What’s God Got to Do With It?

Is Lisa Miller a Christian? Has she ever been to Lakewood?
Why does Newsweek employ this hack?

I have been there and the message is not what she purports. I am a member of a Methodist Church in HouHouston

Jealous much?

Let's remember the basics, all who read the article...no matter what the Osteen's say or do, the truth of Jesus Christ does not change!! Even when people misrepresent the truth, Jesus has not changed. He lived, died, and rose again because he loves us, and if we just admit that we need Him to save us from the judgement described in Scripture, believe that he did do what the Bible says, and confess and repent of our sin that would lead to judgement, then he will accept us right where we are, and thankfully refuses to leave us that way...no matter what any minister says or how any one may act, Jesus Christ is the unchanging truth. (John 14:6, Rom. 10:9)

There are some things that need to be understood. First of all, mega churches in and of themselves are not bad. The church in Acts grew from 120 to over 3,000 in one day. The problem comes when the Pastor of any sized church leaves the truth of God's Word. In the Osteen case, Joel stated on Larry King Live that it is not about sin, but about making people feel good. So then we have a departure from the Word of God which states, "All have sinned . . ." (Romans 3:23)

Lisa Miller hits a nerve in her observations of the Osteens and other prosperity preachers like them. She is RIGHT ON when she titles it, "What's God Got to Do With It?". I always wonder about the parishoners of these mega churches. What are they looking for and why do they go to these types of churches?
Based on their own beliefs, these preachers KNOW they will be accountable directly to GOD for every word that has come from their mouths and pens. They are even MORE accountable as they have put themselves in leadership positions over a flock (a rather large flock).
I liken these types of pastors as generators of "BIBLE LIGHT". They especially tend to use more recent versions of the Bible other than the original King James. (I liken this to the dumbing down of Americans.)
This type of "religion" seems to cater to young, white, middle class and higher Americans that want their 30 minutes of sermonizing to leave them feeling good about themselves so they can go about the rest of their week doing whatever they like.
As for the last sentence... about Joel having read his Bible every day since he was a small boy.... well, good for Joel. But simply reading the Bible doesn't cut it. LIVING it out everyday is the hard part.

The last known address of Jesus was the garden of Gethsemane, an olive grove. But I don't think taking up residence there would make anyone a spiritual giant. Jesus was pleased at receiving the extravagant gift from the alabaster jar and he was disappointed that the rich young ruler wouldn't sell everyting and follow him. He told us each how to become a spiritual giant, "Therefore, whoever humbles himself like this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven" (Matthew, 18th chapter, verse 4) Simple instructions, tough to do.

I wonder what Joel and Victoria would do if Jesus required of them, as He did of the rich young ruler in Matthew 19:16-22, to give up all they have to follow Him.

I don't mind the Osteens (their life, their belief, they don't seem like bad people) but what gets me is when some Christians act as if they're 'better than you' and look down their noses at you. And then they act like jerks and assume that if they ask for forgiveness, they're 'clean'.
All this talk of asking for God's forgiveness when we should be asking the people we wronged. That's much harder! I don't think forgiveness should be handed out like halloween candy, either. It must be earned, one must be truly sorry for what they did. I certainly would not be quick to forgive someone who will then turn around and use me as a doormat again. Of course God knows if you're sorry--but does the person you wronged know?

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if a person ask for God's forgiveness of his sins and accepted the Lord Jesus as His only Master
and Savior, in response, God will place the Holy Spirit in him. The Holy Spirit is the essence
of having an abundant life (as taught in the Bible). When you have the abundant life, that mean
you are completely living under the control of the Holy Spirit. Abundant life NEVER equals to
material prosperity, but Godly living.

The Holy Spirit (God himself living inside us) does the following in our lives:

1. assures us of our Salvation
2. Enable us to completely understand His words in the Bible. He also makes us discern false teachings,
no matter how nicely packaged it is.
3. Enables us to pray to Him always
4. Enables us to obey His Holy commands. Read Ezekiel 36:25-27.

(If you are truely saved, you do good things because you ARE ALREADY SAVED (by faith in the Lord).
If you are a true Christian, your main motivation in serving God is not to get to heaven, but
because we are already saved. Good works are just our expression of love to God because He saved
us first, and not because we are still trying to get to heaven by our own human effort. Good works
alone cannot saved us.)


5. Sanctify us by slowly and surely removing unholy things in our lives like faulthy character,
impatience
6. Guide and counsels us on many things in our lives. He is the one who makes decision for
our lives
7. The Holy Spirit also makes us humble, acknowledging that God is our everthing. He makes us see that
it is never about us, but all about Him, so we stop aiming earthly desires and goals which falsely
satisfies the proud, sinful man. He makes us understand what the phrase "YOUR WILL BE DONE" means
8. etc, etc..

