A Gay Marriage Surge

« Return to Article

Discuss

Member Comments

  • Posted By: thedon @ 12/05/2008 10:32:17 PM

    Putting our heads in the sand and denying that God exists does not make Him exist any less. God doesn't care what our "opinion" is. He has given HIS opinion. All these musings about what we think love is, or what we see animals doing, is irrelevant. In thinking that we are growing more enlightened in our humanistic way, is it possible our minds are just becoming more clouded? (And if you'll read a bit, you'll find out that God said that would happen. That should give us pause.) We don't have the right as the "creation" to contradict the Creator. We will all find that out one day - the easy way or the hard way.

    • Posted By: OttoPilot @ 12/05/2008 11:05:59 PM

      Putting your head in the sand and claiming that your invisible magic friend exists does not make him exist, nor can a myth be said to have opinions. Your fantasy life is your own, but it has no bearing on how other people live their lives.

      • Posted By: thedon @ 12/05/2008 11:35:13 PM

        How do you KNOW God doesn't exist OttoPilot? That a risk you're willing to take? What if God doesn't pat you on the back and have a chuckle about how you were wrong? What if He has a little more of an issue with your disbelief? I'm fine not having a law to protect marriage. I'm not looking to have a law help people recognize that God is. I have a wonderful life, am completely content, and if I come to the end of it and find there is no God, I will just say "Oh well." But if you're wrong, "Oh well" won't be your response. I'm not trying to force anything on you. You have every right to believe what you want to. I would never want America to change in that respect. Just asking you to think. And please don't answer me with demeaning, scoffing remarks. Just interested in having a discussion.

        • Posted By: OttoPilot @ 12/06/2008 12:50:52 PM

          Thedon, the "what if" argument sounded good to Pascal, but it really doesn't hold water, since we can equally well put a "what if" to ANY hypothesis - e.g., what if it turns out to be the Greek or Norse or Roman or Zoroastrian gods who exist rather than the Christian one? The same "risk" is involved in not signing up to many thousands of contradictory beliefs, and no one can cover all those bets.

          • Posted By: thedon @ 12/07/2008 3:43:43 AM

            You didn't answer my question, OttoPilot. With all the evidence, how do you KNOW God doesn't exist? Have you even examined the evidence for yourself? Might be an important thing to check off your list.

            • Posted By: OttoPilot @ 12/07/2008 10:53:58 AM

              Thedon, I'm not sure what you may consider to be "evidence", but the hypothetical concept of a god or spirit world is so unprovable that it's not even meaningful to talk about knowing or not knowing. How do we know there's not some alternate universe where 2 + 2 = 5 ? (Might be important!)

    • Posted By: Derek72 @ 12/05/2008 10:49:53 PM

      News Flash! Your faith (and the silly rules that go with it) should not determine the rights for other people. You're more than welcome to have your belief that a book of fairy tales is God's word, but you shouldn't force other people who don't share your beliefs to live by those rules. Would you like America to have a Muslim majority who forces you to pray to Allah 5 times a day? I thought not. So, live your life how you see fit, and let other's do the same. If you don't approve of gay marriage, then don't get one.

      • Posted By: thedon @ 12/05/2008 11:22:15 PM

        The real "news flash" Derek72, will be when you find out that truth is not up to the individual, as you seem to suggest. You are a humanist, obviously, and maybe proud of it. Fine. You're allowed to be. You think you can build your tower higher and higher, but it will come down one day - just like the Roman, Greek, Babylonian empires did. The American empire is headed fast down the same road. It won't be because we were not tolerant enough of each other, or because we didn't create good enough laws. I don't care what the law is. You think the financial crisis is just because our laws weren't good enough??!! It's called "greed" man. The heart of which is rejecting God and His righteous standards - of which greed is not one. Go ahead! Make gay marriage legal! Any Christian would be foolish to put all their hope into a law - and many have foolishly done so. The point is that I am trying to appeal to your heart, and for you to recognize that you have a God - whether you believe in Him or not. I'm not trying to force anything on you. How foolish of me to think that some law would make you open your heart to God! What do you think about our country Derek72? Think it's getting better? Approaching some utopia? Another newsflash: It's not. And it's no coincidence that God is being forgotten - direct correlation, clearly causative. You'd have to be blind not to see that.

