THE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
So why are the polls even close then ?
Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
Let's teach him we are smarter than that
Stand up and hold them accountable
Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
Elect Obama Biden 2008
Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ
There Is a Silver Lining
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Posted By: cani77 @ 10/13/2008 6:11:53 PM
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Posted By: rabbgnarly @ 10/14/2008 11:56:23 PM
We aren't producing because we want things cheap, and it is cheaper to have things made overseas -- we also do not want to do many lowly dirty jobs anymore -- fyi, the "global economy" is not Mr. Zakaria's invention, but it does originate here in the USA, and we cannot just have things global when it goes well for us, then switch; as for socialism, it is amazing that a Republican administration is pushing it, passed the bailout, which is pretty socialist, and once again: we cannot go socialist when the going gets bad, but otherwise say we are capitalists!
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Posted By: lamama @ 10/14/2008 11:09:01 PM
American ha the capacity and the economical strength to overcome the crisis better as he did in the past. It is just a little funny to realize that some people seem to forget that "to whom much is given, much is required" and that the United States still can count on the world to help beat up the crisis
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Posted By: lamama @ 10/14/2008 11:05:52 PM
This is very enlightening article. In fact, i believe that people grow mature with living experiences and taking for granted that this nation has known period of economic crisis that have somehow turned the nation's off, and still, avoided the worst with economic strategies they worked out that time, Americans can do better and will pass over wisely this crisis.
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Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/12/2008 2:40:01 PM
It's amazing that the left cries "it's only about the economy, character and judgment issues don't matter!"
I don't agree. That said, consider that while George Bush and John McCain were introducing legislation years ago to avert the incredible financial crisis we're in, democrats Barney Frank and Chris Dodd were busy blocking it.... And Obama? He was "busy" writing his second memoir!
- John McCain, in a 2005 Address to Congress:
"I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.
I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation."
And Obama's economic package is based on 95 percent of Americans getting a tax cut. How is this possible when the Tax Foundation says 40 percent of Americans pay no tax?
If it's really about the economy, vote for McCain. He had the foresight and vision to try and stop the current mess we're in, and he has an understanding of who's taxes can actually be cut.
http://webutante07.blogspot.com/2008/09/john-mccain-saw-freddiefannie-crisis.html-
Posted By: getAgripUSA @ 10/12/2008 3:16:07 PM
You mention character and judgement issues.
McCain had other potential running mates to choose from who had the necessary fiscal and political experiance needed to run the most powerful country in the world, together with the necessary "I vote with my heart, not my head" conservative republican values.
Y
You are now saying the decision made by McCain to nominate Palin, a person he had met only once, who is unable to debate a subject in a political forum let alone display any knowledge on policy, world affairs or the economy, who may be a heartbeat away from the oval office was a display of someone with fine judgement?
Please.-
Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/12/2008 3:44:03 PM
Palin has never associated or was friends with a known, unrepentant and proud-of-it terrorist.
Obama, on the other hand, has.-
Posted By: getAgripUSA @ 10/12/2008 3:58:38 PM
And that makes her more qualified to lead the country how?
You are claiming that Obama will be a security threat?? Your own candidate has stated that Obama is a decent family man and there is no need to be afraid with Obama as president.
As for Obama sitting on a community service board with a rehabilitated criminal does not make him guilty by association. And I challenge you to bring any evidence Obama being close friends with Ayers, or sharing any of his values he may or may not still hold from 30yrs ago.-
Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/12/2008 7:09:33 PM
The poster didn't say Obama was a security threat. The post stated Obama displayed extremely poor judgment in associating and being friends with an unrepentant domestic terrorist. I would add to that the poor judgment he displayed in being mentored for 20 years by a racist maniac who thinks the KKK runs the government and that the government created aids to kill black people.
