Dear Mr. President

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  • Posted By: fhunter @ 10/23/2008 1:51:11 PM

    Trying something over and over again that did not work in the first place is the dumbest thing. Why would a Nobel Prize economist would do that? Because Edward C. Prescott advocates to repeat the Bush economy in taxation and health care. Do you think, Mr. Prescott, that this time will come out better? Send back your award to Stockholm, please!

  • Posted By: listeninginlittlerock @ 10/23/2008 1:36:00 PM

    I have no economic background, I'm just a working class American viewing the damage to not only our economy, but our nation. I think the problem is deeper rooted then just making bad loans in order to make more profits for the companies involved so in turn they could temporarily deceive their investors for their personal financial gain. Those and similar unethical practices have been apparent in many ways in far too many of our Fortune 500 companies. The root problem is the integrity of Americans in general.
    You will never make me believe that there were not many people in all of the effected companies from the credit reporting agencies to Wall Street and beyond, that did not realize that their companies had unethical and outright illegal practices in play.
    The problem is people are no longer admired or respected for saying ???no, I won???t be party to such practices???. People are not encouraged to self police the actions of their superior without fear of personally devastating consequences. They are labeled as trouble makers or malcontents and they are generally demoted or fired by companies rather than being viewed as individuals with high moral and ethical standards ??? such standards that would ultimately help protect us all. Until Americans find their integrity again, all the tighter controls and fail safe methods that will come as a result of our financial breakdown, will only work until the next generation of money hungry, blameless self-serving individuals tries to again crush our nation.
    Instead of viewing this national crises as the fault of the Republicans or thinking the Democrats will save us ??? we need to take a long hard look at the business practices of America in general ??? you should never profit at the expense of others ??? in time it will always end up in failure.

  • Posted By: listeninginlittlerock @ 10/23/2008 1:34:29 PM

    I have no economic background, I'm just a working class american viewing the damage to not only our economy but our nation. I think the problem is deeper rooted then making bad loans to make more profits and temporairly look good on the books. Those practices

  • Posted By: marley07 @ 10/23/2008 1:31:43 PM

    First off, 4astrongamerica flat out gets it. Seem to be very few these days who do looking at the polls. I don't like politics as they always get in the way. I don't like big government because typically anything they put there hands on is a disaster. All I care about is having the freedom to make decisions for myself and my family in all aspects. I want to feel safe, which we have since being on the offense after 9/11. I have no problem paying my FAIR share of taxes, but to increase them at this point is sickening on anyone including corporations. Americans need to stop living beyond their means, pointing their fingers at everyone else, and waiting for a hand-out. All you people are going to vote for you who want and that is the way it is supposed to be, but do so from your own research and your own thoughts, not what the media tells you or consensus. This country has become soft and it will get worse with an obama administration and Pelosi and Reid in charge is they have an extremely liberal roadmap to spend on social prgrams with big governement. That would flat out suck and if you don't think so, just wait and you will feel it soon enough if they take over.

  • Posted By: Nins @ 10/23/2008 12:06:12 AM

    The Economist magazine polled 683 professional economists and reported their findings. Of the respondents, 46% were Democrats, 10% Republicans and 44% Independents. The vast majority of them (over 80%) believed that Obama's economic plans will get us out of our current financial crisis. A similar majority believe that McCain's plans will make the economy worse.

    While you can say that all the Dems and all the Repubs may have essentially toed the party line in this survey, it does not account for the fact that essentially all of the Independent economists said that Obama's financial plans are better than McCain's. And if they are a reflection of how Independents across America are thinking, then Obama is going to win. Also, it turns out that about a third of the Republican economists surveyed said that Obama's plans are better.

    That article is in an issue a couple weeks back, still available on-line at:

    http://www.economist.com/world/unitedstates/displaystory.cfm?story_id=12342127&CFID=24946653&CFTOKEN=58463805

    The Oct 11-17th issue of the Economist is titled "Saving the System: the Panic, the Rescues, and a Special Report on the World Economy." Worth reading. It will help you understand what is really going on. http://www.economist.com/printedition/index.cfm?d=20081011


    More articles of interest:

    http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/08/31/business/31view.php

    http://www.newyorker.com/talk/comment/2008/10/27/081027taco_talk_coll

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDofbll86dY&feature=iv&annotation_id=event_922988

    • Posted By: 4astrongamerica @ 10/23/2008 1:27:59 PM

      Maybe they should stop polling the pencil pushers that talk a good talk but have no idea how to fix this mess and start polling small business owners that are actually making a difference. If all of these people had such great ideas, we wouldn't be in this mess right now. Where were they and their bright ideas before the train wreck? It's easy to stand back and say maybe we should have been on another track when the damage is already done. I prefer to listen to people like John McCain that saw it coming and warned us ahead of time. The fact that no one listened and changed course back then doesn't take away from the fact that he was right.

  • Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/23/2008 1:23:05 PM

    People on these bogs are fond of saying that the current economic meltdown was caused by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac underwriting bad mortgages. While Fannie and Freddie obviously are guilty of writing bad mortgages, and worse, guilty of lobbying Congress to allow them to do so with impunity, their actions are just a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to determining who (or what) caused the financial crisis we face today.

    In 1929 the stock market crash caused the banks to fail, because the banks were in bed with the stock market. Back then, banks owned investment houses, so when the stock market fell, the banks fell too. This triggered the Great Depression. So in 1933 the Congress wrote laws that regulated banking, making it illegal for banks to own investment companies, mortgage guaranty companies or insurance companies. The idea was to keep key industries separated by a fire wall, so that if one industry failed the whole economy would not go down in flames.

    But the Republicans under Bush deregulated the banking industry. Senator Phil Gramm wrote legislation (the Gramm Rudman Act, the Gramm Leach Biley Act, etc.) that stripped away the regulations in the financial and insurance industies. He pushed them through the Republican Congress and they were signed into law by Geo. W. Bush. John McCain voted in favor. Everybody said how great it is to deregulate and create free markets.

    Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch each gave over a million dollars to Senator Gramm's re-election campaign.

    The economic collapse that happened later was a direct result of the deregulation, and here's how: the banks wrote bad mortgages, then bundled the mortgages into investment vehicles that they sold all over the world, and they even got firms like AIG to insure the investments. It was all a house of cards.

    If there had been no deregulation, sure we would have had a bunch of bad mortgages, and the mortgage guaranty and real estate industries would have suffered, but there would not have been a global financial meltdown, since the problem would have been contained in one sector of the economy. You can thank Geo W. Bush, Sen. Phil Gramm and Sen John McCain for the meltdown, since they were strong proponents of deregulation.

    Furthermore, although Fannie and Freddie are now holding the bulk of these bad mortgages, Fannie and Freddie did not originally write most of these mortgages. They bought them after the fact, bundled by banks/investment companies. Fannie and Freddie got screwed by the Wall Street fat cats. And so did you, if you pay taxes.

    What is Phil Gramm doing today? He works as a lobbyist in Washington, trying to make it legal for the Swiss bank he represents to sell Death Bonds in the United States. Nice guy, Phil Gramm. Incidentally, John McCain has said that he wants to appoint Phil Gramm as Treasury Secretary. Some people just can't learn from their mistakes.

  • Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/23/2008 1:22:57 PM

    People on these bogs are fond of saying that the current economic meltdown was caused by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac underwriting bad mortgages. While Fannie and Freddie obviously are guilty of writing bad mortgages, and worse, guilty of lobbying Congress to allow them to do so with impunity, their actions are just a small piece of the puzzle when it comes to determining who (or what) caused the financial crisis we face today.

    In 1929 the stock market crash caused the banks to fail, because the banks were in bed with the stock market. Back then, banks owned investment houses, so when the stock market fell, the banks fell too. This triggered the Great Depression. So in 1933 the Congress wrote laws that regulated banking, making it illegal for banks to own investment companies, mortgage guaranty companies or insurance companies. The idea was to keep key industries separated by a fire wall, so that if one industry failed the whole economy would not go down in flames.

    But the Republicans under Bush deregulated the banking industry. Senator Phil Gramm wrote legislation (the Gramm Rudman Act, the Gramm Leach Biley Act, etc.) that stripped away the regulations in the financial and insurance industies. He pushed them through the Republican Congress and they were signed into law by Geo. W. Bush. John McCain voted in favor. Everybody said how great it is to deregulate and create free markets.

    Lehman Brothers, Bear Stearns and Merrill Lynch each gave over a million dollars to Senator Gramm's re-election campaign.