        • Posted By: rodor @ 12/06/2008 2:43:03 AM

          religion is man's word to control through FEAR. spirituality is creating a personal relationship with GOD.
          there are SO many contradictions in the bible if it was truly GOD's word wouldn't it be perfect???

          • Posted By: thedon @ 12/06/2008 3:03:26 AM

            No fear here, rodor. I'll tell you who rules by fear - that would be the government. My religion IS a personal relationship with God. And you'll have to tell me some of the contradictions of the Bible. Go ahead.

        • Posted By: Derek72 @ 12/05/2008 11:40:15 PM

          You religious folk like to blame everything bad on God's wrath, which is just plain lazy. This country has had its rough patches all throughout history. The gays weren't pushing for rights back in the day, so what were religious right wingers blaming old catastrophes on? Probably women fighting for their right to vote, or Blacks asking to ride in the front of the bus. If your God is so omnipotent, why isn't s/he making his/her views on gay marriage more clear -- like sending down a thunderbolt to destroy the California Supreme Court house? I'm sick of religious people attributing everything bad the happens to this country on god's disapproval. What say you, by the way, whenever god's will leads a school bus full of christian children over a cliff, or kills a bunch of christian summer campers with tornadoes? What message is he sending then?

          Whatever your belief is about God, it has no relevance to everyone else's CIVIL rights. We all have to live in this country, and if we start making laws based on someone's faith, a lot of people are going to be pissed off. So, I encourage you to practice your faith, but please keep it out of my civil rights. I don't take any measures to prevent you from practicing your religious beliefs (by all means, keep telling me I'm going to hell because I'm gay -- it entertains me!), and I kindly expect you to exercise the same restraint when I choose to marry the person I love.

          • Posted By: thedon @ 12/05/2008 11:54:39 PM

            And Derek. Please read my response again. I don't care about the laws! Make it legal! I am asking you to reconsider your assertion that there is no God. The deeper question.

          • Posted By: thedon @ 12/05/2008 11:47:57 PM

            Oh boy. Bad things happen to good people, so God doesn't exist? What do you attribute evil to Derek? Please don't tell me it doesn't exist. By the way, I never said anything about natural disasters. Please don't put words in my mouth.

  • Posted By: msalce @ 12/07/2008 9:14:16 AM

    Newsweek knows anyone can hand pick areas for polling and get any finding they so desire. The question is why. Capitalism over journalism? After California how many of us think a national vote would look any differant. We need to stop spending so much time on a very vocal minority and bend to the wishes of the Majority.No matter what you choose to call it a marriage is a bond between a man and a woman.


    • Posted By: FedupinCT @ 12/07/2008 10:53:44 AM

      Under the law, Marriage is a Contract. To the Church, it is a sacrament of committment between a man and a woman. Let the Churches decide upon whom they will bestow Ceremonial blessings and let the States decide if the Contracts of Committment between same-sex individuals are to have all of the legal protections and social acceptance afforded opposite-sex Marriage Contracts. This is not an issue that should be subject to so called democratic vote by the masses who are not applying judgement from a context of Contract Law, but rather from religious interpretation (at best) or from ignorance, hate, and bigotry. Keep the Churches separate from the State!

    • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 9:27:51 AM

      Then I suppose its way past time to end the tyranny of requiring the minority. . .AND the majority of adult Americans (who live in unmarried households) to subsidize and support some "religious" institution that has no place in the government. There is no reason why married people cannot get their legal protections through the web of documents reserved for those who are classified "legally single," is there? After all, we've told the gay families to negotiate life that way - I'd say we set an example and purge the statutes of all of those special rights laws for that legalized "bond between a man and a woman."