I'm going to depend on the president on a daily basis to make sound judgment calls, and these two instances are gigantic red flags as to his ability to do that!-
Posted By: easea @ 10/13/2008 3:15:41 AM
I'm supposed to take you seriously when McCain is buddy-buddy with G Gordon Liddy, a convicted Watergate co-conspirator who also plotted (but failed to execute) politically motivated kidnappings, and the assassination of a persistent journalist. I don't agree with Ayres, but Liddy is the type of violent thug who was operating at the highest levels of government to undermine the Constitution back in those days. McCain, who could hardly claim to be ignorant of Liddy's record, praised Liddy and his principles as recently as last year.
How can you look the other way about this and Palin's ties to the AIP (who, it surprised me to learn, has sought and received favors from Iran), and expect anyone to take your posturing about Obama's judgment seriously?-
Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/14/2008 8:00:45 PM
They are not buddy-buddy. Even if they were, Liddy never blew up the Pentagon, Police Stations and other facilities trying to kill people and destroy property. (which coward Bill Ayers proudly claims as something he's done, and should have done more!)
- William Ayers: "Guilty as sin, free as a bird, it's a great country!" ..... while standing on the American Flag.
Don't even think of comparing the two, but feel free to support someone who's friends with this pr!ck.
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Posted By: easea @ 10/13/2008 3:02:54 AM
I agree, character and judgment matter a great deal, which is why I'm so troubled by the direction John McCain has been going since the Democratic convention. Every week that passes and he seems more desperate and reckless. I'm disappointed, because, while I plan to vote for Obama, I felt like either man would provide dramatically better leadership than we've suffered under for the last 7+ years. Now though, McCain seems to be a man who has abandoned his honor and integrity in the service of winning at all costs. He and his running mate are dividing the country, and peddling fear in a last ditch hope that it will save their campaign. I've had enough division, I've had enough fear.
As for the rest of what you have to say, Fannie and Freddie are hardly the sole cause of this financial disaster. There are a huge number of sub-prime loans that they've had nothing to do with. Moreover, some of the biggest real estate defaults have been in high-end developments. And, of course, there is the deregulation that allowed financial institutions to build a huge house of cards with ridiculous levels of debt.
I don't know if McCain thinks the whole crisis is due to Fannie and Freddie, that's certainly how you present it. If he does, that it shows his understanding of economics and the financial system is deficient, and hardly a qualification for being president at this moment in our history.-
Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/14/2008 7:51:56 PM
Deregulation and other legislation that forced banks into making risky loans, followed by legislation to reign it in and blocked by democrats is certainly is one of the most defining problems we have.
Exactly how long do you think we could have gone on making 300K loans to people who couldn't pay them back before we got in trouble. The fact is, Bush and McC saw this coming and tried to avert it, and the fact is Frank and Dodd stopped it.
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Posted By: ThatOne @ 10/12/2008 4:18:10 PM
Palin is not at the top of the ticket, and for someone like yourself who chooses to only look at certain facts because you are blinded by racism. Palin sleeps with a domestic terrorist every night. Her husband was a member of a group that hates the good ole USA, and she, herself has spoken at their convention in the recent past.
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Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/12/2008 7:10:59 PM
And stop spinning your bullsh!t.... Todd Palin is not a domestic terrorist. Show me a credible instance of him being so.
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Posted By: ItsMyRight @ 10/12/2008 7:34:14 PM
until recently (at least 2002)he was a member of the American Independence Party - they are home grown terrorists/treasoners.. For your information not all terrorists use bombs, some use words. Not all terrorists are middle-eastern ie., Timothy McVey. We have multple white supremist cells all over this country making plans to rid this country of all non-whites. That's terrorism. Like American Indians don't
really own this land. How uninformed you right-wingers are. Have you ever gone beyond Fox News, or
your own opinion for actual facts? This time your aggression and lies aren't working and you don't know
how to deal with it. You too will lose YOUR jobs, YOUR investments, YOUR homes. Get yourself a tent and a soup bowl you are going to need them.-
Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/14/2008 7:44:47 PM
Do you have any legitimate, unbiased proof (other than opinion) that Todd Palin is a terrorist or even that he was a member of the AIP? No, you don't.
