Quantcast
 
 
 
Top Story
Sarah Palin: An Apostle of Alaska
My Journey to the Top
 
 
Latest News
US holds off on civilian nuclear pact with Russia
 
 
expand
JUSTICE

Cops and the Mentally Ill

How police can better handle emotionally disturbed citizens.

Newsweek Web Exclusive
Jul 31, 2008 | Updated: 9:17  a.m. ET Jul 31, 2008

« Return to Article

 
Discuss
 
Member Comments
  • Posted By: SharedThought @ 08/29/2008 1:05:44 PM

    Comment: It's ironic that mentally ill persons are so often urged of the importance of taking their medications, keeping appointments with professional counsellors, etc. ...So, when government, at various levels, cuts back on sources of these things for the mentally ill, a mixed message is unintentionally conveyed, i.e., "Just HOW important can co-operating with these things REALLY be, if the sources where I used to get the have been eliminated, have been treated by society as DISPENSIBLE?"

  • Posted By: decoyscounsel @ 08/21/2008 2:26:59 PM

    Comment: It matters for whom you vote! We can thank Ronald Reagan who saw a savings in closing down mental hospitals to send patients to community -based care. Problem was, no funds followed. Throughout the country mental health workers sent the patients for whom they could provide no service onto the next venue. Thus the term:bus therapy. The situation has gotten only worse. Families have no support services, case managers have no support, and patients have no care. But we have saved so much money in tax cuts. The American public has become so detached from its responsibility, so addicted to shallow political viewpoints, and so seduced by its own self-absorption that we may have deserved what we have now received. We will certainly be remembered for what we have not had the will to do.

  • Posted By: neo8260 @ 08/06/2008 7:25:00 PM

    Comment: I was a Los Angeles Police Officer for 14 years. In 1989 I shot and killed a schizophrenic man named Donald Jamme in Hollywood, CA. Mr. Jamme thought he was a cyclops and had disemboweled his apartment building manager who had come to his door to evict him. It was a sad situation for everyone involved, especially for Mr. Jamme, who in my opinion never should have decompensated to the point where he got to without someone having been there to intervene. Unfortunately this situations have continued happening over the years since deinstitutionalization occurred. When will we wake up to the fact that we threw the baby out with the bathwater on this one. We need to have a State Psychiatric Hospital system where the disenfranchised can be cared for and monitored until they are truly ready to be released into the community. What good is freedom if it all it provides is a life on the street, with victimization, street drugs, crime and violence, all the while the mentally ill individual becomes a criminal and scores out prison sentences by accumulating convictions. The Mental Health Courts are a separate but equal system of jurisprudence that will someday be viewed as having been unconstitutional because of the basic procedural shortcomings that cause mentally ill defendants to be coerced into accepting plea bargained convictions. I am in a Forensic Psychology Master's Progam today. I am also now a mental health consumer myself. Postraumatic Stress Disorder is a reality of life for those of us who have to kill in the line of duty. I plan to someday treat patients with the diagnosis. I hope to make a difference before the folks on the street shooting it out with the police are our returning war veterans. This is a tragedy that must be avoided at all costs.

    • Posted By: flawedexistence @ 08/06/2008 22:05:04

      Comment: You have my deepest sympathy. What you live every day is beyond my imagining.
      I am the parent of a mentally ill 19 year old who is 6'2"/175, and not terribly stable. He will not acknowledge having a mental illness. More than once I have called 911 after being threatened by my son, who has firearms and knows how to use them. I fear for the police who answer my call as much as I do myself. I am not the only parent I know living in fear of what their mentally ill adult child is going to do next. There is no help for us. My sister has very seriously suggested I move and leave no forwarding address. I deeply believe in our fundamental human right to be free from forced medical care, but my son CANNOT make a reasoned decision on his own behalf regarding medication and treatment. Consequently, he cannot hold a job, attend school, keep friends...such a terrible waste of an extremely intelligent and wonderful young man. If I could compel him to accept treatment, who knows what he could accomplish in his life?

  • Posted By: neo8260 @ 08/06/2008 7:10:06 PM

    Comment: I was a Los Angeles Police Officer in 1989 when I had to shoot and kill a schizophrenic man. 2 1/2 years later I exhibited the first symptoms of the Postraumatic Stress Disorder from having taken a human life. So much time and effort went into training me how and when to shoot. Nothing prepared me for the aftermath. Today I am in my 6th year of social work and I have gone from Mental Health Case Manager to a Mental Health Liaison in the Mental Health courtrooms in Broward County, Florida. I so see the need for the return of the State Psychiatric Hospital system. We gave so many the right to live their lives on the street and get themselves killed by police officers around the nation each and every month. Why have we allowed the system to create the "criminalization" of the mentally ill and then justify our mistake by giving them a "separate but equal" system of justice in the mental health court system. If this was done to any other minority in the United States, the US Supreme Court would put an end to it. Mentally ill defendants are not being given criminal trials in Mental Health Court and are thus being coerced into accepting plea bargained deals which are felony convictions in cases that should not even be criminal filings by State Attorney Offices. A Mental Health Diversion into a mental health system in which doctor's can treat mental health consumers without having to have judges dictate the treatment plans is necessary. If mentally ill people could have a caring society willing to pay to take them off of the streets and stop putting money into penal industrial complex, the violence and desperation on the streets would subside. I have been on both sides of this equation and represent mental health consumers by virtue of the fact that I identify myself as being one as well. 14 years on the LAPD should speak for itself. Representing mentally ill defendants in the courtroom as an advocate means that I still care to help those caught up in a system that is too dysfunctional to right the course before a significant catastrophe happens again.

  • Posted By: MrAce @ 08/04/2008 12:40:35 PM

    Comment: The police have to protect themselves from anyone who attacks them; mentally ill or not. Front line law enforcement professionals only have split seconds to make life and death decisions. It isn't their function, nor do they have the time to diagnose or treat in the field. Someone who is mentally ill with a knife is probably more dangerous than someone with all of their faculties, as they have no fear. Quit blaming the police for everything wrong in our society. Governments are willing to spend very little to help treat mentally ill and our health insurance system in this country is absolutely shameful. The police are doing fine; it's everything else that is so f***ed up

  • Posted By: YSREBOB @ 08/01/2008 5:22:50 PM

    Comment: The real problem is not the cops; it is the legal systems and a concept of patient rights. In an attempt to protect patients, our legal system is killing them. It boils down to this:

    Most severely mentally ill people do not believe they are sick. The psychotropic medications have negative side effects so they stop taking them. The court systems will not step in until the patient "becomes a danger to themselves or others." At that point the judge orders them confined to a hospital or mental health facility just long enough for them to become stabilized. The patient is released on a 90 day out-patient commitment. Some time after day 91 they stop taking their meds and the cycles starts over again. Repeat this process for decades.