    The economic collapse that happened later was a direct result of the deregulation, and here's how: the banks wrote bad mortgages, then bundled the mortgages into investment vehicles that they sold all over the world, and they even got firms like AIG to insure the investments. It was all a house of cards.

    If there had been no deregulation, sure we would have had a bunch of bad mortgages, and the mortgage guaranty and real estate industries would have suffered, but there would not have been a global financial meltdown, since the problem would have been contained in one sector of the economy. You can thank Geo W. Bush, Sen. Phil Gramm and Sen John McCain for the meltdown, since they were strong proponents of deregulation.

    Furthermore, although Fannie and Freddie are now holding the bulk of these bad mortgages, Fannie and Freddie did not originally write most of these mortgages. They bought them after the fact, bundled by banks/investment companies. Fannie and Freddie got screwed by the Wall Street fat cats. And so did you, if you pay taxes.

    What is Phil Gramm doing today? He works as a lobbyist in Washington, trying to make it legal for the Swiss bank he represents to sell Death Bonds in the United States. Nice guy, Phil Gramm. Incidentally, John McCain has said that he wants to appoint Phil Gramm as Treasury Secretary. Some people just can't learn from their mistakes.

  • Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/23/2008 1:22:36 PM

    After 9/11, the US government started rounding up Muslims without cause and without due process of law, like we did to the Japanese Americans in WWII. The Bush administration called it's main internment camp Guantanamo Bay. While there are certainly many guilty terrorists held in Guantanamo, there are also many innocent American citizens who have been held illegally for years without even being charged with any crime. They have been tortured by our government. Some of them have died.

    Recently the Supreme Court ruled against the Bush administration in the matter of Guantanamo Bay. The Supreme Court Justices were NOT on the side of the terrorists. They were on the side of the Geneva Convention, that says you can not torture POWs, and on the side of US laws that state you can not imprison a person without charging them with a crime and bringing them to trial. I'm sure that like most Americans, the Justices who voted against the illegal, immoral doings at Guantanamo didn't feel sympathy for the terrorists. They felt sympathy for the laws of AMERICA, the land of the FREE, where even rat finks get a fair trial.

    Meanwhile, back in Iraq, the Bush administration is busy trying to build a smokescreen to hide the CRIMES they have committed. Those pesky weapons of mass destruction. Just think, the National Debt went up over 6 trillion dollars under Bush. More than 2 TRILLION of it went directly into the pockets of Halliburton, a corporation owned by the Cheney family. Halliburton is now a DUBAI corporation and therefore is not subject to US taxes. All that money they took out of the US Treasury is going into the coffers of a MUSLIM country.

    Did you hear about how the US government is being charged millions for Halliburton deliveries of sand into Iraq from Kuwait? Sand. Like there is a shortage of sand in Iraq? Another contractor shipped sand from Idaho to Iraq at our expense. Nobel prize winning economist Joseph Stiglitz discusses these and other excesses of our current government's out of control spending in Iraq.

    Your grandchildren will be working like slaves to pay off this debt, so that the Bushes and Cheneys can live the high life in Dubai.

    Yeah, they're patriots, Bush&Co. They wear flag pins. And hide the money they stole from America in Dubai.

    And they want me to believe that Obama is a socialist. Right.

    In case you think McCain is any different than Bush, watch this:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdJUCU1UH2w

  • Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/23/2008 1:22:23 PM

    HE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
    I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
    He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
    is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
    The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
    The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
    the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
    McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
    That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
    It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
    Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
    Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
    Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
    No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
    It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
    even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
    If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
    When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
    So why are the polls even close then ?
    Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
    which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
    They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
    Let's teach him we are smarter than that
    Stand up and hold them accountable
    Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
    Elect Obama Biden 2008






    Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ

  • Posted By: Vote Now @ 10/23/2008 1:22:14 PM

    HE GREAT BUSH DEPRESSION
    I follow an economist named Bob Proctor. He has called the top and bottom of every market crash since the 70s correctly.
    He perfectly predicted the current meltdown and the picture he paints about what will happen next
    is terrifying.He thinks it will be worse then the great depression.
    The banks in the U.S. are going under one after the other. Countrywide ,Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers and Merrill Lynch , Fanny and Freddy Mae ,AIG
    The government took them over because they are bankrupt. Even with the goverment nationalizing hundreds of billions of dollars in debt the stock market is crashing
    the credit markets are frozen and all of us may suffer beyond anything seen in generations
    McCain just like Bush " doesn't understand the economy".
    That not just my opinion its his own words. Not only does he not understand how to fix it but he does not understand how its been broken.
    It is no surprise that he doesn't. The people that make up these securities use quantum mathematical models very few people understand.
    Bush and McCain both can take the credit for this mess since they helped deregulate the laws that were protecting us.
    Bush's economic advisor Phil Graham wrote the deregulation bill that allowed banks to take huge risks with all of our future.
    Now, Phil Graham is the head of McCain's economic policy.He is also McCain's choice for the next secretary of the treasury.
    No one in this country can afford for that to happen. The last time Bush met with his economic advisors was in March. He was the last to know somthing was wrong. Phil Graham had the guts to say that we are in a mental recession after he helped create the worst economy meltdown in our lifetime. Check out this link to the truth http://my.barackobama.com/keatingvideo
    It will take the best and brightest minds in the world to get us out of this nightmare. As bad as Bush has done, McCain would be
    even more destructive because things are in much worse shape. The next president will not inherit a budget surplus like Bush did but a crashing economy and a 11,600,000,000,000 (trillion) dollars deficit. Most of it Bush created and it will take decades to pay it back.
    If you do what you have always done then you will get what you have always got.
    When it comes to policy Bush and McCain are the same 90 percent of the time.
    So why are the polls even close then ?
    Mccains team just said they no longer want to talk about the economy.Instead they would like to spend time talking about obama
    which means running the biggest smear campaign in history.
    They think they can just tell you lies and you wont be smart enough to see through it
    Let's teach him we are smarter than that
    Stand up and hold them accountable
    Bush isn't on the ballot this year but his policies are
    Elect Obama Biden 2008






    Check out this video of sarah palins interview and ask your self if she understands what she is talking about.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r36Xc0GG4iQ

  • Posted By: alphadominance @ 10/23/2008 1:13:35 PM

    America has fallen so far since our heyday in the 50's and if we are to have any hope to returning to global supremacy we need to buoy the lower and middle classes. Pathetically if you earn more than $32,000 you are in the top half of income earners, yet the highest earners make hundreds of millions, or billions. This obscene spread between the mean and median earnings means our economy cannot be sustained as a middle class society. Lets assume the highest income is 100 million and the lowest is zero. This would put the median income at 50million, with the mean about $32,000 as referenced. If we want to consider the scope here, the median income supposed is over 1,562 times the mean. These are dollars we the underclasses are earning, but allowing the CEO's and members of America's "Aristocracy" to steal from us legally. Nobody should earn this huge multiple above their lowest paid employees. It's lost relation to the principle of merit. They earn this due to nepotism and a good 'ol boy network, not because they are so fundamentally smarter or harder working than others. The recent crisis shows they aren't that much smarter then Joe the Plumber, just more entitled. Stop the madness. A longer term mindset must be enforced in business and politics, and we must return to a society of savings and operating on capital vs. credit, particularly in government. Fed economic management is a failed experiment. A return to fundamentals and common sense is a must. Read more on my take on the economy here: http://alphadominance.com/?p=66
    www.alphadominance.com

  • Posted By: canyoureadthisredneck @ 10/23/2008 11:25:01 AM

    Marley says, "Finally I am not even going to start Obama because i don't have the time type that much. Bottom line on Obama IF he is president, we will see the great depression" Well Duh! of course there is a good chance there will be a deep recession or depression, but it has been caused by the IDIOT Bush and Reagan and their Lazier Faire policies over the last 20 years. Finally I recommend you returen to school and try to earase that bigoted ignorant red-neck attitude of yours.

    • Posted By: marley07 @ 10/23/2008 11:34:20 AM

      Oh and by the way, this mess was caused by lazy Americans who think they deserve a house they can't afford that was pushed by democrats in congress like Frank and Schummer and artifiially low interest rates made by Greenspan. Why do you think he was on the hill today being drilled and simply asked if it was his fault? Clinton signed the bill into law. check your facts idiot. Clinton had a free ride from a booming economy from technology. He was too busy sitting in his office with monica under the desk to do anything constructive. I can tell you are the type that likes Clinton and enjoys people flat out lying to your face. Amazing how stupid america has come to get their information from the liberal media.