And get rid of all non whites? Are you kidding me? Are you the Reverend Wright? Do you think the KKK runs the government and that the same government created aids to kill the black people?
And you speak of my "aggression and lies?"
Wow, you need professional help.....
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Posted By: ItsMyRight @ 10/12/2008 7:21:03 PM
He's talking about tax payers, duh! I'm sure at least half of the "40 percent of Americans" who pay no tax are the wealthy with their loopholes and the other half are the poor and homeless.
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Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/12/2008 6:56:18 PM
He must have really hit a nerve with you... he makes a legitimate statement and you call him a racist. Where in this post was there anything that mentioned racism? When people like you run out of answers, calling our your racism card is your only weapon.
Pathetic.
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Posted By: Glenno @ 10/14/2008 7:28:25 PM
It is amazing that US is collapsing and still, not a single politician want to even question the feasability of keeping the empire! America cannot keep controlling the world, how about closing some of the 700 military bases around the world, people would also hate americans less then.
Why keep financing the aggressive military empire with foreign loans, delay it for another year or two and with even more people hating America and America even more broke?
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Posted By: olderwiser @ 10/14/2008 4:50:11 PM
Let me see if I've got this straight. All of the world's banks which lack money to lend are rescuing each other by giving each other enough money to lend so that we do not have to quit borrowing and spending. So, if I am a bank and have no money to lend, all I have to do is borrow from a bank in another country which also has no money to lend. The country with most of the United State's money, China, does not spend it, even though the U.S. government's policy is that spending a lot of money, whether you have any or not, leads to great prosperity. China saved and lives in prosperity. We spend and our prosperity leaks out in proportion to our spending.
But don't worry. Worldwide banks, all of whom are broke, will lend us what we need.-
Posted By: olderwiser @ 10/14/2008 5:01:58 PM
As in Dickens' "Through The Looking Glass", "a dollar means what I say it means".
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Posted By: olderwiser @ 10/14/2008 5:08:23 PM
It's Shrinkage that got us.
When we buy something worth ten dollars for fifteen dollars, and then borrow fifteen dollars to buy it, after which we have to pay twenty dollars back to the lender, then the money shrunk. Then, multiply that shrinkage by the hundreds of billions of such purchases and we see that money no longer exists because it all shrank away. Then, when we see that the item that we bought which was worth ten dollars has depreciated down to one dollar, we practically have nothing but a cheap trade-in. Brother, have you got a dime to spare?
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Posted By: VoiceFromWhoville @ 10/14/2008 4:37:55 PM
In the past few decades, Western civilization has collectively ignored the centuries-old warning to avoid the Seven Deadly Sins, among which are greed, gluttony. In that time our homes, our cars, and our bodies have all grown fat. Greed encourages gluttony. Consumers have been preyed upon, but we've allowed ourselves to fall prey to our own imprudence.
Not only have we spent more than we had, but we've spent it on the wrong things.
The US auto industry is in dire straits because it's been
pushing bigger cars with bigger profit margins at a time when efficiency would have reduced our national dependency on oil from countries with hostile regimes. We bought big because Detroit told us that's what we wanted, while all the while spending billions on advertising to try to convince us that was what we wanted. Meanwhile, as the government spent billions securing the supply of oil, Detroit crushed electric plug-ins and sat on plug-in battery technology.
It's time for consumers to exercise common sense and self-discipline, learn to reconcile individual wants and needs with those of the greater community, and to say no to appeals to our baser instincts. The ultimate reward in doing so is peace of mind.
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Posted By: desertclair @ 10/14/2008 1:45:59 PM
"If there is a lesson to be taken from this crisis, it's a simple and old rule of economics: there is no free lunch. If you want something, you have to pay for it."
