Ther lifestyle is against all Christian teachings. They chose this, what goes around comes around.
Ther lifestyle is against all Christian teachings. They chose this, what goes around comes around.
I was a homosexual male for the last 50 years, but I woke up this morning and decided that I would like to change into a heterosexual Christian male. Maybe if I hurry and get married to a woman as soon as possible, I can avoid an eternity of pain and suffering. So here's the thing: I would like to meet one of you Christian women out there for dating, or possibly marriage. Come on -- how about a drink tonight? Well, if not you, maybe I can date your sister!
Hmmm so many opinions and thoughts.... I find it humorous that sombeody even said that homosexual behavior is found in the animal kingdom! Unbelievable!.... Now we should adjust our laws and imitate animal behavior?
You don't have to imitate. You are part of the animal kingdom, or whatever kingdom you may wish. Whatever you do/ not do and for whatever reasons or no reason, from conception, adulthood (and ultimately to grave) you will see a counterpart in the biological/physical world to varying degrees. It's just that the collections of these behavior (and other factors) warranted that you be classified as a H. sapiens. Now if you want to have laws enacted to ask everyone to behave just like any organism in the biological world, then surely you will need millions of congressman to make them. And actually you don't have to. Many of them has been built right into the genes and the physical outcome. But then again we need to classify another species and contend with another perspective at looking at the world.
It is obvious that you didn't read the post that I was refering to ..... in this post the writer distinguish that humans were not apart of this kingdom and made reference saying that homosexuality is found in the animal kingdom (excluding humans) therefore it justified homosexuality among the humans.... so the species that were studied (non-human) are being equated with those (humans) being talked about on this blog... so if we are equating humans to monkeys, donkeys, cows, gorrilas, tigers, lions, hyenas, elephants, crocodiles, lizards, frogs, dogs, cats, ....... I think you get the picture..... should we make our laws and form our behaviors based on a specific type of species of the animal kingdom.... or according to the animal sign one was born under?
My point is the whole concept of studying non-human species to equate or even dictate the accepted behavior of human beings is plain STUPID!.... I pray that you see the point in this post since you clearly missed in my first post.....
i think you hit the nail right on the head. humans being equated to lower thinking animals. i think gays will go to any extent to explain their lifestyle. i personally have known a lot of gays think that it is all about sex. that being said,i will better understand when homos come out and face that fact, rather than try to shove it down our throats that it is a genetic make up. give me a break
Actually the link between the mammalian species is very strong. The simple fact is that homosexuality is a normal part of animal behvaior and human beings are at their core animals (mammals to be exact. We are not talking about laws and chosen behaviors. We are talking about what is completley normal from a natural perspective. There will always be a homosexual component in any mammalian species and we are mammal. Therefore homosexuality as a component of our population (and by the stats alone that is small enough to to have no effect on the continuation of the speices) is not only normal but probably needed and beneficial.
Nature rules things and homosexuality as appx 10% of our population is what is appparently natural.
Posted By: ghostmasseur @ 09/19/2008 4:44:13 PM
Comment: Actually the link between the mammalian species is very strong. The simple fact is that homosexuality is a normal part of animal behvaior and human beings are at their core animals (mammals to be exact. We are not talking about laws and chosen behaviors. We are talking about what is completley normal from a natural perspective.
As smart as you are (being a teacher) you have no common sense.... take a look at what you are saying and try not to be selective in your listening .... to do something natural encompasses not only a select few doing what you call a natural thing but the whole group..
There will always be a homosexual component in any mammalian species and we are mammal.
This statement lack validity since you Sir haven't the knowlegde of the behavior of every mammal and what sexual activities they engage in and why they engage in them! Don't quote any pro-gay research to me because their are many who refute these claims as rubbish....
Therefore homosexuality as a component of our population (and by the stats alone that is small enough to to have no effect on the continuation of the speices) is not only normal but probably needed and beneficial.
