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  • Posted By: fatherjoseph @ 10/22/2008 4:47:27 PM

    I would highly suggest that those who disagree with the tenets of the Church move over to the Episcopal Church. It is a church now where "anything goes" . You can't rationalize your way on the abortion is.
    It is easy to be for abortion . .you're alive . .so what's the problem? The problem is primarily that people who are more than willing to be pro-choice become somewhat selfish in their judgments. "I am alive" so why should I care why a woman wants to have an abortion?

    There are Catholics like the Kmiecs,, et alii who rationalize any and everything about the tenets of the Church. Personally, they should not be teaching in Catholic Universities ..if there are any true Catholic Universities around anymore.

    Life . ...the greatest gift has given to us because within us resides grace which is terms is the Spirit of God. Why would one want to destroy or be indifferent to the abortion issue?

    Amazing!!!!!

    Joseph
    Baton Rouge, La.

  • Posted By: Micky Devine @ 10/22/2008 4:32:05 PM

    Two points: One, Gov. Casey was denied a speaking role at the 1992 convention because he refused to endorse the presumptive nominee, Bill Clinton. His anti choice views had nothing to do with it. Two, in your rush to condemn the Democratic Party as single minded on this issue you disregard the fact that the current Majority Leader, Harry Reid, scored a whopping 29% from NARAL.

  • Posted By: Micky Devine @ 10/22/2008 4:30:12 PM

    Two points: One, Gov. Casey was denied a speaking role at the 1992 convention because he refused to endorse the presumptive nominee, Bill Clinton. His anti choice views had nothing to do with it. Two, in your rush to condemn the Democratic Party as single minded on this issue you disregard the fact that the current Majority Leader, Harry Reid, scored a whopping 29% from NARAL.

  • Posted By: jim_jones @ 10/22/2008 4:24:56 PM

    I am a pro-life Catholic. Like you, I bought into the notion that my religious belief on this single issue required me to vote for the GOP in 2000 - house, senate, and president. Eight years later - six of those being a solid majority of the house, senate, president, and Supreme Court - what did this pro-life government do for the abortion issue? Diddly squat.

    There is so much more to being a Catholic than the single issue of abortion. War, poverty, and capital punishment are three biggies that the prototypical "Pro-Life" candidates ignore (if not encourage).

    Yes, A Pro-Life Catholic can endorse an individual who happens to be pro-choice. This Catholic has already voted for Barack Obama.

  • Posted By: lucy2008 @ 10/22/2008 4:20:10 PM

    This author misrepresents Senator Obama's public opinion and voting record. This tripe has been talked about before and has been refuted in the public forum by Obama himself, other politiicans in Illinois who worked on the same legislation and so forth. In otherwords, this author is just lying. Why would someone do that? Well, it just part of story telling to make a case- truth be damned. This is sad and prevents real dialogue.

  • Posted By: cinnapatch @ 10/22/2008 4:17:39 PM

    I got a vasectomy back in 1978 and don't care about abortion one way or the other anyway. But what about miscarriages? I got thisd gfrom Wikipedia: "...Determining the prevalence of miscarriage is difficult. Many miscarriages happen very early in the pregnancy, before a woman may know she is pregnant. Treatment of women with miscarriage at home means medical statistics on miscarriage miss many cases.[26] Prospective studies using very sensitive early pregnancy tests have found that 25% of pregnancies are miscarried by the sixth week LMP (since the woman's Last Menstrual Period).[27][28] Clinical miscarriages (those occurring after the sixth week LMP) occur in 8% of pregnancies.[28]

    So we see that whoever causes all these miscarriages is the greates abortionist in the world. Is it God--or Satan!

  • Posted By: lucy2008 @ 10/22/2008 4:16:37 PM

    I am a working mother who owns her own small business with a young adult daughter. These types of discussions do come up. The majority of Americans and an overwhelming majority of women support Roe v. Wade. You are wrong. It is our right to privacy. Not all religions take as narrow a view of abortion as you do. The best thing to do is make birth control as easily accessible, affordable, fitting lifestyles with education. That will lower the abortion rate beyond all else. Educating women lowers the pregnancy rate and abortion rate. Greater education and civil rights are good for all. Y

  • Posted By: lucy2008 @ 10/22/2008 4:12:23 PM

    I whole heartedly disagree with you. Your article is misrepresentation to say the lease. First, the majority of "women" believe that Roe vs Wade decision should stay the way it is. Second, the majority of our population believe that the reversal of laws to pre-Roe vs. Wade should not happen. You are simply writing an article and saying what you believe. That isn't helpful to any debate. Your comments about Senator Obama leave out his public record of interviews by the media, speeches, and seminar discussions. You are just plain wrong.

