When Atheists Attack

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  • Posted By: Mirabhai @ 09/23/2008 3:03:22 PM

    What strikes (and unnerves) me about the anti-elitism of Palin's supporters is that they seem to be assailing meritocracy, not inequality. Americans have traditionally valued egalitarianism, in the sense of striving (with varied success over our history) to provide equal opportunities for all of our citizens. Barack Obama is a sterling example of equality of opportunity: the half-black kid of a single mom on food stamps who could rise on his own brains and hard work to aspire to be President of the United States. Palin's supporters, in contrast, don't seem to support equality of opportunity, but equality of outcomes: anyone who excels is the object of their burning resentment. It is not unfair social or economic advantage, but the gifts and achievements of the extraordinary individuals among us that they mock and revile. Palin is an anti-elitist icon not because she rose from poverty or oppression, but because she did not rise above the level of mediocrity that most of us inhabit.

  • Posted By: jfirebug @ 09/23/2008 3:00:15 PM

    Sarah Palin's religion is no different than any other follower of Billy Graham, a highly respected religious leader of all Pentacostal Religion, and who Sarah's church follows. She points out her personal views do not supercede her governmental decisions, where she would be sworn to uphold the Constitution. A world traveler, does not make a world leader, Lots of travel agents travel. People in alaska are all quite aware of how close Russia is to them, and you should be too. Her comment about seeing it from her window, means more than a frivolous statement. Perhaps Sarah, sadly, will learn that her endearing qualities are made fun of and criticized by so called "educated" people who have no real lives. Your long diatribe, was not helpful nor even useful, and you have no understanding of a real person.

  • Posted By: jpdemers @ 09/23/2008 2:52:10 PM

    Republicans are aghast at the sight of religious extremists taking over one country after another in the Mideast and central Asia. Their solution is to put Palin in the White House?!? Jon Stewart can be hysterically funny merely by reporting on what these loons are saying and doing, but it gets less funny as the election gets closer. It's so depressing to know that this election is even close.

  • Posted By: anchovy @ 09/23/2008 12:50:13 PM

    Why won't you print the gaffes and stupid statements that Obama makes instead of glowing and worshipful cover stories? Obama doesn't even know what committees he is on. How many states there are. What his Middle East policy is. The Kennedy-Khrushchev summit in Vienna. You allow him to get away with dangerous associations with Bill Ayers and Jeremiah Wright which you dismiss as "distractions" but no slack for Palin

    • Posted By: Booshlar @ 09/23/2008 2:50:09 PM

      Let us not forget, when the atheist Putin invaded Georgia, (eerily quiet response from the pacifists in America BTW was it because he is an atheist and a thinker?) Barack's first response was to go to the UN security council and apply sanctions. Obviously unaware that the Russians have veto power. What would have been the response from the brain trust on the left if Palin had made that gaffe?

  • Posted By: dicoby @ 09/23/2008 2:49:07 PM

    Amazing article! I truly enjoyed reading it until the end. I strongly agree when you say that: "When it comes to politics, there is a mad love of mediocrity in this country". True! In any other developed country, the race would have been already over when a highly educated candidate (Harvard graduate) and his well versed VP go up against a C+ average student (894th out 899 in the academy) and a VP who took 6 years and 6 universities to get a college. degree. I guess this is AMERICA!

  • Posted By: Scott.W @ 09/23/2008 2:19:32 PM

    Re: post from Ben Garrison, headered by "Comment: Montana woman"
    My god (this is just an expression), how did David Koresh miss you?

    Specifically, Harris' opinioin piece
    This is perhaps one of the best pieces of commentary about the American political process, and of the current election that I've seen yet. I really wish I had written it.