    Most private mental health benefits are designed for people with depression or addictions. After a few weeks of hospitalization they stop paying benefits. The patient is stuck with huge medical bills that bankrupt them and they end up on Medicaid, and don't take this wrong, thank God for Medicaid.

    This is the process for the luck ones who have families to help take care of them. The unlucky ones are homeless or in Jail. Even after a loved one has been deemed mentally incompetent and has a guardian, YOU STILL CANT FORCE THEM TO TAKE THEIR MEDS.

    The courts need to force these severely mentally ill people to take their meds. Schizophrenics are not stupid evil people without skills. They are victims of their disease who are incapable of making sound decisions about their health care. As the son of a Schizophrenic who has been dealing with these issues my entire life, I can tell you the cops are the least of the problem.

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:25:57

      Comment: I disagree, and the reason for that is because medications are not perfectly prescribed. Far from it.

      We have a pharmaceutical lobby that fosters a system by which patients are given out psychiatric medications like candy. The bipolar person I know, when he first started having trouble back in college, was prescribed medication on his *second visit* - not even directly by a doctor, but secondhand through a first- or second-year *resident* of the student health center with little to no experience in treating people directly. There was no chance for talk therapy, no chance to try to let the problems work themselves out for even a week before this person was medicated. And this medication was Paxil, which was later found to help *cause*, not prevent, incredibly depressed feelings in young people, including suicidal ideation. This is exactly what happened. Within a week of taking the meds, this person had become immobile with crippling fear and depression, and later attempted suicide, with absolutely no prior history of self-harm.

      Unless our pharmaceutical lobby is cleaned up and there aren't fifty samples of twenty different medications in designer colors lying all over every psychiatrist's office in the country, I will never support a system by which medications are given by force. There are psychiatric medications out there that will destroy a person's liver, and psychiatrists who will do everything in their power, including threatening language, to still force a person to take those medications.

      I truly and deeply sympathize with your plight, since everyone involved in my acquaintance's situation has been through hell and back over and over trying to deal with things. Schizophrenia is a hard, horrible disease and one that's frustrating for caretakers to the point of despair and tears. And if the pharmaceutical industries and lobbies would clean up their acts, I would support forced medication. But in a system like today's, where medication samples come in packaging that looks like more money was spent on marketing than on clinical trials or research in development, I just can't.

      But I wish your parent the absolute best of luck in his or her treatment. May God be with you.

  • Posted By: gobbledegook @ 08/01/2008 1:00:29 PM

    Comment: I won't call you Innocent By Reason Of Insanity. Quite the opposite, you are brute cunning devoted to power; you lie extravagantly and dismiss the holes in your story as the craziness of the accused. For you, Cold Cases are solved by America's Top Model. To you, fashionistas with theatre experience qualify to understand Criminal Minds, while only a cockroach from outer space can understand Criminal Intent. Call for the Men In Black, then switch channels.

  • Posted By: C. MacLean @ 08/01/2008 12:42:13 PM

    Comment: Most law enforcement professionals do the a good job with the chronically mentally ill - in smaller towns and cities, the chronically mentally ill are usually well known to the police and the emergency room staff. And while extra training and resources for the police are always helpful, why not focus on getting the mentally ill the help they need?

    Everyone knows that local emergency rooms are strained to the max, and psychiatric inpatient facilites are faced with chronic personnel and budget shortages, but the true problem is the lack of outpatient resources for follow-up care, and the lack of funding - insurance - for medications and therapy.

    One of the reasons so many state budgets now spend more on prisons then on education or health is because we have so many people in jail with untreated addiction, serious mental illness, or both.

    If we offered these people treatment, instead of incarceration, we wouldn't need so many jails.

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:48:26

      Comment: I completely agree. I don't think it's quite that simple - when Michigan had state-run mental hospitals it was something like 30% of the state budget, which wasn't good for anyone - but I do think our jails have taken the place of mental hospitals in terms of treating the mentally ill, and jail is generally bad enough anywhere you go that it could make a sane person unwell. Sending the mentally ill to jail is like pouring fuel on a gas fire.

  • Posted By: gobbledegook @ 08/01/2008 12:36:34 PM

    Comment: When will cops and politicians start getting convicted Innocent By Reason Of Insanity? The stigma of damning the accused with reverse psychology and drugging them out of their wits is contrary to reason. So I turn a deaf ear to stories made up by cops, politicians, psychs and the reporters who pass on the lies. A Cover story is psyops to hide the real story.

  • Posted By: tiredoftreatingfakers @ 08/01/2008 12:20:06 PM

    Comment: There are far too many people who are actually criminals disguised as mentally ill. These mental health diagnosis thrown around far too liberally and are worn like badges by con men and criminals and often times affording them immunity from more harsh punishment for their acts. I say give all the care in the world to those who are truly mentally ill, but I see way too many characters and those with personality disorder that use our caring society for a free ride.

  • Posted By: deckerrekced @ 08/01/2008 9:32:37 AM

    Comment: The crisis with mentally ill homeless is not due to the closure of large mental hospitals in the 1970s. It is due to budget cuts of the 1980s that cancelled plans for community-based facilities and shut down existing clinics. Advocates who worked to get the "warehouses" shut down always said, from the word go, that the hospitals would have to be replaced with outpatient care. Their only mistake was in believing that politicians (such as Reagan, cited below) would in fact support the move to community-based care. Of course they didn't. They wanted zero funding for mental illness. So they shut down the hospitals *and* de-funded the clinics. Other countries moved away from "warehousing" yet don't have such massive problems. Duh. They actually funded the clinics.

  • Posted By: gobbledegook @ 08/01/2008 2:05:38 AM

    Comment: Distrust Authority

    BOBBY FISCHER

    The son of two pacifists: his dad was a German national secular atheist biochemist and his mom was a secular atheist Jew physician from New York; the couple met at an international peace conference. Two children before the split, a girl and a boy. The mom had trouble keeping a job, she did things like chaining herself to the White House fence to protest the *Korean* War. If winning in life means winning and sharing approval, Bobby was a luser from the start compared to his sister. As products of outmarriage, Sis married a doctor and became a successful Republican wife while Bobby had fags set on him by polite society and was isolated. Bobby tried quitting in 1963 and again in 1968 but he kept getting roped into competing with the Soviets at chess; he couldn't hold a job, kept getting robbed and needed the money. The Soviets knew the game beyond the game, they cooperated on outcomes when playing each other. If you was ever asked who should win Fischer-Spassky 1972, the *only* correct answer was to say, "I love Dr. Zhivago, Fischer is the best chess player but the worst of both worlds in the East/West Cold War split. Spassky is devastated by his divorce yet has found a new love with a female French diplomat and he wants to flee with her thru the snow in a sled and escape the wolves. Tho he is no Pasternak, Spassky is no Omar neither, and Fischer is so wrapped up in achievement with no thought of what goal and always trying to prove some point when the point of it all is winning approval and sharing approval." The media put out many hit pieces on Fischer and then the featherweight candyasses ABBA had the Final Word with the hit musical "Chess." Tim Rice collaborated on "Chess" and he's the moral philosopher who mandated Judas be an N-word in "Jesus Christ Superstar"

    Bobby Fischer said pawn to K4 (e4) is the best move to open a chess game because it leads to sharper tactics and more decisive outcomes.
    Bobby Fischer valued the lowly pawn, some say too much.