  • Posted By: little5er00 @ 10/22/2008 4:10:57 PM

    This statement floors me: "The full implementation of the most radical interpretation of Roe would seem to be the goal of Obama's support for the federal Freedom of Choice Act [FOCA], which, by stripping Catholic doctors of 'conscience clause' protections currently in state laws, would put thousands of Catholic physicians in jeopardy." Catholic physicians are in jeopardy? Are you KIDDING me? What about the women desperately seeking objective medical advice who get turned away because their situation doesn't align with some self-righteous doctor's personal beliefs? Outrageous.

  • Posted By: rddowney @ 10/22/2008 4:10:25 PM

    No leader on the right DARES to repeal Roe v. Wade -- how else would they drive their lunatic supporters to the polls? As long as Roe is around, the GOP will continue to trumpet that Dems. are the party that "hates life" and wants getting an abortion to be like super-sizing your fries or getting one of Sarah Palin's lattes. NO ONE wants more abortions..but as long as Dems. have to defend themselves against charges that they're baby-killers, the GOP will keep it as an issue, despite not wanting to do A sman thing about it.

    No

  • Posted By: JoanR @ 10/22/2008 4:06:00 PM

    I agree with you.It is not necessary to be a religious fundamentalist to understand that the SCOTUS in Roe invented a right that is simply not constitutionally mandated but,the majority thought, was socially desirable.Nor is it necessary to be anti-abortion to be repulsed by infanticide.Senator Obama's views on these matters demonstrate intellectual dishonesty, to say the least

  • Posted By: Davidebert @ 10/22/2008 2:46:41 PM

    The whole idea of wasting legislative efforts on a law protecting a child who survives a failed abortion is a red herring in benefit of those who support a broad conservative agenda. Physicians already have a moral and legal mandate to save lives. The law is redundant and unnecessary. It is just another false litmus test to throw in front of liberal candidates- akin to questions like: "Yes or no, Senator, have you stopped beating your wife?". If you support the law, you lose knee-jerk pro-life votes from people who are not very thoughtful, and if you oppose the law, you are trumpeted as a baby killer. A lose-lose proposition, and all in the cause of a basically fake law. We need legislators to foster meaningful laws to help children. No one really likes abortion, but if you want to reduce abortions in the real world, you have to have society pledge to support unwed mothers, and help keep them on track for school and careers. Want to reduce abortions? We need universal child day care. Anti-abortionists, rally a movement for Christian women to start faith-based nursery care for teen mothers while they work or attend high school. Then maybe they won't be afraid to keep their children.

    • Posted By: Abots22 @ 10/22/2008 3:45:34 PM

      Furthermore, why did Obama LIE about which way he voted??

    • Posted By: Abots22 @ 10/22/2008 3:41:06 PM

      If in supporting the (Born Alive) law, you loose knee-jerk pro-life votes from people who are not very thoughtful, then why did every other democrat vote in favor of it!?!? Pelosi, Hillary, Kennedy all voted in favor of it. This bill was the biggest no-brainer in no-brainer history.

  • Posted By: hrob27 @ 10/22/2008 1:45:54 PM

    bojack27, you are missing the point that so many people are making. No one is celebrating abortion. People are saying that the government should not control women's wombs. Crunch all of the numbers you want, but if you are as moral as your quotation of the Bible would have us believe, you will see that this is the truth. Christians don't try to control other people's lives, nor do they persecute others because of their lifestyles or choices. By the way, I don't know how many people here on this blog have actually been to war, but if you have then you would know first hand what I mean by war being worse than abortion. This is not about numbers. This is about wholesale destruction and slaughter. You must also understand that just because someone feels strongly about their religion does not mean that they cannot see the larger picture. Many of our problems today are secular in nature and thus must be looked at and solved from that perspective. That's why so many people who are deeply religious are still choosing a pro-choice candidate because they know that there are larger problems in our society that have to be addressed immediately.

