which they did. They also used humiliation and corporal punishments as incentive for the students to succeed. Students were made to stand all day if they did not do their homework and publicly embarrassed for vairous infractions.The students who could not or would not conform were kicked out. Students were told that their parents did not know how to help them like the teachers did. I left because it was like working for a cult. The everyday teachers and schools in any city do not have the luxury of hiring and firing their students like KIPP did. They also have to abide by state and federal mandates dictated by NCLB unlike KIPP. Please stop comparing apples to oranges and actually investigate the charter schools before you laud them.

    • Posted By: ImaTeacher @ 07/14/2008 7:43:40 AM

      Well said!

    • Posted By: loriw @ 07/13/2008 6:43:56 PM

      I attended meetings in our school district and from the "sales pitch" for charter schools you'ld have thought they were better than sliced bread. The charter school option failed and after reading your post I'm glad it did. Yikes!

  • Posted By: teacherandmom @ 07/13/2008 3:45:52 PM

    I am one of those teachers who you are criticizing. I sacrifice time with my family to help students in any way I can. I work extra hours both at school and home trying to teach students in the best way I can. I have taught in 3 different states, mostly with at risk students. The problems are the same everywhere. Education is controlled locally and most people( and I don't mean educators) resist any other way, because they think their schools are great and don't want "those kinds of kids" in their schools. Most of the people I work with are hard working individuals, not the beauracrats you imagine them to be. I taught in what was considered a "good" school and I have taught where the test scores are low. I'm the same teacher I was in both places but the results are different because the students are different.
    I am so tired of being criticized everyday that I would to be willing to see drastic changes. Let anyone with a college degree become a teacher. Since so many people are apparently waiting, as you suggest, to get these jobs that ineffective teachers hold that would solve some of the problems. We'll see how many people are willing to take on this responsibility. If the teacher's unions aren't providing the answers, what would you suggest happen? Hiring "effective teachers" is so vague. How would you do this? What pool would they come from? Where I teach now they can't find enough people at all and in rural areas it's even worse. The reason they may not fire people very much is because half of all teachers leave the profession within 5 years. I would love to hear concrete suggestions rather than criticism.

    • Posted By: ImaTeacher @ 07/14/2008 7:35:57 AM

      Oh my! I could have written this! Yes, three states in a fourteen-year-long career, and in each state, each district, my (students') scores were different based on the socio-economic status of my children.
      I, too, work long hours, take time AND money away from my family, and dedicate myself wholeheartedly to the education of my students. What I cannot do is follow them home and make them eat breakfast, do their homework, or make their parents pay attention to what time they go to bed at night. I can't force them or their parents to value an education, I can't heal their minds of the damages of prenatal drugs, alcohol, or poor genetics.
      Every year, my children make gains whether they are in the top ten percent or the bottom ten. Every year, I put my heart and soul into what I do only to hear from the government or the media that it is not enough because I cannot bring children with IQ's of 80 to grade level.
      I am a teacher, not a miracle worker. Until the law is able to make accomodations for US based on the composition of our classrooms, then I am afraid that we will not be judged realistically or fairly.
      By all means, fire those of us who are inept, apathetic, and ineffective - but make sure that, before you do, you are able to do so fairly. I promise you this much: those teachers on the other side of town, the ones whose teach the children of the doctors, lawyers, and other professionals, would not have the faintest clue as to what to do with the children that I work with every day.

      Oh - and the part about replacing us... HAHAHAHAHA!!! NOBODY wants *my* job! I'm in the school that they use to threaten other teachers. I'm just twisted enough to like being where I am really needed. : )

    • Posted By: loriw @ 07/13/2008 6:38:58 PM

      Thank you for your dedication. Teachers aren't just teachers any more they have to be pseudo parents, disciplinarians who may not phsically discipline, classroom cops, social workers, "nurses", and the list goes on. The pay stinks. The worst part of the job is probably dealing with the parents. Who would want the job. Not me. Teachers are having to do more and more with less and less...

  • Posted By: gramsci @ 07/14/2008 6:58:58 AM

    Only in America can one hear so-called "liberal" columnists demand the (further) destruction of labor unions so that we can fire more people. If teachers are measured "incompetent" based on "failed" test scores (i.e., as determined by "annual yearly progress" according to No Child Left Behind), then around one-quarter of teachers are worthy of being fired. In a field that is poorly compensated relative to other professions -- and generally blamed for other people's failures, namely, oblivious parents and government policy makers, I am interested in how Mr. Alter envisions replacing 25% of all those who presently teach. If I was dictator for a day, journalists like Alter would be forced to teach a few months in a struggling school before writing about my profession.

  • Posted By: BusinessMgr1 @ 07/14/2008 3:07:55 AM

    Jonathan - Finally ! Someone with the courage to take on this liberal sacred cow and call it what it is - a roadblock to improving education in the United States. As a Business Manager for a public school in Ohio, I can tell you that each time negotiations begin for a new union contract, its like the district is being held hostage to the threat of strikes if the union doesn't get the money they think they deserve. Understanding that a 3% salary increase on the base is not really a 3% increase. In most districts, you have to couple that with an increment for just being in the classroom for another year. In our district that can change a 3% salary increase to a 7% increase - all with iron clad job security and benefits that are the envy of the private sector .. (180 day work years, fully paid medical insurance in many cases and generous sick and personal leave time). I'd be thrilled to see Obama or McCain really put the students first and tell the NEA and the AFT to get serious about education .. not about entitlement and protecting incompetent teachers!

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