      Conservatives should certainly agree with this proposal. After all, they showed their disdain for that "bond between a man and a woman" when they paraded around demanding the state arbitrarily dissolve the Michael-Terri Schiavo marriage without the consent of either of the parties. Then they ran around screaming that we have to "protect marriage" by constitutional amendment and, in the process, claimed all those INDIVIDUAL life experiences like hospital visitation, inheritance, funeral arrangements, etc. were ONLY "incidents of marriage." Enough of the hypocrisy. It is the MAJORITY in this country who are being denied equality by a minority of legally "married" people who demand a continuation of special rights for their families ONLY.

  • Posted By: joepalooka1943 @ 12/07/2008 10:42:51 AM

    Again, I suspect the poll selected respondents with a view to ensuring the outcome.
    Marriage is an insitiution to ensure an orderly society, regulate inheritance, and conform to genetic survival.
    Bobby doesn't need two mommies or two daddies.
    (No, I'm not a homophobe - the homosexual's immediate slur; but I don't support the lifestyle either.)

    • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 10:53:18 AM

      This, of course, is based on your objective education on statistics. LOL!

  • Posted By: Loric7 @ 12/07/2008 10:38:07 AM

    Comments like those from Nelda reflect the ignorance associated with people indoctrinated in fear and ignorance. You and your kind are the ones who are dying out. Today's young people are better educated and more tolerant due to not spending as much time hiding behind the bible, spewing the hate it espouses.

    • Posted By: damonwv @ 12/07/2008 10:44:02 AM

      Im afraid thats just your personal opinion. You call ignorance of people who reject the gay and lesbian agenda. Arent you wielding a double edged sword ? Cant i say the same thing for people who are against those of us who hold strong morals and see homosexuality as wrong. Dont read on us, we dont tread on you. Marriage is already clearly defined, and it does not need to be changed. If it is, it will cause more problems then you can imagine.

      • Posted By: mcgun @ 12/07/2008 10:53:10 AM

        I believe that heterosexuality is wrong for the country and the world....look at what is happening right now in Africa...reproduction gone wild....more children than ever...who SUFFER!

        People against the homosexual agenda are just plain ignorant. It is so fustrating.

      • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 10:48:15 AM

        Perhaps your morals aren't so strong. After all, don't you object to pedophiles marrying? Or serial rapists? Or murderers? Yet they marry every single day, without a peep from your phony "moral" piehole.

  • Posted By: TonyK101 @ 12/07/2008 10:51:54 AM

    The Devil is spreading his sin thru the Gays. Get out of the WAY, don't turn GAY!

  • Posted By: wendywantstounderstand @ 12/07/2008 10:51:14 AM

    I would like to see us stop judging each other. Let people do as they choose. Let people worship without threatining to take their rights away. Let people unite in marriage. People will do what they believe is right for them. Laws only make it easier or more difficult. Stop fighting and look for the good in each other.

  • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 10:50:52 AM

    I think it is obvious here that no heterosexual should be allowed to marry until they have studied the history of the institution and became familiar with all of teh special rights laws reserved for only them. That should be a requirement, because I'm appalled at how ignorant so many of these "marriage protectors" are of the entire institution. No wonder so many straights fail miserably at keeping their vows. They don't even know anything about marriage except as a party, a lot of gifts, and a chance to dress up and have everyone pay attention to them for a day.

  • Posted By: Frye23 @ 12/07/2008 10:48:12 AM

    One of the issues I hear in regard to denying gay marriage is that marriage is for procreation. So if one of the issue surrounding marriage is that marriage is for the purpose of procreating, then I say what a joke because.....

    1. So if straight people who can't procreate due to health issues, should they be banned from marriage too?

    2. Okay, so let a gay person enter into a traditional heterosexual marriage for the purpose of procreating, then divorce and claim child support for 18 years. How fair would that be!

    3. Albeit probably a small percentage but for all those men out there paying alimony because their wife left them for another woman, they can't get their alimony stopped as 2 women can't marry.

    but also, civil unions are not the same because......
    4. Civil unions are not federally recognized so true "economic" benefits of marriage don't apply. You can not claim your "domestic partner" as a dependent for tax purposes.

