WORLD AFFAIRS

The Death of the Dissident

Russian nationalism is surging, and now even one-time liberals are turning away from the West.

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  • Posted By: Glenno @ 11/09/2008 7:17:58 PM

    The reason a lot of young people in Russia are starting to hate America is the same reason why Europeans are starting to hate America. Wars, missile shield, interference in other nations elections, arms build up, no respect for international law, nato expansion, encirclement of russia, war crimes etc.

  • Posted By: FrVladimir @ 11/01/2008 2:11:15 AM

    To understand Russia and Russian it is necessary to go not only across Moscow, but also it is far behind it. Hura-patriotism exists last decades unless only for politicians who occupied capital of Russia. Russia always was monarchic, and to us, to the simple people, no business is present up to ideals of the West. We live an own life. Russia is a huge country. Analogues in the world to it are not present. As each country in the world is unique also. And search of management always was. Therefore both falling and rises in the huge country with greater consequences. Nobody will help Russia advice. You know, I am not going to learn the fisherman of Alaska as it is necessary to fish a fish... Silly and far...

  • Posted By: Glenno @ 10/30/2008 11:32:23 PM

    Americans are patriots and Russians are nationalists???

    What did Putin do that was so bad, reducee poverty, build a middle class, increase birth rates, increase life expectancy, defend Russians when attacked? Those damn Russians decide to be proud of their country as NATO encircle them, humiliate them and sponsor attacks through Georgia.

  • Posted By: advoidleftists @ 10/28/2008 12:13:45 PM

    This nationalism in russia and way russia been acting looks so much like way nazi germany rised. Alot of folks making sound like Russia innocent but in reality there been state sanctioned murder on anyone who talks bad about dictactor putin and his puppet president who has no power. This is not rise of Soviet Union but this nationalism and way russia been acting like way nazi germany did but without all that racial killings and holocost. Open your eyes this is so familair and Russia is going do whatever it takes bully eastern european nations who want to join nato which is any nation right but according to russia those nations have no rights. Russia bully nations too using her gas. The new indiana movie pissed off russian leadership and any thing that small seem to make them mad sounds like nazi germany leadership but if western europe continues with impeasement like they did to nazi germany the end result will be disaster. Europe always been known for appeasement they did it with hitler and now putin which is greatest threat to the world as long he going around murdering X kbg agents who willing to talk to the west or innocent journalist who show darker side of putin. I never trust Russian state TV reporters anything under State control ( propaganda)

    • Posted By: oea65 @ 10/29/2008 9:45:02 PM

      Shut up, the USA has been acting like NAZI Germany, torture included.

      • Posted By: Kuksha @ 10/30/2008 12:06:26 PM

        Yes do not say lies! Whom else for Putin have not shot also execution at us it is forbidden. At what here Hitler - a fruit of the inflamed imagination? Putin the first sane president of Russia, and lick to it.... Officials. USA and England with pleasure have accepted all Russian gangsters of 90th years.

  • Posted By: Kuksha @ 10/30/2008 11:38:50 AM

    From Russia.USA the patriotic hysteria worries too. Look as confused wars are advertised, be better than the American democracy cannot anything else. And cinema look - the obligatory raising of a flag and delivery of awards have finished with the next monster. In Russia half of population with medieval consciousness and all wait for the good tsar. Democracy in 90th years has appeared such dung that badly all. But we do not have pathological hatred as at - guess at whom? l