  • Posted By: onepoker @ 08/01/2008 1:47:07 AM

    Comment: The reason the mentally ill are victims of violence is because they irritate people. They often don't understand appropriate distances and they invade space making the general public uncomfortable. When they invade the space of someone prone to violence it can be tragic.

    I guess we should of reformed our mental health facilities instead of abolishing them. Thank the aclu and the like for stepping up for the mentally ill's rights at the expense of their lives nice job libs.

  • Posted By: gobbledegook @ 08/01/2008 1:34:39 AM

    Comment: Cops make the diagnoses for 5150, the psych just rubber stamp approve. A cop on your left arm, a cop on your right arm, a cop up the middle with a taser; then they throw you down and grind your face on the concrete of your own driveway. With persistence, I was able to persuade the cop cuffing me to stop trying to cut off the circulation to my right hand. Psych is a kidnap, extortion, forced drugging racket which costs me in the 5 figures every time, with the bills paid out of my pocket, not your tax monies. TSA screeners, cops, psychs all believe in superficial profiling. The only counseling most people need is an Image Consultant.

  • Posted By: wildlifeusa @ 08/01/2008 12:26:45 AM

    Comment: This is an outrage and has been for a very long time. The large majority of homeless people are mentally ill.. And you call this country civilized and compassionate??? You've got to be kidding!!! I will be moving back to europe soon and cannot wait! I have been disliking this country more and more everyday!

  • Posted By: macfar @ 07/31/2008 10:33:12 PM

    Comment: You hospitalize them and hope that the inpatient staff can get them to consent to treatment. If they won't and you have the legal documentation, you force meds. Time and time again, we have brought people out of psychotic states by "forcing meds" which sounds really inhumane. It is done VERY carefully and by the book at my hospital as to protect the patient's needs. Within days, usually hours, the patients come around and are much less paranoid therefore able to take their medicines by mouth. Doesn't mean they'll stay on them after discharge though.

  • Posted By: macfar @ 07/31/2008 10:29:45 PM

    Comment: As an inpatient psychiatric nurse, I find our local law enforcement to be quite helpful on the whole. They do what needs to be done to "rescue" the patients and get them care. The breakdown that I see is with our hospitals' Emergency Departments. They brand patients as "psych admits" and disregard their medical issues and frankly, their personal, basic needs.

  • Posted By: eberha @ 07/31/2008 10:28:37 PM

    Comment: How do you help a person that is hearing voices ?But beleives no medicine is needed ?

    • Posted By: Cssndra @ 08/01/2008 14:35:42

      Comment: Unless you can demonstrate that someone is going to harm themselves or someone else, you cannot legally compel someone to take medication. It is a person's right to refuse medical treatment, and this includes pharmaceuticals for psychaitric care.

  • Posted By: tangledsynapses. @ 07/31/2008 10:22:44 PM

    Comment: It is time for America to come to grips with the issue of mental illness in society. We have very smart people in both ends, the mentally ill and the normal¨as well. We just need to put them together at the same level and to learn from each other. In the military it is customary to carry IDs, for identification, should they die in combat. The mentally ill could also carry a ¨badge¨for a lack of a better word describing their mental condition, point of contact, and other precautions. This would save lives from both ends.

  • Posted By: PReed1962 @ 07/31/2008 10:11:49 PM

    Comment: Bless you cowgirl_lieutenant! Here in North Phoenix Arizona I have had great experiences with officers. My sisters and I have a childhood friend who is certifiably crazy. Sometimes he gets mixed up with his medications or just gets too paranoid to take them. Whenever he has a crisis and calls up threatening the sheriff or the FBI or the mafia, the police have always been patient and caring! We love this man and care for him like a brother. Most families are touched by mental illness in some way. The Democrats have invited everyone to participate in their party platform this year (even Independents like me or Republicans or whatever) When I go to our neighborhood meeting this Sunday I will suggest we make a plank for support of all those who work to treat them with dignity and respect. Mental illness and drug abuse are ilnesses and we need to treat them like you would treat any other disease. Make Insurance companies cover treatment!




    everyone


  • Posted By: idonow @ 07/31/2008 9:53:24 PM

    Comment: how many families dump these people[no contact for 5-10 years ] then sue the state because their "loved one "died in state care "what a joke!!

  • Posted By: benedicite @ 07/31/2008 8:22:49 PM

    Comment: I am so happy to see this national crisis finally being addressed. Here in California pharmacists had to sue the State to try to reverse the cuts in Medi-Cal funding for prescriptions such as anti-psychotic drugs that are the only thing standing between the poor mentally ill and long term hospitalization, being dumped on Skid Row or incarceration after committing crimes due to their illness. Unfortunately for us, so far the judiciary has been unable or unwilling to do so. I can't wait to vote Democrat in November!!!!

  • Posted By: puppyatplay @ 07/31/2008 7:59:56 PM

    Comment: Ever since we changed the system to the more severely mentally ill release themselves in the mid-70's this has been an endemic and growing problem. Ideally since we can't confine them to prevent them harming others or themselves if they can check themselves out, we should taser them along with those suffering from dementia, blindness, or who are paraplegic.

  • Posted By: cowgirl_lieutenant @ 07/31/2008 7:54:56 PM

    Comment: As a detention supervisor and a mental health peace officer, I totally agree that our jails and prisons are filled with people who society has no other place for. As a parent of a bipolar child, I floundered in the mental health system trying to get my child the help she needed only to be told "You have insurance, we can't help you." Today my child is 20 yrs old, married, uninsured and on the waiting list for state mental health assistance, a wait she was told may be up to a year. As an officer, I make it a point to see as many of our mentally ill inmates as I can during the course of my shift so I can build some kind of rapport with them in the event they have a crisis. I want them to know I am safe and I can get them help as long as they will try and work with me. Granted, in a manic or psychotic state, they are out of control, but there are times they will calm down as best they can and try and talk with me. Our government needs to make mental health care a priority because it will help to decrease our inmate populations that have swollen with people who should be in a treatment center, not a jail.