Now lets take this argument that same sex unions are beneficial and that it is "small enough to have no effect on the continuation of the species" So in this statement you have proven my point in the above statement that it is "NOT NATURAL" being that only a few people choose to engage in this type of behavior shows that an abnormalitiy in the thinking process of the few will not damage the continuation of the majority. Yet when one pushes to embrace it as being normal and try to pass laws enforcing people to accept this behavior as being normal... infringes upon the normality of our thinking process .... if resistance is found we are labeled racist, hatemongers.....etc...
Nature rules things and homosexuality as appx 10% of our population is what is appparently natural.
God rules and judge the earth before....flood.... less one forgets! I wouldn't care if 90% of the population agrees with it being natural.... one still has to convince God (the Creator, Author, Manufacture of Mankind) that his purpose for their being is wrong and that he made a mistake..... That is not going to Happen!
Ahhhh...the famous words of a gay liberal...bigot...That's all you can say. The law is that a marriage is between a man and a woman. So you're saying that if I wanted the speed limit increased to 90 MPH all I should have to do is say that I am a speeder and I was born with it, so the law doesn't apply to me? I don't care about gays wanting more rights.....get a life
There was a time when marraige was only between a man of woman of the same race (and even the same religion). We grew up and realized that those laws were wrong.
Slowly but surely we will realize that defining civil marriage as only between a man and a woman is wrong as well. Marriage is between (two) loving and commited people. And technically, a civil marriage does nto even require that the two love each other (or becommitted to each other. That is the only real flaw in the law. but one that is all but impossible to correct.
If you don't care, then kindly refrain from making comments just to make noise and let those that do care discuss their points of view. Feel free to live and think the way you feel most comfortable- you are entitled to it, as long as you don't limit the freedoms of others. And while you happily live your life, please gently extend that freedom to others.
If you are entitled to all the "benefits" in this country, then you should abide by the laws our founding fathers set up. The states that passed the laws approving gay marriage would make our founding fathers regret the fact that their name is even associated with this country. You don't like some of the laws, then move to a country which will appease your cravings.
What if I thought I was created to have intercourse with 12 year old girls......or boys.... What if I could get some psychiatrists to testify that this was just the way I was wired, I have no choice in the matter. What then If I found some other species of animal in nature where the adults prey on the younger ones and say...."see, it happens in nature, it must be ok, leave me alone."....What if I were also able to collect a following, and the whole group of us went around raping children in the name of what we thought was right. What would it take for you to agree with me, and help me seek defense against those who thought I was wrong, bible or no bible. What side of that fence would you sit on.
That is a useless analogy. We are talking about two consenting adults able to enter into legal contracts but being denied such a rigth solely on account of religious idiocy. Children cannot enter into contracts and cannot provide legal consent to have sex with an adult.
You do not know what you are talking about. Our founding fathers would say that the will of the majority should NEVER be a reason to deny the rights of a minority.
Leave the Bible out of it. Anyone can read and interperete the Bible to mean exactly what they want it to. My partner and I should be able to have the same basic rights as other couples. If i were injured and were unable to make a decision for my medical needs i would want the person who knows me best (my partner) to be able to make that decision for me. Other couples have this basic right. Who is it hurting for me to have that basic right.
you have that choice .... a medical power of attorney ... get one for both of you and you are both covered should you get hurt, sick, etc.
The problem is that even with a DPOA or MPOA some states, localities and facilities do not recognize them if the person named is a same sex partner. The same for living wills.
You have that right ... it is called a living will. You make one and you can give the right to anyone you choose to make your decisions.
If I had never heard about homosexuality as a child I would still be a 41 year old gay man because it is what I am. If no one had ever raised you hate filled people to be "Christian" you wouldn't miss it in your little lives. It's strange that we are the ones who are are accused of recruiting when what we are comes natural to us.
What are you trying to say...I think most Christians, like myself are just becoming a bit pissed off hearing are these lame excuses for being gay. There is no gay gene, and even if there was then it is still your choice to act act in a homsexual manner. The homosexual community either denies Christianity and its teachings of speaks against it's followers so they can promot their agendas without having to be held accountable.