  • Posted By: alex_85 @ 10/29/2008 5:10:27 PM

    I grew up in the former USSR and I've witnessed much of the turbulent 90s. Those were awful times and I am very happy to see economic growth and an emerging middle class in Russia. However, I do not see how it was a US-driven plan to devastate Russia economically. Let's not forget that it was the old party elite and the government employees in the position of power that robbed their own people blind in massive sell offs of state property and unlawful privatization projects. Current hysteria and paranoia of the Russian state news channels (there are not very many independent ones, right?) is part of the Kremlin's strategy to create a common enemy and shift the public attention from a near totalitarian regime at home onto the US which is all of a sudden out to get Russia. The Georgian war is another planned patriotism booster. Come on now, crossing the border into a tiny country and overwhelming Georgian military with sheer numbers is not that much to celebrate. This current government-led chest thumping is used to keep Russians from pondering the following questions: who really elected the new president in March, why is Russia the most dangerous place for journalists, what happened to independent media and how does the life quality in the countryside compare to that in the city. Russian government is quick to take credit for the economic growth, while it's not all that difficult to out-muscle all of the competition in the energy sector (BP is the latest example) and reap the benefits of the world's increasing demand. I won't be surprised if there isn't already a mandatory Little Putinci organization for the elementary school kids.

    • Posted By: streetwise @ 10/30/2008 9:57:57 AM

      The Georgian war is another planned patriotism booster. Come on now, crossing the border into a tiny country and overwhelming Georgian military with sheer numbers is not that much to celebrate.

      The georgian war (better said: incredible mistake -from the georgian point of view, of course-) was such an unespected and unpredictable gift for Putin that no one can say that he "planned" it . Right, georgian army was not a juggernaut (maybe they thought it, after years of US training, but...), but crush it was simply the duty of russian soldiers, under circumstances . Politically, it has been an injection of self-exteem for the army and Russia as a wole . And that can't be bad...

  • Posted By: advoidleftists @ 10/28/2008 12:18:31 PM

    Putin will use anything to blame the world except themselfs because they know by using this to make public hate the outside world is a tactic to assert control on them and assure loyality from public which is sad I see nazi germany all over again the new Russian national empire is going to rise and west has to be prepared that if russia invades ukraine we will back those innocent nations. then what is the folks on these forums still going to blame anyone but the russian for the next country she invades???? This is just nazi germany again wake up but most folks here probly russians

    • Posted By: oea65 @ 10/29/2008 9:42:38 PM

      Shut up, you wish we had a president with Putin's balls and brain (88 % rate aproval)

  • Posted By: oea65 @ 10/29/2008 9:38:03 PM

    By the way, Russia didn't lose any war in Afghanistan, the Soviet Union did. Russia won the war in Chechnya, they just named the main avenue in Grozny after Vladimir Putin, and the Chechen "bin Laden", different than the real one, is dead. What kind of journalists are you?

    Russia is a highly educated nation, it is about time they realize the West is a hypocrite whining old lady, which fears a strong Russia.
    Russia's future lays in the East together with China and India, the next superpowers, if this happens the West will regret it. Only France, Germany and Italy are aware of this, but the Anglo-Saxon duo and the vengeful former communist Baltic states keep pushing for confrontation.

  • Posted By: Kuksha @ 10/29/2008 1:29:56 PM

    From Russia. USA were for us a fairy tale or a myth at the time of cold war. Fantastic locks unfortunately collapse in due course! Dissidents do not speak about the present, do not know what to do and many were engaged in business. Watering by dirt USSR - has bothered. Democracy has brought with itself to Russia unemployment, a narcotism, disorder of a family and other bad things. But the most sad goes nation change, will be possible years through 100 Russia the Islamic or Prochinese state.

  • Posted By: SergioLatino @ 10/29/2008 12:40:56 PM

    Newsweek is an American magazine and mirrors the view of the mainstream U.S. political views. This article in particular illustrates why the United States has lost 100% of its credibility with Russians. Russians praise the progress of their country but Newsweek calls it "jingoism", "staunch nationalism", "crowing", "gloating", and ends the the incredibly biased report by implying that the Kremlin is to blame for racist attacks and that it's all a "cynical ploy with sinister precedents". What a joke.

  • Posted By: streetwise @ 10/29/2008 10:33:02 AM

    west has to be prepared that if russia invades ukraine we will back those innocent nations
    -
    Georgia (better said, the georgian government and army) was not innocent at all in the recent crisis (even BBC says so, now) . And Ucraine is not at risk at all . Russians have other ways beside war to obtain what they need from it (no Nato forces, etc.) . And they are not fools...

