A Personality Referendum

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  • Posted By: bluegrass101 @ 08/18/2008 9:09:22 PM

    Unless you're a Neo_con or Conservative , Fox News is the wrong program to watch, unless of course you like to be brainwashed.

    • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 3:11:16 PM

      So what you think MSNBC or CNN are totally unbiased?

      • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 6:36:13 PM


        Zombie, Yes, most of the stations except FOX will not bring up topics for discussion or investigation about Obama that most folks want to hear about. I see Harley cannot deny your comment and resorted to name calling again. Very immature. ; - (

  • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 6:00:12 PM



    Here is a detailed article about Obamas REAL stance on the BAIP Act by Jill Stanek. It is long but worth posting, especially since NEWSWEEK chose to bury their article about Obamas not voting for this bill! Any thoughts?

    Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act
    4-2-2008
    by Jill Stanek

    PART I

    On JAN. 10, 2005, newly elected U.S. Sen. Barack Obama visited former colleagues and staffers at the Illinois state Capitol, where he had served seven years as state senator. I happened to be at the Capitol that day, too, and a friend and I took the opportunity to speak to Obama, who had not yet achieved rock-star status and was still approachable.

    We were in Springfield to lobby for passage of the STATE BORN ALIVE INFANT PROTECTION ACT, legislation that would require hospitals to care for infants who survive an abortion. OBAMA SPOKE AGAINST the legislation in 2001 and 2002 and SINGLE-HANDEDLY DEFEATED IT in committee in 2003.

    My friend stood in Obamas path and said, Senator, we are going to pass Born Alive here in Illinois this year. Obama smiled smoothly and agreed, I think you will, adding, I would have voted for the Born Alive Infant Protection Act in Illinois HAD IT BEEN WORDED the SAME as the Federal bill. I think that is the position the Democrats should take(, he said).

    THERE IS JUST ONE THING HE FORGOT TO MENTION: Obama had STOPPED his committee from adding the Federal wording. With Obama no longer in the state Senate, the Born Alive legislation passed in 2005.

    First Encounter

    An Illinois lawmaker offered the FIRST DRAFT of the states BORN ALIVE INFANT PROTECTION ACT in 2001 after I revealed publicly that Christ Hospital left babies who survived abortion - viable babies whose delivery was induced, and whom the abortionist intended to kill but somehow survived - in a utility room to die.

    The bill, sponsored by (Illinois) state Sen. Patrick O???Malley of Oak Lawn defined BORN ALIVE using LANGUAGE IDENTICAL TO that of FEDERAL LEGISLATION introduced in 2000 by Rep. Charles Canady, R-Fla., who in turn drafted wording

    Source: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

    (Continued below - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

  • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 5:59:03 PM



    (Continued from above - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

    PART II

    developed by the World Health Organization in 1950 and adopted by the United Nations in 1955:

    DEFINING BORN ALIVE:

    The term BORN ALIVE, with respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the COMPLETE EXPULSION or EXTRACTION from its mother of that member, at any stage of development, who after such expulsion or extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been cut, and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean section, or induced abortion. I first encountered Barack Obama on March 27, 2001, when I testified before the Illinois Senate Judiciary Committee, of which he was a member. My testimony included my description of holding a premature aborted baby until he died:

    One night, a nursing co-worker was taking an ABORTED DOWNS SYNDROME BABY who was BORN ALIVE TO OUR SOILED UTILITY ROOM because his parents did not want to hold him, and she did not have time to hold him. I could not bear the thought of this suffering child dying alone in a Soiled Utility Room, so I cradled and rocked him for the 45 minutes that he lived. He was 21 to 22 weeks old, weighed about ½ pound, and was about 10 inches long. He was too weak to move very much, expending any energy he had trying to breathe. Toward the end, he was so quiet that I could not tell if he was still alive unless I held him up to the light to see if his heart was still beating through his chest wall. After he was pronounced dead, we folded his little arms across his chest, wrapped him in a tiny shroud, and carried him to the hospital morgue where all of our dead patients are taken.

    Obama questioned whether the BORN ALIVE legislation would impede the right to abort and doctor/patient decision-making. He and an American Civil Liberties Union attorney speculated BORN ALIVE would force doctors to resuscitate nonviable aborted babies.

    Obama OPPOSED BORN ALIVE in committee, BUT voted PRESENT - neither yes nor no, but merely present - on the Illinois state Senate floor, one of MANY PRESENT VOTES that Hillary Clinton has cited as evidence that Obama lacks leadership skills. Clinton voted for the federal Born Alive bill, putting her on record as more pro-life than Obama.

    Source: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

    (Continued below - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

  • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 5:57:07 PM



    (Continued from above - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

    PART III

    Constitutional Blindness

    A graduate of Harvard Law School, Obama TAUGHT CONSTITUTIONAL LAW at the University of Chicago for 10 years. Both schools are listed in the top 10 law schools in the country. BUT Obama revealed his CONSTITUTIONAL BLIND SPOT in his (own) book The Audacity of Hope:

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created [emphasis added] equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among those are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.???

    OBAMA: (T)he essential idea behind the Declaration ??? that we are BORN [emphasis added] into this world free, all of us; that each of us arrives with a bundle of rights that cannot be taken away by any person or any state without just cause; that through our own agency we can, and must, make of our lives what we will, is one that every American understands.

    Note Obamas choice of the word BORN over the word CREATED. Perhaps that helps explain his (Obamas) support for UNRESTRICTED ABORTION. Also note that our BUNDLE OF RIGHTS can be TAKEN AWAY with JUST CAUSE.

    Obama clearly considers abortion a JUST CAUSE. Here is how he argued against Born Alive during Illinois Senate debate in 2001:

    OBAMA: I just want to suggest ??? that this (legislation) is probably not going to survive constitutional scrutiny. Number one, whenever we define a pre-viable fetus as a person that is protected by the equal protection clause or the other elements in the Constitution, what we are really saying is, in fact, that they are persons that are entitled to the kinds of protections that would be provided to a - child, a 9-month-old - child that was delivered to term. That determination then, essentially, if it was accepted by a court, would forbid abortions to take place. I mean, it, it would essentially bar abortions, because the equal protection clause does not allow somebody to kill a child, and if this is a child, then this would be an anti-abortion statute. For that purpose, I think it would probably be found unconstitutional.

    The legislation passed the Senate, but (it) did not survive in the House. When Rep. O???Malley reintroduced Born Alive and its companion bills in 2002, they headed again to the same committee, where Obama rewrote history:

    Source: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

    (Continued below - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

  • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 5:56:28 PM



    (Continued from above - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

    PART IV

    OBAMA: Ms. Stanek, your initial testimony last year showed your DISMAY AT THE
    LACK OF REGARD FOR HUMAN LIFE. I agreed with you last year, and WE SUGGESTED that there be a Comfort Room or something of that nature be done. The hospital acknowledged that and changes were made and you are still unimpressed. It sounds to me like you are really not interested in how these fetuses are treated, but rather not providing absolutely any medical care or life to them.

    Of course, Obama HAD NOT AGREED with me the year before, and I WAS THE ONE who had TOLD HIM ABOUT THE COMFORT ROOM, which the hospital created in response to MY testimony: We now have this prettily wallpapered room. ??? There is even a NICE WOODEN ROCKER in the room to rock live aborted babies to death.

    The hospital made live birth abortions LOOK NICER, but the end result was still DEAD BABIES.

    OBAMA SAID: What we are doing here is to create one more burden on women, and I can not support that, and he voted NO in committee again.

    The bill went again to the Senate floor, where Obama was the SOLE SPEAKER AGAINST IT, claiming that it would impose a BURDEN on PHYSICIANS:

    OBAMA: [T]his [legislation] puts the burden on the attending physician who has determined, since they are performing this procedure, that in fact, this is a nonviable fetus.

    Troubled Conscience?

    Democrats won control of the Illinois state Senate in November 2002, and when Born Alive was REINTRODUCED FOR THE THIRD TIME in 2003, it was directed to the Obama-chaired, infamously LIBERAL Health and Human Services Committee, where HE simply REFUSED TO CALL IT FOR A VOTE.

    By this time Obama was running for U.S. Senate. He won his primary in March 2004, and Republicans recruited former U.N. Ambassador Alan Keyes, who lived in Maryland, to oppose him. It was Obamas position against Born Alive that persuaded Keyes to run, as he stated in his announcement speech:

    Source: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

    (Continued below - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

  • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 5:55:42 PM


    (Continued from above - Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act )

    PART V

    Keyes said: When I was first approached about this possibility, I have to say that my reaction was negative. What finally caught my eye, however . . . what finally arrested my attention and forced me to consider whether I not only had the opportunity to oppose him, but the obligation was when I learned that (OBAMA) had actually, in April 2002, apparently cast a VOTE that would continue to ALLOW LIVE BIRTH ABORTIONS in the state of Illinois.

    We are talking about a situation in which, in the course of an abortion procedure, a child has been born alive, IS OUT OF THE WOMB, breathing and living on its own, and he (OBAMA) CAST A VOTE AGAINST THE IDEA THAT WE SHOULD NOT STAND BY AND LET THAT CHILD DIE!

    This was why Keyes alleged during their campaign that Jesus Christ would not vote for Barack Obama, as he explained in an interview with an NBC affiliate:

    Keyes said: CHRIST WOULD NOT STAND IDLY BY WHILE AN INFANT CHILD IN THAT SITUATION DIED. . . Christ would not vote for Barack Obama, because Barack Obama has voted to behave in a way that it is inconceivable for Christ to have behaved.

