Appeasing Russia

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  • Posted By: Tournesol @ 08/17/2008 4:58:18 PM

    It is difficult to understand the critics of Russia who fail to establish the connection between the West's support for the independence of Kosovo and the Russian intervention in Georgia. In 1999 NATO intervened in a strikingly similar, though much more brutal way, bombing Serbian army and civilian targets for 3 months in order to save the Albanian rebellion. The Serbian army and police had practically destroyed the Albanian guerilla whose leaders are now indicted for war crimes in the Hague, but after heavy bombing they eventually had to withdraw from Kosovo. Like Russia today, NATO paid no respect to Serbian sovereignty and used the same humanitarian reasons to justify it's action.

    Supporting Kosovo's independence in February this year, western politicians kept repeating that Kosovo is a unique case that will not be used as a precedent but failed to explain what exactly makes it so unique and who will make sure it is not used as a model by any of the hundreds of ethnic disputes around the world. In one thing one must agree with Russian diplomats: after invading Serbia and Iraq, the US and Britain have little credibility left to reproach Russia for doing the same. That is of little comfort to the small countries like Georgia or Serbia, but one should expect from commentators to show some more respect to common sense.

  • Posted By: fromiowa @ 08/11/2008 9:04:48 PM

    I don't trust Russia and I certainly don't trust the kremlin. The kremlin staged and provoked this whole attack. I am from Iowa and I think our Government better hurry up and play out the different scenerios of Russia's motive and plans, check the intel, and act accordingly. But I would like to see American jets tear up the Russian advance and rescue Georgia, if at all possible. I also suggest world leaders and worldwide government officials inspect everything they eat and drink, as the kremlin's kgb has been known to secretly poison and murder people at will, even with radioactive materials in food and/or drinks. Play it safe, we don't know the kremlins true motives are, and we shouldn't wait to find out.

    • Posted By: OneManArmy @ 08/16/2008 10:30:40 PM

      First key word, "Iowa." Second key word, "intel." Is this the same intel that suggested Iraq had WMDs?

    • Posted By: Braes @ 08/12/2008 1:33:49 AM

      You drink an awful lot, right?

      • Posted By: Ivan_Russian @ 08/12/2008 2:25:15 AM

        Iowa... ha-ha-ha ! Where is your informer? Where do you take information from? CNN? or BBC? or any other government channel?
        Read more my friend from different sources>
        Better ask Osetians or Abkhasians or Armenians about their standpoint... you`ll see that all the picture is rotating upside down by western TV/newsmakers...
        So you can only repeat the opinion of your purschased news channels.
        Better Phone to Osetia to gain real information.
        Or fly to Georgias POTY - there is NO russian troops and never were!
        Dont forget - Russia just reacted on DESTROING several cities and KILLING more than 2000 people in South Osetia BY GEORGIANS (with tanks and artillery 07/08/2008). Our reaction obviousely MUST be HARD!!!!

  • Posted By: OneManArmy @ 08/15/2008 8:07:37 PM

    Somebody pleeeasssse tell Rice to shut up. No one even listens to her.

    • Posted By: Braes @ 08/16/2008 11:31:36 AM

      Rice is the ultimate nobody. Nobody believes her here either. She was absolutely useless as a national security adviser, and has been totally useless as a Secretary of State. She is one thing, completely loyal to Bush. She is trained up in the Kissinger school. She represents a moderate intellect struggling with a limited knowlege of an Empire long gone, the Soviets. She is stll wishing she had a relevant job when the wall came down. Trump noted that she has never delivered a deal or averted a war.
      America squandered any moral authority during this regime, has crippled it's military might through wars of agression and conquest, and frittered away the gains of decades of service against the Soviet State, for a small political advantage. They are breathtakingly stupid, Bush, Cheney, Condi, and these neofascists.

  • Posted By: Freedomlives @ 08/14/2008 3:47:12 PM

    I would like to know what countries OneManArmy and MrBigZig are from? Probably France or another country the US has spent lives and treasure saving. I sure you spoke out about the US removal of those peace loving gov'ts in Afghanistan and Iraq but now have nothing bad to say about Russia attacking a small neighbor? Affraid of the bear? You make me ill.

    • Posted By: OneManArmy @ 08/15/2008 7:57:59 PM

      Heres Johnny! Country = Your Mamma! If I am from France, I would be proud to admit it over the US anyday! The US only interferes in there own interest, if they have something to gain. The world is much worse of a place to live in thanks to US's constant interference. The US has spent to kill just as many innocent civilians. As if the US is peace loving, it probably has committed the most wars on this planet. Bush the dictator needs to be tried for war crimes against humanity. I'm sure your one of the many in-bred rednecks that re-elected Bush. Russia is defending, not attacking. I love the big bear. I respect Russia's intelligence, strength, and take no crap attitude from the US. If I make you ill, good! Your also probably one of the many who can't afford health insurance in the US. Now why don't you go get your daily fix of "brainwash" from the US media and government.