Fantastic summary. I wish the Republican ideologues would open their eyes and admit that their economic ideas have been proven wrong by this recent financial collapse. It's time to move forward. This article has great insights into how best to do that.
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Posted By: ClementW @ 10/14/2008 1:14:47 PM
Fareed Zakaria is absolutely right. From most of the comments below, I doubt that anyone wants to hear him today.
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Posted By: Tazzman @ 10/14/2008 12:29:07 PM
Take all the free bonus given to CEO for free and use it to cover the lost of the regular people.Make them accountable for the havoc they brough you for selfishness.its ok for you to suffer from theur mistakes so why cant we not go after their so call free bonus for good work?
They arent better then the sheik or terrorist,they are even worst since all goverment allow this.In what name?Screw the public we have what we need to live on.
Well its time to turn thing around go get all the bonusses from them and put it in the diffecit.
And dont stop there why should any sport player make millions upon millions and still cry foul.
Why does as actor make $61,000,000.00 for 1 movie how stupid is this?
Capitalist?There you got it,keep those huge salairy up and it all adds up.
Every where you turn all you see is "I WANT MORE"What about the persons who cant make enough to get the basic of life.
These CEO and high level money greedy jerk should be the one stumbling from this.Go after their free taxex assets and pay off the dam lost and share it with the low incomes people.
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Posted By: alex777 @ 10/14/2008 11:57:20 AM
The heart of the issue is that smart financial people will always figure out a way to leverage profit. This occurred in the 1920's run up to the Great Crash and it now has occurred during the period of sustained rising home prices. We won't get past this crisis until we diagnose the new methods of leverage (including insurance policies on credit swaps) and institute reforms to limit leverage. For now, longer term investments in private companies look more attractive until the mess in the markets sorts itself out. Alex Alben, Seattle
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Posted By: Jim Johnson @ 10/12/2008 4:13:42 PM
Let's see now.
Obama does not wear a flag pin because it does not represent 'true patriotism.'
Obama does not hold his hand over his heart during the National anthem.
Obama's campaign remakes the Presidential seal using his logo and slogan in Latin.
Obama takes the American flag off of his campaign plane.
Obama puts the Obama logo and 'President' on his first class leather chair in his new campaign plane.
Now the DNC puts the American flag upside down on its convention tickets.
Coincidence? I think not. Anti-war protestors typically carry or display the American flag upside down
The rules on display of the American flag are very specific, 'Section 8, The flag should never be displayed with the union down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property.'
Why would any American want to vote for this man??? Is there anyone out there stupid enough to admit that they back Obama, and that they believe in having an anti-America and anti-white president??-
Posted By: tc125231 @ 10/12/2008 6:21:23 PM
Sonny, be proud. In America, we allow even liars and fools such as yourself to have their say.
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Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/14/2008 11:42:43 AM
Anyone who makes a point or disagrees with you is a liar and fool. Sheeesh....
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Posted By: rosieo7 @ 10/12/2008 4:46:19 PM
YES, ME - I'M VOTING FOR CHANGE BECAUSE I AM FED UP TO MY BACK TEETH WITH THE NUMSKULLS IN POWER TODAY AND I DO NOT WANT MORE OF THE SAME.
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Posted By: ICYEYES800 @ 10/12/2008 5:06:58 PM
Did you say you are fed up to your BLACK teeth????? That would explain the lame statement!!!!
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/12/2008 8:03:07 PM
This link of a CSPAN video clip may help set the context, as these hearings were at the time of McCains attempt at S.190.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs
"Video Unearthed Democrats in their own words Covering up the Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac Scam that caused our Economic Crisis"-
Posted By: rail60 @ 10/12/2008 8:26:21 PM
Wow, how could this happen? A couple of rogue democrats in congress brought the economic world to its knees. And, during a republican administration and republican controlled congress. Says a lot about republican leadership, doesn't it? What really surprises me, is that the republican controlled congress, during the Clinton years, spent $50 million investigating the $30 thousand white water deal, only to find that Bill got a hummer from Monica. For some reason, the strong and wise republican leadership couldn't uncover this whole economic conspiracy before it unraveled. I guess the republican leadership only concerns themselves with important issues, like who's getting hummers from interns.