Actually there are many gays and lesbians who are very believing and caring Christians. Their complaints are agasint the people who are trying to rape the US Constiution by making US law in the mold of thier view of what their religion believes in. That is the same problem that many heterosexuals (both atheists like myself and belivers in various religions like many of my friends, including dozens of Christain clerics) have with Christain conservatives.
luckywifenmom; Why would want to leave the bible out of it? Does it convict you? Please read Romans 1:21-32.
She wants to leave the bible out of it because it is irrelevant to US law.
For many of us (including herterosexuals like myself) it is irrelevant period.
The US was founded to escape from religious persecution....why are you guys persecuting people who think differently than you?
In the past 100 years there have been more Chirsitans killed world wide than in the first 19 centuries simply for being Christians. How many homosexuals have been killed. Christians are not the bad guys. One day and it will probably be soon you will realize who and what love truly is.
How many of them were killed by co-religionists (The troubles in Ireland for one).
I does not matter that more Christains may or may not hae been killed for their religion (mostly by believers in another religion that also targetted gays and lesbians). Also given that gays and lesbians only make up about 10% of the world's population, in relative terms it is very possible that by percentage of the homosexual population worldwide verssus the percentage of the Christian populationworldwide, that the homosexual population suffered more damage. But that is irrelevant.
And I already know what true love is and it has nothing to do with religion, god or Jesus.
Everyone should watch a documentary film called Ten More Good Years that was recently screened on The Sundance Channel and currently on LOGO. This is an amazing feature length film that speaks to all of the issues in this article. Several LGBT elders share their stories and people who work in the field of aging explain the ins and outs of the issues. Go to TenMoreGoodYears.com for more information on screenings, press, etc. This is truly an amazing film and well worth your attention!!!
you know, all i've read on here is one person after another either "quote" the Bible saying that "IT'S A SIN" to sleep with someone of the same sex or others say that those people are ignorant for saying it. but you know want, WHAT DOES IT MATTER? let them live their lives how they wish without you or anyone else imposing your opinion on them, and them on you. besides most of you posters have gotten way off topic. this was about one group of PEOPLE wanting the same legal rights as everyone else. not whether they have sinned, should be able to have children to raise, go to hell or heaven. but just straight up whether they can have the same rights under the U.S. laws as everyone else. besides what does it matter how they live their personal life if they don't push it on you, you shouldn't push your personal views on them. if you don't like, just to bad! it's around now, and that lifestyle isn't going anywhere soon. besides if you did some history hunting you would find out that they have homosexuality in the past and everyone was for it. they even looked apond it with honor. so stop bashing everyone else for being different. that's what makes us humans. if everyone liked or wanted the same thing then it wouldn't be a life worth living.
DON'T PUSH WHAT YOU BELIEVE ON EVEYONE ELSE JUST TO MAKE THEM LIKE YOU!
I would ask for the same from you. Every homosexual society that I have heard of has been destroyed (of course there are many things I do not know). What society are you refering to?
Name one completely homosexual society. (and Sodom and Gemorrah was not a homosexual society). there has not been one so none have been destroyed.
I am amazed at how many people think they know what God wants others to do. Live your life as you believe God wants you to. Don't condemn others, because almost all of us are simply not qualified to be judges. And ... most of us are hypocrites.
I say each person should have rights to a domestic partner, even if it is a non-sexual relationship between two siblings (old maid sisters?).
Mikeonatrike
The Bible says homosexuality is wrong. And actually most of the time there is a sexual relationship. Homo...........
Actually the bible does not say homosexuality is wrong. It condemns anal sex (lying with man as with woman). Not all homosexual couples engage in that specific form of sexual activity.
In reality if you knew more abuot TaNaKH, you would understand that what is being condemned is NOT the committed long-term relationships that are talked about in theis article. It is talking about the omnisexual activities (including the one's that are talked about before and after the one activity of two men) that the high priests of an idol worshipping religion in Canaan engaged in (which included sex with everything that move, including thier relatives, animals and the dead). Looking at just one line is what fools do and has always been cindemned by the Rabbis and Jewish sages. And their viewpint on how to read it is the only one that matters as it is thier book first and foremost.