    • Posted By: onepoker @ 08/01/2008 01:56:20

      Comment: the article really didn't give proper credit to officers like you. I have witnessed officers on the street dealing with people most folks would run from. I appreciate your service to the community and I wish you and your child well. Mental health is one area where I believe National healthcare is necessary. I am a republican and am opposed to nationalized healthcare on the whole but it is obvious many mentally ill people can not maintain a job well enough to provide them the care they need. What is most ironic is with the proper care many of these people are capable of leading very productive and enjoyable lives.

  • Posted By: olderwiser @ 07/31/2008 7:32:31 PM

    Comment: There just has to be some acceptable medium between the old Insane Asylums and the exactly opposite total divestiture of any public responsibility at all for the seriously mentally ill. It is just too cruel to have to use violence to stop predictably violent people because a government thought more of the money than the person, and that is exactly what happens when you cut taxes to the bone. You love the money more than the people who should have benefitted from it in some humane way.

  • Posted By: GreenBushido @ 07/31/2008 7:22:03 PM

    Comment: Rather than talk about what can be done to help the police with these EDP situations, maybe we should focus on providing these people with the care and help they deserve? Too many of our resources in this country go to treating symptoms as quick-fixes that can get people re/elected and not enough on treating the causes. It's a shame lives have to be lost in order for problems to be discussed.

    My heart goes out to the millions of people suffering from mental illness and the lives they touch. They're beautiful people like anyone else.

  • Posted By: MH ADVOCATE @ 07/31/2008 5:04:12 PM

    Comment:
    I TOO HAVE WATCHED AS MY BIPOLAR SON FALSELY CONFESSED TO A DOMESTIC ABUSE CHARGE THAT WAS FABRICATED BY HIS GIRLFRIEND BECAUSE SHE WAS AFRAID. A PA STATE TROOPERS TOLD HER MY SON "LOOKED LIKE" A PSYCHOPATH AND WOULD KILL SHE AND THE REST OF HER FAMILY. HIS PSYCHIATRIST WOULD SAY THE OPPOSITE BUT NEVER HAD THE CHANCE. IN AN ATTEMPT TO GET HELP FOR MY SON, HIS GIRLFRIEND, HAD CALLED THE AMBULANCE, BUT THE POLICE ARRIVED FIRST. THE STATE TROOPERS CALLED ME TO PICK UP MY SON. I ASKED IF THEY WOULD MEET ME AT THE HOSPITAL WITH MY SON. DENIED. "OK,' I SAID, "I WILL PICK HIM UP AND TAKE HIM." I WAS TOLD, "NOT ANYWHERE AROUND HERE. " I SAID, "OK," I W TAKE HIM TO A HOSPITAL NEAR WHERE I LIVE. AT THAT, THEY SAID HE WAS BEING ARRESTED, NOT TO COME, THEY WOULD CALL ME AFTER HE WAS SEEN BY THE DISTRICT JUDGE. HIS 'LAWYER" ADVISED HIM TO PLEAD GUILTY, AGAINST MY ATTEMPT TO GET HIM TO GO TO TRIAL, SO THAT THE TRUTH COULD BE TOLD. THE LAWYER SAID I WAS HURTING MY SONS CHANCES. OF COURSE, MY SON LISTENED TO THE LAWYER; AFTER ALL, THEY KNOW BEST DON'T THEY? A COUPLE OF MONTHS LATER I WATCHED AS HE WAS THROWN AROUND A COUNTY CRISIS ROOM BY FOUR POLICE OFFICERS, AFTER HE HAD TAKEN ALL OF HIS MEDICATIONS AND DRANK A FIFTH OF VODKA, IN AN ATTEMPT TO KILL HIMSELF. MY SON HAD FLAKES OF PILLS DRIED AROUND HIS LIPS. THIS WHITE, FLAKEY CRUST AROUND THE LIPS IS A SIGN OF OVERDOSE. I HAD GIVEN THEM INFORMATION ABOUT THE FACT THAT HE HAD TAKEN HIS MEDICATIONS, AND DRANK. I ASKED THE POLICE TO BRING HIM TO THE HOSPITAL SO THAT I COULD FILL OUT THE PAPERS, THE CRISIS INTERVENTION "SPECIALIST" DENIEDTHE INVOLUNTARY COMMITMENT. HE WAS NOT SEEN IN THE EMERGENCY ROOM, NO BLOOD WORK WAS DONE, NO PSYCHIATRIST SAW HIM, NOT ONE THING WAS DONE TO PREVENT MY SON FROM DYING. IN JAIL BLOOD WORK FOUND THAT HE HAD TAKEN AN OVERDOSE, HE WAS GIVEN A BOTTOM BUNK, SO THAT "HE WOULD NOT FALL AND HURT HIMSELF.' THEY PUT HIM ON 15 MINUTE "CHECKS," IN A REGULAR CELL. APPARENTLY, HIS STOMACH EMPTIED ENOUGH SO THAT HE DID NOT DIE. I SPOKE TO EVERY AGENCY AND CONNECTION I COULD, THEY GAVE HIM THE CHOICE OF GOING THE HOSPITAL OR STAYING IN JAIL WITH NO MEDICATIONS. AFTER 5 DAYS HE BEGAN TO PUT THINGS TOGETHER. THE DAY AFTER HIS MEDICATIONS WERE STRAIGHTEND OUT, HE WENT TO COURT AND CONFESSED TO A CRIME HE DID NOT COMMIT.
    PLEASE FAMILIES, FRIENDS, CO-WORKERS, OR ACQUAINTANCES OF AN INDIVIDUAL WITH A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS, ADVOCATE, ADVOCATE, ADVOCATE!
    THEY NEED YOU!

    • Posted By: NCAPD @ 08/01/2008 09:45:47

      Comment: I am a Assistant Public Defender in a mid-size city. Every time I go to trial or enter a plea with a seriously mentally ill client (and it happens all the time), I feel that I am seriously letting that person down. The mental health system is seriously broken, and people end up in jail. For those mentally ill people who commit less serious crimes, there is an endless revolving door. Fortunately our jail has an excellent psychiatrist and an excellent mental health social worker, but really, jail is no place for treatment.

      I have a client with severe Post-Traumatic Stress Dsorder from seeing his family members murdered. His illness causes him to drink and become violent. I tried to find out whether there was treatment available for him in the prison systerm. The answer? "PTSD can't be treated with a pill.... " This is no way for society to manage sick people and no way for society to manage people who could be harmful to others. The mental health system a serious upgrade.

      Most police officers are respectful towards mentally ill individuals (although there are SERIOUS exceptions), but it shouldn't be their job to manage medical crises.

      Also, the public should know that most seriously mentally ill individuals are considered competent to stand trial and cannot be found not guilty by reason of insanity. They go through the system like everyone else - labeled as worse "criminals" with each mental health crisis.

