Unsecured debt should not be legal. It is the true cancer within our financial system and not one elected official has the strength to talk to the American people about how their immaturity and gluttony is crippling our childrens' future. It is the greatest problem our families face, yet very little attention has been focused on it for fear of estranging a constituency.
PERSONAL FINANCE
Bah, Humbug!
A Christmas without credit cards? What lower limits mean this holiday shopping season.
Published Oct 15, 2008
Member Comments
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Posted By: crwcpa @ 10/25/2008 3:22:01 PM
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/24/2008 2:08:11 PM
Spread the wealth how? Look at his past. Obama in this video, addressing his work with ACORN litigation against the banks and relating to the Community Reinvestment Act and the failure of Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae, as they relate to the current real estate and financial crisis, states that, and I quote:
"Subprime lending started out as a good idea, helping Americans buy homes who previously could not afford to. Financial institutions created new financial instruments that could securitize these loans, slice them into finer and finer risk categories, and spread them out among investors and around the country, as well as around the world. In theory, this should have allowed mortgage lending to be less risky, and more diversified."
"The original idea was a good one, which was, lets see if we can distribute risk more broadly, and make it easier to provide loans to people who otherwise might not be able to get one."
Listen for yourself. You cannot dispute the mans on words recorded live:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr1M1T2Y314&feature=related
Obama in this second video is campaigning at a convention of Acorn and I believe two other Community Activist's organizations. Ask if he will be their ally if he becomes President, Obama says, quote:
"Yes, but let me say that before I even get inaugurated, during the transition we are going to be calling all of you in to help us shape the agenda."
See and hear it for yourself. Obama promised that Acorn and other groups like it will setting his agenda if elected:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vJcVgJhNaU
Below is a link to C-SPAN video clips of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCains attempt at S.190. to fix Fannie and Freddie. See for yourself who said what.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs
See also
http://www.newsweek.com/id/164732 from this web site. (oops!) stating that Freddie Mac was spending tax payer money to target Republicans in 2005 who were trying to regulate Fannie and Freddies fraud. Democrats were not targeted, as the were all in the tank with Fannie and Freddie to kill the regulations. Hear that, the article admits that Republicans were trying to regulate Freddie and Fannie, and Democrats were trying to stop it from happening as a means to facilitate the Community Reinvestment Act.
See also: http://www.newsweek.com/id/164972
Stating that Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act wasn't what caused the meltdown, and noting that "economists on both sides of the political spectrum have suggested that the act has probably made the crisis less severe than it might otherwise have been." -
Posted By: James Little @ 10/23/2008 12:27:07 AM
Some of us are solvent, pay plastic in full every month and wear out our cars, clothes and mowers. And of course have houses paid in full before we retire.
The sirens do not attract us to the shoals and rocks of debt from overused credit.
With luck all this will change when November 4 votes are tallied and others see the light.
duke -
Posted By: fdchiu @ 10/22/2008 10:07:35 PM
I don't know why Newsweek has such article when the whole world is worried about US depression? Are we, American, too worried about China getting better? From the negative article of Newsweek about China, I think so. You tell me!
Now I can only offered to by from a web site that sells electronics made in China: www.yeedong.com.
Guess what, it's too expensive to buy from Best Buy or other US outlets.
No, more to say. Just feel sad.... -
Posted By: VOTENOW @ 10/22/2008 4:26:41 PM
People on these blogs are fond of saying that the current economic meltdown was caused by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac underwriting bad mortgages. While Fannie and Freddie obviously are guilty of writing bad mortgages, and worse, guilty of lobbying Congress to allow them to do so with impunity, their actions are just a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to determining who (or what) caused the financial crisis we face today.
In 1929 the stock market crash caused the banks to fail, because the banks were in bed with the stock market. Back then, banks owned investment houses, so when the stock market fell, the banks fell too. This triggered the Great Depression. So in 1933 the Congress wrote laws that regulated banking, making it illegal for banks to own investment companies, mortgage guaranty companies or insurance companies. The idea was to keep key industries separated by a fire wall, so that if one industry failed the whole economy would not go down in flames.
But the Republicans under Bush deregulated the banking industry. Senator Phil Gramm wrote legislation (the Gramm Rudman Act, the Gramm Leach Biley Act, etc.) that stripped away the regulations in the financial and insurance industies. He pushed them through the Republican Congress and they were signed into law by Geo. W. Bush. John McCain voted in favor. Everybody said how great it is to deregulate and create free markets.
Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch each gave over a million dollars to Senator Gramm's re-election campaign.
The economic collapse that happened later was a direct result of the deregulation, and here's how: the banks wrote bad mortgages, then bundled the mortgages into investment vehicles that they sold all over the world, and they even got firms like AIG to insure the investments. It was all a house of cards.
If there had been no deregulation, sure we would have had a bunch of bad mortgages, and the mortgage guaranty and real estate industries would have suffered, but there would not have been a global financial meltdown, since the problem would have been contained in one sector of the economy. You can thank Geo W. Bush, Sen. Phil Gramm and Sen John McCain for the meltdown, since they were strong proponents of deregulation.
Furthermore, although Fannie and Freddie are now holding the bulk of these bad mortgages, Fannie and Freddie did not originally write most of these mortgages. They bought them after the fact, bundled by banks/investment companies. Fannie and Freddie got screwed by the Wall Street fat cats. And so did you, if you pay taxes.
What is Phil Gramm doing today? He works as a lobbyist in Washington, trying to make it legal for the Swiss bank he represents to sell Death Bonds in the United States. Nice guy, Phil Gramm. Incidentally, John McCain has said that he wants to appoint Phil Gramm as Treasury Secretary. Some people just can't learn from their mistakes.-
Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/24/2008 2:09:04 PM
See also: http://www.newsweek.com/id/164972
Stating that Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act wasn't what caused the meltdown, and noting that "economists on both sides of the political spectrum have suggested that the act has probably made the crisis less severe than it might otherwise have been."
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Posted By: VOTENOW @ 10/22/2008 4:26:31 PM
People on these blogs are fond of saying that the current economic meltdown was caused by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac underwriting bad mortgages. While Fannie and Freddie obviously are guilty of writing bad mortgages, and worse, guilty of lobbying Congress to allow them to do so with impunity, their actions are just a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to determining who (or what) caused the financial crisis we face today.