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Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/12/2008 8:50:27 PM
Know your history... It wasn't just a couple of democrats, it was all of them. It takes 60 votes to get anything through the senate. Democrats Barney Frank and Chris Dodd voted party line to get the measures squashed. The pubs would have had to do the same, and with the number of moderate republicans, it was close, but it didn't happen. That's why Bush and McCain couldn't stop the train wreck.
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Posted By: rail60 @ 10/12/2008 9:09:59 PM
Thanks for the history lesson. The whole economic world was brought to its knees because of Fannie Mae and Feddie Mac and democrats wanting to give loans to poor people. I thought more institutions and people of all socio-economic positions were involved. Stupid me, I guess I should start listening to Rush and Fox News, so I can can understand "more better", like Dubya.
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Posted By: skeptical53 @ 10/12/2008 9:40:23 PM
Don't you ever check your facts? It was deregulation of the financial market that allowed those PRIVATE
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Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/14/2008 11:06:07 AM
You're really clueless here... regulations for lending applies to all institutions, private or otherwise.
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Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/12/2008 11:08:58 PM
The fact is rail, lending institutions could make only so many $400 K dollar loans to people that had bad credit, no down payment and no job verification before the system started to collapse. Say hello to Fannie/Freddie, who had 50 percent of the nations residential mortgages....
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Posted By: easea @ 10/13/2008 2:37:48 AM
You have an interesting (and self-serving) view of accountability.
In most states in the US, if a driver rear ends another driver, he's at fault because he was following too closely.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac certainly bear some blame for backing dubious mortgages, but they scarcely bare all of it. The private financial institutions that were actually originating those loans bare a great deal of the blame. The private financial institutions that were making sub-prime loans without backing from Fannie, Freddie, or the Fed bare a great deal of the blame. All the financial institutions who were, in effect, following too closely by building a massively leveraged house of cards by securitizing low quality mortgages are to blame. All the banks around the world who used those securities to leverage up are to blame. The regulators who allowed the house of cards to be built are to blame. The politicians who changed regulations to allow the house of cards to be built are to blame, particularly, I think, those who saw the underlying risks in key aspects of the system, and yet still rolled back regulations that would have kept firms from building elaborate debt pyramids on it.
More importantly though, the people defaulting on their mortgages are, for the most part, not the people who got their chance for home ownership due to the community reinvestment act. Its people who could get mortgages, but wanted more and took out all sorts of ridiculous mortgages. Its the people who financed their consumption by borrowing against the equity in their homes. Its the people who wanted to get rich quick by buying houses for no money down and flipping them. They make up the bulk of the market for sub-prime mortgages. The lower income people who got govt backed mortgages are a pretty small part of all of this, and they do a pretty good job of making their payments. That's more than can be said for a lot of these private banks, not just in the US, but around the world.
Harping on Fannie and Freddie, and trying to pin all the blame on Democrats and poor people? Well, that's just wrong. So what's your excuse? Are you just ignorant, or are you dishonest?-
Posted By: celticdreaming @ 10/13/2008 8:25:54 PM
easea: I don't see anyone here pointing the finger at 'poor people'. In fact...from what I can see...the general comments have been "people who couldn't afford it'. That pretty much includes ANYONE that tood advantage of the loose regulations for sub prime loans...no credit check...no credit history...no viable income...ect.... It doesn't have to just be poor people who took advantage of that legislation. Once a law or regulation is passed...it pretty much applies to everyone who can take advantage of it. And that is what the CRA regulations did, and the de-regulations of the financial institutions did. It opened it up WIDE. So low income people used it, speculators used it, developers used it, and middle class people used it. Now...that free access to money needs to be halted so NO ONE gets it unless they are fiscally ready for it. That means....good credit score...credit history...viable income..which welfare checks and unemployment checks are NOT...and a full examination of their finances. So yes...some 'poor people' may not qualify.....but neither will the developers and speculators or anyone else who can't substantiate their finances. Kinda like the way it is SUPPOSED to be. sheesh.