    • Posted By: News and Notes @ 09/23/2008 2:47:41 PM

      Objectively, as someone who doesn't support Palin, this article was poorly written, judgemental, personal, and written by someone who comes across as a super angry left wing liberal. The article does nothing but provide undeserved sympathy for Palin. It is monsterous. If anyone did these kinds of personal attacks on Obama they would be ripped to shreds. This kind of divisiveness is what has crippled our political system. While Palin is inferior to HIllary on the mertis of holding higher office, she is on the ticket to remind Hillary supporters that Obama screwed up by leaving Hillary off the ticket. Biden is an old bore. If you blame anyone, blame Obama for this mess

  • Posted By: Heldenhammer @ 09/23/2008 2:47:07 PM

    Clarification to my previous post; we've both graduated from college, Obama meanwhile graduated from the most prestigous college in the United States and doing so with honors. I could easily compare myself to Palin and one up her on the fact my degree is in business management, at least there I have actual experience in managing people and making executive decisions.

    And before people get all; 'Eisenhower wasn't a CEO you moran' (yes deliberately mispelled in celebration of an internet meme). He was Supreme Allied Commander and that gives him all the executive experience you could have asked for in a President during a time of crisis. Ironically, even that didn't help him go down in history as one of our most well respected, historical presidents.

    Anyone using the Lincoln argument is also pretty laughable, considering the parties were -vastly- different prior the Great Depression and almost do not even closely resemble what we have today. Even then, Lincoln was more closely comparable to Obama than to Palin. Truman was inexperienced, but he was also raised in an era of hardship and troubles that far exceed what Palin has had to deal with and his use of the nuclear weapon on civilian targets is still cause for debate today. I could go on, but my work day is over with.

  • Posted By: mamou0 @ 09/23/2008 2:41:19 PM

    Re: When Atheists Attack:
    Your article was well written. I'm NO fan of Sarah Palin! The beauty queen thing was background stuff until last week, when she pronounced "nuclear" as "new-cue-ler"! As a woman with a degree in Journalism, and a former TV announcer, Palin should have KNOWN better! Obviously, she did not! I wonder if she still carries that tiara around with her? This is the LAST person I would want to see in the White House!!

  • Posted By: McKell @ 09/23/2008 1:14:52 PM

    I am a progressive Christian and totally agree with Sam Harris's article; there are many of us out there. The work of the vice president requires a lot more experience and education than Sarah Palin has. It is pure egotism,hubris and ignorance for her and women who identify with her life story to assume that they, could be vice president. Frighteningly enough, there are a lot of women who think so! This is why so many women are voting for the McCain/Palin ticket.

    • Posted By: Booshlar @ 09/23/2008 2:38:19 PM

      How hard can being a vp be? Al Gore did it for eight years.

    • Posted By: Booshlar @ 09/23/2008 2:33:10 PM

      How hard can being vp be? Al Gore did it for eight years.

  • Posted By: Heldenhammer @ 09/23/2008 2:31:03 PM

    A previous poster compared this to a 'modern dark ages'. I find the use of that misnomer to be really amusing, considering it was the Christian church in power during the first, maligned Dark Ages. Unless you are choosing to specfiy Catholic church, in which case I would argue there is little difference between the religious practices and dogmatic focus; the bibles you both worship are otherwise the same.

    Palin is an amusing diversion from McCain. She is the lipstick put on the pig of a Republican party and just as substantive. She is an empty skirt and an insult for the feminist movement that sought to empower women, not deride them with an inexperienced 'gag'. While the Republican party pats themselves on the back for being 'progressive' lets not forget the Democrats did it almost twenty years ago and we had a qualified, experienced female candidate running for the highest office. What the Republican party is doing is basically patting women on the head and telling them 'good girl, heres your treat'.

    I'm an atheist, but I don't care about Obama's Christian faith or even if he was the much laughably rumored Muslim. He draws a line between his personal religion and the office he would take. He is an elitist and good. He is far smarter than me just from having graduated college and I know I don't have the answers to fix this country, the intelligence or the dedication that his balance between work, family and community has taken. Palin 'running' her state when most of the work fell to employees doesn't even come close to registering as executive experience. Come back to me when she's a CEO or a large multinational corporation, as that is the sort of 'executive experience' that would be necessary for running this country. Since none of our officials have had that since Eisenhower, you can take that right off the plate for Palin. That leaves her with nothing. Absolutely nothing. I don't want my mom in office. I want a leader. I'm an adult now, time for the rest of America to be.