In 1929 the stock market crash caused the banks to fail, because the banks were in bed with the stock market. Back then, banks owned investment houses, so when the stock market fell, the banks fell too. This triggered the Great Depression. So in 1933 the Congress wrote laws that regulated banking, making it illegal for banks to own investment companies, mortgage guaranty companies or insurance companies. The idea was to keep key industries separated by a fire wall, so that if one industry failed the whole economy would not go down in flames.
But the Republicans under Bush deregulated the banking industry. Senator Phil Gramm wrote legislation (the Gramm Rudman Act, the Gramm Leach Biley Act, etc.) that stripped away the regulations in the financial and insurance industies. He pushed them through the Republican Congress and they were signed into law by Geo. W. Bush. John McCain voted in favor. Everybody said how great it is to deregulate and create free markets.
Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch each gave over a million dollars to Senator Gramm's re-election campaign.
The economic collapse that happened later was a direct result of the deregulation, and here's how: the banks wrote bad mortgages, then bundled the mortgages into investment vehicles that they sold all over the world, and they even got firms like AIG to insure the investments. It was all a house of cards.
If there had been no deregulation, sure we would have had a bunch of bad mortgages, and the mortgage guaranty and real estate industries would have suffered, but there would not have been a global financial meltdown, since the problem would have been contained in one sector of the economy. You can thank Geo W. Bush, Sen. Phil Gramm and Sen John McCain for the meltdown, since they were strong proponents of deregulation.
Furthermore, although Fannie and Freddie are now holding the bulk of these bad mortgages, Fannie and Freddie did not originally write most of these mortgages. They bought them after the fact, bundled by banks/investment companies. Fannie and Freddie got screwed by the Wall Street fat cats. And so did you, if you pay taxes.
What is Phil Gramm doing today? He works as a lobbyist in Washington, trying to make it legal for the Swiss bank he represents to sell Death Bonds in the United States. Nice guy, Phil Gramm. Incidentally, John McCain has said that he wants to appoint Phil Gramm as Treasury Secretary. Some people just can't learn from their mistakes. -
Posted By: fdchiu @ 10/22/2008 1:40:53 PM
I don't know why Newsweek has such article when the whole world is worried about US depression? Are we, American, too worried about China getting better? From the negative article of Newsweek about China, I think so. You tell me!
Now I can only offered to by from a web site that sells electronics made in China: www.yeedong.com.
Guess what, it's too expensive to buy from Best Buy or other US outlets.
No, more to say. Just feel sad.... -
Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/21/2008 6:42:45 PM
Comment: THE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
So why are the polls even close then ?
Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
Let's teach him we are smarter than that
Stand up and hold them accountable
Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
Elect Obama Biden 2008
Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ -
Posted By: Nins @ 10/21/2008 1:35:38 PM
People on these bogs are fond of saying that the current economic meltdown was caused by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac underwriting bad mortgages. While Fannie and Freddie obviously are guilty of writing bad mortgages, and worse, guilty of lobbying Congress to allow them to do so with impunity, their actions are just a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to determining who (or what) caused the financial crisis we face today.
In 1929 the stock market crash caused the banks to fail, because the banks were in bed with the stock market. Back then, banks owned investment houses, so when the stock market fell, the banks fell too. This triggered the Great Depression. So in 1933 the Congress wrote laws that regulated banking, making it illegal for banks to own investment companies, mortgage guaranty companies or insurance companies. The idea was to keep key industries separated by a fire wall, so that if one industry failed the whole economy would not go down in flames.
But the Republicans under Bush deregulated the banking industry. Senator Phil Gramm wrote legislation (the Gramm Rudman Act, the Gramm Leach Biley Act, etc.) that stripped away the regulations in the financial and insurance industies. He pushed them through the Republican Congress and they were signed into law by Geo. W. Bush. John McCain voted in favor. Everybody said how great it is to deregulate and create free markets.
Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch each gave over a million dollars to Senator Gramm's re-election campaign.
The economic collapse that happened later was a direct result of the deregulation, and here's how: the banks wrote bad mortgages, then bundled the mortgages into investment vehicles that they sold all over the world, and they even got firms like AIG to insure the investments. It was all a house of cards.
If there had been no deregulation, sure we would have had a bunch of bad mortgages, and the mortgage guaranty and real estate industries would have suffered, but there would not have been a global financial meltdown, since the problem would have been contained in one sector of the economy. You can thank Geo W. Bush, Sen. Phil Gramm and Sen John McCain for the meltdown, since they were strong proponents of deregulation.
Furthermore, although Fannie and Freddie are now holding the bulk of these bad mortgages, Fannie and Freddie did not originally write most of these mortgages. They bought them after the fact, bundled by banks/investment companies. Fannie and Freddie got screwed by the Wall Street fat cats. And so did you, if you pay taxes.
What is Phil Gramm doing today? He works as a lobbyist in Washington, trying to make it legal for the Swiss bank he represents to sell Death Bonds in the United States. Nice guy, Phil Gramm. Incidentally, John McCain has said that he wants to appoint Phil Gramm as Treasury Secretary. Some people just can't learn from their mistakes. -
Posted By: Nins @ 10/21/2008 1:24:03 PM
After 9/11, the US government started rounding up Muslims without cause and without due process of law, like we did to the Japanese Americans in WWII. The Bush administration called it's main internment camp Guantanamo Bay. While there are certainly many guilty terrorists held in Guantanamo, there are also many innocent American citizens who have been held illegally for years without even being charged with any crime. They have been tortured by our government. Some of them have died.
Recently the Supreme Court ruled against the Bush administration in the matter of Guantanamo Bay. The Supreme Court Justices were NOT on the side of the terrorists. They were on the side of the Geneva Convention, that says you can not torture POWs, and on the side of US laws that state you can not imprison a person without charging them with a crime and bringing them to trial. I'm sure that like most Americans, the Justices who voted against the illegal, immoral doings at Guantanamo didn't feel sympathy for the terrorists. They felt sympathy for the laws of AMERICA, the land of the FREE, where even rat finks get a fair trial.
Meanwhile, back in Iraq, the Bush administration is busy trying to build a smokescreen to hide the CRIMES they have committed. Those pesky weapons of mass destruction. Just think, the National Debt went up over 6 trillion dollars under Bush. More than 2 TRILLION of it went directly into the pockets of Halliburton, a corporation owned by the Cheney family. Halliburton is now a DUBAI corporation and therefore is not subject to US taxes. All that money they took out of the US Treasury is going into the coffers of a MUSLIM country.