  • Posted By: MH ADVOCATE @ 07/31/2008 4:26:05 PM

    Comment: Many police departments and Mental Health Agencies such as, NAMI (National Alliance for the Mentally ILL), are getting REAL help from the CIT (Crisis Intervention Training), developed in Memphis TN. The help is for Mental Health consumers, the public, AND Police Officers! The CIT PROGRAM has been HUGELY successful in BETTER protecting ALL persons involved in a mental health crisis. Many states and counties all across the UNITED STATES are sending VOLUNTEER police officers to the training AND BUILDING A PROGRAM THROUGHOUT COUNTIES TO INTERVENE, PLACE, AND TREAT INDIVIDUALS IN CRISIS.
    I AM PROUD TO SAY THAT BUCKS COUNTY, PA HAS BEEN TO MEMPHIS, TN THIS SUMMER TO FIND OUT HOW IT ALL WORKS SO THAT WE IN BUCKS COUNTY, PA CAN HANDLE THIS SOCIETAL CRISIS IN A HUMANE, AND RESPONSIBLE WAY!!!
    AS THE POST BY "THE VIGIL," 7/31/2008 HAS TOLD A HORROR STORY ABOUT A BIPOLAR FRIEND, I TOO HAVE WATCHED AS MY BIPOLAR SON FALSELY CONFESSED TO A DOMESTIC ABUSE CHARGE THAT WAS FABRICATED BY HIS GIRLFRIEND BECAUSE SHE WAS AFRAID. A PA STATE TROOPERS TOLD HER MY SON "LOOKED LIKE" A PSYCHOPATH AND WOULD KILL SHE AND THE REST OF HER FAMILY. HIS PSYCHIATRIST WOULD SAY THE OPPOSITE BUT NEVER HAD THE CHANCE. IN AN ATTEMPT TO GET HELP FOR MY SON, HIS GIRLFRIEND, HAD CALLED THE AMBULANCE, BUT THE POLICE ARRIVED FIRST. THE POLICE DO NOT LIKE TO TAKE MENTALLY ILL PEOPLE TO THE HOSPITAL. THE POLICEMEN HAVE TO STAY WITH THEM UNTIL THERE IS A HOSPITAL BED AVAILABLE. IT IS VERY TIME CONSUMING.
    THE STATE TROOPERS CALLED ME TO PICK UP MY SON AT THE BARRACKS. UNAWARE AT THE TIME OF THIS DYSFUNCTIONAL SOCIETAL PROBLEM, I ASKED THE OFFICER IF THEY WOULD MEET ME AT THE HOSPITAL WITH MY SON, SO THAT I COULD HAVE HIM COMMITTED AGAINST HIS WILL. DENIED. "OK,' I SAID, "I WILL PICK HIM UP AND TAKE HIM." I WAS TOLD, "NOT ANYWHERE AROUND HERE. " I SAID, "OK," I WOULD TAKE HIM TO ABINGTON HOSPITAL, NEAR WHERE I LIVE. AT THAT, THEY SAID HE WAS BEING ARRESTED NOT TO COME TO THE POLICE BARRACKS; THEY WOULD CALL ME AFTER HE WAS SEEN BY THE DISTRICT JUDGE.
    HIS 'LAWYER" ADVISED HIM TO PLEAD GUILTY, AGAINST MY ATTEMPT TO GET HIM TO GO TO TRIAL, SO THAT THE TRUTH COULD BE TOLD. THE LAWYER SAID I WAS HURTING MY SONS CHANCES. OF COURSE, MY SON LISTENED TO THE LAWYER; AFTER ALL, THEY KNOW BEST DON'T THEY??
    PLEASE FAMILIES, FRIENDS, CO-WORKERS, OR ACQUAINTANCES OF AN INDIVIDUAL WITH A MENTAL HEALTH CRISIS, ADVOCATE, ADVOCATE, ADVOCATE!!!!!!!!
    THEY NEED YOU!!!!!!!!!!
    NEWSWEEK NEEDS TO DO A HUGE INVESTIGATION INTO THIS EXCELLENT PROGRAM IN MEMPHIS TN, OR CAMDEN NJ, OR ANY OF THE THREE PROGRAMS IN PA, OR MANY OTHER STATES. THE CIT PROGRAM ADDRESSES ALL OF THE ISSUES COVERED IN NEWSWEEK'S ARTICLE.

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:46:16

      Comment: Amen. Thank you so, so much for advocating for advocacy on these boards. It eases something deep in my heart.

      I wish you and your son the absolute best in dealing with what is a hard and crippling illness for everyone concerned. Please take my blessings and hopes that you and your son will be okay.

  • Posted By: delewisut @ 07/31/2008 3:36:23 PM

    Comment: Please let those in your city know about Crisis Intervention Team (CIT) training of law enforcement to handle just these types of situations. The National Alliance on Mental Illnesses (NAMI) website for this program is: http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Section=CIT2&Template=/TaggedPage/TaggedPageDisplay.cfm&TPLID=62&ContentID=35547

  • Posted By: delewisut @ 07/31/2008 3:35:29 PM

    Comment: Please let those in your city know about Crisis Intervention Team (CIT) training of law enforcement to handle just these types of situations. The National Alliance on Mental Illnesses (NAMI) website for this program is: http://www.nami.org/Template.cfm?Section=CIT2&Template=/TaggedPage/TaggedPageDisplay.cfm&TPLID=62&ContentID=35547

  • Posted By: Cssndra @ 07/31/2008 2:38:52 PM

    Comment: It does seem rather ludicrious that a such a big ole former marine would need to shoot such a little kid five times in the back to subdue him, when he had his taser right there. And as I've said previously, there must not have been enough political capital in it for the prosecuting attorney to really build a solid case - you know, those little old Irish Immigrants don't make good news stories.

    TheVigil - I have a bipolar uncle, and cousin. Neither of the refuse to take their medication now, but have before, and on occaision one of them has threatened suicide, and has ended up in the hands of the police, and has been forcefully committed. Threatening to do harm to yourself or others is the fastest way to have your rights revoked. The person in question - a phd candidate! And like so many others, full of the belief there is nothing really wrong with him and that medicine is bad (when lucid).

    Law enforcement because of low pay and burnout attracts the lowest common denominator. Do you want to be a cop? I don't. I do think that tasers ought to be the first line of defense (I know there are sev. wrongful death lawsuits pending but c'mon, heart attack or gunshot - pick) for any police department.

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:12:24

      Comment: Yes, these things were present in that case. Crippling and very painful side effects resulting from mismedication had caused him to stop taking his meds, and that was a bad thing - but many of his psychiatrists had strenuously resisted changes in medication despite the difficult pain he was in. He's now on a medication - finally a changed one -that actually works and has fully admitted to having problems with his brain chemistry and that he needs to be on medication permanently, with no trace of defiance left.