      "If you truly want to help your country, do not deceive yourself from the truth."

      PS...I better not say too much because your "democratic" government might be spying on me.

    • Posted By: edspan @ 08/15/2008 12:57:36 AM

      It doesn't mater what country comments come from. Outsiders seems to have a better perspective. We trend to believe the whole world should agree with us. When bush invaded Iraq, the whole world was in disagreement (except those bought to join the so call coalition, i.e. Georgia and others) and here the media made us believe everybody was wrong, just to later learn that no Weapons of Mass Destruction existed and that everybody was right.

    • Posted By: edspan @ 08/15/2008 12:32:54 AM

      It doesn't mater what country comments come from. Outsiders seems to have a better perspective. We trend to believe the whole world should agree with us. When bush invaded Iraq, the whole world was in disagreement (except those bought to join the so call coalition, i.e. Georgia and others) and here the media made us believe everybody was wrong, just to later learn that no Weapons of Mass Destruction existed and that everybody was right.

  • Posted By: 1941 @ 08/12/2008 12:08:10 PM

    I do not agree with Russian action. But Georgia poses the same feeling to Russia which Pakistan does to India. Pakistan has been a hub of Terrorists which US and Europe did not agree for 40-50 years and no body knows what Georgia is doing to Russia.

    • Posted By: Braes @ 08/15/2008 11:18:36 AM

      This is the real point. The other end of the Pankisi is in Georgia, through which Chechen Rebels resupplied from their Kist cousins in Georgia. Ivan has had security issues along the Caucasus since the breakup. Ivan is just taking this opportunity to make his tormentors fear for their lives, and his tormentors friends to be exposed, humiliated, and called out for their hypocrisy.
      Unfortunately, it is us losing face, as our bully-president (who never understood bully-pulpit or soft power) gets a big heaping dose of his own stuff, served cold.
      What is scary is John McCrazy and his top policy guy telling us we are all Georgians. McCain sold out for a $200,000 lobbyist. That same guy brought us Chalabi and the Iraq war, and is a Bushite-Neo Con PNAC board member. The GOP has become the party of institutionalized fascism and perpetual wars of conquest.

  • Posted By: fallison @ 08/12/2008 10:51:03 AM

    The KGB is alive and well. The earliest ramifications of the bloodless coup de tat that kept Mr. Putin in power are now being felt by the world. Ezekial Chapter 38 indicated that Russia would join forces with the Anti-Christ and the Muslims in Iran to march southward....it is happening literally before our eyes. Putin and the new KGB will not be stopped until millions have died....Russia has again bought the lie......Obama has too...

    • Posted By: Braes @ 08/15/2008 11:06:59 AM

      Ohh this is about Jesus, and that justifies anything.

  • Posted By: Questions2 @ 08/14/2008 4:36:26 PM

    There are many similarities between the rhetoric and behaviour of Germany in 1938 and Russia in 2008, for example the defending of one???s citizens abroad argument, accusing a smaller country of attacking a larger one, claiming that the world is biased against them, fostering separatism and ethnic conflict in its neighbours??? territories. Carl Bildt drew some good parallels between Russia and Hitler???s Germany in a recent article.

    • Posted By: Ivan_Russian @ 08/15/2008 3:11:22 AM

      Georgia attacked small Osetia!
      Georgia killed about 2000 people. NOT Russia.
      Don`t forget it .

  • Posted By: Ivan_Russian @ 08/14/2008 3:59:23 AM

    There are new photos from Osetia... very cruel photos... be carefull to see it.... ((
    http://tskhinvali.org/photogallery.html

    Photos show HOW georgians do their business ... This is a real GENOCIDE of Osetians.
    just look and try to say something against it...

    • Posted By: Freedomlives @ 08/14/2008 3:52:00 PM

      Good propaganda!!

      • Posted By: Ivan_Russian @ 08/15/2008 3:08:24 AM

        I tryed to enter this site last night.
        Georgian (USA`s) hackers displaced photos of destroyed Tskhinvali... ((
        Instead they placed several comixes... not funny.
        It shows HOW georgians trying to HIDE the TRUTH!

        Try to fing photos from OSETIA (not only from georgia)...