Did you hear about how the US government is being charged millions for Halliburton deliveries of sand into Iraq from Kuwait? Sand. Like there is a shortage of sand in Iraq? Another contractor shipped sand from Idaho to Iraq at our expense. Nobel prize winning economist Joseph Stiglitz discusses these and other excesses of our current government's out of control spending in Iraq.
Your grandchildren will be working like slaves to pay off this debt, so that the Bushes and Cheneys can live the high life in Dubai.
Yeah, they're patriots, Bush&Co. They wear flag pins. And hide the money they stole from America in Dubai.
And they want me to believe that Obama is a socialist. Right.
In case you think McCain is any different than Bush, watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdJUCU1UH2w-
Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/21/2008 6:14:20 PM
you are awesome and totally correct thanks for telling the truth
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Posted By: VOTENOW @ 10/20/2008 6:21:25 PM
THE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
So why are the polls even close then ?
Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
Let's teach him we are smarter than that
Stand up and hold them accountable
Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
Elect Obama Biden 2008
Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ -
Posted By: VOTENOW @ 10/20/2008 6:21:16 PM
THE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
So why are the polls even close then ?
Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
Let's teach him we are smarter than that
Stand up and hold them accountable
Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
Elect Obama Biden 2008
Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ -
Posted By: VOTENOW @ 10/20/2008 6:21:06 PM
THE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
So why are the polls even close then ?
Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
Let's teach him we are smarter than that
Stand up and hold them accountable
Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
Elect Obama Biden 2008
Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ -
Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/20/2008 6:19:12 PM
Who "Joe the plumber" may be is not the issue, though it's easy to see why the Dems want it to be. That's because the real issue is what Obama's comments to him revealed about Obama. In the exchange with "Joe the plumber" we find out that Obama really is as radical as his early political acquaintances, Davis, Ayers, Wright, etc., and that he is into the failed economic policy of wealth redistribution. Obama's tax and spending plans alone would be bad enough, but add Reid and Pelosi to the mix, with the three of them controlling both houses of Congress and the executive branch without any effective restraint, and you have something that should causes concern even among moderate Democrats.
See Wall Street Journal: A Liberal Supermajority:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122420205889842989.html
And whether McCain won or lost the third debate is also not relevant. He succeeded in the first half hour to plant the seeds of a Reagan style wipeout. Reputable historians and economists overwhelmingly agree that the taxation imposed by Hoover and FDR, and the "stimulus" spending and public works programs of FDR, actually deepened and prolonged the Great Depression. It was the production demands of WWII that got the economy going again. And when the war was over, the economy promptly went into recession.
See e.g. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/10/03/opinion/main4499465.shtml
And
http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/FDR-s-Policies-Prolonged-Depression-5409.aspx
Point is, Obama's programs are to tax, and it does not really matter who he taxes, those taxes are going to be passed through the economy. He has to tax, because it is they only way he can pay for his massive social engineering experiments. Any first year economics student knows that taxation is a tool used to contract an economy experiencing inflation, because it reduces demand by reducing the amount of money individuals and businesses have to spend. It is contractionary, which is exactly what you do not want to do when the problem is that the economy is contracting already into recession. Like Hoover and FDR, Obama's plans will only make it worse for longer.-
Posted By: EliFree @ 10/20/2008 9:35:00 PM
So, your answer to fix the economy is another world war?
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/20/2008 6:19:01 PM
Look and listen for yourself. Hear Obama in his own words discusses his links to both ACORN and the mortgage meltdown, and praises bundling and securitizing mortgages by banks as a means to float loans to the poor. Never mind the link commentators point of view, just listen to what Obama says in his own words. A picture is worth a thousand words. Maybe more in the case of the last half of the second link.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8vJcVgJhNaU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr1M1T2Y314&feature=related
See also:
http://boards.msn.com/MSNBCboards/thread.aspx?threadid=808692&boardsparam=Page%3d2
This is a link to C-SPAN video clips of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCains attempt at S.190. to fix Fannie and Freddie. See for yourself who said what.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs
The link below contains a purported list of the top 25 in Congress who got contributions from the folks at Fannie and Freddie. Obama is listed third, after Dodd and Kerry, even though Obama is just a junior Senator. Obama is followed next by Clinton. Barney Frank and Nancy Pelosi are on the list as well.
http://www.investors.com/editorial/IBDArticles.asp?artsec=16&artnum=1&issue=20080918
And the link below describes how some Democrats in Congress tried to use the original version of the bailout bill to divert money eventually recovered to groups like ACORN, a group Obama has a long association with. See:
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122247015469280723.html?mod=googlenews_wsj -
Posted By: haynessemperfi @ 10/18/2008 2:27:37 AM
PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE TO BE HELD SUNDAY AT COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY
The Free and Equal Elections Coalition (FREE) and the Columbia Political Union are pleased to announce that a Presidential debate will be held this coming Sunday, October 19th, 2008, on the campus of Columbia University.
ALL SIX of the Presidential candidates who appear on enough state ballots to acquire the 270 Electoral Votes needed to become President are invited. They are as follows (listed in alphabetical order by affiliation):
Constitution Party Candidate: Chuck Baldwin
Democratic Party Candidate: Barack Obama
Green Party Candidate: Cynthia McKinney
Independent Candidate: Ralph Nader
Libertarian Party Candidate: Bob Barr
Republican Party Can John McCain
The Columbia Political Union will present the debate from 8:00pm to 10:00pm in the Altschul Auditorium, located at 417 International Affairs Building. The debate will be moderated by Pacifica Radio's Amy Goodman, the host of "Democracy Now!". CSPAN will cover the debate, and live radio broadcasts are expected.
"The Columbia Political Union is committed to energizing political discourse on Columbia's campus," said Allon Brann, Columbia Political Union Publisher. "As a non-partisan organization, we work to provide students with opportunities to encounter and engage with political ideas across a wide ideological spectrum, and on a wide range of issues."
"It is with these goals in mind that we have organized this Presidential Debate: to give all candidates-- either within or outside of the political "mainstream"-- the opportunity to speak directly to students about their goals on the issues they deem critical for this country."