Where do I even begin with Deelessa? If you were functionally literate you would see that my name is "GoGatorsJH" and that comment was directed to jj so-and-so who had posted previously. That is not my name. So...before I even read into your comment...I see what level of intellect I'm up against. Yes, I am more disgusted by ignorant uneducated people that "carpet munchers." We save our "disgusting" sexual preferences for the privacy of our own homes but you idiots just come out and flaunt your stupidity openly. The fact that you got so tickled to find out that I'm a Christian Republican Lesbian exposes your ignorance. Simple people tend to have a hard time when people don't fit in tidy little boxes. I AM a Christian b/c I know that Jesus died for my sins and is my Lord and Savior. There is no debating that one...even the hateful Christians will agree with me there. Secondly, I am a republican b/c of my political views regarding foreign policy and the economy. Unlike you, I am able to think logically and not emotionally. Either way...it's Saturday night and I'm heading out b/c I actually have friends. I don't sit on the computer fighting with people I'll never meet b/c I don't have anythings else to do, like other people.
By the way...I'm not familiar with the FDS. Does that stand for Fugly Deeleesa Society? Nice name...can I buy a vowel? I'm leaving now...If you respond while I'm gone, I'll let you win. Deeleesa is my intellectual superior everyone. She wins....I lose. Haha.
Comment: Where do I even begin with Deelessa? If you were functionally literate you would see that my name is "GoGatorsJH" and that comment was directed to jj so-and-so who had posted previously. That is not my name. So...before I even read into your comment...I see what level of intellect I'm up against. Yes, I am more disgusted by ignorant uneducated people that "carpet munchers." We save our "disgusting" sexual preferences for the privacy of our own homes but you idiots just come out and flaunt your stupidity openly. The fact that you got so tickled to find out that I'm a Christian Republican Lesbian exposes your ignorance. Simple people tend to have a hard time when people don't fit in tidy little boxes. I AM a Christian b/c I know that Jesus died for my sins and is my Lord and Savior. There is no debating that one...even the hateful Christians will agree with me there. Secondly, I am a republican b/c of my political views regarding foreign policy and the economy. Unlike you, I am able to think logically and not emotionally. Either way...it's Saturday night and I'm heading out b/c I actually have friends. I don't sit on the computer fighting with people I'll never meet b/c I don't have anythings else to do, like other people.
By the way...I'm not familiar with the FDS. Does that stand for Fugly Deeleesa Society? Nice name...can I buy a vowel? I'm leaving now...If you respond while I'm gone, I'll let you win. Deeleesa is my intellectual superior everyone. She wins....I lose. Haha.
Ok, so I clicked the incorrect reply button, how precisely does that not make me "functionally literate"? Since you want to "ream" other people and point out their mistakes, point your own out as well:
GoGator wrote: Yes, I am more disgusted by ignorant uneducated people [that] "carpet munchers."
Nice to see you have such an inflated view of yourself to imagine (and that's all it is, imagining) that I am tickled about any aspect of you or your bleatings that don't mean anything. Go ponder this next time you are munching a rug and multi-task by remembering exactly WHY Soddom and Gommorah were destroyed by GOD
Sodom and Gemorrah were destroyed on account of baseless hatred. Heterosexual men raping other men purely as a form of violence and subjugation (which what happened and has NOPTHING to do with true homosexuality) is just ONE example of that.
And before you ask where that reason is found, that has ALWAYS been the reason as interpretted by the Rabbis and other Jewish sages. And since the TaNaKH , which is correct acromym/name (meaning Torah Neviim [prophets] & Khetuvim [writings]) of what Christians mistakenly call the OT, has always been and is first and foremost a Jewish religous text, the Jewish interpreation is the valid one.
If you want to know what baseless hatred is all about look in the mirror and think about how you view homosexuals. The purveyors of baseless hatred in the US today are the conservative Christians like rovbertson, Dobson and their ilk. They are the true present day heirs to Sodom and Gemorrah.
As a child of a homo or bisexual for those of you who are anal, I have never seen anything that would suggest that anyone is born into this sexual depravity. "Orientation" is just the gay lie de jor. There is no factual basis for "orientation". I have however, seen examples of homosexual recruitment.
joe,
You are not intelligent enough to recognize a factual basis even if Albert Einstein was there to explain it to you.