    • Posted By: edspan @ 08/15/2008 12:55:37 AM

      I'm a strong believer of freedom and democracy, but not a any cost. Crimes must be punished whether they are done by the west, orient, north or whoever. Some people (fortunately not all) in America think crimes can be done in the name of freedom. Leaders like Bush manipulate reality to make people believe their freedom is at stake and gain support to do atrocities. I'm convinced Bush encouraged the Georgan leader to provoke Russia, now he is gaining support from countries like Polonia to install missiles. Bush is good at inducing fear to influence people's decisions, that is how he got reelected.

    • Posted By: Jill from Florida @ 08/14/2008 11:55:05 AM

      Thank you for giving us the website. It is most informative and has left me with an empty feeling, knowing that the Western World has done nothing to protect the South Ossetia peoples over the past 18 years. I understand why the South Ossetia's would distrust Western media, especially since they have been enduring terrorist attacks from Georgia since Saakashvili has taken over as President.

      It bothers me that my country's government has backed such a brutal leader as Saakashvili. I feel that the extremists of both the Democrats and Republicans do not have any interests in common people within my own country and the entire world.

  • Posted By: Glenno @ 08/15/2008 2:38:33 AM

    Russias neighbours invites US troops to train their armies??? Great American journalism, United States has spend hundreds of millions to in "election donations" for color coded revolutions to gain influence to get "invited".
    No matter what Russia does, they will always be a threat and enemy to the US because they are a regional power, and like every single regional power they disrupt US global dominance.

    US does not use its power to expand democracy, they are using democracy as a way of expanding their own power. A Georgian president receiving 97% of votes in what can only be described as a US coup to instal a satelite state is not a "beautiful democracy"!

    I especially enjoyed reading how McCain was barking threats at Germany for being too friendly with Russia. The cold war is over! Europe should support Russia on this issue

  • Posted By: edspan @ 08/15/2008 1:52:30 AM

    Check this out for a reality check:
    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1832982,00.html
    I'm glad to see Gates has not lost reality as Rumsfeld did.

  • Posted By: Glenno @ 08/15/2008 1:29:40 AM

    How is Putin a dictator, he has about 70-80% support of the nation, also confirmed by the international community. Because he opposes the illegal independece of a new puppet state Kosovo, because he critised how the Serbs were demonised and US attacked the civilian infrastructure, because he opposed the Iraq war and asks for caution about attacking Iran? Russia has not attacked a country since the end of the Soviet Union, they intervened once when their citizens were being massacered! Why is US expanding into Eurasia?

  • Posted By: Glenno @ 08/14/2008 8:55:59 PM

    Restoring the Soviet Union? There is a difference now, Georgia and Ukraine are American satelite states after the US supported their free elections by pouring millions into the pro-American (anti-russian) parties. In Georgia the president received 97% of the votes, God bless american democracy...

    The US expansion into Eurasia is the new Soviet Union. US army bases built along Russias border and the rocket shield is the new Hitler standing on Russias borders.

  • Posted By: thuctho @ 08/14/2008 4:45:25 PM

    Send in the Marines to fight the Russians. We will show Russia who is the super duper power. I'm not joining the military. I'm just a keyboard warrior like many of you people commenting here and reporters. LOL

  • Posted By: Questions2 @ 08/14/2008 4:36:40 PM

    The method Russia seems to be using in gaining its objective of restoring the Soviet Union is to separate a piece from another country and then move in its ???piecekeepers??? to keep that piece for itself.
    In conclusion, the international community should make plans for reacting to the next Russian attack on its neighbour. The present reaction is inadequate since Russian forces are staying in Georgia. The next attack will come since the invasion of Georgia is premeditated and part of a bigger plan (Robert Kagan???s Aug. 11 article in The Washington Post). There are also plenty of ???frozen conflict??? opportunities that Russia can warm up ??? Nagorno-Karabakh in Azerbaijan, Eastern Ukraine that is mainly Russian-speaking, Transdniestria in Moldova, the Russian enclave of Kaliningrad between Poland and Lithuania (access rights for example), the mainly Russian-speaking Ida-Virumaa region of Estonia.

  • Posted By: Firefoxgs @ 08/13/2008 4:29:33 PM

    Absolute lunacy. The writer would have us in a military confrontation with a major power in an area that is well within the sphere of influence of that power. Georgia is not, thankfully, within NATO, nor does the U.S. have a defense treaty with Georgia. It is not within our national interest to get involved in a shooting war in the Caucasus. Russia is not Iraq or Afghanistan. It will not lay over and play dead. Although it neglected the modernization of its conventional forces, it does have nuclear capability and perhaps the will to use it if pushed far enough. The West has been pushing Russia for 17 years. This is the blowback. .