    Obama later admitted Keyes comment NAGGED him and has written or spoke about it several times, although he always misrepresents Keyes rationale as being about abortion support when it was specifically about infanticide support. In a July 2006 opinion piece in USA Today, restated later in The Audacity of Hope, Obama wrote:

    If I am opposed to abortion for religious reasons, but seek to pass a law banning the practice, I cannot simply point to the teachings of my church. I have to explain why abortion violates some principle that is accessible to people of all faiths, including those with no faith at all.

    Obamas faith has come into question on the campaign trail. Accused of being a Muslim, he has insisted that he is ROOTED in the CHRISTIAN TRADITION and has a personal relationship with Jesus Christ. In fact, Obama has attended the largest church in one of Americas most stridently PRO-ABORTION denominations, the United Church of Christ, for 20 years. His church, Trinity, is located just five miles from Christ Hospital. Obamas pastor, the Rev. Dr. Jeremiah Wright, served on the board of Christ Hospitals health care system.

    It is ironic in the extreme that the most determined opponents of pre-born life, and even those who are born , embrace the name of the One who caused John the Baptist to leap in his mother???s womb.

    Source: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

    Another similarly related article by Jill Stanek: http://www.illinoisrighttolife.org/newpage36.htm

  • Posted By: HolyRoller @ 08/18/2008 5:21:26 PM

    Boy ya'll Kool-Aide Kids.......aka obamamohammeds, declare ANY criticism of your messiah as slander. Why don't you say what you really think....APOSTASY and HERESY.......

    FYI...Hussein's camp today ADMITED, he has been lying (par for the course with Barry)... about his reason for voting against banning infanticide, inIllinois. He had been saying it would restrict Roe vs Wade. They finally admit it would not have. They are trying to spin it, but it will not work. The proof is in black and white. The identical bill cleared the U.S. Senate with NO dissenting votes. Hussein killed it in committee in Illinois.

    Hussein out and out supported killing newborns. No other way to say it.

    I wish the MSM had the guts to ask this question...At what time did YOUR daughters receive human rights, Senator???

    He supports murder, in return for votes or money. As the hippies used to call our soldiers...BABY KILLER!!!
    Hussein "Barry Soerto" Obama is no more than a BABY KILLER!!!

    He is a Crook and a Fraud. And ya'll have fallen hook, line, and sinker...Idiots.

    NOBAMA!!!

    • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/18/2008 6:23:17 PM

      No one particularly cares to listen to a "Christian" who's advocated mass murder in Iran and Palestine, Roller. Go follow your own Commandments and then come back and talk.

      • Posted By: sharenews @ 08/19/2008 5:41:13 PM


        . . . or the supposed Christian who continually blocked the Born Alive Infant Protection Act from passing in his state of Illinois.

        Obama Blocked Born Alive Infant Protection Act
        4-2-2008
        by Jill Stanek

        Article: http://www.citizenlink.org/CLtopstories/A000007034.cfm

        Even all of the abortion orgs did not object to this humane bill which finally did pass in Illinois once Obama left office.


        Here is another (MUST READ) related article by Jill Stanek:

        http://www.illinoisrighttolife.org/newpage36.htm

      • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 6:47:59 PM

        That was pretty good. He is a tad annoying with all that blathering.

    • Posted By: SPIRITED AWAY @ 08/18/2008 5:43:00 PM

      The O-man had to stand by Planned Parenthood's side, didn't he? I wonder if he knew what PP was really up to? Surely not.

  • Posted By: denmill @ 08/18/2008 11:08:00 AM

    Eleanor Clift I have just read that the Palestinian brothers inside the Hamas-controlled Gaza Strip are listed in government election filings as having donated $29,521.54 to Sen. Barack Obama's campaign. Can you do your research? We hardcore Americans want to know the "TRUTH".

    • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 11:42:43 AM

      Maybe she can do research into why "hardcore Americans" just make up stuff. Maybe she can do research and find out why people are born, go to school, then live for fabrications. Maybe she can find out if there are physiological reasons why people make it there life's goal to divide, while talking about how awful division is.

      • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 1:51:58 PM

        And the Democrat screams FOUL!!!! And the Democrat screams RACIST!!!!! And the Democrat screams BIGOT!!!!!!

        • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 2:21:30 PM

          I'll try to be as refined and gentlemenly as you Mr. Mo-nay. Perhaps, I'll start intolerance poetry.

          • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 3:15:29 PM

            Ignorance is, was, and has always been your strong suit. Why abandon it now?

            • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 4:20:12 PM

              Ignorance is name-calling, lies, bigotry and boorishness. That would be you sir. I'm nice.

              • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 4:57:14 PM

                Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 14:21:30
                Comment: I'll try to be as refined and gentlemenly as you Mr. Mo-nay. Perhaps, I'll start intolerance poetry.

                Mr Monay? Is that name calling? LMAO My lord you are horrible at this.

                • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 6:09:22 PM

                  Did not you say you were Mr. Mo-nay in a fit of street-cred?

                  • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 7:19:11 PM

                    Again you made a boo boo. Poor fella, I said my daughters name was Monay. You seem to think it's funny to add your own puntuation. Wonder why? We know why though don't we Mr. Racist?

                    • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/19/2008 5:24:44 PM

                      Ask Ms. Mo-nay, why daddy posts slurs. You have the resources right at your little fingertips. I don't hate people of color at all. I don't post about their successes, failures, fears or concerns. I - being of average intelligence - know they have them. I will not pretend I know more about them than they know about themselves. The difference between me and you is, I grew up in a rainbow, and you grew up in the rain. I don't wish harm, ill will, make-up stories, post racially charged lies and stereotypes, wait for the best burn, or lies about how I've been posting. I leave that to you. I could not if I tried waste my time making up a disgusting race-driven poems to hurt someone. I would never refer to a candidate as a Messiah, Idol, God, Hussein in the negative connotation. That's just foul and wrong. And people like you who do this type of thing daily, should never call names. It calls into question to your fitness of household and mindset. Sorry.

              • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 5:27:10 PM

                Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 16:15:38
                Comment: And you sir - may I use caps - CLEARLY do not understand supply and demand and process. It WILL BE 20-30 years before it relieves a harder arch - no savings or relief. Which WILL equate to a lesser burden on the consumer down the line. You need to stop calling people idiots. You're not that smart it seems, but most folks who reply like you are not. Perhaps you've dipped too many ponytails in inkwells, and punched-out little guys with glasses to fully understand. Perhaps the burden of ripping off old ladies makes you angry. The answer right now is 284-169 electoral Mr Trader. Being a blog bully does not help your cause.

                More name calling. Guess you dont even believe what you post.

                • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 6:08:30 PM

                  I thought that was nice as compared to you guys. Why is you guys always are so mean, hard and angry - then turn it around to the nice guy being mean? McCain-ish right? Take our posts, cover the names, give them to your little girl, and ask her who she thinks is the bully. Please remove the F, A and N-bombs before you do. FAN-bombs?

            • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 4:31:02 PM

              Sorry. This is ignorance:

              Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 12:43:08 PM
              Comment: Barack H Obama
              Dont dare say his name
              McCains playin politics
              Racisms your game
              A sip of the kool aide
              A heartwarming speech
              Edwards admits to his lies
              Your at the beach
              Michelle looks like Rambo
              black power she loves
              at the wedding were pigeons
              HELL NO to white doves
              So vote for Obama
              but dont say hussain
              you'll be labeled a racist
              by the legally insane

              The guy who wrote this is just well...

      • Posted By: careerdaytrader @ 08/18/2008 3:35:24 PM

        I'd like YOU to tell me how Obama plans to create 5 million jobs? I'm hoping he doesn't plan to expand government that much! Small businesses are the fuel to job creation and by taxing small business owners more how is he going to accomplish this? Btw, MANY small business owners make over $250,000 per year. I know it SOUNDS like a lot of money to you folks but it really isn't that much money. Taxing us will hurt jobs.

        He'd have been truthful if he had simply said I promise to COST America 5 million jobs! The truth, but doesn't sound as good as flipping the truth upside down! lol

        • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 4:54:51 PM

          I hear cricketts!!!! lol Very good point. You think he can comprehend that taxing the shyt outta small business owners will not make hiring more employees easier? Im waiting for him to reply "If you want to know about Obama read his book" lol

        • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 4:27:06 PM

          Five million jobs will be tough - has nothing to do with my post - but it will be tough. One would need new ideas and initiatives. Not the same "good-old-boy" network of thieves, lawyers, lobbyist and day traders. I have no idea how he can do it. Neither does anyone else - including you. I wish him well, and I do believe he will give it try. But to say lose 5 million is true? Well, that's just irresponsible. Like ripping off the public-at-large. But once again, you know that.

      • Posted By: denmill @ 08/18/2008 11:47:25 AM

        How about finding out "THE TRUTH ABOUT BARACK HUSSEIN OBAMA"

        • Posted By: Driver of wagons @ 08/18/2008 12:44:02 PM




          Release the sealed records the complete records you know the ones you had sealed when you fought long and hard to seal up with the passing of the McCain Bill Circa 1992 Come on John McCain and lets put this election on a level playing field. let the truth be know for all to see.




          • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 3:16:41 PM

            Diverting the question doesn't answer the question does it?

          • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 1:13:50 PM

            Hey Im having deja vu again. Where did I hear this from again? Oh yeah, Hilary!!!!!! LOL
            I guess these types of things are only distractions when you ask Mr Obama huh?

      • Posted By: denmill @ 08/18/2008 12:03:05 PM

        Obama is a big disaster more like "an environmental apocalypse". As an american who truly love my Country, I will not be conned into destroying my Country by electing a sleazy environmental apocalypse for the sake of change or no matter how I feel about George W. Bush. Not all changes are good changes. No to enviromental apocalypse! NOBAMA.