"We have invited all eligible candidates, and it is our sincere hope that all will participate, to ensure the substance and rigor of the dialogue which we believe is crucial at this time."
Certified letters officially inviting each candidate have been sent to the respective campaigns.
The Free and Equal Elections Coalition and the Columbia Political Union await the response from the candidates. All candidates' supporters are encouraged to contact the Presidential campaigns and urge them to attend.
The Columbia Political Union seeks to enhance involvement in the political process, domestic and international, and draw every member of the campus community into an ongoing discussion of political ideas.
FREE is a coalition of political parties, independent citizens and civic organizations formed to promote free and equal elections in the United States.
http://www.freeandequal.org/events.php?id=7
FREEDOM ISN'T FREE -
Posted By: jujujoe @ 10/17/2008 6:44:08 AM
The end of this article makes it seem that if you have credit available, then that is how much money you have to spend: "double-check your limit.." How grossly irresponsible. People shouldn't be maxing out their credit cards. People shouldn't be thinking their credit limits are limits to how much money they have to spend. This makes the article sound that consumers not spending on credit and spending what they can afford is a bad thing, because it will hurt retailers. Come on Newsweek Editors.
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Posted By: jujujoe @ 10/17/2008 6:43:26 AM
The end of this article makes it seem that if you have credit available, then that is how much money you have to spend: "double-check your limit.." How grossly irresponsible. People shouldn't be maxing out their credit cards. People shouldn't be thinking their credit limits are limits to how much money they have to spend. This makes the article sound that consumers not spending on credit and spending what they can afford is a bad thing, because it will hurt retailers. Come on Newsweek Editors.
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Posted By: jujujoe @ 10/17/2008 6:37:24 AM
This is a grossly irresponsible article. If you are already nearing your Mastercard limit, you shouldn't be filling out a new credit application in the first place. Moreover, if you are embarrassed because you are denied credit and you know you have maxed out your other credit cards as in this scenario, then good. You should be. This articles makes it seem that the consumer should be allowed more credit debt regardless of whether the person has maxed credit cards. People with good credit, who haven't maxed out are going to get credit. Newsweek ought to start focusing on ways people can clean up their financial mess, live below their means, save, and get knowledgeable about personal finance, and stop glamorizing debt and stop all the woe is me articles like this one.
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/17/2008 1:41:50 AM
Whether McCain won or lost is not relevant. He succeeded in the first half hour to plant the seeds of a Reagan style wipeout. Reputable historians and economists overwhelmingly agree that the taxation imposed by and the "stimulus" spending and public works programs of FDR actually deepened and prolonged the Great Depression. See e.g. http://newsroom.ucla.edu/portal/ucla/FDR-s-Policies-Prolonged-Depression-5409.aspx. It was the production demands of WWII that got the economy going again. And when the war was over, the economy promptly went into recession.
Point is, Obama's programs are tax and spend, and it does not really matter who he taxes, those taxes are going to be passed through the economy. Any first year economics student knows that taxation is a tool used to contract an economy experiencing inflation, because it reduces demand by reducing the amount of money individuals and businesses have to spend. It is contractionary, which is exactly what you do not want to do when the problem is that the economy is contracting already into recession. Like FDR, Obama's plans will only make it worse for longer.
Similarly, who "Joe the plumber" is is not the issue. The issue is what Obama's comments to him revealed. In the exchange with "Joe the plumber" we find out that Obama really is as radical as his early political acquaintances, and that he is into the failed economic policy of wealth redistribution. Obama's tax and spending plans alone would be bad enough, but add Reid and Pelosi to the mix, with the three of them controlling both houses of Congress and the executive without and effective restraint, and you have something that should be something that causes concern even among moderate Democrats. Don't think so? Watch and listen to a C-SPAN video clip of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCain's attempt at S.190. to fix fannie and freddie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs -
Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/16/2008 8:36:07 PM
Baby I'll be there to take your hand,
Baby I'll be there to share the land
That they'll be giving away, when we all live together.
So, in the exchange with "Joe the plumber" we find out that Obama really is as radical as his early political acquaintances, and is into the failed economic policy of wealth redistribution. Yahoo, back to the 70's we go! So now we know that an Obama presidency really would be as if it were Carter's lost second term after all. -
Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/16/2008 1:43:11 PM
Whether McCain won or lost is not relevant. He succeeded in the first half hour to plant the seeds of a Reagan style wipeout. Reputable historians and economists overwhelmingly agree that the taxation imposed by and the "stimulus" spending and public works programs of FDR actually deepened and prolonged the Great Depression. It was the production demands of WWII that got the economy going again. And when the war was over, the economy promptly went into recession.
Point is, Obama's programs are tax and spend, and it does not really matter who he taxes, those taxes are going to be passed through the economy. Any first year economics student knows that taxation is a tool used to contract an economy experiencing inflation, because it reduces demand by reducing the amount of money individuals and businesses have to spend. It is contractionary, which is exactly what you do not want to do when the problem is that the economy is contracting already into recession. Like FDR, Obama's plans will only make it worse for longer.
Obama's tax and spending plans alone would be bad enough, but add Reid and Pelosi to the mix, with the three of them controlling both houses of Congress and the executive without and effective restraint, and you have something that should be something that causes concern even among moderate Democrats. Don't think so? Watch and listen to a C-SPAN video clip of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCain's attempt at S.190. to fix fannie and freddie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs -
Posted By: cleoj @ 10/16/2008 12:26:37 PM
When I was growing up, we never spent a lot on Christmas. Some years, we didn't give presents to each other at all. My siblings and I never really cared either, my sister and I were tomboyish and would rather have spent our childhoods outdoor than inside playing with fancy dolls or the like anyway. Perhaps what society needs is to take a hard look at Christmas and think about what it really means. It doesn't mean buying your kids hundreds of dollars worth of material things, it's about being together as a family. If you can't afford Christmas gifts, find some other way to express your love.