  • Posted By: ObjectiveIndependent @ 09/23/2008 2:21:31 PM

    Newsweek/MSNBC: why would you name this opinion piece "When Atheists attack"? If Sam Harris were black would you call it "When Blacks attack"? Or if he were Muslim, "When Muslims attack"? The annswer is clear.

  • Posted By: workingmomsaregoodmoms @ 09/23/2008 2:18:37 PM

    Anyone who thinks they are appointed by God scares the hell out of me.

  • Posted By: PaulWilliam @ 09/23/2008 2:17:30 PM

    Jack Dempsey says that the people that like Palen because she's a mom, are all wrong. How about the Millions who Support Obama because he is black? If she is a nutso christian because she goes to a certain church, then Obama, must be a raging bigot because he spent 20+ years listening to Jerimia Wright., in his church. Mr. Dempsey opinions like yours reviels you bias and that to me deminishes your credability.

  • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/22/2008 8:55:53 PM

    Mr. Harris, I would like to see you in a debate with Gov. Palin; I wonder how many of the people who read your "opinion" realize that you are in one of tne smallest minorities in the United States (your disbelief in the God of our universe)? Please accept my apologies if I choose to not join in your circle of privileged, "highly-educated" elites . . . or is there a better term to describe you? Perhaps you would be more comfortable across the pond . . .

    • Posted By: ctpjs99 @ 09/22/2008 9:26:10 PM

      After reading through comments like this, I find it very sad that Sam Harris is only preaching to the choir. The people that really need to hear his message are people like you; Christians who are terrified of having their unfounded beliefs questioned, whether they will admit it or not.

      You claim that Harris is "one of the smallest minorities in the United States" for his "disbelief in the God of our universe". You are wrong. It's time to come out of your circle of church friends and find out what's really going on in the world.

      • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/22/2008 10:02:04 PM

        What you refer to as an "unfounded belief" is what a majority of Americans call faith: "being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1 I would urge you to spend more time in your Bible, and less in Newsweek . . . I prefer to be of this world, and not in it.

        • Posted By: ctpjs99 @ 09/23/2008 12:39:52 AM

          Just because a majority of Americans identify themselves as Christian, does it mean that the teachings of Christianity are true? (Hint: No)

          Actually a lot of people identify themselves as Christian because they were raised that way, even if they don't attend church at all or really believe in the literal truth of the Bible. There is evidence from recent polls that the percentage of adults who identify themselves as Christian is dropping almost one percentage point per year, while persons identifying themselves as having no religion is increasing at about a half a percentage point per year.

          Of course, people identifying themselves as having no religion won't going up too fast because the word athiest has such a negative connotation in this country. Apparently, when people want good reasons and evidence when choosing the beliefs to base their lives upon, you get labeled a dirty word.

          More and more people are figuring out that we be kind, giving, and lead ethical lives without an imaginary God based on a delusional book full of contradictions. We don't have to suspend logic and rational thought for superstition and fear of going to hell.

          Oh, I almost forgot..

          "being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see." Hebrews 11:1

          Translation: "follow what you were taught by your parents blindly, and do not question it, even if you are presented with an overwhelming amount of evidence that this book is not true, because if you do Satan will rip your eyeballs out and burn your pubes."

          • Posted By: RavenMaven @ 09/23/2008 1:23:19 AM

            What overwhelming evidence? There has never been any evidence that supports the notion that there is no God. There can not be any such evidence. All the scientists in the world could work their whole lives on that one thing and never produce any evidence that proves that there is no God. You don't understand that do you? Of course not. Because you place your faith in the works of men, who have admitted that what they do not know about science far exceeds what they do know, and none of what they know proves that there is no GOd. Even after 2000 years of trying to prove the Bible wrong, no has been able to.

            • Posted By: ctpjs99 @ 09/23/2008 11:05:51 AM

              You are absolutely right; science cannot prove that God does not exist. That is because Christianity and other religions create a concrete barrier for any honest inquiry or criticism, and is the reason it is so dangerous - the Christian doctrine teaches that you can't question anything about it. Science also can't prove that Big Foot didn't exist, does that mean we should believe in him too?