    • Posted By: Lee Holmes @ 08/18/2008 11:42:22 AM

      According to the Federal Election Commission,their names are Manir and Hasan Edwan,and appeared on the FECs radar when they listed their home as ''Rafah,Georgia''. Georgia does not have a ''Rafah''. Gaza,however,does. The FEC forbids donations in the amount given by the Edwans individually,and is now having a look at the two brothers. It is unknown whether or not the Obama campaign is returning the money.

      www.fec.gov

  • Posted By: Driver of wagons @ 08/18/2008 1:32:47 PM



    McCain falsely claimed that the war in Iraq was "the first major conflict since 9/11" -- either forgetting about the war in Afghanistan or deeming it not major enough. This is not all that surprising, since McCain's policies on Afghanistan -- the real central front in the war on terror -- have been all over the map. Indeed, McCain first attacked Obama's policy on Afghanistan, then adopted it for himself.

    http://thinkprogress.org/2008/06/19/mccain-bush-gi-bill/



    McCain has a long history of paying lip service to supporting America's troops but voting against their interests. His handling of the new GI bill was the latest example of his hypocrisy: he consistently and vocally worked to defeat it, then, once it passed, tried to take credit for it.

    Extend your wrongly informed PAIN with your vote for McCain

    • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 3:08:22 PM

      More hypocrisy at it's best!!!!! And now that you cleared that up tell us what Obama thought about Off shore drilling before the polls showed the it's popularity among voters?

      • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 3:18:56 PM

        Answering a statement with inert gas. Mr. Obama is against drilling, decided to look at it due to public outcry, and decided that it should be done with care if done at all. As it turns out, take away all the emotion, and that oil will not be available for 20-30 years, and will not reduce costs to the consumer. Mr. Obama's 10-15 percent of the reserves is indeed a better idea for the immediate concern. Please google if drilling is the best answer. It is not. Mr. Obama's course is more adult, dedicated and not from the hip. The economist agree that drilling now is just "drilling for dollars" for old bud's.

        • Posted By: careerdaytrader @ 08/18/2008 3:31:10 PM

          Ask Plus you CLEARLY do not understand the energy markets. They are markets and their price is MARKET driven. It's 100% supply and demand and as most of us who have seen gas prices falling almost to the DAY that Bush lifted the offshore drilling ban. The prices are set in the FUTURES markets and if America commits itself to producing oil the futures markets will reflect this with lower prices.

          Only a complete idiot thinks it takes 20 to 30 years to drill for oil BEFORE the oil comes up and is usable. haha, just when I thought I found the biggest idiot Democrat on here you say this. Really funny! You must be Obama's CHIEF ENERGY advisor !

          • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 4:15:38 PM

            And you sir - may I use caps - CLEARLY do not understand supply and demand and process. It WILL BE 20-30 years before it relieves a harder arch - no savings or relief. Which WILL equate to a lesser burden on the consumer down the line. You need to stop calling people idiots. You're not that smart it seems, but most folks who reply like you are not. Perhaps you've dipped too many ponytails in inkwells, and punched-out little guys with glasses to fully understand. Perhaps the burden of ripping off old ladies makes you angry. The answer right now is 284-169 electoral Mr Trader. Being a blog bully does not help your cause.

            • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 4:44:38 PM

              Gas prices before lifting the ban.... $4.17 gallon Cincy Ohio
              Gas prices after lifting the ban......$3.59 TODAY!!!!

              Look up the prices the day before and the day after the ban was lifted. Then a week afterwards. Notice anything weird? lol

              • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 6:00:29 PM

                The NYT and USA Today said it was a cycle, the Economist said it was the natural direction when people are driving less. You said McCain. I'll go with the experts.

                • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 7:10:58 PM

                  Funny stuff. NYT is a Liberal paper is it not? Do liberal papers want to say Bush was right? And the cycle, as you say, never began is circular motion until after the ban was lifted? Seems prices according to the stock exchange were only on the rise ^ until the ban was lifted. Sometimes it doesn't take an expert to figure this stuff out. Sometimes the answer is obvious. All year prices skyrocket. Bans lifted, prices go down, you believe it is a coincidence? Come on Ask, you said average intelligence, start acting like it.

                  • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/19/2008 5:12:28 PM

                    Here again is smart. I'll try to be more like you. But next time please address the standards. NYT is liberal, is not a response. It's also half true since the paper is having issues with people wanting them to report more against Mr. Obama. And of course you "forgot" to mention the Economist.

                    Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 5:01:12 PM
                    Comment: Barack H Obama
                    Dont dare say his name
                    McCains playin politics
                    Racisms your game
                    A sip of the kool aide
                    A heartwarming speech
                    Edwards admits to his lies
                    Your at the beach
                    Michelle looks like Rambo
                    black power she loves
                    at the wedding were pigeons
                    HELL NO to white doves
                    So vote for Obama
                    but dont say hussain
                    you'll be labeled a racist
                    by the legally insane

                    Genius at work Mr. Sportslock09. Your humanity is only surpassed by your fabrications.

  • Posted By: bluegrass101 @ 08/18/2008 3:12:51 PM

    Another visit to THE REPUGLICON CONVENTION-------I was there as a Witness and this is what we all saw. 50,000 Pick-up trucks in the parking lot with Rebel Flag,s some with fenders , some with bumpers missing, and some with no doors. Inside 10,000 Brown Shirts stomping the floor to the hit tune of Toobie Kieths " A BOOT UP YER BOOTY" as they dragged their Knuckles around the Hall. 10,000 wealthy , well dressed Evangelicals with their arms in the air praising Craig and Haggert (Some had their hands in the pockets of Fixed News Commentators, thanking Jesus for making them rich. A few Repig's acknowledged Global Warming and were immediatly stabbed with pitchforks from the Hill Folk, Hannity , being the Chicken -Hawk he is was hiding behind Dennis Hastert. Everyone from Fixed Noise including R. Murdoch and Limbaugh looked like they had a cucumber in their pockets, but alas they were just getting excited to see the CREEPIEST SCENE on the face of the planet -- On Stage, the most grotesque sight imaginable, get ready-----Cyndi and Johner McFudd, Lindsey Graham, Joe Lie berman, Phil (Turtle Head) Gramm, Cheney, Dumya, all grinning like The Joker and 1,000 Nascar fans yelling GIT ER DONE fur McFudd. Hello Wolfie and Jackie M.

    • Posted By: careerdaytrader @ 08/18/2008 3:22:12 PM

      You forgot to mention the MILLIONS of Millionares who really RUN AMERICA.

      Meanwhile the Democratic party will have all the high school dropouts, ignorant fools who believe anything their Obama "ONE" says and who can not think critically nor understand the issues. All they know is they need CHANGE and instead of looking into a mirror to see how pathetic they screwed up THEIR lives they vote for a man who PROMISES them everything but the kitchen sink.

      Barak "America HALF OFF SALE" Hussein Mohammed Obama !!

      • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 4:07:13 PM

        That was terse. You should to read the demographics of who is getting the votes. The "dumb-ones" are not voting for Mr Obama. But you know that. Hell, you're a day-trader. You know every thing:

        http://www.usnews.com/blogs/robert-schlesinger/2008/08/18/barack-obama-and-the-curious-incident-of-the-stubborn-polls.html

        I think Mr. Bush already sold the country. The next president will have to buy it back. Sorry about the higher taxes.

        • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 4:36:59 PM

          Pssst ............."Everything" is one word not two.... lol Yup fellas... the smartest and brightest are voting Obama LMAO

          • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 5:57:39 PM

            I'm not the brightest - I'm of average intelligence and education. I'm also not preoccupied with some one's grammar on a blog. BTW, you're one sentence has two errors. Good one though Mr. Mo-nay. If you're being base, you're not in bigot mode.

            • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 6:56:22 PM

              Someone is one word not two. Yet another example of the more intelligent, more educated Obama voter.

              • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/19/2008 5:07:55 PM

                Now here's intelligent:

                Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 5:01:12 PM
                Comment: Barack H Obama
                Dont dare say his name
                McCains playin politics
                Racisms your game
                A sip of the kool aide
                A heartwarming speech
                Edwards admits to his lies
                Your at the beach
                Michelle looks like Rambo
                black power she loves
                at the wedding were pigeons
                HELL NO to white doves
                So vote for Obama
                but dont say hussain
                you'll be labeled a racist
                by the legally insane

                Pure unadulterated genius Mr. Sportslock09. Genius.
                You have that natural street brainiac facade.

            • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 7:01:54 PM

              Average I assume is based off of the failing public school system?

      • Posted By: News and Notes @ 08/18/2008 8:07:48 PM

        Your arguments would be stronger if you didn't criticize all democrats. most of us are strong, hard working, intelligent, educated, and pursuing the american dream. Of course millionaires don't run the country. If they did, there would be no opportunity left for the rest of us. It would be like Russia where the president pays himself billions of dollars a year. Everyone has opportunity in the United States, and with luck, intelligence, and perseverance, most of us will get there. I don't necessarily have a problem, however, with giving a helping hand to those who are trying hard and falling a little short,

  • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 3:34:55 PM

    With a new swift-boat style attack book, the Republicans are doing a masterful job of defining Barack Obama. It's time to fight back ??? and quickly.

    I love the heading of this article!. But they left out how the Democrats have been doing a masterful job of defining ALL Republicans as a clone of Bush for the last 4 yrs LMAO
    Don't wanna give the facts now would we?

    • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 3:59:31 PM

      McCain is not a clone. He's 95%. And swift-boating is lying. That's all.

      • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 4:30:38 PM

        Well what is it called when the Dems blame everything on the Reps even though they hold a house majority. Oh yeah, lying!!! But the good kinda lying right? lol

        • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/19/2008 10:28:50 AM

          You forget one itsy bitsy piece of the pie that was left out, the dems may have the majority, but not enough to override fillabusters.

          • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:40:00 AM

            How many filibusters so far since 2006?

            • Posted By: Driver of wagons @ 08/19/2008 12:59:02 PM




              Close to 100? just a guess actaully last i counted it was about a month or so ago it was above 90



              • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 3:10:48 PM

                Sorry If I don't believe you, you have a link to a source?
                It maybe be that many....compared to how many times Reid has envoked Cloture?

        • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:39:18 AM

          See its easy for the Berry supporters to blame everything on McCain. You see them do it all the time...McSame...McWar...I've even seen a McHitler a dfew times...
          Yet you see the outrage for holding Barry accountable for his own words and his own record....
          Look at Barry's vote against Born Alive....now I'm pro-choice but voting 3 times against it? The first two...maybe.. I can give him the benefit because it didn't have the neutralization clause.
          The third time it did....the records show that Barry voted in the clause, then immediately killed the bill in committee. Now Barry is outraged that people are trying to straighten out a record he has distorted. Why hasn't the University of Chicago released Barry's records? Remember the outrage when Hillary didn't release her tax returns?

        • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 5:40:23 PM

          1.5 years versus 10.5 years. That's called truth.

          • Posted By: SPORTLOCK09 @ 08/18/2008 6:10:22 PM

            And where were gas prices 1.5 yrs ago?

            • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 6:56:50 PM

              Exponentially increased with the cost of the war. It was not cheap then either. You know this. Why ask me this question?

  • Posted By: bob_hall27 @ 08/17/2008 1:08:34 AM

    A SUMMARY OF THE COMMUNIST MANIFESTO
    The communist manifesto represents a misguided philosophy, which teaches the citizens to give up their RIGHTS for the sake of the "common good???, but it always ends in a police state. This is called preventive justice. Control is the key concept. Read carefully:
    1. abolition of private property (imminent domain, national parks)
    2. Heavy progressive income tax (This one is obvious and they want to raise it more)
    3. Abolition of all rights of inheritance (we have an Inheritance tax which is unconstitutional)
    4. Confiscation of property of all emigrants and rebels (this is coming wait till they start labeling American citizens as terrorists much the same as when they where labeling communists)
    5. CENTRAL BANK (federal reserve)
    6. Government control of communications and transportation (FCC, DOT, Patriot Act)
    7. Government ownership of factories and agriculture (they want to socialize oil and healthcare to start)
    8. Government control of labor (Dept. of labor, minimum wage)
    9. Corporate farms, regional planning (all of the sustainable development laws they have and are trying to pass)
    10. Government control of education (Dept. of Education)
    And many more they are adding to them daily

    • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:18:55 AM

      Oh look - another republican giving voice to the politics of fear - what a surprise.

      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 2:38:02 AM

        Look another Obama poster that can't hold a debate, and has to rely on personal attacks to make up for lack of ....

        • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:40:37 PM

          Yep, personal attacks are so much easier - you're an idiot. Yep, that was much easier.

          • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:26:06 PM

            Still mad at me? I'm sorry I wont rough you up as bad as I did before.

            • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 12:19:36 PM

              It's important to you to rough people up? You've been "roughed-up" a few times too.

              • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:28:19 AM

                Really never noticed....I'll try and pay more attention next time.

      • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/17/2008 1:27:50 AM

        Zig Zag! Good to see you back. We missed you.

        • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 1:10:51 PM

          Hi Pia, I am back finally, two weeks early, thank heaven. I see all the bs being spewed. Well, I will be back posting in the next day or so. See you.

          • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/17/2008 3:31:31 PM

            Hi Mark, glad you're back two weeks early. You have been gone a long time and you have been missed. How was your work/vacation? Left you a post above too.

        • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:43:22 AM

          Thanks! I missed you too! I see things haven't changed much - although it looks like Holy Roller got himself a girl friend. Maybe that will mellow him out a little bit :-)

          • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 2:19:00 AM

            You assume its a girl, he does represent the Larry Craig party.

      • Posted By: bob_hall27 @ 08/17/2008 1:58:40 AM

        wouldn't consider myself a republican just like to show where our country is heading considering it is fact you shouldn't have to much to say

    • Posted By: raddave @ 08/17/2008 3:06:38 AM

      1. Eminant Domain and National parks does not abolish private property. National parks were made from public lands.
      2. The key word to shis one is HEAVY, the US does not have a heavy tax even on the highest tax brackett.
      3. Inheritance tax does not abolish all rights to inheritance. Inheritance is taxible if it is worth more than $2 million this year and will be $3.5 million next year.
      4. Confiscation of all property of emigrants and rebels, hasn't happened and will not happen.
      5. the actual number five of the communist manifesto is "Centralization of credit in the hands of the State, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly" The federal reserve is not a national bank.
      6. actual is "Centralization of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State" not "control" of the media with the FCC, DOT, and Patriot Act, which the first two do not control but rather regulate and I am not sure what the Patriot act has to do with this.
      7. No one in Government is trying to socialize Oil or healthcare.
      8. actual No., 8 is "Equal liability of all to labour. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture." Nothing to do with establish labor laws or a minimum wage.
      9. Actual No. 9. "Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of the distinction between town and country, by a more equable distribution of the population over the country." Nothing about Corperate farms or reginal planning.
      10. Number 10 is "Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children's factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production." Again, nothing about regulating education.

      That was a poor attempt to twist the facts to show that our country is headed to communism.

      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 3:22:39 AM

        I agree we are not moving towards communism, but I think (IMHO) we are moving to a socialistic society. Which has pros and cons, my big issue with it and communism as well is that by having the state provide, it leave no incentive to progress on the part of the people.
        Why work if the state will give you food and subsidize housing while you play PS3 all day?
        Why pay insurance premiums when the state will provide healthcare?

        • Posted By: raddave @ 08/17/2008 4:09:19 AM

          I have to humbly disagree with you on that. We have had federal assistance since the 1930s and our unemployment has stayed relatively low, I won't deny that there are people who take advantage of the welfare system Lets also look at Germany which has a more socialistic, it is the worlds largest exporter of manufactured goods and has an unemployment rate of 7.2%, Obama's plan is for afordable health insurance, there is an income-related subsidy for people who still could not afford to purchase his plan, he is not proposing that the Government pay for it.

          • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 4:19:10 AM

            This isn't the 30's, 40's 50's....today's society is completely different, people now don't have the same work ethic that they did back in the 30's. There are tons of people that take advantage, its free money to them.
            Afordable health insurance paid for by the taxpayer....that's the key...only one more step to a new cabinet or office of Medicine, with full government control over all aspects...I'm sorry but I like being able to go to the doctor tomorrow if I need it.

            • Posted By: raddave @ 08/17/2008 5:00:56 AM

              I will agree that there are many people who feel that way and I agree something needs to be done about these people taking advantage of the system. But I do feel that the majority of people in this country want to earn their own way, but if they should fall into financial hardship they should be helped TEMPORARILY until they get back on their feet.
              I do not think the Government will take control of medicine the way you imagine it. I do not see anyone doing away with private health care insurance, because the insurance business is too powerful in this country.

              • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 5:22:44 AM

                I agree with the Temporarily, there should be a safty net but like you said only temp...I think we need to have a process in place to weed out the deadbeats that are sucking the system dry; drug testing, three strikes etc....
                I agree the Gov won't take control because there will always be a right and left to balance out the issues. But that doesn't mean that a lot of people in power won't try to push it in that direction.

                • Posted By: raddave @ 08/17/2008 6:35:50 AM

                  Yes we do need a way to get rid of the deadbeats. I know it will sound weird coming from a "liberal" but maybe these people could be put to work to earn what they are getting and to be more productive in the community, there is alot of trash that needs to be picked up and graffiti to be cleaned, etc

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:25:16 PM

                    Hey I'm more liberal than conservative but there has to be limits....that's my point...you have to have some checks in place or people will run amuck. You better be careful some of your fellow Obama supporters will start to call you name and ridicule you for some of your answers...I know....been there still fighting back.

                  • Posted By: SPIRITED AWAY @ 08/17/2008 8:23:11 AM

                    What happened to the "Work First" programs and the cap on monthly checks? I thought these programs had been implemented at the state level. Maybe I'm wrong about this. I just thought the Clinton admin. had made major changes to the system.