There is far more recruitment into the depravity of your style of bigotted fundamentalism than there will ever be into homosexuality. I have been around gay men most of my lidfe and they never tried recruiting me. They knew that I was heterosexual. On the other hand I have had plenty of evangelicals try to recruit me into their idiocy. Luckily I am too smart to fall for their garbage. My (intelligent) non-evangelical Christian friends have never tried to recruit me and we respect each other and each othrer's beliefs.
Recruitment? yeah, right. We really want you . hahaha.
I find it odd that every reporter talks about how the issue of inheritance is a big problem for gays and unmarried people. The solution is simple as a will or a trust. I find it poor argument for sanctioning gay marriage, I have no objection for gays to marry as it will create business of divorces for the greedy lawyers and perhaps the lawyers will leave us hetero males alone for awhile. I do object to false arguments!
"I find it odd that every reporter talks about how the issue of inheritance is a big problem for gays and unmarried people. The solution is simple as a will or a trust. I find it poor argument for sanctioning gay marriage, I have no objection for gays to marry as it will create business of divorces for the greedy lawyers and perhaps the lawyers will leave us hetero males alone for awhile. I do object to false arguments!"
It is not a false arguement. A married person has certain tax benefits that a will or trust do not bestow. And that is only one the issues. There are courts that have said that even with the will or trust it is not considered as strong without marriage so jerks int eh family can more easily contest it, or more specifcally cause serious financial losses to teh remain partner (which is often the real desire for the bigotted family members.) Marraige helps to prevent some (although not all) of that. Awith amarriage (and the long term relatinship) those who contest the will or trust are often summarilly dismissed.
There is no believing or not believing in a gay lifestyle, there are gay people. period. it really doesn't matter what you believe in, it is what it is. It exists, it is real and you have a right not to like it, but not "believing" in it makes no sense....sort of like not "believing" in evolution. it is what it is. They are citizens of the country and pay their dues just as much - if not more - than you do. They pay taxes, they serve in the military and every other aspect of American life. You not believing in the lifestyle is your religiosity - which is not supposed to have anything to do with public policy or the law.
So why are they facing special problems that straight society does not seem to face?
the main problems they face is due to discrimination from both indivuduals and the government.
There is no valid reasn why a gay monogamos couple who have lived together 30 years and shared everything should not be entitled to the same pension, tax and end-of-life benefits as a heterosexual couple have have been married for the same length of time simply because they are not allowed to get married. Allowingt sme-sex couples to ahve the same rights of access and legal standings as heterosexual married couples would solve that. No special rights. Equal rights.
but if you want to get legal about it, they knew what they were getting into when they made the choice, right or wrong..........
""they knew what they were getting into when they made the choice"
It was not a choice. (Yes I have read the garbage about their actions being a choice) but that is not really relevant. Why should they be treated as second class citizens because of who they love (and the pedophilia arguement is garbage too. We are talking about two consenting adults here. Big difference).
They are entitled to equal treatment. In reality there is far more choice about being Christain (oir whatever religion one may CHOOSE to follow or not) then there is abut being gay or lesbian. Why should their loving someone of the same sex result in having to go extra steps to try to secure estate , and end-of-life rights (and then even after going through those hoops) running into discrimination because some idiot in a hospital or legislature believes in some man-made god and decides that even though they have been in a monogamous relationship for 30 years that they are not entitled to same benefits that a heterosexual couple is given automatically with the artifical institution of marriage.
The only choice that should affect thsoe outcomes is whether they choose to get married or not. The government has no legitimate right to deny them THAT choice.
everybody has a choice whether or not to stick your finger into frying oil. we have a choice when it comes to taking drugs of any kind. Likewise, we all have a choice when it comes to what we do with our body parts. would you use a hammer to do the job of a screwdriver? would you use a pencil for a project that needs a needle and thread? Would you tell a young child that a square peg fits in a round hole?
I am a heterosexual woman. I was never taught to be hetero and I never made a choice. Even if I would have never had sex I would still be a straight woman. Sexual orientation has so MUCH more than what one does or doesn't do with one's anatomy.