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Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/13/2008 8:03:59 AM
I didn't see any ignorance or dishonesty in that post. But yours reeks of it. All the politicians were fine with the way things were until the mule went in the ditch. However, the fact is Bush and McCain saw the coming disaster, and you can spin this any way you want, it was democrats Barney Frank and Chris Dodd that blocked legislation that Bush and McCain introduced that would have reigned in Fannie and Freddie.
And your line of "harping on Fannie and Freddie, and trying to pin all the blame on poor people?" The democrats? Yes, blame Dodd and Frank for voting party line and blocking the legislation. And the poor people? Your statement is laughable! Maybe the people who took out mortgages they couldn't possibly afford got that way by doing so! Of course, accountability and personal responsibility isn't part of your vocabulary....-
Posted By: rail60 @ 10/13/2008 1:06:33 PM
Thanks for pointing out how two democrats, in a republican controlled congress, were such influential leaders that they were able to convince a majority-yes both fellow democrats and some republicans-to vote with them. This puts into question republican leadership, doesn't it? What was it about Dubya's leadership and McCain's leadership that couldn't convince the majority of republicans to vote with them on such an important and critical bill? In the end we all have endure the consequences of our actions, whether we accept responsibility or not. So, don???t worry the middle class (2005-40% of all home purchases were for investment/second homes) and some of the poor, who in many cases were pursued by predatory lenders, will experience the consequences of their actions for years to come. Unfortunately, most of the greedy and amoral bankers/lenders will walk away untouched. You and nowforthetruth can continue to either believe (because you can???t see the forest for the one single tree) and/or mislead people into believing that one plus one equals eleven, but anyone who has studied the complexities of the current economic crisis can only laugh at your focus on one single event. I think we have all heard the ???right wing sheepherder??? cry ???liberal wolf??? one to many times.
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Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/13/2008 3:28:50 PM
It takes 60 votes to get anything through.... Frank and Dodd voted party line. With the small number of Republican moderates going with them, the measure would not have passed.
Spin it any way you want, but you cannot deny history.... Bush and McCain tried to push through legislation to stop this mess while Barney Frank and Chis Dodd stopped it.
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Posted By: skeptical53 @ 10/12/2008 9:45:33 PM
Don't you ever check your facts? It was private corporations that fradulently gave those loans to the poor people you talk about. From mortgage brokers to the banks to the investment firms. Since Reagan, Republicans have been against regulation. You can't totally trust the government or business -- human nature is what it is. The Constitution was founded on checks and balances.
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Posted By: Vypurr @ 10/13/2008 3:35:54 PM
You should check yours. Bill Clinton signed the bill that forced (yes forced) lending institutions into making risky loans. They paid heavy penalties if they didn't.
And the "poor people" you mentioned that took out those loans? They weren't forced to borrow more than they could pay back! Whatever happened to personal accountability and responsibility? Tell you what... go down to your local nice restaurant and order a steak you can't afford, eat it, then tell the waiter you can't pay for it.
See what happens next.
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Posted By: whs806 @ 10/14/2008 7:10:33 AM
America needs to change it's tax laws. Current tax laws reward debt but discourage savings.
Fix It! Implement the FAIR TAX PLAN! Reward savings, choose when you pay tax! Learn more at www.fairtax.org. Give yourself a raise! Eliminate the IRS.
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Posted By: Fayruz @ 10/14/2008 3:23:53 AM
The world takes a knock because America has been greedy - so what's new? America needs a reality check. Here in Africa, most people don't even have houses, cars, credit cards. Come and see how real people live...might be a wake-up call.