      It's not easy at all to walk in a bipolar person's shoes, and one of the reasons that many bipolar people don't particularly want to own up to it is because for the *rest of their lives* there are certain legal rights they will be denied due to a diagnosis of mental illness - I know they'd be denied those rights anyway, but it's hard to see that from the inside of the diagnosis at times - and yet, if they refuse to take their meds, even if those meds are improperly prescribed, they're held fully accountable for that and are quite severely chastised or punished.

      This person in question was beaten without cause PRIOR to admitting to any suicidal feelings. I have every reason to believe that getting beaten up by six angry police officers was absolutely a factor in those suicidal feelings. This person had already been in-processed, was in jail, and was no threat to anyone around him. And there is absolutely no excuse for having the psychiatric cell covered in human waste - none at all. There's also no excuse for having a mental facility where patients piss on the chairs and where the orderlies refuse to clean it up, or where one patient belts another across the face and the staff similarly does nothing.

      While I agree that the police are very human, and deserve the benefit of the doubt in many cases, I also think that some of our policies have contributed to a police culture that prizes its brutality and takes pains to cover it over in the public consciousness. And our state-run mental health facilities are just broken. I do understand that the cops face a lot of highly dangerous people at low pay, but there are still some things that should just never happen. Ill or not, those with mental problems still deserve dignity, and that was manifestly denied in this case.

    • Posted By: onepoker @ 08/01/2008 02:14:10

      Comment: Don't blame the cop he wasn't the one banging on windows in the middle of the night. put yoursefl in the cops shoes. The call is you have someone banging on the windows of a house the person on the phone claims his family is inside and this person is threatening them. You show up at the house and find a guy outside banging on the windows. You Identify yourself and ask the guy to lay on the ground. in a blurr he lunges at you. what do you do? You don't know if he is armed, you don't know if he intends to kill you or your partner or the family in the house but you have less than a second to make up your mind.

      You talk about your relative wanting to kill himself and you are angry that the cops took his rights away. Does your relative have the right to kill himself or worse harm others.

      You talk about cops being the lowest common denominator this is just plain ignorant. These people are putting their lives on the line often times to protect people like your relatives from themselves or people like you from your own relatives. 99% of the time they end up difusing the situation with the outcome being a mental evaluation and a night in jail for someone who was intent on killing themselves or their nieghbor but no physlcal harm coming to anyone. the other one percent of the time someone gets hurt I hope most of the time it is the person causing the problem unfortunately it doesnt always work out that way. Besides dealing with the perpetrator they often have to deal with emotional relatives who don't approve of the physical nature of police work these ungrateful civilians demand badge numbers and scream and yell often upsetting an already bad situation. Sometimes in extreme cases they attack the officers. Let me tell you its not the cops who are the lowest common denominators.

      • Posted By: Cssndra @ 08/01/2008 14:26:43

        Comment: So you chase a guy down the street and shoot him in the back? Because that is what happened in the Hanlon case - he ran the guy down the street and shot him in the back. That's just plain wrong, no matter what the circumstance. I don't care if you are a cop or not, you just shot someone who was running away from you because he was scared. That makes you the biggest dick in the world.

        I had someone try and break into my house when I was home, thank you, and had law enforcement respond quite promptly. In fact, they told me to go and buy a gun (check). When my cousin tried to kill himself, they were quite prompt, courteous and far gentler than I would have been had I been the first one there. So I definitely appreciate our folks in blue. Now I live in an middle class area and we are able to draw policeman to our community because we can afford to pay a higher salary than most. However, if you look at the numbers, most law enforcement agencies do not have big budgets, and cannot afford to pay salaries that most people can live on. Here in Atlanta, most law enforcement officers that work in the city do not live there, because they cannot afford to. The city does not pay them enough money to live in their own district. How can you do an effective job policing if you do not know the community in which you are to work? How can you form bonds with people in that community so that they trust you if you aren't there?

        And I don't back off my comments about the police forces of america tending to attract the LCD element. While I know personally many fine law enforcement officers, I have also met many fine people I wouldn't trust to tie my shoe, much less diffuse a tense situation, or fire a gun, or write a parking ticket. My point was simply that the law enforcement entities of America, as a whole, are so pressed for manpower that they have in the last five years begun taking a much poorer quality of candidate into their ranks (much as the Army has begun taking in the last few years as well - at least they publicly admit their faults).

        So before you run around with a big stick and beat on people yourselves, perhaps you should actually read what people right and apply some logical thought. Instead, you focused on the words "lowest common denominator" and went off.

        • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:16:43

          Comment: I totally agree. I completely think we need better equipment for our police officers, and better pay - but that equipment should be body armor and more non-lethal weaponry, not bigger guns, since in the vast majority of the cases the police deal with, the offenders are unarmed. I'd never advocate taking guns away from the police in this country - a violation of the Second Amendment in any case, and a horrid idea considering that the population is frequently armed here - but I do know there is a culture of brutality in many police departments, and a LOT of racism.

          Anyone who wants to research the subject should look up the "Blue Code of Silence" - the unwritten code by which police are expected to cover up their fellow officers in legal situations involving brutality. I'm not necessarily condemning the police for this, since the worst of the offenders they deal with are truly violent and brutal, and we have an EXTREMELY litigious society - but I do think some way, somehow, a better solution needs to be found.

      • Posted By: summer4077 @ 08/01/2008 10:39:39

        Comment: Nicely said, onepoker. Insulting the police force that protects us as 'the lowest common denominator' is ignorant and shows a total lack of respect. Let's see how lowly you think the police are when someone breaks in at 3am, or when you're assaulted by your uncle. Threatening to do harm to others RIGHTLY causes your rights to be revoked. If someone is threatening to assault or kill me, you'd better believe I want the cops there to lock them up away from harming normal, sane people. Yes, I want them to get proper help. But I also don't want to be killed by a mentally ill person then have it excused because, "Oh, poor them, they're mentally ill." That doesn't make it ok.
        For example...the women that kill their children and are excused the death penalty because they are 'insane'? What about those kids? They don't have rights, too? I believe some people are too sick to ever be better, and if they murder innocent people, they need to be held accountable.

        • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 15:42:53

          Comment: When my apartment was robbed several years ago, the police took nine hours to arrive on the scene and showed up with one officer at something like 10PM at night. He acted so bored and condescending to take the police report that I was sure absolutely nothing would be done to recover my property. This is exactly what happened. It was only about three thousand dollars worth of stuff, but still, it was almost everything I had. It transpired later that it was several acquaintances of mine actually committed the crime - one more or less came clean and brought most of it back to me - so it's hard for me to believe the police couldn't have figured that out if they'd been trying in any way. What *did* happen is that later on a detective called me with pseudo-threatening language to try to pump me for information for a gang file. At that point I distrusted everything about the situation and refused to tell him anything. I felt like I was in an episode of The Shield, or something. It was scary.