As for those of you who really do need your credit cards to survive, my sympathy goes out to you. I can't imagine what it's like to be disabled, or living paycheck to paycheck, because it hasn't happened to us yet. My husband just lost his job but we are simple people, we don't have any kids, and we have enough in our savings for awhile until he can hopefully find something else to do. So for now we're good, but the gift-giving is going to definitely be diminished this year, and that's fine. Most of my friends and I agree to not give each other gifts and my family already doesn't really expect anything! -
Posted By: stacy_a_lbc @ 10/16/2008 9:46:05 AM
The tightening of credit on good customers is what has hit me the last few months. All my payments on all cards and my mortgage were on time. Yet, on one account, I was late in making a payment because i was in the hospital. As soon as I found out, I caught that account up, but that late payment did its damage. All my other cards picked up on my diminished credit rating, and lowered credit limits, further hurting my rating for percentage of available debt in use. Thus, for one corrected misstep, I am now a customer worth getting rid of. This "panic" and herd mentality is what will cripple this holiday season. I am totally not going to use any credit cards. And I will not be buying any Christmas presents.
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Posted By: pezled @ 10/16/2008 8:07:22 AM
if no store sold a single item, my family and I would still have a wonderful Christmas. Retailers just don't get it. I'm glad we can get more focussed on the "Reason for the season." Anyone worrying about this from a gift giving perspective should examine their priorities. Nothing can "spoil" my Christmas.
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Posted By: Tea6 @ 10/16/2008 8:05:52 AM
Just like with a casino, credit card companies make all their money on people who get in trouble or are losers. They do not make money on people who pay on time. If they give rebates, then they actually lose money on people who pay on time.
While a certain percent of people will always be irresponsible, the credit card companies work to boost the amount of losers by giving teaser rates, ie. Zero interest for 12 months, hoping that some misfortune will happen to people with good credit who take out these loans. All it takes is being late one day on a utility bill and they jack up rates to 30%. Instant losers. If teaser rates do not work to increase the amount of losers, then the card companies unilaterally cut your credit limits and jack up rates.
All this worked while the economy was doing well. But now that the economy is tanking their chickens are coming home to roost. I do not feel sorry for these companies. They are like a casino that lures customers in with free booze. They should be regulated like gaming companies, which is what they really are. -
Posted By: wildbill69 @ 10/16/2008 2:07:00 AM
Maybe we can get Christmas BACK!!!!!!!! Instead of this yearly BUY-A-THON.
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Posted By: poorboy @ 10/16/2008 2:04:18 AM
PAY CASH
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Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:16:08 AM
Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!
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Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:15:38 AM
Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!
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Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:14:08 AM
Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!
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Posted By: trogers @ 10/16/2008 12:53:38 AM
Americans were encouraged and enticed and seduced into the credit card world of easy living and endless pleasure. The credit card companies gave cards to college kids, to the working poor, to the unemployed , to the proven deadbeats, to illegal immigrants, and to anyone with a pulse. They will be bailed out by the US Government and will never have to answer for their reckless behavior. The borrowers will end up in bankruptcy court and will be held accountable and forced to pay something for the rest of their lives. Fairness and justice will be done as the creators of the problem become the victims of the problem. Long live the lenders; kill off the past due borrowers. The rebirth will be different until it is not.
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Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/16/2008 12:18:09 AM
Whether McCain won or lost tonight is not relevant. He succeeded in the first half hour to plant the seeds of a Reagan style wipeout. Reputable historians and economists overwhelmingly agree that the taxation imposed by and the ???stimulus??? spending and public works programs of FDR actually deepened and prolonged the Great Depression. It was the production demands of WWII that got the economy going again. And when the war was over, the economy promptly went into recession.
Point is, Obama's programs are tax and spend, and it does not really matter who he taxes, those taxes are going to be passed through the economy. Any first year economics student knows that taxation is a tool used to contract an economy experiencing inflation, because it reduces demand by reducing the amount of money individuals and businesses have to spend. It is contractionary, which is exactly what you do not want to do when the problem is that the economy is contracting already into recession. Like FDR, Obama's plans will only make it worse for longer.
Obama's tax and spending plans alone would be bad enough, but add Wright and Pelosi to the mix, with the three of them controlling both houses of Congress and the executive without and effective restraint, and you have something that should be something that causes concern even among moderate Democrats. Don't think so? Watch and listen to a C-SPAN video clip of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCain's attempt at S.190. to fix fannie and freddie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs-
Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/21/2008 6:42:32 PM
a reagan style wipeout where he is 14 points down in the polls ?
Just saying mccain is winning doesnt reflect reality
He is losing right now because we are voting right now -
Posted By: blogger2008 @ 10/16/2008 1:32:09 AM
You should read more into the new deal. I agree many of the new deal programs fdr passed were not good for the recovery. But this argument that wwii saved the economy came with a price. which is it went on the credit card... the national debt. seems to me just like it is now. maybe we should put another 10 trillion on it and see if that gets us out of this forlooming depression. maybe better lets start a few more wars that will go on for countless years. McCains plan is worse adding another 1 trillion to the national debt, where obamas plan would add 737 billion. That according to NBC fact checker.
There is no easy anwser either way, but we are all going to have to become finaciale conservatives not only in the next few years, but hopefully for generations to come.
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Posted By: WeGotPapi @ 10/15/2008 11:39:48 PM
Comment #1....hahah. Speak for yourself, please. I don't have "subscriptions, a cell phone, I cut my own hair, I brown bag it, gym???? You can afford that?? Like I said, please speak for yourself.
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Posted By: sunblocker @ 10/15/2008 11:18:21 PM
without credit this will cease to exist. duh,see what happened now.make every effort to budget/ manage and pay your bills.somehow there is never enough money to make ends meet. credit may save you from a temporary spill.don't depend on it for this crisis."when the going gets tough-the tough gets going. fight back, don't buy these holidays-buy very little. watch the table turn, for good of ''WE THE PEOPLE''.
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Posted By: dominantone @ 10/15/2008 11:13:12 PM
I guess I am out of touch. A few sound like you're using the "economy" as a reason to be cheap and cheat your kids out of presents. I hope people can cut back in other ways and afford Christmas. Cut the cable, cell, subscriptions, gym, expensive lunches, hair etc. but give the kiddies something. If you really want to get technical, Christmas is for Christians to celebrate the birth of Christ. Credit cards are fine, if you use them to your advantage and responsibly. Charge what can be immediately paid off, at zero percent interest and no fees. Loans are necessary for college and homes, for the majority of the American population. ARM loans, why on Earth would people do that to themselves? Oh well, God Bless America. I always wondered how those familiy's on Oprah could afford those humongous houses? Who knew? They couldn't/can't.