    5. Domestic partners are not federally recognized for beneficiaries on some retirement and pension plans.

    6. You can not obtain health insurance benefits for your domestic partner if you work for the Federal Government so your "partner" would be uninsured unless they had their own insurance. Those brings us to affordable health care and I won't go there.

    Just remember and never forget:
    Separate is not equal.

  • Posted By: costatico @ 12/07/2008 10:46:52 AM

    When it is all said and done the love I share with my wife when manifested, God willing, will create life. Our children will be tangible evidence the love my wife and I shared exsisted and was true. Same sex couples can try to manifest their "love" but nothing will or can be created in attempted manifestation; and in as much, the feelings they chose to act upon, and some cases created, will end in mortality. I know true love is eternal and can only be manifested between wife and husband, man and woman, just as our Father in Heaven designed for our happiness. To think we know more than God will lead us to eternal misery.

  • Posted By: jfranksocal @ 12/07/2008 7:29:45 AM

    The beauty of this poll is that it show the younger generation not feeling as opposed to Gay marrige as the older generation is. This is surely a sign of things to come. Soon all of you "scared of something you don't understand" people will be dead and buried (thank God!) and the rest of the country can start living with equal rights for everyone!

    • Posted By: GHookway @ 12/07/2008 7:59:10 AM

      And the gats will be dying of AIDS (thank God) !!!

      • Posted By: truluv2thee @ 12/07/2008 10:46:01 AM

        People can marry anything or anyone they want .as long as they don't bother me. I have two cousins in my family who claim to love each other, everyone in my family is pissed about it, but you know what i just don't care, i let them live, I try to live my life as much as i can, I have my own life to worry about other people' business and yes, I beleive in God, i just don't see judging anyone as a priority thing in my life.

      • Posted By: jfranksocal @ 12/07/2008 8:31:43 AM

        who are the gats again?

  • Posted By: TonyK101 @ 12/07/2008 10:05:07 AM

    That would be the worst day in my life if one of my children turned out Gay. I don't even want to think about it as my stomach is already turning.

    • Posted By: dwmusic @ 12/07/2008 10:43:12 AM

      TonyK101 Don't worry, as soon as your gay child grew up, they would get out of the house at the first opportunity and would never speak to you again, and that would suit both of you down to the ground.

    • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 10:17:51 AM

      I think the people should be voting on your right to create children.

  • Posted By: DS42 @ 12/07/2008 10:28:19 AM

    If I was a black person, I would be outraged that anyone would compare the struggle, the fight for freedom and liberty that was the experience of so many black people during that time period of humanity. To compare that to the distorted idea that somehow the sanctity of marriage should now include gays is nothing more than the legalized form of domestic terrorism. Destroying the fabric of the family and demeaning the value of human morality.
    30 years ago this discussion would not be happening, people understood the value of family, I can only imagine that in another 30 years the gays will be on the side of moral folks battling the new movement to legalize bestiality and farm animal marriage.

    • Posted By: luckylarry @ 12/07/2008 10:37:35 AM

      Right on! I could not have said it better.

    • Posted By: mcgun @ 12/07/2008 10:36:34 AM

      Oh my....what tales these mortals tell....these homophobes do not get it.....just do not get it....

  • Posted By: jfranksocal @ 12/07/2008 9:45:13 AM

    Yeah, children need angry buttholes like you raising them, right?

    • Posted By: gemmy @ 12/07/2008 9:49:39 AM

      at least this angry person doesn't stick something into a child--you scum of the earth!

      • Posted By: jfranksocal @ 12/07/2008 10:00:57 AM

        Boy I hope your child grows up Gay.

        • Posted By: notogays @ 12/07/2008 10:37:29 AM

          This is a society as a whole issue not a place for a few misguided gay persons. The "MAJORITY," has spoken in a legal and binding vote for all! Do we forget prosecution for rape of a child or woman because it infringes on a few people???s rights for misguided and deviant ways? The answer is, ???NO.???

