Sorry, Pal, You're Rich

Your argument is interesting but you cannot compare the super wealth of a country against the population of that country. You have to compare the super wealth of one country against the next and in that category the US has no match. Dont get me wrong I to think that 250,000 a year is good money but in my position in New York or Boston or DC I could easily reach that amount and still be living at a middle class level. I personally refuse to live in an area where my children will go to school and be frightened, where my wife refuses to go out because of what might happen. So no I completely disagree with the thought that 250,000 is rich.

I went to school for 8 years to get my degrees to earn a living that will allow me to provide my family with a few nicer things in life and I refuse to have someone, who has made their own choice to work for minimum wage, force me to be considered rich. In the United States of America we are afforded the choice to excel or stay behind, and the argument of I cann't does not work.

Your argument is interesting but you cannot compare the super wealth of a country against the population of that country. You have to compare the super wealth of one country against the next and in that category the US has no match. Dont get me wrong I to think that 250,000 a year is good money but in my position in New York or Boston or DC I could easily reach that amount and still be living at a middle class level. I personally refuse to live in an area where my children will go to school and be frightened, where my wife refuses to go out because of what might happen. So no I completely disagree with the thought that 250,000 is rich.

I went to school for 8 years to get my degrees to earn a living that will allow me to provide my family with a few nicer things in life and I refuse to have someone, who has made their own choice to work for minimum wage, force me to be considered rich. In the United States of America we are afforded the choice to excel or stay behind, and the argument of I cann't does not work.

Geez. You greedy wealthy bastards make me sick. You want to know why the poor hate your guts? it's not because we envy your bank accounts, it's because of your condescending "Here, Boy, lick the dog *** off my boots" attitudes.

Some day you will die, and you'll turn into a soap mummy, just like the po' folk.

A wealthy and powerful country is also measured by average wealth deposited to the citizens. A country with mighty military and average poor citizens is not considered a powerful country.

Yeah your R I C H RICH RICH RICH that is 4 and a half time what me and my wife make combined!!!! If we had 250,000 a yr like the saying says we'd burn our s for yours.

My husband and I earned a bit more than 250k last year and, as others have said, we're certainly not rich. We have a nice house, nice cars, take great vacations, save money. But, we're not rolling it in. And, we don't have kids yet, so I can't imagine adding that to the mix. Granted, part of this attitude is probably because our country has become the land of one-uppers and ultra consumers. Nothing is ever enough these days, which is quite sad. Sometimes it makes me want to move to a small farm in Montana, make much less money, and do without all the "stuff". It's a different than the time when our parents were young. Things are getting more and more expensive and salaries/commissions just aren't keeping up. Regardless, I am not here to complain about our situation. I feel very fortunate that we are so lucky and am thankful everyday. But, I can tell you for sure - we're not hurting, but we're certainly not rich over here. On the other hand, I can safely bet that old Obama is, indeed, quite rich.

My husband and I earned a bit more than 250k last year and, as others have said, we're certainly not rich. We have a nice house, nice cars, take great vacations, save money. But, we're not rolling it in. And, we don't have kids yet, so I can't imagine adding that to the mix. Granted, part of this attitude is probably because our country has become the land of one-uppers and ultra consumers. Nothing is ever enough these days, which is quite sad. Sometimes it makes me want to move to a small farm in Montana, make much less money, and do without all the "stuff". It's a different than the time when our parents were young. Things are getting more and more expensive and salaries/commissions just aren't keeping up. Regardless, I am not here to complain about our situation. I feel very fortunate that we are so lucky and am thankful everyday. But, I can tell you for sure - we're not hurting, but we're certainly not rich over here. On the other hand, I can safely bet that old Obama is, indeed, quite rich.