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Posted By: sunblocker @ 10/15/2008 10:58:19 PM
credit is a good thing,if you manage it correctly. sometimes its really needed due a unfortunate,sudden mishap or such.that can put one in legal,medical bind.that can save troublesome threats or lawsuits. sure savings is a good thing.but there is never enough for said.try renting a vehicle without one.-you won't get it. credit is a display of character. it shows your responsible,honest.budget/manage and pay yor bills!!!!1
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Posted By: Lolah @ 10/15/2008 10:56:56 PM
What the heck does buying our kids what they want have to do with this credit crunch??? This is about poeple who are forced to use thier credit cards for groceries, gasoline, toothpaste, the electric bill, etc. Don't think for a minute that kids are being handed things they don't need in this economy!!! Geez, get a grip on reality!!
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Posted By: PolishGirl @ 10/15/2008 10:50:01 PM
Leave the plastic home. give yourself a christmas present.=pay off your credit card bill, carry cash and use checks or checkcard. go to discount stores=buy cheap stuff that looks expensive, enjoy life without debt
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Posted By: ryansmom125 @ 10/15/2008 10:29:20 PM
AMEN! If you don't have cash, you don't need it! Kids don't need everything under the sun to be happy. They need parents time and attention. How much does that cost? Nothing, but a piece of yourself. I would rather give that to my kids than the stressed out mommy they would get if I had to pay all the bills with the interest rates!! Plus they learn a valuable lesson. We have to work for what we have, its not handed to us.
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Posted By: Grammiex4 @ 10/15/2008 9:59:18 PM
Leave the plastic at home...if you can't pay cash you don't need it!!!!
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Posted By: Siamesemom @ 10/15/2008 9:57:04 PM
Credit cards are the worst thing, they want you and they get you with high interest rates. Too bad tables can't be turned on them for the harm the do to us by taking unfair advantage of us.
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Posted By: blogger2008 @ 10/16/2008 12:26:41 AM
To bad you cant overpay your credit card and charge them that interest back. That might make them a little more weary of who they give their cards to and the limit they put on them.
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Posted By: Grammiex4 @ 10/15/2008 9:56:20 PM
I don't need plastic to have a great Christmas. We have a Christmas that we can afford and no credit card bills!!! I just say "NO THANKYOU" to all the credit card offers and I come out ahead. If I can't pay cash I don't really need it.
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Posted By: Siamesemom @ 10/15/2008 9:54:38 PM
Too bad we can't turn all of our credit cards back to them and say, we're finished getting stuck with all you've done to us. High interest rates to pay for those who didn't pay. Why make those who've been paying our cards right on time or off the bad guys?? It's not fair.
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Posted By: shar.mar @ 10/15/2008 9:48:20 PM
To the person who thinks the "burden" should be spread around equally. I agree (also voting Obama)... the point is that the rich have been getting a "pass" while the middle class struggle with the burden. Just one example: Social Security taxes come out of paychecks up to $102,000 (90,000 until recently). Everything you earn in your paycheck ABOVE THAT is not subject to ss taxes? So the middle class are bearing the brunt of that responsibility with a much larger percentage of their income going to ss taxes... why not may those fat cat paychecks also contribute to ss... in a few years, we could be solvent. Because the rich get social security too you know... not many send back their checks.
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:10:09 AM
I understand why your voting for Obama, even your post is COMPLETELY INCORRECT. If I am middle class and make 50k a year and the guy down the street is wealthy and makes 500,000 per year, who pays more SS tax? HE DOES. The current SS tax rate is 6.2%. My tax 50,000 * 6.2% = $3100.00. His tax 102,000 (limit) * 6.2% = 6324.00. You said the middle class are bearing the brunt of the responsibility, as usual that simply is not true. The wealthy pay WAY more than anyone else. ALL TAXES SHOULD BE LOWERED, SPUR THE ECONOMY, CREATE JOBS, TAX INCOME INCREASES DUE TO MORE JOBS AND SPENDING.
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:41:36 AM
The actual truth of the matter is the top 10% of earners pay 68% of the taxes in this country. I encourage you to research it, google it. You will find all the politicians are full of **** as usual. If the media repeats it enough it becomes true, screw the actual facts I heard it on CNN 12 times today. The tax cuts only benefit the rich.
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:35:44 AM
We are SCREWED as a nation. With people like this going to the polls and voting, we are screwed. This person COMPLETELY contradicts herself in her own post. Anyone with half a brain reads her post and comes away with the opposite of her conclusion. I SERIOUSLY THINK WE NEED TO SPLIT THE COUNTRY IN HALF. One side will have the no weapon, Godless, socialist nation and the other side will have the armed capitalist nation.
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Posted By: FrozenEagle @ 10/15/2008 9:47:57 PM
P.S. Please send Turkey to Detroit Lions front office,, we could use another Quarterback, that could throw on the fly.
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Posted By: Biowill21 @ 10/15/2008 9:45:01 PM
Geee, some people are really making sence in this blog..... I mean, since when was CHRISTmas about racking up $7,895 in credit card charges ?? I mean come on... I have $40k in my checking account right now, im 23, and drive a mercedes... Now im not bragging what so ever, But no where in my mind am I thinking about going out and blowing $15k on gifts, hell Im no even going to spend $500... Christmas isnt about blowing money to show someone you love them, Christmas is about family & friends..... What makes me happy is my family together, my mom baking, the temp like at 45 outside, and inside drinking somthing warm listening to christmas music..... Come on people, pull your heads outta your A*S !!
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Posted By: FrozenEagle @ 10/15/2008 9:41:52 PM
Christmas???/// well be lucky if we dont get denied at the register for a Turkey for Thanksgiving!!!
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Posted By: FrozenEagle @ 10/15/2008 9:38:14 PM
Christmas??/// Well be lucky to make it through Thanksgiving,,, try using your credit card to buy a Turkey.........DENIED
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Posted By: wg4958 @ 10/15/2008 9:29:41 PM
Oh please! Gimme a break - if you ain't got the money then you got no business buying anything. Christmas isn't suppose to be about buying anyway - well - that is unless you listen to the cry baby retailers and the chicken little people.