          Just as a side note, you've been such a force for compassion on these boards that it's a bit surprising to hear you condemn the mentally ill so fully and roundly. I support your right to your opinions completely. But just remember the horrendous conditions on the insides of many mental institutions - not all of them, but many of them. I do not believe that they make people well or help them deal with their lives in any way. If you advocate wider use of forceful commitment to mental institutions and the death penalty for the severely ill, I urge you to also support mental hospital reform. Also know that the insides of most mentally ill people's heads, including the women who kill their own children, are already a world of pain far beyond what any of us will ever know.

          I might also note that there are a tremendous number of people who *should* qualify for mental illness but will never receive a diagnosis due to the fact that they'd rather die before seeing a shrink, and these people still retain their full legal rights. This isn't due to any kind of altruistic desire to prevent psychiatric abuse, just a rampant hatred of anyone who might get inside their heads, and they usually hate indiscriminately along with it. I might point out our mutual friend HolyRoller as an example of this kind of thing.

          But I do want to say that I really respect you as a blogger on these boards and look forward to seeing your future opinions on everything. You're a very positive person. Keep up the good work.

          • Posted By: summer4077 @ 08/05/2008 10:54:36

            Comment: SIgh, I know I usually AM a pretty positive, compassionate voice. I guess I just get driven down by all the crazy women who have killed their children in horrific ways, citing "insanity", or the numerous times that cops, firefighters, and EMTs in my city have had to apologize and go on trial when mentally ill people attack them and they fight back. It's just very discouraging. I firmly believe the mentally ill need better treatment facilities and that cops need better training to handle them--however, I balk at the suggestion that cops are the bottom of the totem pole or wrong for defending themselves. There are going to be bad cops just as there are bad people everywhere, but for the most part they mean well. I've relied on my city's police force a few times and have always come away with the utmost respect for them--then I see them lambasted for using force on someone who attacked them with a knife. I guess it just tends to break you down.

        • Posted By: Cssndra @ 08/01/2008 14:31:05

          Comment: Summer -

          I've never thought that insanity was an excuse to avoid the death penalty. In fact, I'm one of those weird "eye for an eye" liberals. Even insane people understand that death is final, and they know it's wrong.

          • Posted By: summer4077 @ 08/01/2008 15:05:20

            Comment: Lol you and me both. I'm more liberal than conservative, but I hold conservative views on things like pleading insanity. Don't get me wrong, I know there are people out there who are truly insane, but I feel the majority of defendants now try to use that to get out of their crimes. Also, perhaps because I deal with public servants on a daily basis, I have a soft spot for criticism of them. Most of them I know are truly selfless people who are fine people, and are trying to make their communities a better, safer place.

  • Posted By: RO in Reno @ 07/31/2008 2:38:26 PM

    Comment: Yet another result of Reagan's "let the good times roll" policies. We have him to thank for closing the state and federally funded mental health facilities, depriving the economically challenged from receiving help,
    Got to get rid of those entitlements??? you know.

    • Posted By: onepoker @ 08/01/2008 02:15:12

      Comment: your an idiot the institutions were closed in the 1960's and 70's

      • Posted By: RO in Reno @ 08/01/2008 09:19:54

        Comment: No Kidding and just who was Govenor of Calif ? Ronald,, I was personnally involved in the closure of Camarillo, I damned well know who closed it down, Ronald did.

        • Posted By: Cssndra @ 08/01/2008 14:29:22

          Comment: Right, RO, it was entirely Reagan's policies starting with his work in CA that closed down all institutions across the U.S. I'll happily point out several excellent links to academic sources on the treatment of the mentally ill in the U.S. and the history of instititonalization if anyone is actually interested....

  • Posted By: summer4077 @ 07/31/2008 2:33:23 PM

    Comment: Police officers definitely need better training, but I can't blame them for shooting when they are threatened. I live in Ohio, and we recently had a similar situation. A man stopped taking his medication to control schizophrenia, and a judge ordered the police to pick him up and take him to a mental health facility. When they arrived he rushed them with a knife,and they shot and killed him. The officers have come under fire from some groups in the area, which I don't agree with. Yes, public servants (police officers, EMTs, and firefighters) should have better training to deal with mentally ill people. But if a person rushes you with a knife, you're going to protect yourself. I think we've gotten so caught up in patients' rights that we have forgotten that police officers--productive members of society that serve to protect us--have the same rights. They have families waiting for them at home, too. For every neglected patient story, there's also a story of people hurt and/or killed at the hands of the mentally ill.

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/02/2008 16:26:22

      Comment: "For every neglected patient story, there's also a story of people hurt and/or killed at the hands of the mentally ill." - This is not fair without actual statistical analysis, summer. I also might ask if you knew anything personally about this situation or just read about it in the paper.

      As far as the knife goes, a properly trained group of police officers could have almost certainly tasered the man or else shot him in a non-lethal way without killing him. Police work in groups of at least two and frequently three these days. One officer could easily have fallen back while the other two circled from behind and tasered the man. Or they could have aimed at the arm, or the legs. For two or three armed officers to fatally shoot one man armed with only a knife strikes me as a sign of panic. I'm not condemning the cops here, and I understand why they shot him. I don't think they should be punished, and I do think they did their jobs. But I think there may have been better ways to handle the situation with training (or maybe not, I'm getting the story secondhand too).

      I also want to ask if the person involved had actually *done* anything criminal prior to the judge ordering the police to come take him away. Jails are horrible places. To order the police in to subdue someone with force when that someone is in a horrendously paranoid and fearful place is inviting a violent reaction, unless this person had a history of violent behavior. Someone who's backed into a wall will sometimes use violence even if they otherwise wouldn't have.

      But I'll withhold further comment until you provide more facts about the situation. Just remember that it's hard to know the full story from a secondhand or thirdhand account (which applies to me too).

      • Posted By: summer4077 @ 08/05/2008 10:59:30

        Comment: The man had attacked his family in the past, with a knife also. That's the only detail the news story gave about his history. I completely agree that public servants need better training to deal with the mentally ill. I also agree that they could have probably used less force and the patient would be alive today. I guess my point is that if cops aren't given the proper training, we can hardly decry their use of force when that is all they know. We need to come down harder on the system that is failing the cops AND the patients by insisting that police receive the proper training to deal with these situations. Until that happens, I will stand by the police that go out every day and try to do their best to serve their communities.

  • Posted By: TheVigil @ 07/31/2008 1:51:49 PM

    Comment: Much as I hate to be a dissenter to the other comments, I am going to. The comments so far are unfair and ridiculously one-sided.