              The overwhelming evidence that I was talking about is evidence that the Bible cannot be taken as literal truth regarding faith. The Bible contains so many inconsistencies and self-contradictory parts that I don't feel my life should be based upon its teachings. Also, according to it, the earth was created in seven days roughly 7,000 years ago. We have overwhelming evidence that this is not true. (I.e. fossil records)

              I won't go into an entire list of the contradictions because they are already very well documented. If you do a Google search for "Bible Contradictions", you will find plenty of reading material.

              You will almost surely respond by saying that I am simply interpreting the Bible wrong. I find it interesting how Christians have to cherry pick certain parts of the Bible while dismissing other parts to make it fit into their lives nicely, and further illustrates just how unreasonable it is to base your life upon it.

              Look, I know that I'm probably not going to change your mind, and I apologize if it sounds like I???m trying to cut down on you with a negative tone. I just want you to know that people can live secular lives and still be awesome, loving, caring, ethical people.

              The main difference between Christians and people like Sam Harris and I is this: If we were presented with reasonable evidence that the Christian God truly existed and the Bible was a legit source of faith, we would change our minds. When Christians are presented with legitimate reasons suggesting the contrary, they rarely will even consider the reasons or evidence presented - because your faith is based on dogma that is beyond criticism or inquiry, and uses fear and guilt as a way to keep people from questioning it.

              • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/23/2008 2:16:03 PM

                The source of the evidence you want to present (and you claim I won't consider) is man; the source of my evidence that God exists is God Himself, laid out in His divine Word. I accept that God created the world; how long is a "day" as referenced in Genesis? I don't know, and the answer will never be revealed by scientific study. I simply accept the fact that my existence is not for my own purpose, but is part of a bigger plan. When Jesus told his disciples "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life", he was either the world's biggest liar/lunatic, or he was the Son of God as he proclaimed . . . the fact that he went to his crucifixion for the salvation of God's ultimate creation (mankind) tells me everything I need to know to answer that question. It's not a blind following of something someone else told me, nor is it a fear of eternal punishment. It is the grace of our God that gives me salvation, not because of anything I did or will do, but only because of God's unfathomable and unconditional love. I will pray that you too will someday come face to face with that awesome love; whether you realize it or not, God does want to bring you into His eternal fellowship, and He has given us that message through Jesus Christ for almost 2000 years.

          • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/23/2008 9:42:11 AM

            Take a week and read C.S. Lewis's "Mere Christianity" . . . he was once where you and Mr. Harris are. If you don't know God nad His Son, when the day comes that you know He is real, it will be too late for you. In the meantime, I will pray that God will touch your heart and bring you to Him . . . that is by far much more important than the outcome of this pending election.

      • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/22/2008 10:14:05 PM

        And you and anyone else may question me anytime about my faith; your questions don't terrify me, they simply give me another opportunity to profess my faith. I know where I will be spending eternity . . . the more important question for you should be, do you?

        • Posted By: ctpjs99 @ 09/22/2008 10:38:58 PM

          Apparently I will be spending it in a lake of fire burning in damnation.

          • Posted By: jashurley @ 09/23/2008 10:35:16 AM

            It doesn't have to be that way; you have the ability to change that with a simple, honest profession of faith

      • Posted By: RavenMaven @ 09/23/2008 12:43:37 AM

        OK. I have no circle of church friends. I belong to no church. I am very in tune with the advances of science and the social and spiritual landscape of the various cultures of the world. And with that knowledge and wisdom, I can tell you with certainty, that you and Harris are among a very small minority of people due to your disbelief in the God of our Universe. You are just plain wrong. I'll tell you what, when Science can prove God does not exist, then I'll believe you....

