Bah, Humbug!

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  • Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/16/2008 1:43:11 PM

    Whether McCain won or lost is not relevant. He succeeded in the first half hour to plant the seeds of a Reagan style wipeout. Reputable historians and economists overwhelmingly agree that the taxation imposed by and the "stimulus" spending and public works programs of FDR actually deepened and prolonged the Great Depression. It was the production demands of WWII that got the economy going again. And when the war was over, the economy promptly went into recession.

    Point is, Obama's programs are tax and spend, and it does not really matter who he taxes, those taxes are going to be passed through the economy. Any first year economics student knows that taxation is a tool used to contract an economy experiencing inflation, because it reduces demand by reducing the amount of money individuals and businesses have to spend. It is contractionary, which is exactly what you do not want to do when the problem is that the economy is contracting already into recession. Like FDR, Obama's plans will only make it worse for longer.

    Obama's tax and spending plans alone would be bad enough, but add Reid and Pelosi to the mix, with the three of them controlling both houses of Congress and the executive without and effective restraint, and you have something that should be something that causes concern even among moderate Democrats. Don't think so? Watch and listen to a C-SPAN video clip of the Congressional hearings at roughly the time McCain's attempt at S.190. to fix fannie and freddie.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs

  • Posted By: cleoj @ 10/16/2008 12:26:37 PM

    When I was growing up, we never spent a lot on Christmas. Some years, we didn't give presents to each other at all. My siblings and I never really cared either, my sister and I were tomboyish and would rather have spent our childhoods outdoor than inside playing with fancy dolls or the like anyway. Perhaps what society needs is to take a hard look at Christmas and think about what it really means. It doesn't mean buying your kids hundreds of dollars worth of material things, it's about being together as a family. If you can't afford Christmas gifts, find some other way to express your love.

    As for those of you who really do need your credit cards to survive, my sympathy goes out to you. I can't imagine what it's like to be disabled, or living paycheck to paycheck, because it hasn't happened to us yet. My husband just lost his job but we are simple people, we don't have any kids, and we have enough in our savings for awhile until he can hopefully find something else to do. So for now we're good, but the gift-giving is going to definitely be diminished this year, and that's fine. Most of my friends and I agree to not give each other gifts and my family already doesn't really expect anything!

  • Posted By: stacy_a_lbc @ 10/16/2008 9:46:05 AM

    The tightening of credit on good customers is what has hit me the last few months. All my payments on all cards and my mortgage were on time. Yet, on one account, I was late in making a payment because i was in the hospital. As soon as I found out, I caught that account up, but that late payment did its damage. All my other cards picked up on my diminished credit rating, and lowered credit limits, further hurting my rating for percentage of available debt in use. Thus, for one corrected misstep, I am now a customer worth getting rid of. This "panic" and herd mentality is what will cripple this holiday season. I am totally not going to use any credit cards. And I will not be buying any Christmas presents.

  • Posted By: pezled @ 10/16/2008 8:07:22 AM

    if no store sold a single item, my family and I would still have a wonderful Christmas. Retailers just don't get it. I'm glad we can get more focussed on the "Reason for the season." Anyone worrying about this from a gift giving perspective should examine their priorities. Nothing can "spoil" my Christmas.

  • Posted By: Tea6 @ 10/16/2008 8:05:52 AM

    Just like with a casino, credit card companies make all their money on people who get in trouble or are losers. They do not make money on people who pay on time. If they give rebates, then they actually lose money on people who pay on time.

    While a certain percent of people will always be irresponsible, the credit card companies work to boost the amount of losers by giving teaser rates, ie. Zero interest for 12 months, hoping that some misfortune will happen to people with good credit who take out these loans. All it takes is being late one day on a utility bill and they jack up rates to 30%. Instant losers. If teaser rates do not work to increase the amount of losers, then the card companies unilaterally cut your credit limits and jack up rates.

    All this worked while the economy was doing well. But now that the economy is tanking their chickens are coming home to roost. I do not feel sorry for these companies. They are like a casino that lures customers in with free booze. They should be regulated like gaming companies, which is what they really are.

  • Posted By: wildbill69 @ 10/16/2008 2:07:00 AM

    Maybe we can get Christmas BACK!!!!!!!! Instead of this yearly BUY-A-THON.

  • Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:16:08 AM

    Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!

  • Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:15:38 AM

    Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!

  • Posted By: Susan M. @ 10/16/2008 1:14:08 AM

    Good! Christmas shouldn't be bought with credit anyway. Use CASH!

