A Post-Evangelical America

I do not know why the religious right has any right to use ones " Christianity" as a litmus test for public office.
First of all they can't define what a "Christian" is except in their own narrow view. THere are well over 250 recognized religious sects or churches that call themselve Christian and range from people who drink poison and handle venomous snakes to those who feel perfectly comfortable with homosexual marriage and homosexual clergy. That is a huge diversity of viewpoints.

Second, this is a pluralistic society made up of people of various religions. The religious right veils their prejudice by taking up the Cross and proclaiming the US to be a Christian country, no one else need apply.
At first their venom was directed at the Jews and now its the Muslims. Well I would rather have 1 Jew, Muslim. or aetheist who has read the Constitution and understands it and ABIDES by it to raise this Country to measure up to its ideals than a whole host of Christians singing Hallelujah while the ship of State sinks beneath the waves. I laugh every time I see or hear a Christian rally where someone is yammering about the Jewish influence in America- banking, movies, culture, etc. and how it is having a negative pervasive influence over "American" culture and values. They then join hands and sing " God Bless America" a song written by one of the most patriotic songwriters our land has known, Irving Berlin---a Jew.

I forget who said this but it is a great line " Be wary of people who call themselves "Christian", some of them are the descendants of people that lions refused to eat." As I listen to some of the hateful remarks made by these people, fore example Elizabeth Dole, I worry about this country. THey are cultivating the came attitudes that were so prevalent in Europe and which Hitler used to his advantage to rise to power. As for Kulture Kritics statements about Hitler, Stalin, and Pol Pot both Hitler and Stalin were raised in religious families, Stalin was even in the Orthodox seminary for a time.

I would tell the Evangelicals to quit looking for hidden meanings and future happenings in the Bible and read it for the real message that is plainly on its face. YOU have become the Pharisees and Saducees that Christ warned about and it is time that you quit worrying about others 'salvation' and start to worry about your own.

I also want to say that I was raised a Chrstian and went to both Christian grade schools and college for my greduate and post-graduate degrees. On some matters close to your heart and your concern I agree with you. It is your methods that I cannot and will not tolerate. If there is something that you REALLY want to do for this country, give up your tax exempt status under 501(c) (3) of the tax code and pay your way like everyone else. If you want to call the dance, pay the band.

1. This election was about the economy first, the war second and all other issues were way down the list. Therefor, it is not surprising that Obama won in spite of the religious right. Those people are intractable and many of them are single issue voters. The problem was that despite his endorsement by the Rpublican Party, and Palin's forced attachment to his campaign, John McCain is not a soldier in the born again Christian army. Given those circumstances, the effect of religion on this particular election was minimized. That doesn't mean it won't re-appear...

2. I would like to see the source of the claim that a quarter of atheists believe in a higher power or spirit. To me atheism asserts that there is no tangible or verifiable evidence of any form of the supernatural. So, if there is some supernatural "power" or "spirit" out there, it might as well be called God. I can't see anyone owning up to atheism watering it down so.

2.

Re the Religious Right, you say "Their power, their rhetoric, their numbers, their theology???all have been so dominant that many of us in the media had forgotten that religious faith could be expressed any other way..."

Well, many everyday Americans, including myself, never forgot. We express our faith in the way we want to express our faith -- we don't need a monied guy like Jerry Falwell ... or Pat Robertson ... to communicate with our God. Nor do we rely on the Congress, the Executive or any other elected office to express our religiosity ... or lack thereof. It's called seperation of church and state.

The Religious Right has an ego the size of Alaska (and Sarah Palin). Their power lies in the political bargin they made with the Republican Party. Help us force our religious views oin the rest of America and we'll help you stay in office.

Their behavior is about as "Christ-like" as a bribe ... as Christ-like as the war in Iraq ... as Christ-like as torture (in other words, not at all Christ-like).

when will we stop believing all this superstitious nonsense? All powerful being in the heavens is just as silly as the Easter Bunny or the Tooth Fairy. Oh, and there is not a pot o' gold at the end of the rainbow either.