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Posted By: IA buckskinner @ 10/15/2008 9:18:22 PM
This year we're going to have a home- made Christmas.I'll make clothing,a quilt for our grandson,and a rag doll for my daughter.Mom will get a gift card for the grocery store.My step- son and his wife will get a goody box with a meat bundle,diapers,etc. because if we gave them a gift card it would get spent on pop and cigarettes.We're going to hunker down and spend ABSOLUTELY NOTHING on unnecessary things.What gets me is that even though the banks were so bad off that the taxpayers are going to get financially sodomized for decades over this,we got two credit card offers in the mail,and one offer over the phone today.Seems like it didn't phase them a bit.People in this country need to get an attitude like the one that pulled this country together during WW II.Those who can need to rip out those worthless expanses of grass and plant gardens.Learn to sew,learn to cook,re-use everything.Above all,learn to say no to yourself.As we learned the hard way,it only takes a milli-second for a catastrophic medical condition to appear,and everything changes.If all you have for Christmas is the presence of loved ones,it's the best present of all.
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Posted By: debtfreeandproud @ 10/15/2008 9:17:23 PM
Here is an idea that I think people should use to help pay for Christmas presents without credit cards.....remember the old Christmas Club/Account at your local bank???? See if your branch has one and have a set amount taken from your checking account automatically every month. If that is impossible, try buying presents early so you can "disperse" your dollars over a few months instead of all at once. Also, why do you feel "committed" to buy so much? Reevaluate your list and keep it simple. Remember, it is the thought that counts. Also, if you have kids, set the tone early of what can be expected if they know Santa doesn't exist and if they are very young, they won't remember much, much like my own did not remember, what they got from the age of 1 to about 8 or 9. A nice homemade card and/or homemade gifts or consumables is always a welcomed treat that is either unique or yummy. We are a society that has been seduced by major credit card companies and marketers that try to make us feel empowered with cash that we don't have to spend. Focus on the spirit, be thankful you have a long list of friends and family that you feel obligated to buy gifts. You can write a nice letter expressing your gratitude or a time where your friend or family member helped you during the year or relive a funny moment that you shared.
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Posted By: bonnie0 @ 10/15/2008 9:13:44 PM
the tightening of credit to less than stellar consumers should have been done YEARS ago. People can't keep on depending upon credit for everything, and then yell sour grapes when they are denied. The rest of us are paying the price for those people, who ran up and maxed out their credit, and bought homes when they knew they couldn't pay for them. Those are the ones who got us into this whole economic mess!!!!!
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Posted By: SPOOFY13 @ 10/15/2008 9:02:50 PM
If the Goverment would have staied out of the credit crard mess three years ago when they rasied the rate of repayment. Then at that point all credit card compines started the the cycle of 30 plus intrest. So when they stared that we did not agree to those terms and cutup all cards and sent them back. We pay as agreed when we opened the accounts. most now want all balances due but: ask daddy big pockets for the bail out.
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Posted By: trogers @ 10/15/2008 8:46:54 PM
The credit card issuers will suffer massive defaults and they, unlike the borrowers, will be bailed out by the government. They already have been bailed out to a great extent. The borrowers will end up in bankruptcy where the latest and greatest laws will rule against them, and they will have to keep paying something no matter what. No executives from the credit card companies will ever be forced to testify why they extended credit to anyone with a pulse. No responsibility for this financial meltdown will be placed with the companies for the irresponsible ways they distributed credit cards with high limits to college kids, to the unemployed, to known deadbeats, or to the working poor. Yes, many who should have known better abused the credit extende by spending and spending until nothing was left. The blame goes both ways, the pain is only on the borrowers side.
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Posted By: Lady Marion @ 10/15/2008 8:46:23 PM
Xmas, alas ... I got carried away with paper. I really like the person who is going to give to their favorite charity
instead of the spoiled kids who complained they didn't have cell phones, as it appears they have everything else. Even though I have lost my father and have my mother who is great need of affection in her saddness, and medical care, I am at least glad I have a job and I can care of her and myself, and my dog! I have to give thanks for at least that! Believe me when I say harder times are yet to come. At least for now ... AMEN!! -
Posted By: Lady Marion @ 10/15/2008 8:35:42 PM
None of this is going to do any good, unless the situation that created the mess to begin is corrected. The economic structure needs to revamped. Unless it is money is going to be worthless. It'slike saying: Go back and give Long Island back Indians who bought for how many beads ... 8, well at this poin the number doesn't matter. Whether it's 8 or 8 trillion, it's win or loose. The sytem has to be changed from the inner core to make money, paper, beads constitute a value.
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Posted By: Lady Marion @ 10/15/2008 8:54:47 PM
This is directed to myself lady Marion, as I apologize for the puncuation or lack therein of. I hope the idea got accross. And I wish they would allow us to see a black typeface not gray. OOPS, O'bama and McCAin are on.
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Posted By: dane3263 @ 10/15/2008 8:27:58 PM
We have a $40 limit person. We celebrate the true meaning of Christmas. Some how becoming in debt is the way for most people celebrate. we are teaching our children the wrong way to live. If you do not have the cash to pay for it, you do NOT need it. It took me almost $10000 in credit card debt (all since paid off) to realize this. And my family still loves the gifts that they get and think no less of me for not being extragavant.
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Posted By: gigglinggirl @ 10/15/2008 8:26:45 PM
Last year, after seeing my two nieces (9 and 11 at the time) with closets STUFFED full of clothes, shoes, etc., etc., etc., and getting to have swimming lessons, gymnastics lessons, etc., etc., and them COMPLAINING because they were the only ones in their class WITHOUT A CELL PHONE, I decided that I would give everyone on my Christmas list a donation to a charity in their name. I wrote a letter explaining how we all had more stuff than we needed, and there wasn't a better time than Christmas to put aside our devotion to material goods, and think of others who had less than we had. You wouldn't believe what a positive response I got from people! They not only agreed, but were happy to have a reason not to shop, wrap, and send some gift that was probably going to loose it's allure within a month or two. (Even the nieces warmed up to it after I explained how good it feels to share!)