      • Posted By: TheVigil @ 10/23/2008 12:07:13 PM

        Can you please explain to me how the CRA caused the practices of using credit swaps to get around liquidity requirements and running at 40-to-1 leverage ratios? These played a MAJOR part in the economic crisis and had nothing to do with anyone's foolish home purchases. The banks were required to grant loans to people who often were a bad investment, but NOBODY made them reduce their cash on hand or borrow more than forty times what their company was worth.

        Also, quite honestly, if I make a bad loan, and it doesn't get paid back, that's on *me*. There's no other industry in America where you can blame your customers for your bankruptcy. I loaned some friends a couple thousand dollars to try to start a business. They went under. I spent a month or so trying to get my money back and moved on. If just about any private individual loaned money out this way, and they started to complain to anyone else about it, the response would be "Well, you're an idiot for loaning it out." But somehow this doesn't apply to Wall Street. There were PLENTY of subprime loans given out that had nothing to do with CRA requirements. My feeling is, well, you loaned out money to someone who screwed you over. Tough luck. Next time maybe you'll know better.

        • Posted By: esq1991 @ 10/23/2008 12:26:13 PM

          I don't think you have read much about the issue and how the social agenda that Dems were pushing to get everyone in a house led to reduced lending standards and ignoring common guidelines in place when I bought my house. My mortgage could not exceed 25% of my income and all debt could not be over 30%. But with the CRA and the social engineering Clinton et al pushed, these types of limits were ignored. For example, I read an article yesterday in a Calif. paper about how the housing market is starting to rebound and it included a story about a couple of sisters who had purchased homes next to each other. The one had a husband who was a painter and when his business dropped, they were foreclosed and they and their two kids now live in a two-bedroom apt for $750 a month. Sad story, but here's the point that demonstrates how ignorant people are and how lax the standards were: the mortgage was $2,000 per month and the income was only $3,200 net! She said when they bought the thouse business was good and they thought they could do it. Duh! How would you raise four people on $1,200 after paying your mortgage? Why do you think Countrywide went under? The subprime mess and loans to people like that. Why were they making those loans? Pressure from the Dems and ACORN to make these loans. ACORN would threaten banks with lawsuits to block mergers, I believe it was, if they could not prove they were making the same # of mortgages in disadvantaged areas as others. Why would any politician or the President think that was a good idea to push that policy? It was a disaster waiting to happen.. I saw a special where an economics professor explained in very plain fashion how this whole mess began and came to a head. The problem didn't start with Bush; it started under Clinton and just happened to manifest itself at this time. And people saw it coming; no one wanted to listen. One person being interviewed (I think he was reporter for WSJ) remembers interviewing the head of Countrywide and asking questions and raising the concerns that what has happened could. Do you know what happened? He said the man sat there and screamed at him and told him to shut up because he didn't know what he was talking about. Have you seen the YouTube video of Barney Frank, Maxine Waters, and Raines saying there was no problem, when it was around the same time Raines had to resign over falsifying earnings to boost his bonuses? Hummmm - seems Countrywide and the others were the ones who didn't know what they were talking about. It's just very convenient to blame everything on Bush. I do agree that greed does play a role and there probably are a number of forces that contributed, but it is clear from a number of sources that the subprime mess played a large role and the situation today might not be as bad as it is if it had not been for those loans.

          • Posted By: TheVigil @ 10/23/2008 1:05:15 PM

            Believe it or not, I agree with the majority of the things

            you just said. People WERE foolish. The nation

            collectively got greedy, and wanted to live above its means.

            It's a huge problem and one of the big drivers of this

            mess. I hope you will believe me when I say the homebuyers

            are by no means innocent with regard to the consequences

            here. People spent way above their means.

            You're talking about the CRA, so let me say that I think

            that the CRA was a well-intentioned and idealistic piece of

            legislation that ignored some very inconvenient realities

            about the lower-middle classes and poor, the main reason of

            which is that a lot of them manage their finances poorly. It was intended to reduce another genuine problem, which was the practice of "redlining" or denying loans to *qualified* buyers based on their current residence in a lower-income area, but went way too far in the other direction. It was a poor piece of legislation and a major contributor to this mess.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Community_Reinvestment_Act

            I have done a fair amount of reading into all of this - the

            default swaps, the tranches, the securitization, the CRA,

            the leverage, and all the other factors of this "perfect

            storm", so to speak. They're all interrelated. What I'm

            arguing against is the tendency among a certain group to

            argue that the CRA was the devil incarnate and responsible

            for causing this entire problem, which is absolutely not the

            case.