  • Posted By: streetwise @ 10/29/2008 10:22:35 AM

    Now, for the first time in a generation, Russians have a short, victorious war to crow about, after defeats in Afghanistan and Chechyna.
    -
    Not exactly . The 1st chechen war (started by the "democratic" Eltsin) was indeed a defeat . The 2nd one was not a victory to chant about (it was a civil war, after all, and russians sometimes use, say, "unnecessary roughness"...), but if THAT war was a defeat (a friendly, if not unreproachable, regime firmly in power in the region, "freedom fighters" out of order and a row of enemy chiefs gone-gone -Basaev, Khattab, etc.-), what in the hell is Irak (and Afghanistan too) ?

  • Posted By: TMacPen @ 10/28/2008 5:48:32 PM

    Interesting. Just as we are having the biggest 'socialist' candidate running for office here (and having so much or our media pushing him as hard as they can), the Russians are waking up to some nationalistic feelings about not wanting to be abused and threatened! I don't blame them. Their 'liberal groups pushed them into weakness and their people got fed up with it.
    The most sucessful period of our history was when we had a competetor to face against. It would be nice to ensure they are stable and not hostile, no they don't have to like us, but let them compete as we did in the Space Race. They got satelittes up first and even the first astronaut, while we got to the moon. (Lets try to skip the Vietnam and Afganistan mess though, both sides ended up loosing from those tug of wars in 3rd party countries). 2 or 3 Superpowers balancing each other would be better in the long run (as long as all sides realize that Nuclear Destruction is the most realistic balance to everybody, as much as none of us really wants that Genie to come out of the bottle). I say let them feel proud to be Russian, just like I am proud to be American. (I don't kill Russians or even dislike them, just like I expect them to give me the same respect).

  • Posted By: Arby74 @ 10/28/2008 1:16:24 AM

    Oh I believe there is some misunderstanding with NGO Sova report.
    It is widely known now (thanks to NGO Filin) no foreigners have been killed and only 6 wounded in Russia last 18 months.
    The NGO Sova report is obviously outdated.

  • Posted By: M E @ 10/26/2008 12:46:36 AM

    I agree with Vyacheslav Igrunov ??? I was also disenchanted with how Western countries reported on and supported Georgia during the August war. Western media barely covered it at first, and they almost totally disregarded eye-witness accounts describing how American soldiers were included with the Georgian troops during the fighting. One little girl, another eye-witness, was allowed to appear briefly on Fox but then she got shouted down by the announcer. The first Western stories insisted Russia invaded poor innocent Georgia without provocation. Hello? Then Western news articles supported Saakashvili, that vicious little ankle-biter, both spiritually and politically, and we kept propping him up as our ???friend??? and an ???example of democracy??? when he was anything BUT. The Georgians themselves knew what kind of an ???example??? he was when he put down protests in their capitol. And the news here in the States didn???t mention how, the very day that the Georgians invaded South Ossetia, the American-led fleet involved in war games in the Atlantic promptly changed course and steamed for the Persian Gulf (that news I found off of a business site in Europe, not in the States). Was Saakashvili supposed to keep the Russians occupied long enough for us to bomb Tehran? And it???s not just me asking. Well, it didn???t work, if that was the plan. The Georgians lost in less than a week, which shocked us and even convinced the Israelis, who had helped arm Georgia, to say ???It wasn???t us! We???re good friends with the Russians! Here, have some nanotech!??? But how much of that was in the mainstream news? And now the latest stories are all about how Russia is being paranoid because they don???t like it when we place missiles on their doorstep? Well, we didn???t like it either when the Soviets started placing missiles in Cuba, but I guess that doesn???t count. Gosh, who would have thought that the Russians would be so unreasonable!
    Before August, I had no idea what was happening in the Caucasus and I didn???t care. I accepted all the propaganda - er ???news??? - here in the States about Russia and the supposedly beneficent NATO activity. But I don???t accept it anymore, not without a bushel of salt. Western media coverage proves, yet again, to be grossly slanted and inaccurate. I???m not the only American who feels this way, either; a lot of us are reading and posting on foreign news sites ??? especially if they are on a completely different continent. They have their own slant to the news, but when foreign stories are overlapped with American news, a kernel of truth can be discovered. It won???t ever be discovered by following American or even Western news alone, which is sad. What surprises me now is that you are surprised when Russia looks in other directions than just to the West for friends. We haven???t exactly proven ourselves to be friendly.