Gee guys, I make $20k a year, I work very hard, pay child support, student loans and a car payment. If I manage enough fuel to get to work on a regular basis, I don't eat very well. I have no credit card debt and I cannot afford a residence of my own. I receive no handouts from the government. I have friends at work at around my wage with two small children who get a whopping $49 / month in food stamps, thank God they get Medicaid. Fuel is killing us; winter will be hell. I am 44 years old, spent my life devoted to my family, got screwed and have nothing to show for it. It is really hard to feel sorry for you guys! All I want out of life at this point is a home no one can take away from me...any home.

A different thought:
Rich and poor is more properly defined as ownership of productive assets as opposed to wages that are earned, although ownership of assets can produce income. Five million in tax free bonds migh earn someone $200,000 or $250,000 in annual income. A wage earner would have to earn a significant amount more to equal the $200 or $250,000. Who is richer, the bond holder or the wage earner?z

This argument of what is rich is silly, and evidences once again of media's desire to raise the ire of the common man in order to sell magazines. They are not alone, politicians do it equally well, in large part to move the arguments away from more important issues under the guise of getting us to believe they care.

As a group, with exception given to few lonely voices, the tax code is a tremendous source of power for each elected officials. It is there way to play king or queen and grant favors to favorites sons, while disporportionately delivering small sustinance to those capable of revolting, and allowing the better off to remain complacent, and carry the burden of funding their powerplay.

It is time we define the arguments, not the four year statesman that deliver promises we not will not be delivered, and define problems designed to tug at our emotional heart strings. It is time we define the problems, and make them find the solutions. The solution is not a promise to make someone else pay my bill.

That's bullshit* Hahaha god I love you ignorant b*tches*
My parets SACRIFICED so that I could go to a great school, but I just turned down a 140k job (yes out of high school) to take an 90k one because of the qualms of taxes like this, education is power, and power is a cornerstone of wealth- you keep taxing the people who bail you out, and you will have situations like me, -where financial planners tell me to not work harder- because it actually will cost more money (price of living, and higer taxes). You people are stupid if you think that the young and bright are not going to start to follow in my footsteps, working less hard, and earning less money, but still able to take home more than those earning 50-60k more than they do.
-By the way, my parents are what you call rich-300k but between 60k per year for my brother and I to go to school (that's 60k each) and their little house, and two cars, there is not much left over. They work twice as f*cking hard as you do- they are your bosses- (I am sorry that the only vision you have seen of those who earn more were yatchs and vacations) they spend their free time managing the books of their companies, tracking down people who owe them money, networking, and leaving earlier than you and coming home later- so that out of high school I *have* the oppertunity to even be able to CHOOSE between a 90k or 140k job.
Think about what happens if everyone like me makes the same choice... Class stratification- there will exist no more middle class- who are you going to tax now dummies?
There will not be a category whom carries 80% of the responsibility to pay social programs, bye bye free clinics, public schools, mail couriers (the mailman), cops, firemen and women, and every other program that you take for granted, you say you don't pull on the *system* because you don't use welfare- *chuckles* all those are your welfare programs, not just the soup kitchens.
- My parents paid about 100k in taxes last year- how much did you?
-and a greater question- when the youth lose their desire to improve their conditions because they are punished for it- where does that leave a nation- I know you don't think we are in the same boat because of how much my parents made, but we live in a *really* poor neighborhood, and still just get by, do the math you will see I am right, but they did that so I could make more than them and earn more- but it's just too expensive a choice for me...
If all the youth makes the same choice, then you my friends- are screwed, for the young pay for the old's social security- did you hear that? *Social* security, I am sure you know who contributes to that,and no it is not the *real* rich people, for they make interest, and do not need to draw upon retirement.
To tax them is wrong too- I propose a fair flat tax, which strips corruption, and the need for foriegn borrowing. The more you buy, the more the tax,that allows for taxing visitors who tavel here and harvesting from unrecognized (illega

politicians generally stay away from CLASS discussions.Its very devisive,also it would awaken the sleeping public to the fact that it is MILLIONAIRES that are setting the policy agenda for the working class! Do you really think they would even entertain a policy of wealth redistribution that reaches into their very pockets?