            I absolutely at this point do not deny its status as a contributor to this *particular* crisis. But EQUALLY as important and risky were the practice of using credit default swaps as a form of unregulated insurace and the practice of borrowing forty times as much as a bank was worth or more. When you do that, *any* major downturn will bankrupt your company. If the banks were truly concerned about their companies, they would have *tightened* credit standards on the rest of their loans in order to compensate for the increased risk on the CRA loans. Hopefully everyone knows the extent to which they did absolutely the opposite, reducing credit standards across the board to next to zero.
            CRA or not, banks were engaged in a whole mess of risky practices. Putting the entirety of the blame on the CRA is a convenient way for the pro-financial sector to avoid some of their own responsibility for the other things that were going on.

            • Posted By: TheVigil @ 10/23/2008 1:11:52 PM

              Sorry for the line breaks, by the way. Copied and pasted from Notepad, which is...not the most compatible of word processors.

    • Posted By: marley07 @ 10/23/2008 11:29:54 AM

      we are in a recession and business globally will slow for a while, but we can avoid a depression without Obama. He will limit growth, eliminate jobs and use the rediculous idea of "trickle up." Stupid. The last thing we need is to have more government. I enjoy the idea of private property and making my own decisions on how I live my life. Obviously you don't agree supporting Obama.

  • Posted By: RFlorida @ 10/23/2008 2:14:55 AM

    Some people in the world need to learn basic math. Currently our national debt is about 10 trillion that is 10 plus 9 zeros. we currently owe about $33,000 in national debt for every man women and child. A million dollars for every tax payer ( about 150 million) would be about 150,010 trillion 150,010,000,000,000 of national debt including our current debt. I'm not sure what they call that numberis called but I think it is a 150 Zillion ten trillion. The e-mail floating around that says 200 million tax payers that split the 85 billion loan to AIG would get 425,000 each is really only $425 each if you do the math correctly. I hope I didn't bust anyones bubble.

    • Posted By: esq1991 @ 10/23/2008 12:35:06 PM

      Since the Dems want everyone to share the wealth, maybe George Soros and Obama's rich Hollywood friends could spread some of their wealth around to each of us to shoulder our shares of that debt!

  • Posted By: Tony Francis @ 10/23/2008 2:50:03 AM

    Hi Geniuses, my name is Tony Francis, a non-deans list college graduate from a 4th tier state college. The only way to fix the 'GLOBAL' economy is for the United States (which is the primary market for the entire world) to place a tax or a 'tariff' on imported goods in order to secure domestic jobs. If people are out of work they are not going to buy domestic or even foreign products placing all markets in jeopardy. The system in place now supports the production and sale of cheaper foreign products that have flooded the global market and wreaked havoc on factories in the United States. One does not need to address the unemployment rate but one does need to draw attention to the number of poorly employed - for example a 40 or 50 year old supporting a family by working for $9 an hour at a Home Depot. If they were working on the floor at GM they would earn a fairer wage.

    Free trade is naive, the Japanese buy Japanese cars because they are Japanese. This goes for all markets accept for those of the United States where we are so diverse and optimistic that we blind ourselves to the national pride of our competitors.

    Buying American is the only way.

    15 - 20% luxury tax on all goods imported to the United States. 5% tax on products that are made by foreign companies but manufactured by US workers. The tax money goes to subsidize its American counterpart and the price of the American product is driven down creating more jobs and boosting both domestic and foreign products. Once the economy is healed people will want 'luxury' foreign goods again.

    -Tony Francis
    B.A. History, Film and Political Science (Non-Nobel Prize Winner)

    • Posted By: esq1991 @ 10/23/2008 12:33:52 PM

      No, the Japanese buy Japanese cars because they are built better and you get more quality for the money. I have not purchased an American car for decades, and I have seen my Japanese cars last much longer than American ones, without any mechanical problems. I get more for my money every time I buy a new Japanese car. The problem with the auto industry is not something that could be helped by stopping competition. They produce an inferior product that costs so much more to make due to the costs of production, which includes paying auto workers probably $30 to $40 per hour to push a button plus a lot of good benefits. No, the problem in this country is the cost of doing business, and taxes is another one of those costs. I mean, I don't need to do a study to know that taxes play a role - when you see businesses leave as taxes rise, there must be a relationship.