    • Posted By: bojack27 @ 10/22/2008 2:46:43 PM

      Comment: bojack27, you are missing the point that so many people are making. No one is celebrating abortion. People are saying that the government should not control women's wombs.
      You are missing the point that I???m making and other people are making as well. You say that the government shouldn???t have control over a women???s womb??? and I agree ???. Women have the right to have sex with whom ever they want and at anytime they want??? Now when they become pregnant they still have the right to have sex. But as far as giving them the right to decide on the life of the unborn I don???t believe that anyone should have the authority to terminate this life, except if the woman???s life is in jeopardy then it should be her choice if she is willing to give up her life for her unborn. Now with that being said women aren???t in jeopardy of loosing their lives in over 96% of abortions performed in the United States. Making them murderers of innocent children through selfish reasons period!

      Crunch all of the numbers you want, but if you are as moral as your quotation of the Bible would have us believe, you will see that this is the truth. Christians don't try to control other people's lives, nor do they persecute others because of their lifestyles or choices.

      If you cannot see the truth that this is a life we are talking about then all is lost! You say concentrate on this truth but you failed to acknowledge that (1) the unborn is not apart of a woman???s womb and not even apart of her body (2) she is not the sole cause of her pregnancy (therefore negating the rights of the father) (3) fail to establish that this is a life (everyone born goes through this process) (4) many murders have been committed when we humans de-humanize others to justify our actions (Indians =savages, Jews = non-humans, blacks = animals ???.etc) (5) You failed to realize that Planned parenthood was started by a white racist Margaret Sanger to terminate the black race (6) That every form of Eugenics is against the laws of God and nature and in which every war stems from (which you protested in earlier post)

      By the way, I don't know how many people here on this blog have actually been to war, but if you have then you would know first hand what I mean by war being worse than abortion. This is not about numbers. This is about wholesale destruction and slaughter.

      So have you thrown out the numbers and are suggesting the monetary value is more important than human life? What is more wholesale than the systematic destruction and the slaughter and abuse of women throughout the world than Abortion? Planned Parenthood receives close to 1 billion dollars a year to carry out this genocide from tax payers??? dollars. You cannot claimed to be concern about the destruction of other human beings and totally ignore the unborn as collateral damage in the social warfare being raged.


      • Posted By: bojack27 @ 10/22/2008 2:48:23 PM

        You must also understand that just because someone feels strongly about their religion does not mean that they cannot see the larger picture. Many of our problems today are secular in nature and thus must be looked at and solved from that perspective. That's why so many people who are deeply religious are still choosing a pro-choice candidate because they know that there are larger problems in our society that have to be addressed immediately.

        Seeing the larger picture! I see a larger picture than those who think that we must use secular reasoning to solve the problems today. If it wasn???t for religious people in this world the secular thinking people would go uncheck in their agenda of ???Do what is right in your own eyes??? and totally annihilate each other. As for those who you say are deeply religious ???. I say this that they are pseudo religious and deny anything of moral value in order to serve the God of money and selfish gain???

  • Posted By: MegaDeath @ 10/22/2008 2:46:22 PM

    Obama Praised 'Searing and Timely' Book by Ayers
    Barack Obama once gave a glowing endorsement of a book by former domestic terrorist William Ayers and was mentioned by name in the book itself. This story is about two gay men who could not stand to be away from each other. Kind of like "Brokeback Mountain".

  • Posted By: melbs @ 10/22/2008 10:23:14 AM

    This hinges on a definition of 'life' and whether one considers there to be an 'essence' or 'soul' that is Life in an abstract disembodied sense, prior to and independent from complex eco-social relations and physical-material world contexts; or whether one considers 'life' to be entailed by those very embodied relations and contexts. As emotional, rational, and highly social beings, we need to think about which of these 'lives' need promoting and protecting - which of them can we even protect? Is it possible that protecting the former has wide-ranging and deleterious effects on the latter, meaning that a pro-Life stance would then be a detriment to productive interactions and communities, that a culture of Life would then be a degeneration of culture?