From the majority of posts I have read, it seems to me that those who are earning above 250K a year are not complaining that they can't make ends meet, just that they don't consider themselves truly rich. It is a luxury to be able to buy diapers for an infant and not have to worry about whether the diapers are on sale. That is living a comfortable life. But living a very comfortable life is not the same as being rich--especially when it comes to paying a greater % of income in taxes. How many people earing over 250K have incurred significant debt (in connection with an education or starting up a business) to get where they are today? The methodology of higher taxes for those earning over 250K does not take into account paying off student loans, which in some cases are higher than the average mortgage nor does it take into account offensively high property taxes depending on where in the country you live. This is not a complaint that we are poor. We are not and most of us appreciate every luxury we can afford. But rich??? I would be interested to see what percentage of the population earns over 1 million a year. Maybe that is rich. But if you are earning $250K and trying to save for retirement, weddings, colleges and living in an area that has very high real estate values and property taxes, you are upper middle class, very lucky, truly blessed but not rich.

I agree with your data, but fundamentally the argument is wrong; mainly because income has not kept up with inflation. Labor demand, compared to supply, has decreased dramatically due to outsourcing and the influx of female workers over the past few decades. Human labor follows the same laws of supply and demand as any other resource. As a result, engineers are now paid a salary comparable to what production workers were paid a few decades ago (when scaled with inflation). This goes to show that the "middle class" is falling from existence. Your data agrees with this by showing the increased seperation between rich and poor. By definition, the "middle class" holds the median income and cannot consist of only 20% of the population (the amount above $100,000 as you've indicated). The solution is not to decrease taxes for the middle income families; the solution is to increase their pay. The only way this is possible is to decrease CEO compensation and distribute these funds equally. I propose CEO salary caps based on two variables: the number of subordinates/employees and the lowest paid employee's salary. The last requirement is US based operations. Example: A CEO with 100 employees can receive a total compensation of 20 times the salary of the lowest paid employee. A CEO with 1000 employees can receive a total compensation of 50 times the salary of the lowest paid employee. These numbers are just hypothetical, but the incentive is to offer free trade (no taxes on company profit) for companies that follow these guidelines. This encourages higher pay and the hiring of more employees. The taxes system can be adjusted from there. More taxes will come in from increased employees and wages, and capital gains/dividend taxes could be increased if needed. Bottom line is the fact that taxes come predominantly from middle class income and the middle class is disappearing.

So much anger to the rich here. These top flight earners are your surgeons, execs, lawyers, investors.... People who pay the taxes for the lower earning 50% to get their earned income tax breaks, half of those roads and military, and help for the poor. So you have about 6 million people (2% of 300 million) paying that and fueling investment (when those factories want to expand, they need to get their money from somewhere).

Without the possibility of rewards would anyone take the risks associated with high incomes? Would anyone start a business if they knew they would never recoup the hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring it on line when 9 out of 10 fail even now). Would anyone take the hundreds of thousands of dollars to become a surgeon when they only make $50k year, and would take years to pay it off even scrimping.

Personally, I know without the taxes I wouldn't give a dime to the poor. Not to be nasty, but I don't give money to people who hate my guts, or made such terrible decisions they are destitute. If some one does drugs and ends up eating garbage, they should know better (not like there's no info on the subject). I do give money to people who are having a rough time, but only to people where i know them and their situation. If people do it to themselves, I am not their momma...I shouldn't be expected to make the right decisions and do well to support them when they made all the wrong ones. Where people made the right ones and still have it rough I want to give them all the help I can.

250k is not middle class, but there's always a reason to be earning that. They worked hard, started a new business, learned a profession that takes a high degree of skill and education that is rare and in demand (while 100% of people can flip burgers, not as many could be a heart surgeon). However, if people with 250k are barely making ends meet, welcome to America....many people are having the disease of spending more then they earn. Bad fiscal education is pretty much what's happening across the board.