  • Posted By: jbs5280 @ 10/22/2008 10:17:25 PM

    marley07, was that the year you were born? FREEDOM? What do you call being a slave to $4/gallon almost overnight and the damage it's done to this country? FREEDOM? What part of the First Amendment have the narrow minded right wingnuts tried to take away by trying to publicly humiliate anyone with a measurable IQ, particularly those with an exceedingly high IQ. DUMBED DOWN is what you all have done by voting Bush in twice and trying to get Bush Jr for another 4 or 8. Just don't vote anymore. A blinding glimpse of the obvious is not enough for you to believe that we're on a path to ruination. It frankly amazes me how many sheep there are in America on 2 legs. You would follow these people off a cliff and you're reference to 'Socialism' and Obama is anothat Karl Gestapo Rove tactic out of his playbook. I bet you're a Christian too. We had one of those in CO Springs pray for rain the night Obama gave his acceptace speech at the DNC in Denver. Pray for rain? What part of Christianity is that, the Roman part? You people are just dumb AND crazy.

    • Posted By: marley07 @ 10/22/2008 10:46:13 PM

      A slave to $4/gallon in oil? that is funny. I suppose this financial mess and high oil prices is Bush's fault or the GOP's fault right? Well if you believe that, you are jsut like all the other idiots who listen to the media. I would recommend understanding how the markets work, how capitalism works and how we are now a global economy more than our own. That might help before making comments like that. What does relgion have to do with this by the way? And follow these guys off a cliff, that is funny. I am not of fan of government period. Bush, MCcain, Obama whoever, but guess what, you deal with the hand laid in front of you and that is McCain or Obama. I am not going to vote for Obama so I can have my hard earned dollars taken away and given to some joker like you who won't get off his ass and do something on his own instead of bitch and complain about everyone else doing well. Oh and who had the stage looking like Rome for his acceptance speech? Oh yeah that conceded, tax raising, fascist Obama.

      • Posted By: jbs5280 @ 10/23/2008 8:45:29 AM

        You have no idea what you're talking about. Get off my ass? You have to be shitting me. I own a business and have for decades and would wager my entire net wealth that it exceeds yours exponentialy. . The difference between you and I is that I am not an *** to other people and don't step on their backs to make my way. If you truly understood anything, it would be amazing. I've travelled this globe for many years and have a global perspective but any strategy from anyone that does not include the people is flawed to begin with. I don't need a handout and could retire right now at 54 and in fact, could have done that 10 years ago if I had wanted, but I preferred to keep my practice going for not only clients but for the great people that work in my business that have made it so successful. I profit share so they can have a good life too. People only need so much in this world to have a great life and the feeling of helping another deserving person in this country is something you'll never know. Continue on this path of the great divide between the haves and the have nots, and you will see the next revolution in this country. Understand a little human psychology dumbshit when people's security is threatened. You might want to study a couple of people in our history like Carl Rogers and Abrahm Maslow, who can give you a lessen in human nature. That's the trouble with you morons, You have no respect for differences of opinion and true intellect. But since you obviously have no intellect other than what the right wingnuts run up your ass and down your throat, then all you will do is to continue to look at the world thru a coctail straw. You are a sick ***.

        • Posted By: marley07 @ 10/23/2008 12:01:24 PM

          yeah i am ... to other people. Typical obama supporter response. You owned a business and traveled the world? wow so impressed, hahaha. Maybe you should find out what i do before making a statement jackass. I manage money for 100's of thousands of people in their pension plans, 401k's etc, which i would not call running people over to make my way. Like I said before if you want to support Obama and believe what he will bring to the table will be a good thing, then go live somehwere else because that is not America my friend.

  • Posted By: BillinVegas @ 10/22/2008 9:54:11 PM

    Six "Nobel Prize Winners"? Wow, that really means something doesn't it. Lets see, a lawyer/politician with zero, sip, nada education, experience or training in ANY field remotely resembling environment, climate or earth sciences, wins a Nobel Prize for his opinions on so-called global warming, and we are supposed to take the Nobel committee awards seriously. Right, may as well ask Santa what to do with the economy.