    • Posted By: Prayingthevote @ 10/22/2008 2:43:55 PM

      I am Catholic and I would like you to know that our pastor is not ignorant nor narrow-minded. I think you may need to ask your parents exactly how their Priest got away with saying this during Mass. Priests are not allowed to make political statements as you have mentioned here. Before 'you' make narrow-minded statements such as "Funny thing that I am wondering is did the Church stand up to the Nazi's' and 'To be stuck on one issue and not focusing on the future of the children that are born is just plain narrow-minded," research the facts first instead of reading or listening to anti-Catholic remarks and then posting what you feel is the truth. It's a shame that the article did have a few positive statements and what is happening here is just plan Catholic bashing. The Catholic Church gives millions of dollars away during each year. If you want to know the truth about the Catholic Church all you have to do is read your Bible and live by the Ten Commandments. I think one say's, "Thy shall not kill!"

  • Posted By: krigden @ 10/22/2008 2:41:39 PM

    The most important aspect of our inalienable right afforded to us by our Contitution (the rules and morals ALL AMERICANS LIVE AND GOVERN THEIR LIVES BY) the radical "pro-life" advocates (ie the Catholic Church) conveniently overlook is LIBERTY. In this context liberty equates to CHOICE. To create laws and pass judgment in order to limit one's , nay, all person's LIBERTY is as unamerican as you can get. We write laws that punish deeds, but we never right laws that take away the choice the do those deeds.

  • Posted By: Young Hickory @ 10/22/2008 2:25:15 PM

    "No expression of today's commitment to liberty and justice for all can be more basic than the protection offered to those in society who are most vulnerable." Does this apply to Vietnamese children who happened to be underneath John MCain when he bombed them in Vietnam? Are you stating a universal Christian position or just one that applies to only Americans?

  • Posted By: arabeguiled @ 10/22/2008 2:15:27 PM

    thank you. God bless you. you're a voice of sanity in this apparent free fall

  • Posted By: hrob27 @ 10/22/2008 10:40:03 AM

    dsr9996: you might want to include the stats for World Wars One and Two before you come to that conclusion. Are you absolute in your belief that more babies have been aborted than men have been killed in all wars? When you even include the massacres in Africa, the Holocaust, and other war-related deaths, there is no way that conclusion can stand up to the truth. Abortion is indeed sad, but war is far worse. I can say this because I have seen the Iraq War and its effects with my own eyes.

    • Posted By: bojack27 @ 10/22/2008 12:46:48 PM

      WORLDWIDE
      Number of abortions per year: Approximately 42 Million
      Number of abortions per day: Approximately 115,000
      Where abortions occur:
      83% of all abortions are obtained in developing countries and 17% occur in developed countries.
      © Copyright 1996-2008, The Alan Guttmacher Institute. (www.agi-usa.org)
      UNITED STATES
      Number of abortions per year: 1.37 Million (1996)
      Number of abortions per day: Approximately 3,700

      http://www.abortionno.org/Resources/fastfacts.html

      Now here are the number of deaths from wars... even with new estimate it would only reach 5.5 million from 1955-2002.... now let us add in the death of the Jews in Germany and Poland to be around 13 million all together.... and we still haven't reached half the deaths that occur yearly for the unborn.... and mind you that these deaths from war occurred over a 60 year period verses a 1 year period... here are some sights where I got my data from

      http://www1.va.gov/opa/fact/amwars.asp

      5.5 million died in wars from 1955-2002
      http://www.forbes.com/health/feeds/hscout/2008/06/19/hscout616694.html

  • Posted By: kold @ 10/22/2008 11:39:26 AM

    This is a dangerous thing to say, probably, but we all have to depart from this life, this way or that. In an ideal world we would all live to die in sleep of old age. This doesn't happen. Who is to decide, then, what way we leave this world and when? What if abortion comes as the best pro-life choice in certain cases? Had Hitler been aborted, would have the world been better? Who is to judge this? A moral dogma? No, not in my opinion. It must be left on the mother and the people close to her, on their judgment,on trying to figure out the best thing to do. I know, I was given this chance to live, and I do think that it's best to take up the responsibility for one's own actions, but I would never say to any woman, look, you can't do this, or else you go to prison. This would be a total misunderstanding of the life's nature. The Catholic church should shed its fears and treat this world the way it was meant to be - yes to homosexual marriages (it's up to them to decide, the church can only provide leads), yes to the idea that even animals have souls, and many other things that the church isn't able to comprehend. The church's main and only goal is to help and lead to where the truth lies, not in politicking and thinking - this can be, of course, but one has to have that main goal on mind, because anything apart from it is unsubstatial. Church isn't here to judge, so any of its statements, decisions even, partial to legislation, are but dust in one's eyes if they don't follow truth.

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