But I guess you don't get the point do you?
B
sure you did, you made a choice today to remain straight. You have the opportunity right before you everyday to go the other way if you desire.....that;s called a choice
Actually if she was attracted to both men and wpomen then she would be bisexual and that would still nto be a choice. In that circumstance the only shoce she would be making is which attraction to go with. Even then, most bisexuals are attracted more to one sex than the other. Whether they follow that stronger attractin is the choice. But for Gays and lesbinas there is not choce, except to folllow their natural atttraction. And there is no reason they should not as there is nothing wrong with being gay or lesbian (or bisexual for that matter). It is all natural, just as my being hetero is natural for me. My only choice was what type of woman I chose to date, and even then there are natural attractions at work, some physically based and some intellectually based.
you seem to be the life of this thread. your anaologies are strongly executed and are at the very least worth replying to. it's very hard to reply to a thoughtless post.
the only thing that came to mind when i read this post was the infathomable complexity of our species. the human can not be dummed down to square pegs in round holes and fingers in frying oil. the human body and mind are so intricate, it's an injustice to use such descriptions when describing how we live and love.
i can see now why i stay away from these message boards, it's addicting! lol !!
if i don't get off now, i'll be reading all night.
keep firing and be well...
My Bad, found my comments. They were NOT deleted out!! My mistake!! Sorry !! :(
WOW!! Found my commnents were deleted out!! No profanity or anything worse in it then what I currently see here!! Maybe I am too politically incorrect to be on this site. So much for "Freedom of the Press". He who has the paper can controll the press, Uncle Sam owns this one!! A free american on the outs!! Humm?? Wonder why?? I'll just keep my mouth shut like a "Good little American."
KM521: why would the press push for genetic verses choice?
first off, we know the media to be liberal so thier natural swing would be toward a postion that is more acceptable to the masses.
second, there's more money to be made by saying it's genetic.
third, it takes responsibility away from the public, and that's what the public wants mostly.
But what if they were wrong, and it really is a choice?
Dear Get the point: wait, first you say that the liberal media (ps have you ever watched fox? didn't realize that O'Reilly was liberal)are succombing to the wants of the masses, then you state that they are pushing the genetic argument to make people feel better that they don't have a choice. Well, the gay community is not what I would consider the "masses," but instead a minority so which is it? So, how do they make more money by stating that homosexuality is genetic again? Also, who is paying off the scientists and doctors who have studied this and believe it to be genetic. I would like to figure out this big money trail that is going on - maybe we can hit them up to help out with the US economy
Its a new day and age. Barbarism and Discrimination only existed back in our history with the old mindset of killing those who sought freedom and equality. It is time for understanding the world as it is TODAY!
Peace, Liberty, and the pursuit for happiness....THOUGH SHALL NOT JUDGE! Only one person can do that.
Marriage Equality for ALL! Equal Rights for ALL!
Wrong. God already made his Judgment or have you conveniently forgotten Soddom and Gomorrah?
Sodom and Gemorrah had nothing to do with homosexuality. IT had to do with baseless hatred (those of you who make bigotted commetna bout gays being sick and depraved, look in the mirror for what baseless hatred means). That has always been the Jewish interpretation and their interpretaion is the ony valid one since the book was theirs first and foremost. All other interpretations can be dismissed as false.
People seem to be questioning the quality of Christian another person(s) may be (i.e. you believe homosexuality is tolerable, you are not a good or true Christian, etc). The best, bare-bones definition of Christianity I've come across was along the lines of "a belief system in which Jesus Christ was the son of God and that he died for the sins of humanity." Feel free to argue, but it's not a bad place to start. And I believe the term is a lot more forgiving than most people are giving credit.
I just think people should either specify what type(s) of Christianity one is not adhering to, or directly target the beliefs being called to question, otherwise their arguments are moot points. Also, the "you are wrong because I am right" justification really carries no weight so people should try to avoid using it (i.e. using "How can God send me to hell if he doesn't exist?" against a theist, and "Homosexuality is wrong because it is God's word." to an atheist).
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