I'm doing the same this year and from now on. There are lots of wonderful charities out there - you can pick a cause that is special to you, and usually the money you give to a charity goes a lot further than having to spend a certain amount of money to "impress" the gift recipient anyway! And for those of you who need some more motivation...you can deduct cash contributions made to a legitimate charity on your taxes! Now is the time...start your own "Charity Christmas" this year! -
Posted By: JedIsRed @ 10/15/2008 8:22:06 PM
The economy is not the main reason to vote for McCain or Obama -- Their real values are. Will they support or oppose government paid abortions? will they support or oppose fake "marriages"? Will they support or oppose judges who do their jobs right - enforcing the United States Constitution and laws - not some other countries' laws - and not trying to make law from the bench. making laws are the job of the Congress - not judges. Will they support our constitutional rights to freedom of speech and religion or will they support so called "hate crimes" laws which take away our constitutional rights if we speak against perversion. Any person in their right mind will see the obvious choice and kick out the liberal democrats as fast as they can get to the polls this year.
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Posted By: gigglinggirl @ 10/15/2008 8:30:04 PM
You must be very wealthy. Only a really rich person would think that personal social issues are more important than resolving two wars and re-establishing the Middle Class as the engine of the US.
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Posted By: biddiey @ 10/15/2008 8:20:02 PM
We do not have any credit cards. We had one 10 yrs ago and have not had one since. I don't want one. If I cannot pay cash I don't have or need it. In 22 years we had one car that we had payments on. We have a mortgage not much because it is not much of a house. We do not have cell phones and don't want them. We live simply. We do not have what others have. Yes we have a Harley, not new, which was what my husband spent his 401K on when he became permently disabled. It keeps him sane and we use it for transportation 3 seasons better on gas than the car. I go to clearance racks, yard sales, thrift shops, salvation army stores and goodwill for clothes and gifts.Recycle Reuse is my moto. Pay full price for anything is just unheard of in my house, including the Harley and the house. Christmas is for giving something from the heart not the pocketbook. We make things like food, crafts, gifts all from the home and from the heart.
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Posted By: Periwinkle @ 10/15/2008 8:30:20 PM
what a wonderful, conciencious and caring person you sound like....keep up the fabulous work
and attitude that you have. i am somewhat in the same situation in that i am single, work very
hard every day in the medical field. sometimes i am so tired i can't hold my head up. i try so very
hard to live within my means....and...dont get me wrong, i make very good money. i'll drive my
'paid for car' until the motor falls out.
thanks so much for sharing your story. i wish you the very best......and maybe one day i will run into
you at GOODWILL....my very favorite store.
take care girl and keep on keepin' on!
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 8:08:26 PM
Class of 58 is correct. Credit cards and loans in general are a suckers game. A SUCKERS GAME! You simply should not purchase thing you do not have the money to purchase.
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Posted By: Woodsie @ 10/15/2008 8:08:13 PM
In 2002 my husband became disabled over night. Lost his job due to his illness. We lived in a new state, no friends no family and 3 kids. We thought we were going to have to pay taxes for 2001, so we had saved up what we could. Turned out we didn't have to pay taxes for 2001 so we had 2 choices, pay off our debt, or save the money we had and spread it over the next several months. He said pay off our debt. So hard as it was we paid off our debt. Seven years have past with no credit cards, it's amazing how expenisve you find life is when you don't have credit to fall back on. It cost us 600$ a month to heat our house to 60 degrees. Yeah living in your means sure had a different meaning for us this last 7 years. But we're still kicking.
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Posted By: gigglinggirl @ 10/15/2008 8:37:49 PM
Bless you for hanging in there. Here's hoping 2009 will be good for you and your family!
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 8:06:01 PM
MsGingerRogers and people like her are going to bring this country down. By down I mean we will be like all the other former great countries that now barely make it. Her description of why she is voting for Obama is the exact definition of socialism. America is NOT the greatest, richest most powerful country in the world because of socialism. We are great because of capitalism. It seams like we could look at our country and the history and look at others who choose a different path. Under the phrase "deserve to be happy" she just took what belongs to another. If it would make me happy to have your stuff, should I have it? I would encourage all you to vote for McCain. With Obama and the dems leading this country we will soon be France. WE ARE CAPITALISTS, WE SHOULD REMAIN CAPITALISTS! THIS IS THE REASON WE HAVE WHAT WE HAVE!
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Posted By: gigglinggirl @ 10/15/2008 8:35:49 PM
We are capitalists who have successfully overthrown manufacturing and creativity for paper and Wall Street profits. ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!! P.S. Your anger at France seems to overlook that without the help of Lafayette, Cornwallis and the British would have been re-supplied, and the American Revolution would have been lost! But, you probably didn't know that because you're so busy worrying about whether we are capitalists in the "purest" sense of the word. (Besides...the French DO make the best wine and perfume...you can't hate them all!!!!!) hee hee!
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 11:30:11 PM
People really should study the subject before they go making posts on message boards about things they simply do not understand. Had the giggler studied I'm sure she would agree with me.
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Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 11:26:39 PM
You read too much into my post. I don't dislike France, I love to go to France. I also am completely grateful for their help in our independence. I was speaking to the current condition of France.
During the Socialist era, a number of policies were implemented, one of which was the heavy social security tax (about 42% paid for by employers on each employee salary). This tax was used to ???reward??? the unemployed and the middle class with generous social benefits. True, a government has to look after its people, but unfortunately, these benefits are not only too generous that the government and people???s taxes are hard-put to sustain them.
SO YOU FIND THE FRENCH ARE BETTER PAID TO DO NOTHING, because starting salaries are less than what the government gives to the unemployed. You will find the French going on strikes and demonstrating against any adverse reforms on these benefits. Ultimately, the working class are the losers because jobs are few and ill-paid, employers being constrained with financial and government limitations. There is an uncommonly high unemployment in France. FROM ALL YOU HEE HEE'S AND HA HA I SERIOUSLY DOUBT YOU WILL EVEN READ ABOVE.
My point was if you think things suck now, just wait until you bleed the rich dry and they stop producing. If you tax me 70%. I would rather not work and just add my name to the government rolls that receive! Enough people do this and we are all screwed. I ENCOURAGE YOU TO STUDY IT A LITTLE, SEE IF I'M CORRECT. CHECK THE ECONOMIES OF SOCIALIST COUNTRIES. IF YOU REALLY WANT TO BLOW YOUR MIND CHECK THE ECONOMIES OF COMMUNISTS. COMPARE THEM TO US. IF YOU DO YOU WILL BE POSTING ON MESSAGE BOARDS IN ALL CAPS ABOUT CAPITALISM.
GOOD LUCK!
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