      • Posted By: bob_hall27 @ 08/17/2008 10:24:43 AM

        none of these programs are afforded by the constitution and if you think they are you have not read the constitution if the dept of education is so great how come national testing scores have been going down not up. the income tax was never meant to be applied to the individual again read the constitution even the supreme court ruled that the 16th amendment does not apply to the individual it is a corporate tax the income tax as it stands is an illegal tax. the patriot act allows them to spy on civilian communications without warrant or cause this is thanks to your democrat majority house and yes Bush who I thought was wrong from the get go I have not ever agreed with Bush and new he was a mistake from the get go. oh yeah and here the democrat majority house gives amnesty to the telecom companies for spying on American citizens even prior to 9/11. Oh yeah and how about the federal ID act with these rfid chips they can keep track of all of your movements if that's not invasion of privacy I don't know what is. The government has the tendency to take a small program that is regulated then deregulate and let it get out of control. They do not have the right to vote on anyone's rights period you can't take one groups rights away to invent or accommodate rights of another. You cannot violate the right of private property to tell people what they can and can't do on their private property. like everything there are a few exceptions but that is not up to the federal government that is up to the people and their state and local government. A central bank is unconstitutional period the constitution says this outright it is an organization that makes 100% profit on the backs of the American citizens. now that's a pretty good profit margin as compared to your big oil companies that made a 10% profit and then the government makes 34% off of the oil companies for doing nothing other than make it hard on them and the American citizen. And as far as federal land masses in the individual states this is unconstitutional they have no right to confiscate land from the individual states in the name of conservation wildlife or anything else the constitution allows the federal government 10 square miles per state period and that is for government buildings and military. The government has no authority to tell the oil companies where they can and can't drill this should be left to the individual state and the people it is not congresses oil it is the peoples. Well I could probably go on forever so I guess this is as good a place to stop for now as anyplace

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 1:24:42 PM

      I didn't know the manifesto was dogma in the US. I mean I was gone for six weeks from the mainland, and in Hawaii, and I didn't read anything about our constitution being overturned by legislative acts. I didn't see takeovers of private business, unless I was too relaxed to notice. I didn't hear in MSM or read any other place that we have been taken over by the "red machine"

      I think the rich are getting richer and whats left of the middle class barely exists. You might as well throw cops, fireman/firewoman into the mix, and county hospitals that treat indigent people into the fray of your list.

      Relax, and go see Batman, or watch the Olympics. After the conventions, then start pushing the panic button, and i will push it with you and every other blogger here will join with you. ;-) Where is Pia when I need her support. ;-) LOL

      • Posted By: bob_hall27 @ 08/17/2008 4:23:04 PM

        the point is this is the direction we are heading in the constitution does not afford for these programs it says plainly enough that these things for the most part are to be left to the people and local and state government.

  • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 1:15:02 PM

    Mwalimu: Is it a lie that the church Obama attended for 20 years preaches black liberation theology? Is it a lie that Obama has supported partial birth abortion, and fought against a bill which would have protected LIVE BABIES who were living outside the mother's womb, who had survived a failed abortion attempt? Is it a lie that Tony Rezko, the convicted felon, assisted the Obama's in the purchase of their mansion in Chicago? Is it a lie that Obama obtained a $1,000,000 earmark for the hospital which employed his wife, Michelle, and is it a lie that Michelle's income almost tripled shortly after Obama became a Senator? For your edification, here is a quote from James H. Cone, founder of systematized black liberation theology, about the nature of the theology to which Obama adhered for over 20 years:

    "Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him. The task of black theology is to kill Gods who do not belong to the black community. Black theology will accept only the love of God which participates in the destruction of the white enemy. What we need is the divine love as expressed in Black Power, which is the power of black people to destroy their oppressors here and now by any means at their disposal. Unless God is participating in this holy activity, we must reject his love."

    • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:35:00 PM

      Another bigot pushing the republican agenda of hatred and fear. I can't wait until you guys are out of power come November.

      • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 1:41:46 PM

        Please post any comment of mine which you consider to indicate bigotry. If you cannot, then consider your apology accepted in advance. Thank you for your cooperation.

        • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:47:18 PM

          Posting a quote like - "Black theology refuses to accept a God who is not identified totally with the goals of the black community. If God is not for us and against white people, then he is a murderer, and we had better kill him" - and attributing to Obama when you know it is not true.

          Anything else?

          • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 6:29:56 PM

            I am amused by your response. The quote I posted was from James H. Cone, who is the founder of black liberation theology, the so-called "religion" to which Obama has subscribed for over 20 years. You, then call me a bigot for posting his quote. If you can't see the irony in that, then I can't help you.

            • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 1:05:24 AM

              Don't worry about it. I posted a quote from Obama last week about the Strategic Oil Reserves but took out the Obama parts and posted it....a couple Obama people called me a lot of "nice" names, then got really angry after I posted that it came from Obama himself in July. The best words to use against Barry are Barry's own words...and they keep calling anyone that doesn't support Obama, ignorant and bigoted.....they are a joke. Some 19 year old kids that think its "cool" to support Obama.

              • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 12:17:31 PM

                You seem to forget the content of your posts. You can't seem to get around "everyone calls me a bigot". If every one does, you probably are. Stop being paranoid, if you don't want to be called a bigot, stay away from race issues - unlike the horror that you defended in this post, you have not been that bad yet.

                • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:27:23 AM

                  Only Barry supporters like you....I'm sorry you feel threatened by me... I'll be nice to you if that makes you feel better about your self and your superior intelligence.

        • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 1:54:10 PM

          Zig is right about that one buddy boy. If you want to post bigotry, go find Larry Sinclair's blog and that will work wonders for you.

          • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 6:31:14 PM

            If you actually read my post, you would find that the "bigotry" that you are referring to is that of James H. Cone, founder of systematized black liberation theology, Obama's religion. Look it up. Education will set you free.

  • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 1:43:17 PM

    Change we can believe in."

    CHANGE #1: Despite Pledging To Withdraw American Troops From Iraq Immediately, Barack Obama Now Says He Would "Refine" His Policy After Listening To The Commanders On The Ground

    CHANGE #2: Despite Pledging To Accept Public Financing, Barack Obama Has Reversed His Position And Opted Out Of The System

    CHANGE #3: Barack Obama Is Backtracking On His Support For Unilaterally Renegotiating NAFTA

    CHANGE #4: Barack Obama Is Considering Reducing Corporate Taxes Despite Having Called Corporate Tax Cuts "The Exact Wrong Prescription For America"

    CHANGE #5: Barack Obama Has Changed Positions On The D.C. Handgun Ban

    CHANGE #6: Barack Obama Has Shifted From Opposing Welfare Reform To Celebrating Welfare Reform In A Television Ad

    CHANGE #7: As A Presidential Candidate, Barack Obama Criticizes The Administration's Energy Policy Despite Having Voted For The 2005 Bush-Cheney Energy Bill

    CHANGE #8: Barack Obama Has Shifted Positions On Nuclear Power

    CHANGE #9: Obama Adviser Said Obama Was Not Opposed To An Individual Health Care Mandate Despite His Opposition During The Primary

    CHANGE #10: During The Primaries, Barack Obama Pledged To Filibuster Any Bill Which Contained Immunity For Telecommunications Companies Involved In Electronic Surveillance, But Now Backs A Compromise Bill

    CHANGE #11: Barack Obama Disagreed With The Supreme Court Decision Striking Down The Use Of The Death Penalty For A Convicted Child Rapist Although In The Past He Opposed The Death Penalty

    CHANGE #12: Barack Obama Has Backtracked From His Earlier Commitment To Meet With The Leaders Of State Sponsors Of Terror "Without Precondition"

    CHANGE #13: After Saying Jerusalem Should Be "Undivided," Barack Obama Has Since Backtracked

    CHANGE #14: As A Presidential Candidate, Barack Obama Has Backed Away From His Earlier Support For Normalized Relations With Cuba And Ending The Embargo

    CHANGE #15: Barack Obama Is Against The California Ballot Measure Banning Gay Marriage Despite His Assertion That Marriage Is Between A Man And A Woman

    CHANGE #16: Barack Obama Says That "Mental Distress" Should Not Be Reason For A Late Term Abortion Which Contradicts His Past Extreme Pro-Abortion Views

    CHANGE #17: Barack Obama Said He Would Debate "Anywhere, Anytime" But Has Rejected Joint Town Hall Meetings

    For your reading enjoyment, click on to the link.

    http://www.nelsonguirado.com/index.php/asymmetric/2008/07/09/comprehensive-obama-flip-flop-list

    • Posted By: Zig Zag @ 08/17/2008 1:57:17 PM

      How about this:

      * McCain criticized TV preacher Jerry Falwell as ???an agent of intolerance??? in 2002, but has since decided to cozy up to the man who said Americans ???deserved??? the 9/11 attacks. (Indeed, McCain has now hired Falwell???s debate coach.)

      * McCain used to oppose Bush???s tax cuts for the very wealthy, but he reversed course in February.

      * In 2000, McCain accused Texas businessmen Sam and Charles Wyly of being corrupt, spending ???dirty money??? to help finance Bush???s presidential campaign. McCain not only filed a complaint against the Wylys for allegedly violating campaign finance law, he also lashed out at them publicly. In April, McCain reached out to the Wylys for support.

      * McCain supported a major campaign-finance reform measure that bore his name. In June, he abandoned his own legislation.

      * McCain used to think that Grover Norquist was a crook and a corrupt shill for dictators. Then McCain got serious about running for president and began to reconcile with Norquist.

      * McCain took a firm line in opposition to torture, and then caved to White House demands.

      * McCain gave up on his signature policy issue, campaign-finance reform, and won???t back the same provision he sponsored just a couple of years ago.

      * McCain was against presidential candidates campaigning at Bob Jones University before he was for it.

      * McCain was anti-ethanol. Now he???s pro-ethanol.

      * McCain was both for and against state promotion of the Confederate flag.

      * And now he???s both for and against overturning Roe v. Wade.

      For more, take a look at:

      http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/9111.html

      Just wanted to make sure everyone see both sides of the picture - we wouldn't want people thinking you are a hypocrit, now would we.

      • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 6:37:56 PM

        Yeah, I know. The truth hurts about Obama, doesn't it? Some politician of "change." What a joke on the American people.

        • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 1:02:07 AM

          Notice how he didn't and couldn't discredit your post. He just copies and pastes crap from carpetbagger...he can't even come up with this stuff himself. What a joke.

          • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 12:12:32 PM

            Reading your blogs are pretty funny too. The point Mr. Debate-no answer, is that any and every politician will change. That is the nature of the beast. The question you refuse to answer is where do you stand politically? You claim to be a Dem, and no one on this blog believes that. But, if you are so be it. But now, you wiped your emotional hard drive like so many, and have become what seems to be a supporter of ultra-conservative. Then every-other post, you can't seem but help to talk about how black bloggers will think you're racist, if you vote for McCain - making you a racist. Then you bash bloggers and Mr. Obama, and claim Ms. Clinton was bashed too much, making you ultimately not credible. Then after all that you feel this incessant need to brag about how you "hurt" a blogger, or "beat" a blogger, or gave a blogger a "beat-down". That just makes you un-evolved, not smart or witty. Bloggers like you I think, who feel that second-guessing ethnic groups, or delivering the best "burn" is a goal, are on the bottom rung Mr. ZombieHero, not the top.

            • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:25:28 AM

              Ive answered where I stand plenty of enough times..I don't have to anymore. I've even told you a few weeks back but if you can't bother to read it then that's your bad.

              LIke your one to talk....Mr. Everyone one is an idiot because you deem it so....

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 1:49:12 PM

      I can easily reply with www.therealmccain.com, if I want to lower myself to a level of absurdity. What is the definition of a politician? We as people are the only ones that can flip flop our own positions about an issue, but politicians have a higher standard that one cannot change their mind.

      But why should I tell you this, because you already know about flip flops. This is not a pi$$ing contest, this is about who we want as a leader. You can post a hundred things on each side, and it all comes down to emotionally charged arguments that lead nowhere. My gosh man, get a grip.

      • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 6:39:09 PM

        Yes, but Obama pretended to be the candidate of "change," who was a "different" kind of politician. Now, after months of lies and flip-flops, all we have left with Obama is a typical, ruthless and deceptive candidate, only less experienced and more racist.

  • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 2:09:26 PM

    Jerome Corsi needs to be put in prison. If anyone called McCain or Bush a Muslim, they'd be ostracized and probably sued.

    By the way, just for reference, Corsi's made both anti-Semitic and anti-Catholic remarks.

    On Catholicism: "So this is what the last days of the Catholic Church are going to look like. Buggering boys undermines the moral base and the laywers rip the gold off the Vatican altars. We may get one more Pope, when this senile one dies, but that's probably about it"; and, "Boy buggering in both Islam and Catholicism is okay with the Pope as long as it isn't reported by the liberal press."

    http://mediamatters.org/items/200408060010

    And on Kerry and Judaism: ???After he married TerRAHsa, didn???t John Kerry begin practicing Judiasm? He also has paternal gradparents that were Jewish. What religion is John Kerry????

    You all sure you want to hop on board with this guy?

    • Posted By: MXYZPTLK @ 08/17/2008 6:40:59 PM

      Typical Obama cultist response. If someone says something that hurts your little Obama's feelings, then they ought to be put in prison. Grow up.

      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:23:11 PM

        Well you know they are building a prison for people protesting the DNC convention in Denver. So maybe that's really what they plan on doing....imprisoning any and all opposition.

        • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 10:41:34 PM

          Sure, I'd throw the lot of you in prison if I could. I said it. Nothing to do with opposition - it's the unfair opposition. Dirt, lies, slander, threatening comments, the advocation of genocide against several world nations - yeah, I said it. You all should be locked up until you realize what it's like to be completely powerless and violated the way you do to everyone else.

          So there it is, exposed. Yes, I'll be actively trying to think on ways to defang of you up before you bully, lie, cheat, or steal anything more from my country and its people. Let the "fascist" comments roll in - I won't be touched by any of it.

          • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 10:48:30 PM

            Sorry, read that last as just "defang you". Or declaw, whatever you want to say.

            Unlike you, I actually enlisted to serve my country, and I'm going to fight for it until I die against the people who use and abuse it. And I also know that I have more courage than the lot of you - I've shown it. One genuine man is worth forty chickenhawks - of course, I'd say the same thing about the women who were in my ship in Navy Basic.

            • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 12:59:38 AM

              What makes you think I didn't serve? Your assuming a lot but have no proof to back any of it up.

              • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/18/2008 2:07:55 AM

                If you served, congratulations. That gives you a lot more integrity than most on these boards. That ought to also mean that you intend to uphold the honor and integrity of the services.

                I have nothing against anyone expressing an honest political opinion. But when it comes to Corsi - someone who's made anti-Catholic and anti-Jewish remarks in addition to anti-Islamic and two ugly, politically motivated attacks - that crosses the line. I just want the Catholics and Jews that are reading his book to know that he doesn't treat them any better than anyone else.

                • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 4:15:23 AM

                  I would like to thank you for assuming that because we hold opposing view points, that I am scum of the earth....real tolerant....nice way to unify. *sarcasm intended*

                  • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/18/2008 6:42:24 PM

                    I've seen your posts, zombie. I don't assume you're the scum of the Earth because we hold opposing viewpoints - I don't tend to believe that about anyone. I criticize actions, not people.

                    But to the extent that you advocate war with Iran and defend things like Corsi's political hit book, I will continue to call you out and stand up for integrity. It's crucial that I do, and that people like I do. The Munich analogies being tossed around are surprisingly accurate - but not about Iran. The right-wing group seizing power through paranoia in the world today are the neoconservatives - and this may indeed be 1936, so to speak. But I'm planning to follow the lessons of history and stand up to it in a way that wasn't done in Germany at the time, because if enough people had, the Holocaust and the invasions of innocent European countries might have been prevented. Today, I can help prevent the kinds of right-wing genocides that your group is advocating in Iran, Iraq, Palestine, and other places. I'm proud to say that I still stand for "innocent until proven guilty" in a time of neo-McCarthyist thinking of the opposite. And I'm going to continue to stand upright in the storm, so say what you will, because I have enough confidence to take it.

                    • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:23:09 AM

                      What have I said about Iran? I only criticize Obama's talk about direct talks...which he now changed his original position on.
                      If it crucial that you stand for integrity against Corsi's book then fine...just be aware that there are a lot of people out there that DON"T take Obama own personal account of his life as fact. Who is the most biased observer of a person? The answer is that person. Everyone has secrets they don't want out...they aren't going to paint an accurate portrait of themselves...do you think Edwards would ever have wrote about his affair in his autobiography? What about Clinton? Politicians lie...that's a fact. Corsi's book quotes entire passages of "Dreams" and "Audacity" and compares them with other news outlets accounts mainly the Chicago Sun and Tribune...to try and get a difference perspective. Yes he is going to draw the most extreme conclusions but a smart reader won't accept Corsi's explanations but have to interpret their own conclusions.
                      Obviously that is too much for a man of integrity like yourself to do...so keep on parroting Obama's talking points...keep being a sheeple....hide behind your blanket accusation for anyone that doesn't share your view points....your only impressing the people you don't have to convert...other Obama supporters...your not winning any rational person over with any of your argument...

                      Nice bringing up Germany....they had a leader who was a great speaker, pitting the old way with a new beginning too. He had thousand and thousand of supporters that didn't challenge anything he told him...see how that turned out.

                • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 4:12:22 AM

                  I say read his books and prove him wrong with facts. I'm taking a wild guess here but most people that are bashing Corsi haven't read the book. You no better than the Swift Boaters with your hate fill rants about the man....prove him wrong and refute his claims with facts not your own opinions.

                  You don't win debates with personal attacks and perjoratives. You win them by stating your case, backing up your case with evidence, and disprove your opponents case with evidence of your own. What you saying about Corsi has no honor. Your as bad as you make him out to be. If all his claims are soo out of this world and so full of lies, it should be easy for you to disprove him...overwise your just blowing hot air.

                  • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/18/2008 6:31:34 PM

                    I'm not planning to buy the book and put any more money in the man's hands. The kinds of attacks Corsi makes are so farfetched and out there that even responding to them gives them a level of legitimacy they don't deserve - such as the claims that Obama is a Muslim or that because he tried drugs years ago he's utterly unreliable and is probably still using them. It's the same kind of slander, suspicion, and "guilty until proven innocent" nonsense that runs contrary to the principles our legal system is founded on. It's the same thing that was used against Irish immigrants in 1850 and 1900, American socialists in 1950, and anyone whose family ever came from a Middle Eastern country today.

                    I respect your own opinions, but I know enough about this book to know that it absolutely deserves to be completely discredited, as does the author.

                    I said it before and I'll say it again - Jerome Corsi belongs in prison for slander and libel.

                    And by the way, that's "you're".

                    • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/19/2008 11:15:18 AM

                      Your argueing from a position of ignorance....you know nothing about it yet your claim to be an fair critic? Seriously you need some help.
                      If you want to keep your head in the sand about Barry then that is all up to you...

                      Ohhh grammar police.....some take me away.

      • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 10:36:21 PM

        No, actually, if someone commits slander and perjury, they should be put in prison. Has nothing to do with my personal feelings. No one is fooled by your bluster. You just don't have the balls to actually admit that your *party* doesn't have the balls to win without lies, slander, and hate.

        But it's all right, because the country's starting to wake up to it all, and we won't be having it. Cheers.

      • Posted By: Pukeobama @ 08/17/2008 8:53:21 PM

        you got that right if anyone one says anything about Cultleader OSLIMA get ready thats fighting words the cult has his followers so brain washed they would do any thing to get him elected and due to them calling names and him using the race card they all make me puke

    • Posted By: HolyRoller @ 08/17/2008 4:13:31 PM

      But if they called Bush or McCain muslim, it would be a lie. Fact is Hussein WAS raised muslim. There is written proof on his school records, as well as eyewitness testimony. You may not like it but it is true.