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Posted By: Tan Boon Tee @ 10/13/2008 11:59:02 PM
Haven???t I said this time after time for years? Now someone echoes my perception.
Spending far beyond one???s income is unpardonable, and relentless consumerism in the false belief that happiness can be bought by money is flabbergasting.
This is the most opportune time that a lesson must be learned, albeit it is a very bitter lesson.
(Tan Boon Tee)
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Posted By: humbop @ 10/12/2008 3:58:31 PM
It's NOT a good thing for the US to be "playing by its own rules," economically, diplomatically, militarily, or politically. That's the thinking that got us to where we are today. It's time to play by everybody else's, established rules, and try to take on a more mature, responsible, and long-term world and domestic outlook.
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Posted By: celticdreaming @ 10/13/2008 8:58:24 PM
uh....Nope. Sorry. I personally don't want to be told what to do by somebody else that lives in another country. I mean...that is WHY we had the Revolutionary War in the first place. Do we need to behave more maturely? Be fiscally responsible for our own actons? Yes. Do we need to pay more attention to our domestic outlook and STOP letting our governement give our jobs away overseas and by importing cheap labor? Yes. You may not believe it...but this IS America...and we play by American rules. Which is why so many all over the world have wanted to COME HERE. Why do you want to take away the thing that makes us who we are? I don't want a 'world' outlook. I don't want us to rule the world...or be so involved in it that whatever we do dramatically affects so many other nations. Either good or bad. How about we once start taking care of business HERE? And do it by our OWN American Rules.
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Posted By: benluclar @ 10/12/2008 5:40:32 PM
At some point some of you will reach the ACCOUNTABILITY presence.
Bush did not give you credit cards to abuse and overspend. Bush did not send these cards in your mail for you to squander on materialistic things y ou could not afford.
Bush did not send an SUV to your door and twist your arm to buy the gas-guzzling vehicle that replaced the one you could afford and afford to run.
Bush did not give you a loan for a house that you knew when you applied for credit you could not afford, but took the money from the institution who allowed you to jeopardize your financial situation for the next 30 years.
Bush did not drive you to Wal-Mart three times this week to buy a big screen tv that you do not have a wall big enough to put it on.
Bush did not invite you to go on a vacation with your buddies as well as with your family later on in the year and put on your credit card, which you now cannot keep up the minimum payment on.
Bush did not do any of these things.
YOU DID!
YOU DID!
BLAME WHO IS RESPONSIBLE!
And now you want to ''hire'' Obama because he propels the idea that he and the Democratic Party will TAKE CARE OF THY BROTHER!
WHOSE BROTHER? Obama's brother? The same brother who lives in Kenya under a squalored bush?
TAKE THE BLAME, AMERICANS!
Do not ask for any HANDOUTS from YOUR government which is trying to save your backside now!-
Posted By: rail60 @ 10/12/2008 7:50:57 PM
You have to remember that 51% (in 2004) of voting Americans elected a slightly retarded man to the most powerful position on earth, a man that says things like "more better" and "missunderestimate". Does it really surprise you that clever amoral predatory bankers/lenders, that would rape their own mothers for a dime, can lead these same people to the slaughter? This is why regulations were developed after the Great Depression, to protect the stupid people that vote for the Dubyas from the amoral greedy. Keep up the good work you're doing a "more better" job, just like Dubya and Browny, just don't "missunderestmate" the desire of the Kenny Boys of this world to screw you.
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Posted By: celticdreaming @ 10/13/2008 8:36:57 PM
Actually...what YOU have to remember...is that more than 50% of Americans voted for AL GORE in 2000, and we STILL got stuck with Bush. So there ya go. If we had pressed the POPULAR vote in 2000, we wouldn't of had to LIVE with Bush for the last 8 years.