America???s comfortable way of life has a tendency to corrode any objective system of beliefs and turn it into a relative customized experience. When it comes to ???spiritual things???, Americans seeks to achieve only what is comfortable or immediately rewarding to the senses.
Principles like long suffering, humility and self denial which are central to Christianity are generally abhorred by the majority of westerners who contrary to what is explicitly written in their text (the Bible) deny the exclusive nature of the very religion they profess to follow.
Although we enjoy social benefits founded on Christianity such as social equality or women???s rights True Christianity has never been popular. The nature of the message is just to radical and cuts right at the heart of the issue, namely the obviously flawed human nature. The concept that The Christian God had to sacrifice himself and suffer in our stead because of our consistent offenses toward him and one another. does not find fertile ground in this pleasure seeking society but yet Christianity is the only religion that shows a realistic God interacting with real people.

America???s comfortable way of life has a tendency to corrode any objective system of beliefs and turn it into a relative customized experience. When it comes to ???spiritual things???, Americans seeks to achieve only what is comfortable or immediately rewarding to the senses.
Principles like long suffering, humility and self denial which are central to Christianity are generally abhorred by the majority of westerners who contrary to what is explicitly written in their text (the Bible) deny the exclusive nature of the very religion they profess to follow.
Although we enjoy social benefits founded on Christianity such as social equality or women???s rights True Christianity has never been popular. The nature of the message is just to radical and cuts right at the heart of the issue, namely the obviously flawed human nature. The concept that The Christian God had to sacrifice himself and suffer in our stead because of our consistent offenses toward him and one another. does not find fertile ground in this pleasure seeking society but yet Christianity is the only religion that shows a realistic God interacting with real people.

I don't think religion had much to do with those voting for Obama. White Evangelicals went for McCain-Palin by 76% and blacks went for Obama by 95%. This is a usual pattern. The black vote was clearly for the Democratic candidate more than the black candidate. Since about 90% of blacks usually vote for the Democrat. Same kind of scenario with the white Evangelical vote. They usually vote about 75% for the Republican candidate.

Obama got less than half the Catholic vote. This is usual too. Even a Catholic candidate like Kerry got less than half the Catholic vote. About 70% of Jews usually vote for the Democrat. This election was pretty much on party lines. Obama benefitted by the financial meltdown and the unprecedented close tp $1B dollars he spent to buy the office. He was able to do that quite well!

"religious faith" is redundant...try using a copy editor.

"religious faith" is redundant...

Interesting... the article discusses the voting patterns of adherents of 'other' religions but conspicuously omits mention of the Muslims.
Not surprising I guess in a country where it appears to be acceptable to consider that were Obama a Muslim he'd have been unfit to run for the office he won. Colin Powell's comments seem even more brave and refreshing in this context.

Certainly a strong argument for paganism can be made as concerns those who believe Jesus is a grand undertaker who will judge everyone at death, and churches are never going to be sued by disappointed souls waiting for their redemption after death of the mind and body. It is merely a matter of interpretation and my belief in Jesus is what he said, not what others assume based on pagan beliefs at best.

The religious right had their shot. We got a leader that lied to us, then declared mission accomplished and STILL kept killing our kids in an unjust war, then ruined the economy. Hocus pocus was never the answer, it blurs rational vision as we have seen.
Now if youd kindly slide over and let an adult take the wheel for awhile.

I am what many of the Founding Fathers were - a Deist. Thank God they were pluralistic! Can't you imagine George Washington or Thomas Jefferson speaking the way some of our evangelical brethren speak today? The Colonies never would have united! The Constituti0nal Convention did not debate about each other's religious beliefs but about the practicalities of setting up a government with liberty and justice for all.
My favorite comment from an evangelical friend is, "I like you. You're a nice person. It's such a shame yo're going to hell." I respect her beliefs but do not intend to conform to them. In my Father's house there are many mansions.

A little international perspective for you:

Most people around the globe believe that the Obama Administration???s foreign policy will reduce some of the tensions in Iraq, Iran and the middle east in general and present a less insular perspective on America???s role on the world stage. There???s plenty to celebrate on those grounds but there???s more to it than that.