    • Posted By: Freedomlives @ 08/14/2008 3:53:33 PM

      Appeasment is soooooo ugly.

  • Posted By: Glenno @ 08/14/2008 2:52:13 AM

    Why does the United States have to have dominance over Eurasia? And will Europe support the US by bringing war to European soil only to further promote global dictatorship for the US?
    We supported the US in destroying Yugoslavia, bombing Serbia, bypass democracy and install puppet states in Ukraine and Georgia. We are even going along with the rocket shield against Russia to give you first strike capabilities. But assisting the US in arming the Georgians to slaughter throusands of civilians and starting war with Russia.... WUnited Statesmight be stretching the friendship!

    • Posted By: thehappyamerican @ 08/14/2008 11:57:49 AM

      The Europeans are doing a great job of bringing war to their own soil in many ways. EU leaders have become appeasers. Europeans are becoming socially hollowed out to immigration and the immigrants run them by the numbers!
      The pop culture exceeds the concern for national security. And the oil fields of Europe are under observation of Russian military air craft.
      There is NO FIRST STIKE capability in a "rocket" defence.It can only refuse the Russians a successful first strike Russia launches at Europe. And why would Russia even want to launch a first strike at Europe?
      These are tough questions which the contemporary European does not want to deal with. Only hope the US elects an appeaser like Obama.So everyone can have their head in the sand.

      • Posted By: OneManArmy @ 08/14/2008 2:22:25 PM

        And I suppose having your head out of the sand by electing Bush did the US any good? McCain is just another clone of Bush. If you truly love your country, you'll do whats smart and right by electing Obama for a better world. Or you could actually elect McCain and let him destrot the US even further from within. Either way it's a win win situation for the world.

  • Posted By: Omaar @ 08/13/2008 8:16:03 PM

    Georgian President to McCain: "Move from Words to Deeds"


    This Maniac has got to be Kidding !!

    All you Pro-Georgia People, Volunteer to be a "Peace Keeper" in that Region or better still, Enlist in the Military...OK

    I'll lay down Flesh, Blood, Bone and Spirit for Atlanta Ga. Augusta Ga and savanah Ga....But Sakashvilli's Georgia...

    KISS MY BEHIND, WHERE THE SUN....NEVER SHINES !!!
    ------------------------------

    Source: The CNN Political Ticker

    Producer Peter Hamby

    This Maniac Sakashvilli has got to be Kidding Me !!

    Sakashvilli Attacked and Killed Many Osettians Thursday Night, without Provocation.... He Started this Invasion, keep this in mind.

    Keep in Mind...



    1. Russia Supplies the USA with Gas & Oil.

    2. Russia has the Largest Stockpile of Nuclear Weapons on Planet Earth !!

    3. Russia also has one of the Largest Militaries On Earth !!

    4. Russia and China are In Agreement on Most Foreign Policies and Performed Joint Military Excercises with China in Aug. of 2007.

    5. Both Russia and China Together would be a Nuclear NightMare, Noone would WIN and we'd Jeopardize our Nation for Manaical Sakashavilli & Georgia...No Way !!



    No American should lay down their Flesh, Blood, Bone and Spirit, for a Man Willfully Blind in Attacking a Seperated Province with Russian Peacekeepers within Osettia

    ---------------------------------------------



    (CNN) ??? Georgian President Mikheil Saakashvili on Wednesday called for John McCain and other American leaders to do more for Georgia in their response to the conflict in his country.

    "Yesterday, I heard Sen. McCain say, 'We are all Georgians now,'" Saakashvili said on CNN's American Morning. "Well, very nice, you know, very cheering for us to hear that, but OK, it's time to pass from this. From words to deeds."

    McCain told a crowd in Pennsylvania yesterday that he had called Saakashvili to express solidarity with the people of Georgia, saying: "Today, we are all Georgians."

    McCain's foreign policy adviser Randy Scheunemann a Long Time (Georgian Lobbyist) told reporters on the campaign plane Tuesday that McCain's remark "obviously meant a lot to Saakashvili personally, but more importantly the message it conveyed to the Georgian people in this really, time of unprecedented national emergency." Scheunemann said McCain and Saakashvili are friends who have speaking daily throughout the crisis.


    But Saakashvili said action is more important than rhetoric in the face of "brutal" and "deliberate" Russian violence. He urged the United States to take the lead in installing an international peacekeeping force.

    "We should realize what is at stake here for Americans," he said. "America is losing the whole region."

    "What Americans should do know, first of all, clearly make known their intentions," he said.