The electorial college needs to GO AWAY, and the popular vote should hold sway. Representatives in the electorial college are SUPPOSED to vote with the greater majority of their state. What the people want is supposed to be the rule. Then again...in Massachusettes...John Kerry didn't care...he was going to vote the way HE thought he should. After all....we are just dumb Americans and they know best and what is for 'our own good'.
Neither party is my choice. Neither of these candidates meet my requirements. I think I'm just going to vote Ron Paul. -
Posted By: Pallisor @ 10/12/2008 9:05:52 PM
C'mon, rail60, with all due respect, this post is purely your opinion and therefore pure conjecture.
You're free to post it of course, but it's easily dismissed without credible sources.
And you gotta remember that Bush can't run for pres....-
Posted By: rail60 @ 10/12/2008 11:43:04 PM
C'mon, this was a sarcastic response to the pure conjecture and opinion of benuclar. My main message was that we need to be protected from unscrupulous business people. I think their are many in this world that hold the same opinion. So, my statement is more accurately an inter-subjective consensus, not an opinion. My use of Dubya was to demonstrate that sometimes people use poor judgment in making important decisions. Unlike benuclar, it is easier for me to forgive the people that overspent than the amoral wealthy people who are walking away with all the cash and the government that should have been watching them. C'mon, this isn't the first time we've been down this road, you don't remember Kenny Boy and his ENRON scams that robbed many common people of their life savings?
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Posted By: tc125231 @ 10/12/2008 6:17:56 PM
This post is imbecilic. I have no debt. My government, however, does. For example, just as a frame of reference, it is estimated that China holds $1.5 trillion in U.S. securities. Which means, for those of you who are arithmetically challenged, that it owes $5000 per perosn -every man woman and child --ti China.
And yes, it WAS President Bush who chose to slash taxes in 2001, meaning none of the Clinton surpluses were used to pay down debt. This position was maintained by the rocket scientists at the GOP despite declaring two wars and coming up witha massive give away to the pharmaceuticals packaged as a prescription drug benefit.
You copy, sonny?
And yes, that debt is affecting me --despite the fact that I have none and save roughly 20% of my income.
Republicans --one wishes, if they were going to lecture us about economics, that they would at LEAST learn to do arithmetic....-
Posted By: benluclar @ 10/12/2008 7:24:22 PM
Arithmetic is the zero balances that I have in my life and include everything.
Yes, I am a Republican.
Yes, I pay my own debts and health care and other insurances and buy my own gas with MONEY that I EARN. I do not ASK for my government to give me money so I can squander it unnecessarily.
And, no, I am not a ''sonny'', but a baby-bommer female who knows how to BUY what I can AFFORD and not ask for HANDOUTS.
I am glad you are saving 20% of your income.
Take 10% of it and tithe it to the CHURCH, too.
And in all these years, I have never heard the word ''ARITHMETICALLY", mathematically would be more appropriate..... sonny .....
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/13/2008 8:28:49 PM
Biggest one day increase in the Dow in market's history. However:
"The Dow's lone decliner was General Electric (GE, Fortune 500), which reported weak quarterly earnings late Friday. It was also among the 18 components of the S&P 500 that didn't join the rally.???"
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/13/markets/markets_newyork/?postversion=2008101318
Another reason might be that, having provided a soapbox for socialist through its NBC division, the market no longer trusts GE with investment capital, Buffet notwithstanding.
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/13/2008 8:24:18 PM
Biggest one day increase in the Dow in market's history. However:
"The Dow's lone decliner was General Electric (GE, Fortune 500), which reported weak quarterly earnings late Friday. It was also among the 18 components of the S&P 500 that didn't join the rally.???"
http://money.cnn.com/2008/10/13/markets/markets_newyork/?postversion=2008101318
Another reason might be that, having provided a soapbox for socialist through its NBC division, the market no longer trusts GE with investment capital, Buffet notwithstanding.
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