    • Posted By: nimodahooligan @ 10/23/2008 11:24:59 AM

      wow, have you ever met a nobel prize winner? a nobel peace prize winner? a nobel prize scienctific acheivement winner? how ignorant are you...thse people are at the forefront of research/intelligent thought and are some of the most educated progressive thinkers on the planet, thats why its called an acheivement...and without those people you would not have the research that might have brought along a medical breakthrough that just saved your life, or creates artificial intelligence, or any one of the areas of humanity...

      and yes, it is VERY un american, VERY unpatriotic, and VERY VERY sad to see a comment like that...

      im just assuming your voting for McCain and Palin cuz your comfortable with mediocrity...

    • Posted By: notroubleatall1963 @ 10/22/2008 10:04:03 PM

      That's right, just scoff and laugh at all the Nobel decision makers and the rest of the world, who thinks that Al Gore truly deserved a Nobel Prize - who aren't beholden to the moron-class in this country who is totally duped and hoodwinked into voting against their own best interests by the GOP, the party of the Richest Few manippulating the Dummies in the USA.

      Such scoffing at achievement and excellence is counter-productive, un-American, and anti-progressive. If everyone thought like you, we'd really be mired in swamp of ignorance, I'm sorry to say. Sure, have your opinion and share it freely - but that's mine, and I think yours sucks.

  • Posted By: RO in Reno @ 10/23/2008 9:47:39 AM

    If you look at the US as one large single business, bringing it into profitability would not be easy or quick.
    The US has for many years had an outflow of cash much greater than its income largely due to the flow of cash to the Middle East for crude and to China and India for goods.
    Dating from the time Nixon declared the US a "service economy" and with the
    Republicans in office for 30 out of the last 40 years, the US has literally given away it ability to produce a saleable product that would have resulted in profitability.

    The housing crisis is the end result of a stopgap economy that provided cash flow so people could think the economy was just fine. It wasn't and all the equity has now been drained out of it. The bailout will prop up prices for a short time but nothing more. And in the long run will only add to the problem providing cash for banks to lend so the consumers can borrow go further in debt, and again have zero equity.

    Trade agreements are fine, an agreement to buy and sell, the problem is America sent their products to the trade partner to manufacture and became just a buyer with nothing to sell.

    When we see the basis of the economy dependant on a workforce that is as much as 25% in the banking and real estate business, another 20% in government, 25% in health care. Then I guess we have nearly achieved the Republican vision for America, we have a service economy but still have nothing to sell.

    28% of America is now below the poverty level, these are the people who did not heed Nixon's Reagan's and Bush's advise to get a degree and join the "service economy" they are the people who once worked in the now nonexistent manufacturing sector that once produced products for sale that supported the whole country.

    It seems the Republican vision for America lacked one thing; common sense.

  • Posted By: Nowforthetruth @ 10/23/2008 8:17:14 AM

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/27324419/

    AP poll: Candidates running nearly even 10/22/08

    Neck-and-neck results are a departure from many recent national polls
    WASHINGTON - The presidential race tightened after the final debate, with John McCain gaining among whites and people earning less than $50,000, according to an Associated Press-GfK poll that shows McCain and Barack Obama essentially running even among likely voters in the election homestretch.

    The poll, which found Obama at 44 percent and McCain at 43 percent, supports what some Republicans and Democrats privately have said in recent days: that the race narrowed after the third debate as Republican-leaning voters drifted home to their party.

  • Posted By: GregHere @ 10/23/2008 7:14:02 AM

    ............................Just look at the Bush Years to see how the Country has gone down the road on the wrong track with the Economy and with all of the other Bush Blunders. If people have not seen the news presented them and do not realize that they need to get away from the Bush Policies and Priorities it is a shame.............But maybe they have been watching FOX News, the Right Wing Propaganda Station. "Maverick" McCain has supported the Bush Administration 90% of the time even though McCain has a Song and Dance going that he is all different so that he will appear better for the Election.......McCain is an old veteran politico giving us his tricks and saying things to fool us!!!

  • Posted By: ComplainceAuditor @ 10/23/2008 6:42:14 AM

    Nasty rescession by January? My level headed, Harvard petiton carrying campus dwelling bearded friend. We are in a rescession and look to be going into a depression by early 2nd quarter. Thats all, stand corrected!

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