      NOBAMA!!!

      • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 10:29:48 PM

        And what do you think about Corsi himself? I'd be interested to hear. Specifically, what do you think of the comments on Catholicism and Judaism that I mentioned?

      • Posted By: reezel @ 08/17/2008 6:33:37 PM

        Enter Your Comment
        You forgot that he also wrote about Bush trying to integrate Mexico and the US. That is the basis of his immigration stands.

    • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 2:19:52 PM

      He used the word "buggering"? That's it, i'm ok with an American Jackass working to screw our country over by helping to get another slow-witted shmuck in the Oval Office; but no one should accept this smarmy bastard with his clearly "red coat" hidden agenda to screw us again. This is nothing more than a British spy trying to destroy America by placing incompitent leaders in our executive branch. Lets go over there and kick some ass, and steal their tea!!:)

      • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 2:43:11 PM

        Corsi's quite American. Smearing him with untruths isn't any better than what he's doing.

        What I'd like people to know is that he's attacked and demeaned a lot of the people that he's trying to sell his book to, i.e., American Jews and Catholics. He's just using them and I'd prefer them to have the dignity of knowing that he doesn't respect them any more than he does anyone that he targets in his books.

  • Posted By: notroubleatall1963 @ 08/17/2008 11:50:46 PM

    Below are three articles all White Bigots who admire McCrass and his class of Bourgeois Bigots should read... (MXYZPTLK's post)... what a revelation, thanks for sharing, this is really something. Imagine living in a country with so many fools around you, walking around like zombies in the supermarkets pretending to be "American" but in reality they are throwbacks to the German Nazi supporters. Get out your Leiderhosen, volken! Ja, das ist gut! Achtung! Heil McCrass, das ist der neue UberMensch.

    • Posted By: Skypoint @ 08/19/2008 10:40:09 AM

      I haven't checked the links out yet, but I do know your German stinks as bad as your French.

      Go back to school.

    • Posted By: cobalt6 @ 08/18/2008 2:27:40 AM

      And you are the one wrighting german massages!

      • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/18/2008 8:58:40 AM

        Wrighting messages? You are stuck on Red.Wright cobalt, or shall I refer to you as citron?

    • Posted By: cobalt6 @ 08/18/2008 2:29:26 AM

      Due bist ein eisle!

  • Posted By: stonehenge @ 08/19/2008 10:37:37 AM

    "Corsi is my Cheney" John S. McNoshame

  • Posted By: armyspouse1988 @ 08/17/2008 4:13:34 PM

    Obama's lead in the polls has dwindled away because people are really getting to know him by his actions. He has changed his mind on at least 13 major issues, and lacks the ability to make a decision and stay with it. He has character flaws, and lacks experience. It has nothing to do with a smear campaign. I think it is interesting that the Corsi and Fredderoso books are both selling like crazy. People want to know more about Obama, but don't trust the Obama folks or the DNC to tell the truth. Look for a split in the Democratic Party next election--DNC's credibility is GONE!

    • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 4:42:00 PM

      You must be young because I have heard that the Dem party will be breaking up since 1968. ;-) LOL

      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:21:10 PM

        Maybe young but smarter than the rest of the college kids voting for an empty suit.

        • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/19/2008 9:13:25 AM

          Zombie, this man you keep referring to as 'empty suit' won the primaries and your candidate lost! That's the problem you Hillary supp. are having...jealousy! If you have to tear someone apart, tear her, she lost! All by herself.

      • Posted By: cobalt6 @ 08/17/2008 4:46:41 PM

        All good things come to those who wait! The Dem Party has no more credibility.

        • Posted By: raddave @ 08/18/2008 5:28:39 AM

          And yet the Republicans are full of credibility? They are full of something but it is not credibility.

    • Posted By: mattie against MSM bias @ 08/17/2008 4:34:04 PM

      Kool-Aid wearing off. Why was anyone surprised he has been changing his "positions"? He has a history of it from day one. Present...I hit the wrong button...I didn't know the vote was happening so I stayed on NH so I wouldn't have to vote on Iran. C'mon folks.

      • Posted By: marksgershenson @ 08/17/2008 4:45:27 PM

        Is this the same mattie who has a blog about MSM bias? Who needs Koolaide when you can get off with more powerful stuff then that such as political polorization, lies on both sides of the spectrum, politics as usual, the kind of stuff that puts me to sleep. Where is the Starbucks? ;-) Throw out some new bones, my poodle is hungry today. LOL

  • Posted By: Occam @ 08/17/2008 7:23:06 PM

    Obama, CHANGE you can believe in if you want a President who is specious, vacuous, and effete.

    • Posted By: JoeDoaks @ 08/17/2008 7:27:00 PM

      Occam's Razor postulates that the simplest explanation of anything is almost one hundred percent correct. Ergo...Barack Obama WILL be elected president in spite of muppets like you. I rest my case. LOL

      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:09:35 PM

        No the simplest explanation is that Obama is a liar and a cheat and as been peddling nothing but false dreams and false hope to the multitudes that await His coming.

        Why did Obama change his position on FISA; to try and pander to centrist and Republicans.
        Why did Obama lie about his parents involvement at Selma; to pander, trying to give himself some semblance of credibility on civil rights.
        Why did Obama vote against the Born Alive Bill in Illinois; to pander to pro-choicers that see any legislation about abortion as automatically evil, never willing to question the merits of such a bill.....oh yeah then Obama lied about it saying the language was different....why? Because now he is trying to pander to the pro-lifers and evangelicals.
        blah blah blah...list goes on and on.
        Feel free to call me names because that's the only thing your good at.

        • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/19/2008 9:09:31 AM

          Zombie! You post this about Obama and yet you dare accuse his supporters of Hillary bashing? You disappoint me.

        • Posted By: AskPlus @ 08/18/2008 11:55:28 AM

          This sounds radical and uninformed: "No the simplest explanation is that Obama is a liar and a cheat and as been peddling nothing but false dreams and false hope to the multitudes that await His coming."

          Well at least you got simple right.

        • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 8:38:21 PM

          I agree, it may be too much to ask for Obama to come through on alot of the promises. Im not sure how John McCain isn't a huge exploiting liar as well though. he knows what the experts know, oil won't come out of new drilling sites for a minimum of ten yrs., and even then will only be a drop in the bucket of our consumption. McCain knows that he can't keep taxes down. In the current state of things, no one can keep taxes down, the countrys financial standing right now requires a tax hike across the board, and thats whats coming. So whos the better option, really?

          • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:54:14 PM

            "Im not sure how John McCain isn't a huge exploiting liar as well though"

            Admitting that Obama is a liar? Showing some sign of non-partisanship now?

            • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 9:38:33 PM

              All politicians are liars, its time the American voters start acting like grown ups and admit it. Bottom line, I think McCain has drifted ultraconservative, and i find that scary. Because ultra conservative is a whole lot scarier than ultraliberal.

              • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 9:49:09 PM

                How is McCain an ultraconservative? Have any proof?
                He back Stem Cell Research you know. He believe in Global Warming you know. He backs Immigration Reform you know, they same kind as Obama. He backs campaign reform.
                Those aren't the talking points for an Ultraconservative candidate....

                • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 10:09:55 PM

                  You go back and watch that forum last night. He's turned into GWB. Plus, admitting that global warming is taking place is not a big step towards fixing it. The fact that he endorses nuclear power, well thats great, but he fails to mention the detractions of nuclear power. He's on the ultraconservative side of defense, and i dont mean protecting the country, i mean defense contracting. Finally, he's on the bizarre side of the ultraconservative front, where as some are for financial responsibility and low taxes, he is for low taxes and ridiculous Bush style spending. He said, lets give parents a $6,000 gift, lets give people $5,000 to pay for insurance; so how do you pay for it? You don't, because you have no money to pay for it, its insane.

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 10:46:19 PM

                    That's not turning into GWB, McCain is conservative. That's a given, almost everything he said falls into line with conservatism not Ultra conservatism, which is what your trying to say.
                    Again read McCain energy proposals he talks what to do to fix it.
                    How many nuclear accidents have happened in a US Nuclear Power facility in the last 10 years? It took Obama three times to get to the same stance as McCain had the first time on the issue of Russian and Georgia...why is obma trying to emulate McCain?
                    Bush style spending? Are you completely nuts, McCain has been one of the only politicians to fight Pork in the Senate. I'd much rather have him than Obama that thinks by saving 200 billion from Iraq means he can spend 700 billion more on socialist programs. That's Bush style Math coming from Obama not McCain. Where is Obama going to get all this money to pay for everything?

                    • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 08/18/2008 9:03:42 AM

                      Zombie, you dare to connect Obama with Pres, Bush? You are joking I know! McCain=Bush. The country knows it and will vote NO to it in Nov.

                • Posted By: raddave @ 08/18/2008 3:19:33 AM

                  McCain has flipped on immigration and now toes the republican party line, with that, taxes, health care, oil, etc. McCain is the candidate of Change his policies to that of the current president.

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 4:04:51 AM

                    No he only "refinded" his immigration policy, it has and still is all about getting workers on a path to citizenship. Compared to Obama's flip flops, this is minor. Look at Obama's flip on FISA, he went from opposition to immunity, a Anti-Bush view, to a Bush lapdog...voting for a FISA bill with immunities.
                    McCain's biggest flip flop is on drilling. He flipped early, now House Democrats and soon Obama will be flipping on that too...

                    • Posted By: raddave @ 08/18/2008 5:09:05 AM

                      You fail to mention that Obama voted for an ammendment to remove immunity from the FISA bill, the ammendment failed. How is it a refinement when it applies to McCain, but a flip for Obama? McCain flipped when it became politically expedient on drilling. His BIGGEST flip was on the Bush tax cuts, a bill that he voted against and now supports.