The Holy Spirit gives us power (Acts 1:8), power to obey the Lord and surrender completely to Him. This is
what abundant life is all about.

I respect the belief of Joel and Victoria. That's their belief.
But something is implied in their teachings. That if you believe in Jesus you'll be prosperous (rephrased). Does this mean that the act of goodness exhibited by those Honest Philantrophic Athiests deserves no meret beacause their wealth does not come from Jesus? I'm a Christian (I've been reiterating this), but as I said, I stick to the teachings of The Good Samaritan (Luke 10:25-37). When Christ given us the second Greatest Commandment of Love, "Love your neighbor as you love yourself" He gave us The Good Samaritan as concret example. This Good Samaritan reffered to by Jesus Christ was definitely not a Christian when he helped the dying man lying on the street. And when the Good Samaritan said to the innkeeper, "take care of him (the wounded man) and when I come back this way, I will pay you whatever else you spend on him (Luke 10:43)", this only indicates that Jesus Christ approves the affluence of those honest people even though they are living outside the FAITH. Abundance here (in the Christian context) is wrongly apllied. I don't understand why almost all of the preachers in the Christian faith seldom touch the topic about the Good Samaritan. They are very selective in their teachings about the Word Of God. Their teachings define who they are not who God really is.

Joel Osteen's teachings emphasize on success, positive thinking, and material gains.
Since when did positive thinking brings God's favor into your life? If you want God's
favor (i.e. spared from hell), the message of the Jesus has been very clear:

1. We are complete, hopeless sinners and must admit it and ask for God's forgiveness
with a contrite heart. An individual must completely acknowledge his spiritual bankruptcy
(read the Parable of the Pharisee and the TaX Collector, Luke 18), this is the first step
to spiritual freedom (and positive thinking brings you nothing)


2. Since we are sinners, we cant save ourselves from God's coming judgement. Which
means that we trust on a Person who can save us and that is what the Lord Jesus Christ
is to us, our one and only Savior. The Lord Jesus offered HIs life on Calvary, as a
sacrifice (i.e. substitute). This is the only way to salvation, that a
special Person (Jesus) will sacrifice himself, He accepted the punishment that was originally
meant for you and me (have you watched the movie "Passion of the Christ"?), so that you
and I are now spared and saved from hell. Now, if we acknowledge that Jesus is our only
savior by faith, we are saved.


God's message above has been very plain to all of us. Unfortunately, False Positive teachings
like from Joel's blocks the true and only Gospel from enlighting our lives. If we want the abundant
life (not to be falsely understood as financial abundance), we need the Lord in our life, plain
and simple.

I believe that many "christians" who bought in into Joel Osteens message, are the ones who are rather
disappointed with the Lord Jesus lack of teachings on how to gain materially, techniques for a more
comfortable lifestyle, achieving personal success, and other topics found on self-help books

To the detractors: Religion indeed begins (for many) by appreciating what God has given us -- and appreciating that it is from God. It's at the very least a first step -- loving God for the gifts he's given us. Is there more to relgiion than that? Sure. But why not start with what we can all feel and understand?

Correction: To Smitty: The wealth that the patriarchs Abraham, et al. enjoyed were indeed by the promise of God and His people and conditional upon their fulfilling those rules of life which would honor God. (however fitfully the laws were obeyed). Nevertheless, those were promises made for and to the nation Israel as a theocracy. The USA - and Israel today - is not a theocracy but a democracy (allegedly). Else, Jesus and the apostles died without having enjoyed the fruits of their labors (See Hebrews 11).

To Smitty: The wealth that the patriarchs Abraham, et al. enjoyed were indeed by the promise of God and His
fulfilling them, however fitfully the laws were obeyed. Nevertheless, those were promises made for and to the nation Israel as a theocracy., but a democracy (allegedly). Else, Jesus and the apostles died without having enjoyed the fruits of their labors (See Hebrews 11).

Thus spake the devil unto me, once on a time: "Even God hath his
hell: it is his love for man."
And lately, did I hear him say these words: "God is dead: of his
pity for man hath God died."-


My friends, what think ye? Will ye not, like me, say unto death:
'Was that- life?

First, God is not against prosperity. Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were wealthy. God promised wealth and prosperity to those who kept his commandments. This was a mark of God's favor. However, it was not to stop there. Those who were wealthy were responsible to the less fortunate. The wealthy were not to horde or oppress the widows,orphans and the alien/minorities. It is not wealth that is the problem. It is what you are doing with it. I have issues with religious leaders of large churches.
With a church the size of Osteen's there should be no one in his city that are homeless, undereducated or have lack. Everyone in his city should want to become christians because of his good deeds that point people to Christ.