    I know someone who is bipolar, had a fight with his family, and was taken to jail for misdemeanor assault after grabbing his stepparent on the arm, after fifteen years of psychological abuse by her and while on a period of mismedication by his doctors. He later reported to me that while in jail, one of the nurses came in and spoke to another inmate in a contemptuous tone of voice. He said to her, "Hey, don't talk to him that way", and instead of simply telling this person to be quiet, six 200 lb.+ officers dragged him out of the cell and beat him, then threw him into a cell covered in feces for about sixteen hours after he reported suicidal feelings. After this he was taken to a psychiatic hospital where the doctors gave him medicine that put him in liver pain and then said he should be "back in jail" if he didn't want to take it, where one of the other patients urinated on the furniture, where the orderlies refused to clean up the urine and instead stayed sitting and chatting, and where one patient punched another full-on in the face with absolutely no consequences.

    This person I know is not someone with incurable illness and no job skills who's fated to be a drain on society - it's someone who's been trying hard to overcome the bipolar disease he inherited from his father, who possesses wonderful graphic design and programming skills, is now properly medicated, and is an asset to his employers. But in jail he was beaten for expressing an opinion - and not doing so violently - and in one of our state-funded psychiatric hospitals he was subjected to treatment that would shame a second-world country.

    Quite honestly and frankly, our system is broken. Officers receive no training on dealing with the psychiatrically handicapped, and our state-funded mental health system has become someplace where people go to get sicker, not well. And there's another factor that disturbs me terribly, which is that if someone goes to a psychiatrist for help with problems they run the risk of being labeled "mentally ill" and having their legal rights reduced *permanently* after that - yet some of the people we see commenting on these boards are utterly sick, take obvious pleasure in cruelty to others, and yet would not be diagnosed because they'd rather die than admit to needing mental help of any kind and would retain full legal rights.

    We need better regulation of the pharmaceutical industry to end the graft that harms our hospitals. And we need more training of police officers *against* the use of force unless it becomes completely necessary. There's an entire culture of violence in our police of which discussion is completely suppressed. There's too much greed and brutality across the board right now, and things are not going to get better until we stop it.

  • Posted By: AndrewSimon @ 07/31/2008 1:47:24 PM

    Comment: Oregon police officers are trained to use a variety of types of force to get suspects and residents to comply with orders, said Cameron Campbell, the director of training for the state Department of Public Safety Standards and Training. They also are taught when to use which type of force, and are repeatedly drilled to help make snap judgments easier to make, Campbell said. "Officers need to respond with a level of force appropriate and reasonable given the totality of the experience," he said. "You go directly to the level of force necessary given the totality of the circumstance." There are many factors officers have to take into account when using force besides whether the suspect is armed or not, Campbell said. Environmental factors are a concern. Is the suspect hidden in shadow, or in the light of day? Is he or she hiding behind a wall, or out in the open? Is it rainy or dry? The officer also has to weigh his fitness and presence against that of the suspect, Campbell said. Is the suspect younger or older than the officer? Does he or she have a bigger build, or display a better fighting ability? What are the chances the suspect could overpower the officer? Range of training - Officers receive 12 hours of classroom training in use of force at the police academy, more training in their defensive tactics class and countless hours rehearsing different scenarios, Campbell said. The idea behind the training is to give officers a head start in making split-second decisions under pressure. Officers also need to stay on top of their training after leaving the academy, Campbell said. "They are what we call perishable skills," he said. "If you are not engaged and active, they will disappear over time." Silverton Police Chief Rick Lewis said Friday that members of his 17-officer agency take part in periodic training in the use of force. "The training includes a number of regular test questions on use of force given different scenarios and how they're to respond," he said. He added that the small police agency has its own certified Taser instructor.

    Gonzalez fired 7 bullets at Andrew who, according to Grand Jury testimony was at all times only five feet from Gonzales. Gonzalez hit Andrew 5 times and one of those rounds was into Andrew's back. Yet according to the same testimony Andrew was at all times pursuing Gonzalez.

    Gonzalez, weighing in at 237 pounds, a former Marine, a trained and practicing cage-fighter and armed with a Taser and a nightstick and a loaded gun, AND a TORCH!

    AJ Hanlon weighed 130-pounds, was barefoot and UNARMED.

  • Posted By: Cssndra @ 07/31/2008 11:38:29 AM

    Comment: I recommend that everyone interested in the topic read Pete Earley's "Crazy: A Father's Search Through America's Mental Health Madness". Largely, it's about his struggles with his son's diagnosis and struggles with the court system, but told in a larger context i.e. it could be about anyone's child as Mr. Earley examines what it is like to BE mentally ill and in jail, or in and out of jail, or eventually dead. He provides a thorough historyf of social and political treatment of the mentally ill in the U.S. and explains how our jails and prisons have become completely overwhelmed with folk who are disturbed and have no other place to go.

    As distasteful as it sounds: institutions begin to sound better and better. Personally, I believe that the legal system and society erred in deciding that everyone who is mentally ill would benefit from being "mainsteamed". There are some conditions that will never benefit from being exposed to normal society; there are some people who cannot function in a normal society, and cannot be taught how. Those people do need to be institutionalized, as much for their own protection as ours.

  • Posted By: FireNurse @ 07/31/2008 10:06:45 AM

    Comment: I am a mental health professional who deals with potentially dangerous situations on a regular basis. The NYPD and local police in my now suburban community demonstrate professionalism and self-control beyond what was the norm 10-15 years ago.
    The use of tazers has been a life saver when conservatively used.
    Remember, these are potentially life threatening situations on both ends.
    One area that can be improved is the use of physical restraints and incidents of positional asphyxia.
    On the whole... The men and women in the emergency services do a great job and are acutely aware that the less force they use; the less likely they are to be injured themselves.
    Stigma and importance or the right to privacy of the mentally ill individual is something the vast majority of us will thankfully never have to face.
    Creating databases about individuals is a slippery slope and Assisted Outpatient Treatment with Intensive Case Management are great programs...if administered properly.
    The focus needs to be more on enhancing education our first responders in safely and effectively addressing psychiatric emergencies.
    Every situation is different and the underlying illness is fairly inconsequential during the acute phase of the crisis unless it significantly benefits the officer in de-escalating the situation.
    Considering social stigma and right to privacy.... we need to focus more on managing crisis situations in general.

 
 
Reply
Cancel
 
 
Report Abuse

Enter comments if any for reporting abuse

Cancel
 
The Peek
 
 
PROJECT GREEN
Cathleen McGuigan

Sustainable buildings are virtuous, but they can be ugly. Only a few designs are truly great.

Sponsored by
 
 
 
 
GEORGIA
John Barry
Sponsored by