  • Posted By: Omaar @ 08/13/2008 8:12:11 PM

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/13/mccains-top-foreign-polic_n_118743.html

    John McCain's Lobbyist Buddy Randy Scheunemann a Mccain Campaign Cronie was a ....Georgian Lobbyist for YEARS !!!

    This whole Conflict has been Scripted and all for the World to.. SEE


    WASHINGTON : John McCain's chief foreign policy adviser and his business partner lobbied the senator or his staff on 49 occasions in a 3 1/2-year span while being paid hundreds of thousands of dollars by the government of the former Soviet republic of Georgia.

    The payments raise ethical questions about the intersection of Randy Scheunemann's personal financial interests and his advice to the Republican presidential candidate who is seizing on Russian aggression in Georgia as a campaign issue.

    McCain warned Russian leaders Tuesday that their assault in Georgia risks "the benefits they enjoy from being part of the civilized world."

    On April 17, a month and a half after Scheunemann stopped working for Georgia, his partner signed a $200,000 agreement with the Georgian government. The deal added to an arrangement that brought in more than $800,000 to the two-man firm from 2004 to mid-2007. For the duration of the campaign, Scheunemann is taking a leave of absence from the firm.

    "Scheunemann's work as a lobbyist poses valid questions about McCain's judgment in choosing someone who _ and whose firm _ are paid to promote the interests of other nations," said New York University law professor Stephen Gillers. "So one must ask whether McCain is getting disinterested advice, at least when the issues concern those nations."

    "If McCain wants advice from someone whose private interests as a once and future lobbyist may affect the objectivity of the advice, that's his choice to make."

    McCain has been to Georgia three times since 1997 and "this is an issue that he has been involved with for well over a decade," said McCain campaign spokesman Brian Rogers.

    McCain's strong condemnation in recent days of Russia's military action against Georgia as "totally, absolutely unacceptable" reflects long-standing ties between McCain and hardline conservatives such as Scheunemann, an aide in the 1990s to then-Senate Majority Leader Trent Lott.



  • Posted By: Omaar @ 08/13/2008 5:38:55 PM

    Note: Aug-2007... Russia and China Hold Joint Military Exercises...

    A Word to the Very, Very Wisest of Men & Women.

    After the Olympics, Watch China's Hu Jintao and who he will Favor on this Dispute and rightly so, in this case. Keep in mind that, we are in Major Debt with China and Russia Supplies us with Gas and oil, not to mention Both Countries are Both Nuclear and Ever-Ready to Nuke !!

    Russia having the..... Largest Stockpile of Nuclear Weapons !!


    The Associated PressPublished: August 17, 2007
    http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/17/europe/EU-GEN-Russia-China-Maneuvers.php


    CHEBARKUL TESTING RANGE, Russia: President Vladimir Putin said Friday he had ordered strategic bombers to resume regular long-range patrols as Russian and Chinese forces held their first joint military exercise on Russian soil ??? a show of armed muscle aimed at sending a pointed message to the United States.

    The resumption of bombing patrols, which analysts say signaled a significant change for Russian military policy, comes amid a growing chill in U.S.-Russian relations, strained over Washington's criticism of Russia's democracy record, Moscow's objections to U.S. missile defense plans and differences over global crises.

    Both Moscow and Beijing share a heightening distrust of what they see as the United States' oversized role and influence in global politics, and the two former Cold War rivals have forged a "strategic partnership" aimed at counterbalancing Washington's policies.

    The Russian-Chinese war games, which took place near the Urals Mountain city of Chelyabinsk, coincided with Russian air force maneuvers involving 20 strategic bombers which ranged far over the Atlantic, Pacific and Arctic oceans.

    One of those drills, involving 11 Russian aircraft, prompted NATO member Norway to scramble F-16 fighter jets to observe and photograph the Russian planes as they flew over the Norwegian Sea.


    The group of strategic bombers, early warning aircraft, fighter jets and refueling planes represented the biggest show of Russian air power in that region since the early 1990s, said Brig. Gen. Ole Asak, chief of the Norwegian Joint Air Operations Center.

    "We haven't seen that kind of activity in a very long time," Asak told The Associated Press. "Not since the early 1990s. It was quite impressive to see."

    In announcing the policy change, Putin said halting long-range bombers' flights after the Soviet collapse had affected Russia's security as other nations had continued such missions ??? an oblique reference to the United States.


  • Posted By: husein's brain @ 08/13/2008 4:16:46 PM

    why doesnt he invade france there are russians there

    • Posted By: Sickrat @ 08/13/2008 4:57:27 PM

      Because France does not kill them by the thousand.

    • Posted By: OneManArmy @ 08/13/2008 4:18:18 PM

      Because he doesn't care for croissants.

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