    • Posted By: Braes @ 10/28/2008 12:23:42 AM

      About Fox, it is a political channel just for the Republicans. Like Pravda a long time ago. They are part of America's problem, as they have done disinformation against our own democracy. They propagandized people here.
      Saakashvili and Cheney, and Randy Schunemann of the McCain campaign all had a media plan for this war. Please do not judge us based on them. Few of us believe anything they say anymore.

  • Posted By: bormotello @ 10/26/2008 11:45:20 AM

    Russian liberals are betrayed by Western media, which decided that support of Saakashvili regime is more important then truth
    West can forget about support inside Russia. Only pure pragmatism and money, but no acceptance of western values anymore, which are in closer look all lie

    • Posted By: Braes @ 10/28/2008 12:15:57 AM

      Saakashvili is seen as a puppet of the Republicans, and I openly denounce his behavior. I think he is a sick thug. This problem has been brewing because of things being handled poorly since 91. There was no real plan to tie Russia to the world system in a co-operative and positive way. You should have been brought into the WTO and NATO/EU system early. The horrible times of your economic change should have been adressed. Lost time can not be regained. We can however begin to undo the stupid things.
      You should be angry at the governments here that made the mistakes, we sure are. Only 9% of Americans think things are on the right track. The American people are good, and when they figure out all of the things they will want them changed. Most here have been buried in more work and less wages, and have had little time to study the problems. That is changing. Election participation this time may set records.
      I hope this is good for us both.

  • Posted By: AndreiL @ 10/27/2008 8:00:34 AM

    There's a crucial mistake in viewing current US administration as the "voice of the West".

    It isn't. Ask Russians and, especially, liberal minded ones, what do they think of European Union. It would reverse your conclusions upside down.

    George W. Bush has actually stolen American dream in favour of rather commercial and ideological interests. Liberal minded Russians are frustrated by total inability of US & UK political elite (and mass media as well) at least to consider interests and arguments of Russians. They would rather live in illusionary world of "peaceful and democratic Georgian president Saakashvili engaged in a liberty struggle with resurgent autocratic Russia". And would defend those illusions with energy of Al-Kaeda militants.

    It appeared to be something different in the time of Clintons. Russians have seen them unfair in treating Serbia but that was more of an exception than a rule.

    • Posted By: Braes @ 10/28/2008 12:02:28 AM

      Andrei,
      I have to ask you to give us a chance to change governments here and take a different look at the world. I am aware that the United States has made horrible mistakes in dealing with Russia. Condi Rice was supposed to be an expert, but she was an adversary of peace, and a neo-con who believed in war as an instrument of policy. This has been crazy.
      Nothing can be accomplished without global great power co-operation and trust. The party of self-interest, the Republicans, have done terribly. The Democratic Party has always been damaged if they tried to reach out to the world in new ways as risky and dangerous. I believe the political winds here are strong enough to carry through solid reforms.
      We need Russia, not for her resources or land, but your brains.
      Some of us have been yelling at the government here about how the missile system and the NATO expansion would appear to Russia. The Republicans did not care. Shame on them.
      We need a new way forward and need to re earn the trust of many people. I hope that way will be open. I understand the feelings and apologize.

  • Posted By: jxl269 @ 10/26/2008 9:28:28 PM

    Huh, Huh. What a surprise for brainwashed Americans! The Chinese has done so almost 2 decades earlier. Russians are no less intelligent and here they are. Now any one in the US is going to ask "who lost China" and "who lost Russia"?

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