If we shift the focus to the more secular countries of western Europe, like Germany, France, Britain and the Scandinavian countries, there is obvious relief that Obama???s religious views are far from conservative. He is perceived here, as a secularist with relatively little ???faith??? of his own.

We see Obama as a man who will not allow himself to be influenced by groups like the Christian Coalition of America, who base their world view on thousands of years old dogma.

We see a President who will support the continued separation of church and state.
We see a President under whom Evolutionary theory will continue to be taught in schools.
We see a President who might reverse the ridiculous ban on stem cell research which will benefit humanity (not to mention your economy).
We see a President who might look at the woeful state of your science education and decide that it needs funding as science will do more to provide for your future than dogma ever will.
We see a President who supports a woman???s right to choose.

If you disagree with abortion because you have thought through the issues and decided through your reasoning that its wrong, perhaps due to possible psychological problems for the woman, or pain for a well developed foetus, then although I might disagree with you, I???ll respect your opinion.
If you tell me that research on a collection of cells is the murder of child based on your interpretation of some thousands of years old superstitious nonsense, that I???m afraid gets no respect.

It is probable that the first person who will live to be 200 years old is alive today, and possible, that the first person to be thought of as ???immortal??? is also alive today. It is our understanding and growing mastery of the fundamental processes of life, at the nano scale which is enabling our species to develop technologies to achieve these aims.

At every juncture, with every piece of knowledge gained since the enlightenment, the need to evoke ???god??? as the cause of our universe and all the events that occur within it, has been eroded.

Many people in Europe and around the world feel that Barack Obama has a similar outlook.

I think, that the world will have more respect for the United States of America with Obama at the helm, largely because he is perceived to be much less influenced by religion than ???dubya??? is.

I see a lot of sour grapes in this article and within these comments, but most of the rest of the world will be able to make some pretty good wine from fruits of Obama???s vineyard!

Thanks for electing him.

A little international perspective for you:

Most people around the globe believe that the Obama Administration???s foreign policy will reduce some of the tensions in Iraq, Iran and the middle east in general and present a less insular perspective on America???s role on the world stage. There???s plenty to celebrate on those grounds but there???s more to it than that.

If we shift the focus to the more secular countries of western Europe, like Germany, France, Britain and the Scandinavian countries, there is obvious relief that Obama???s religious views are far from conservative. He is perceived here, as a secularist with relatively little ???faith??? of his own.

We see Obama as a man who will not allow himself to be influenced by groups like the Christian Coalition of America, who base their world view on thousands of years old dogma.

We see a President who will support the continued separation of church and state.
We see a President under whom Evolutionary theory will continue to be taught in schools.
We see a President who might reverse the ridiculous ban on stem cell research which will benefit humanity (not to mention your economy).
We see a President who might look at the woeful state of your science education and decide that it needs funding as science will do more to provide for your future than dogma ever will.
We see a President who supports a woman???s right to choose.

If you disagree with abortion because you have thought through the issues and decided through your reasoning that its wrong, perhaps due to possible psychological problems for the woman, or pain for a well developed foetus, then although I might disagree with you, I???ll respect your opinion.
If you tell me that research on a collection of cells is the murder of child based on your interpretation of some thousands of years old superstitious nonsense, that I???m afraid gets no respect.

It is probable that the first person who will live to be 200 years old is alive today, and possible, that the first person to be thought of as ???immortal??? is also alive today. It is our understanding and growing mastery of the fundamental processes of life, at the nano scale which is enabling our species to develop technologies to achieve these aims.

At every juncture, with every piece of knowledge gained since the enlightenment, the need to evoke ???god??? as the cause of our universe and all the events that occur within it, has been eroded.

Many people in Europe and around the world feel that Barack Obama has a similar outlook.

I think, that the world will have more respect for the United States of America with Obama at the helm, largely because he is perceived to be much less influenced by religion than ???dubya??? is.

I see a lot of sour grapes in this article and within these comments, but most of the rest of the world will be able to make some pretty good wine from fruits of Obama???s vineyard!

Thanks for electing him.