  • Posted By: Shane Usary @ 09/23/2008 2:15:52 PM

    Superb piece and one that should be carefully perused by every voter. Among Ms. Palin's quite literal beliefs (or so I've heard) is the notion that the earth, and presumably the balance of the universe, are approximately six thousand years old. That gem of religiolunacy is traceable to one Bishop Usher, a seventeenth century Irish cleric who "calculated" that the "creation" detailed in Genesis occurred in 4004 B.C.E. William Jennings Bryan even trotted out Bishop Usher during his testimony in the Scopes "Monkey" trial. When Darrow showed him the famous rock found locally and estimated geologically to be ten million years old, Bryan sang out his oft-quoted reply: "I am more concerned about the Rock of Ages than I am about the age of rocks." I suppose Gov. Palin holds a similar view. It is equally apparent that her mental processes are on a par with Bryan's in another way. She evidently does not, to paraphrase another of Bryan's priceless Scopes trial responses, "think about things she does not think about." I am not really surprised by any of this. When I forced myself to listen to the Governor's carefully crafted and promptered speech in St. Paul, I felt somehow as if I were witnessing a sequel to the Coen brothers' "Fargo."

  • Posted By: PaulWilliam @ 09/23/2008 2:15:42 PM

    Jack Dempsey says that the people that like Palen because she's a mom, are all wrong. How about the Millions who Support Obama because he is black? If she is a nutso christian because she goes to a certain church, then Obama, must be a raging bigot because he spent 20+ years listening to Jerimia Wright., in his church. Mr. Dempsey opinions like yours reviels you bias and that to me deminishes your credability.

  • Posted By: rube @ 09/23/2008 2:11:42 PM

    Excellent, I beleive in god very much so but I also have common sence. this is what my sence tells me...

    This is what Bush and Cheney basically told the nation they were going to accomplish on day one of their tenure! Some people didnt listen!

    Socialize the debt and privatize the wealth!


    Heres a short line item of "their conservative' legacy" during the past eight years...

    The worst election fraud in history - the 2000 presidential election...

    The first Major attack against America in the lower 48??? (9/11)

    The first American attack against a sovereign country in history - Iraq, all based on subversion and duplicity...there were no WMDs!

    The worst federal handling of a catastrophic even in American History, Katrina...

    The worst time period in American history for privatizing the federal institutions of war, education, prison, etc.
    They are still trying to get our social security and give it to the stock market!

    The largest federal debt in American history...from great prosperity to collapse in just 8 years!

    The worst collapse of our mortgage, banking and lending institutions to date...
    I could go on all day...but I get sick to my stomach!

    So is this what happens when you elect two GOP ex-oilmen to run our nation?

    And now the right wing wants to give us McCain, a 95% mirrored image of past failed GOP policies and Palin, who is more to the right then Bush/Cheney: an absolute dolt, no intelligence...
    just more of that self-righteous underachiever garbage that Bush represents!

    The nation obviously needs oversight , regulation, and political change.
    Dump the GOP presidential candidate. "This is real change we can beleive in!"

  • Posted By: dnha14 @ 09/23/2008 2:10:27 PM

    And Harry Truman was a haberdasher. So, what's your point? Commom people with commom backgrounds can't become successful? Don't think so.

  • Posted By: dnha14 @ 09/23/2008 2:08:49 PM

    And Harry Truman was a haberdasher. So, what's your point?

  • Posted By: zooterboy @ 09/23/2008 2:02:27 PM

    First off, any comment on Obama here is the pure definition of fallacy; it shows the weakness the Republican party has in defending Sarah Palin with anything of substance.

    Anyone who calls liberals "close-minded" needs to acquaint themselves with a dictionary. It actually says "open-minded" as a definition of the word liberal. The Republican party should rename itself "the Rhetoric Party" because they can't argue an issue with any credibility. Time after time, the conversation will turn into fear-mongering "watch out for the terrorists!!" or flat-out lies to keep the money rolling into their pockets. Oil company profits at an all-time high-- we have a President whose family has a history in oil. Coincidence? You make the call.

    Sarah Palin isn't qualified to even hold the governorship she has, let alone govern the Senate. Her foreign experience consists of watching it on television and making up rhetorical statements like "I can see them out my backyard". She can see 90 miles out of her backyard? And discuss diplomacy from there? Those glasses aren't that thick. I'm astounded that McCain actually found someone to run with that is even more out of touch than he is. That is quite an accomplishment; the most populous county in Arizona has more people than the state of Alaska...how would she run a country and represent the majority of Americans, which would be her job?

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