  • Posted By: trogers @ 10/16/2008 12:53:38 AM

    Americans were encouraged and enticed and seduced into the credit card world of easy living and endless pleasure. The credit card companies gave cards to college kids, to the working poor, to the unemployed , to the proven deadbeats, to illegal immigrants, and to anyone with a pulse. They will be bailed out by the US Government and will never have to answer for their reckless behavior. The borrowers will end up in bankruptcy court and will be held accountable and forced to pay something for the rest of their lives. Fairness and justice will be done as the creators of the problem become the victims of the problem. Long live the lenders; kill off the past due borrowers. The rebirth will be different until it is not.

  • Posted By: shar.mar @ 10/15/2008 9:48:20 PM

    To the person who thinks the "burden" should be spread around equally. I agree (also voting Obama)... the point is that the rich have been getting a "pass" while the middle class struggle with the burden. Just one example: Social Security taxes come out of paychecks up to $102,000 (90,000 until recently). Everything you earn in your paycheck ABOVE THAT is not subject to ss taxes? So the middle class are bearing the brunt of that responsibility with a much larger percentage of their income going to ss taxes... why not may those fat cat paychecks also contribute to ss... in a few years, we could be solvent. Because the rich get social security too you know... not many send back their checks.

    • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:10:09 AM

      I understand why your voting for Obama, even your post is COMPLETELY INCORRECT. If I am middle class and make 50k a year and the guy down the street is wealthy and makes 500,000 per year, who pays more SS tax? HE DOES. The current SS tax rate is 6.2%. My tax 50,000 * 6.2% = $3100.00. His tax 102,000 (limit) * 6.2% = 6324.00. You said the middle class are bearing the brunt of the responsibility, as usual that simply is not true. The wealthy pay WAY more than anyone else. ALL TAXES SHOULD BE LOWERED, SPUR THE ECONOMY, CREATE JOBS, TAX INCOME INCREASES DUE TO MORE JOBS AND SPENDING.

      • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:41:36 AM

        The actual truth of the matter is the top 10% of earners pay 68% of the taxes in this country. I encourage you to research it, google it. You will find all the politicians are full of **** as usual. If the media repeats it enough it becomes true, screw the actual facts I heard it on CNN 12 times today. The tax cuts only benefit the rich.

      • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/16/2008 12:35:44 AM

        We are SCREWED as a nation. With people like this going to the polls and voting, we are screwed. This person COMPLETELY contradicts herself in her own post. Anyone with half a brain reads her post and comes away with the opposite of her conclusion. I SERIOUSLY THINK WE NEED TO SPLIT THE COUNTRY IN HALF. One side will have the no weapon, Godless, socialist nation and the other side will have the armed capitalist nation.

  • Posted By: Siamesemom @ 10/15/2008 9:57:04 PM

    Credit cards are the worst thing, they want you and they get you with high interest rates. Too bad tables can't be turned on them for the harm the do to us by taking unfair advantage of us.

    • Posted By: blogger2008 @ 10/16/2008 12:26:41 AM

      To bad you cant overpay your credit card and charge them that interest back. That might make them a little more weary of who they give their cards to and the limit they put on them.

  • Posted By: WeGotPapi @ 10/15/2008 11:39:48 PM

    Comment #1....hahah. Speak for yourself, please. I don't have "subscriptions, a cell phone, I cut my own hair, I brown bag it, gym???? You can afford that?? Like I said, please speak for yourself.

  • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 8:06:01 PM

    MsGingerRogers and people like her are going to bring this country down. By down I mean we will be like all the other former great countries that now barely make it. Her description of why she is voting for Obama is the exact definition of socialism. America is NOT the greatest, richest most powerful country in the world because of socialism. We are great because of capitalism. It seams like we could look at our country and the history and look at others who choose a different path. Under the phrase "deserve to be happy" she just took what belongs to another. If it would make me happy to have your stuff, should I have it? I would encourage all you to vote for McCain. With Obama and the dems leading this country we will soon be France. WE ARE CAPITALISTS, WE SHOULD REMAIN CAPITALISTS! THIS IS THE REASON WE HAVE WHAT WE HAVE!

    • Posted By: biddiey @ 10/15/2008 8:35:04 PM

      I have a guestion for dustbash. Your last comment what do we have???? Please explain I guess I am missing something. I know what I have and don't have. I have the bases of life survival. A roof some food hopefully I can efford some heat. I guess I am luckier than some others.

      • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 11:39:27 PM

        I'm sorry I didn't understand your guestion. I'm sure you are not implying we have less than say, China, Cuba, Brazil, France. We are without argument the best country in the world. People from other countries risk their lives to reach our shores. I personally know some of them. You should find one and ask about the conditions they come from. They would no doubt be sickened by our lack of gratitude and respect for the place you live. As the great Ronald Reagan emphasized," America is a shining city upon a hill whose beacon light guides freedom-loving people everywhere." GOD BLESS AMERICA

    • Posted By: gigglinggirl @ 10/15/2008 8:35:49 PM

      We are capitalists who have successfully overthrown manufacturing and creativity for paper and Wall Street profits. ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!! P.S. Your anger at France seems to overlook that without the help of Lafayette, Cornwallis and the British would have been re-supplied, and the American Revolution would have been lost! But, you probably didn't know that because you're so busy worrying about whether we are capitalists in the "purest" sense of the word. (Besides...the French DO make the best wine and perfume...you can't hate them all!!!!!) hee hee!

      • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 11:30:11 PM

        People really should study the subject before they go making posts on message boards about things they simply do not understand. Had the giggler studied I'm sure she would agree with me.

      • Posted By: dustbash @ 10/15/2008 11:26:39 PM

        You read too much into my post. I don't dislike France, I love to go to France. I also am completely grateful for their help in our independence. I was speaking to the current condition of France.

        During the Socialist era, a number of policies were implemented, one of which was the heavy social security tax (about 42% paid for by employers on each employee salary). This tax was used to ???reward??? the unemployed and the middle class with generous social benefits. True, a government has to look after its people, but unfortunately, these benefits are not only too generous that the government and people???s taxes are hard-put to sustain them.

        SO YOU FIND THE FRENCH ARE BETTER PAID TO DO NOTHING, because starting salaries are less than what the government gives to the unemployed. You will find the French going on strikes and demonstrating against any adverse reforms on these benefits. Ultimately, the working class are the losers because jobs are few and ill-paid, employers being constrained with financial and government limitations. There is an uncommonly high unemployment in France. FROM ALL YOU HEE HEE'S AND HA HA I SERIOUSLY DOUBT YOU WILL EVEN READ ABOVE.

        My point was if you think things suck now, just wait until you bleed the rich dry and they stop producing. If you tax me 70%. I would rather not work and just add my name to the government rolls that receive! Enough people do this and we are all screwed. I ENCOURAGE YOU TO STUDY IT A LITTLE, SEE IF I'M CORRECT. CHECK THE ECONOMIES OF SOCIALIST COUNTRIES. IF YOU REALLY WANT TO BLOW YOUR MIND CHECK THE ECONOMIES OF COMMUNISTS. COMPARE THEM TO US. IF YOU DO YOU WILL BE POSTING ON MESSAGE BOARDS IN ALL CAPS ABOUT CAPITALISM.

        GOOD LUCK!

  • Posted By: sunblocker @ 10/15/2008 11:18:21 PM

    without credit this will cease to exist. duh,see what happened now.make every effort to budget/ manage and pay your bills.somehow there is never enough money to make ends meet. credit may save you from a temporary spill.don't depend on it for this crisis."when the going gets tough-the tough gets going. fight back, don't buy these holidays-buy very little. watch the table turn, for good of ''WE THE PEOPLE''.

  • Posted By: dominantone @ 10/15/2008 11:13:12 PM

    I guess I am out of touch. A few sound like you're using the "economy" as a reason to be cheap and cheat your kids out of presents. I hope people can cut back in other ways and afford Christmas. Cut the cable, cell, subscriptions, gym, expensive lunches, hair etc. but give the kiddies something. If you really want to get technical, Christmas is for Christians to celebrate the birth of Christ. Credit cards are fine, if you use them to your advantage and responsibly. Charge what can be immediately paid off, at zero percent interest and no fees. Loans are necessary for college and homes, for the majority of the American population. ARM loans, why on Earth would people do that to themselves? Oh well, God Bless America. I always wondered how those familiy's on Oprah could afford those humongous houses? Who knew? They couldn't/can't.

  • Posted By: sunblocker @ 10/15/2008 10:58:19 PM

    credit is a good thing,if you manage it correctly. sometimes its really needed due a unfortunate,sudden mishap or such.that can put one in legal,medical bind.that can save troublesome threats or lawsuits. sure savings is a good thing.but there is never enough for said.try renting a vehicle without one.-you won't get it. credit is a display of character. it shows your responsible,honest.budget/manage and pay yor bills!!!!1

  • Posted By: Lolah @ 10/15/2008 10:56:56 PM

    What the heck does buying our kids what they want have to do with this credit crunch??? This is about poeple who are forced to use thier credit cards for groceries, gasoline, toothpaste, the electric bill, etc. Don't think for a minute that kids are being handed things they don't need in this economy!!! Geez, get a grip on reality!!

  • Posted By: PolishGirl @ 10/15/2008 10:50:01 PM

    Leave the plastic home. give yourself a christmas present.=pay off your credit card bill, carry cash and use checks or checkcard. go to discount stores=buy cheap stuff that looks expensive, enjoy life without debt

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