                      • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 5:36:34 AM

                        Yes he did but he still voted for a FISA bill with immunity when he previously said he would "Filibuster any bill with telecom immunity."

                        So really Obama and McCain are even because they both Flip Flop. So I guess I'll just have to vote on who has the better judgment, which is.....John McCain.

                        • Posted By: raddave @ 08/18/2008 6:25:17 AM

                          And I will vote for whom I think has the better judgement and it isn't McSame

          • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 8:50:55 PM

            McCain....Drilling will take a while but alternative energy will take longer... you know that. The infrastructure required for "green energies" will take a long time and a lot of money to build, we should have been doing that since the 1990's, where were the Dems on that back when they had control of Congress and the White House? You know as well as I that the oil market will respond to new drilling with a steep drop in the price per barrel, because it's a futures market...in the future there will be more oil on the market so why pay 130 a barrel now when the price will be $90-$100 later? Why do you think the price of gas has dropped....supply and demand coupled with the futures market.

            Your right McCain might have to impose some new taxes or tarrifs but Obama's plan to tax everyone, except the types of people likely to vote for him, will drive up inflation and put us into recession. There are numerous articles out there bashing Obama new tax refinements, I know it's too much to expect Obama partisans to read anything but he rosey reviews from other Obama partisans.

            • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 9:25:15 PM

              Guy, im sorry, but we are in a recession, and inflation is the highest its been in 17 years. Once again, the oil we would produce in offshore drilling is a DROP IN THE BUCKET. Yeah, alternate energy will take some time to develop, so what good does having John McCain put things off for another term? Im just not seeing what makes McCain better.

              • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 9:40:33 PM

                Did you take Economics? Do you know what the definition of recession is? Two quarter of negative growth....last quarter we had a increase in the GDP of over 1%, not much I agree but not the anywhere near the number of the 2000-2002 recession.

                Q: What about the unemployment rate?
                A: Unemployment is generally a lagging indicator, so it is not as useful as indicators more directly related to economic activity, such as real GDP and employment.
                http://www.nber.org/cycles/recessions.html

                You should actually read John McCain's energy proposals....its obvious that you haven't because you would know that McCain wants to invest into Alternative energy sources as well. He wants what I want, All of the Above energy plan where everything is on the table....read it for yourself, then form your opinion...
                http://johnmccain.com/Informing/Issues/17671aa4-2fe8-4008-859f-0ef1468e96f4.htm

                • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 9:51:29 PM

                  Actually my bachelors is in econ. If you are the expert here though, you realize as well, that you can do alot of accurate speculation based on the information that is already available, the trends. The trends here show our economy suffering severely at the moment, and it's getting worse. Almost every expert has come to that conclusion. So you tell me what you see in the data that shows otherwise.

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 4:06:35 AM

                    And I'm a Hillary supporter...you don't belive me so please don't take it personally if I don't believe you as well....

                • Posted By: TheVigil @ 08/17/2008 10:25:37 PM

                  As far as I know, the oil industry represents something absurd percentagewise of the "economic growth" we've been dubiously experiencing over the last year or so. Something like a quarter of it. Their record profits are causing false

                  Very few people are fooled at this point. Small business and the average consumer are battered, hurt, tired, and not going to sit by and passively listen to greedy and self-serving spin. We're tired of it. We're tired of seeing most of the country's wealth go to the oil executives and barons, and we're tired of getting lied to by conservatives. And we won't be taking it anymore.

                  Just letting you know. Either in November or in four years when the conservatives have pillaged the country to the ground, you all are going to leave. (I personally suspect it'll be this year, but nothing is proven until it is, so to speak...) And I for one will be doing anything and everything I can to hurt and discredit you ugly, brutal bunch of bullies. I'm tired, tired, tired of the *** and I'm not getting pushed around anymore.

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 10:56:35 PM

                    That's real mature.... are you going to get bats and rocks with your angry mob mentality to stick it to the man? Stop playing the victim. Go out and develop some novel idea that will get rid of out dependence on oil....stop blowing hot air, do something about it. I have solar cells on my house and are starting my waste oil to biodesiel conversion now. So why your still complaining about everything, I'll be running on french fry grease.

                • Posted By: mrzoid @ 08/17/2008 10:00:31 PM

                  Look, you support McCain, fine, but stop with the whole "I was for hillary" stuff already. There isn't a question as to who is more closely alligne with Hillary's policies out of the two men left, she's said undoubtedly, Obama, so do what you will. Also, i understand the text book defenition of a "recession", but the GDP isn't even close to the only indicator of the state of the economy, give me a break.

                  • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 10:33:29 PM

                    Fine we agree to disagree...but yes I am a Hillary supporter, but who ever said I have to agree with everything she says 100% of the time?
                    She did say it, because otherwise she wouldn't have a chance to run in 2012. It called being pragmatic, not the enthusiasm that Obama hopes everyone will think.
                    I know the GDP isn't the only indicator but it is the definition. So when you say we "are in a recession," you should be saying we are in an economic downturn, which is correct. It's all about the connotation of the word that is important. Recession has a very bad connotation, which is why the Democrats are so quick to use it against Bush. Its partisan politics...which Obama keeps on talking about post partisanship. I'm doing it by supporting a candidate that I feel is better qualified to be President regardless of Party affiliation.
                    Your quick to attack McCain and his supporters simple because you don't agree with their politics...thats Partisan politics and that being hypocritical.

      • Posted By: freecitizen @ 08/17/2008 7:48:12 PM

        Unfortunately I saw this documentary the othe day about the wholesale corruption of Halleburton and the other corporate criminals operating in Iraq. Their activities are so brazon and utterly corrupt that I've come to believe that these ruthless thugs never ever intend to relinquish power to anybody who might investigate their plundering. They will do what ever it takes. If all the moronic crap we see here doesn't work they WILL take other measures.

    • Posted By: Pukeobama @ 08/17/2008 9:09:22 PM

      Occam: sorry too tell you but i don't think they make anuff CoCo for the change OSLIMA wants and besides unless his crooks he buddies around with says he can change something then it will stay the same not even Opra can change that

    • Posted By: freecitizen @ 08/17/2008 7:34:34 PM

      Wouldn't be nice to see something here besides personal attacks and irrelevant labels applied from a distance?

  • Posted By: Omaar @ 08/17/2008 10:41:56 PM

    Reality: Saddleback Will Not Change Peoples Minds, when their Minds are Made up and don't Forget the Demographics Below.....

    1. Obama Still Leads in the Polls


    2. John McCain has NEVER LEAD in the Polls.

    3. Polls don't Matter

    4. Polls are Deceptive

    5. Early Voting in Some States Favors Obama

    6. Most People have made up their MINDS...Sorry

    7. Freedom of Religion, Agnostics, Atheist and People Indifferent Towards Religions, will not be MOVED by Saddleback...Sorry

    Note: Newly Sworn In Americans from 10 Years back to the Most Present, will Overwhelmingly Vote for Obama. Afro Americans, Hispanic & Asian Americans will Overwhelmingly Vote for Obama.

    Bi-Racial Americans ages 18 & Upwards will Vote for Obama.

    Young White America 18-45, Male and Female will Vote for Obama in Large Numbers. The Highly Educated and Poor America, that Spans all Races.

    Independent Voters will Overwhelmingly Vote for Obama. All Single Mothers in America, Regardless of Race.

    Parents of Bi-Racial Children will Vote for Obama and Large Military and Americans Abroad will Vote for Obama.

    Young Independent & Moderate Republicans will Vote for Obama and the Gay American Vote as well.

    American Females Make Up the Majority Of America and Most will Vote for Obama. The Pro-Choice Female Vote , Roe Vs. Wade, Pro-Choice an "A Woman's Right to Choose" Plays a Big Factor, Obama will get that Vote, EASILY.

    American Females & Parents Against the War, will Easily Vote for Obama.

    Most of these People have made up their Minds, Already and No saddleback Church will change that. Keep this in Mind, also Obama Garnered (18 Milion Votes Too) and Most of Clinton's Voters are going to Vote Democratic Anyway, they have already cast her Aside, as they Refuse to help her get Rid of her Campaign ( SHE STILL OWES MILLIONS)

    Note Obama made 51 Million Dollars last Month, who do you think is Divying Up The Cash...Hmmmm

    John McCain and Racist White America have Not Factored all these Demographics, at all and they will come back to Haunt him in November.

    Underestimating Obama is and will Prove this coming Novemeber, was a Big McCain Blunder.



    • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/17/2008 10:49:22 PM

      Imagine that an Obama supporter trying to bring racism up? Apples don't fall far from the trees do they...

      • Posted By: notroubleatall1963 @ 08/17/2008 11:43:21 PM

        No, and here we have the perfect example of the racist calling the bigot black. Get a life, Zombiehero!

        • Posted By: Bamaboc @ 08/18/2008 1:03:05 AM

          Obama was a disaster in every place he served as a community organizer, look at his neighborhoods in Chicago, according to his own writings: The Crime rate went up, the murder rate went up, drug use went up, the out of wedlock birthrate went up, gang fighting and murders went up, the abortion rate went up, prostitution went up, educational achievements went down, welfare rate went up, this is what he wants to deliver to the rest of the USA.
          What a ???success??? story, he and his fellow marxist gangsters want to bring the same achievements to the rest of the USA.

        • Posted By: Zombiehero @ 08/18/2008 12:57:00 AM

          Where did I say black? Again your making things up...get an education learn to debate.

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