  • Posted By: joey25 @ 12/07/2008 9:57:23 AM

    Wow, I'm just shocked to see all the hate posted here.
    1. Civil unions don't offer ALL the same benefits of marriage. Until that day when they do, homosexuals will keep fighting for marriage.
    2. Marriage is not strictly a religious right. It's not a monopoly! People should be able to marry legally with the government, but churches shouldn't be forced to marry couples. Also, if it is strictly a religious right is this to same that atheists can't get marriage? Absurd.
    3. Why do you guys even care? How does it affect your life that much? Really? If you think it's a sin, don't do it. It's as simple as that. But don't shove your morality down everyones throat.

    • Posted By: wmm35seeksworldpeace @ 12/07/2008 10:36:49 AM

      1. Civil unions don't offer ALL the same benefits of marriage. Until that day when they do, homosexuals will keep fighting for marriage.

      You misunderstand marriage. Marriage is a religious creation, not a state one (check the history books). A marriage is a covenant between a Deity (take your pick), a man and a woman. Until a state can officate of behalf of a Diety, it's union's cannot give all the benefits of a marriage. So your assertation that homosexuals will fight until civil unions give all the same benefits as marriage shows that you do not understand the historical definition of a marriage. That aside, a civil union can and should give all the other legal rights.

      2. Marriage is not strictly a religious right. It's not a monopoly! People should be able to marry legally with the government, but churches shouldn't be forced to marry couples. Also, if it is strictly a religious right is this to same that atheists can't get marriage? Absurd.

      Marriage has historically been a religious rite and should continue to be. We as a society just lost sight of it and have confused marriage with civil unions, see my answer to point #1. You are correct, atheists who take part in a "marriage" ceremony are absurd.

      Marriage should be perfomed for religious ceremonies, civil unions for everyone else.

      Honestly, it's like when I teach my kids to share: "Ok you play this toy, and you play with that toy" At the end of the day, they both played with toys and they each got what they wanted.

      3. Why do you guys even care? How does it affect your life that much? Really? If you think it's a sin, don't do it. It's as simple as that. But don't shove your morality down everyones throat.

      Because people like do not seem to have a sense or understanding for things of a sacred nature. Protecting "marriage" is not about civil rights or morality (at least not in the way you see it). It is about guarding a sacred institution. Maybe you understand my meaning and maybe you don't, but please don't define my wanting to guard something that is sacred as hate. You label this as hate because in conflicts with your world view and because you don't appear to understand the true nature of marriage. Calling it hate, just shows your own lack of knowledge and sensitivity.

    • Posted By: notogays @ 12/07/2008 10:26:27 AM

      It effects our life when their misguided values and morality is forced on the rest of US and our children in school. So we are all effected by the lack of understanding of the issues and concerns of parents when the parents right to opt a child out of such classes is denied.

  • Posted By: filologo1 @ 12/07/2008 10:25:03 AM

    I was not polled and I am totally against gay marriage. I respect gay people's choice to have sex whith any responsible adult who agrees with that lifestyle but that doesn't mean the government should endorse gay marriage and that is what we are talking about. We Christians will always oppossed gay marriage. Black people should be ouraged that the gay community consider themselves as the new "Black." No, sire! As long as the Church stands tall in society there's hope for it. If the Church falls everything will fall with it.

    • Posted By: erinrosemary @ 12/07/2008 10:35:40 AM

      Actually the government SHOULD endorse it. We have separation of church and state so states can allow marriages between two people and the church doesn't have to endorse it. At least thats what alot of people seem to forget these days. Sorry, your church oppresses my friends which is something our country should not stand for. EQUAL RIGHTS FOR ALL was something our country was built on...or did you forget? nevertheless, nothing i say will change your mind since you are in your little "im a christian" bubble. I hope the church does eventually fall...our world would be alot better off without their oppression and hate.

    • Posted By: kevinbgoode @ 12/07/2008 10:30:38 AM

      Which "Church is that, you dominionist?

      And frankly, anyone who isn't married should be outraged that religionists continue to abuse the Constitution with claims that it is merely an extension of their church. I keep looking for the bible passages that talk about a society created with a President and elected representatives, but keep coming across references to a "king" instead.
      So you chose a "Church" which requires you to wage war against the rights of other free Americans, claiming that your chosen "religious" belief is the foundation of our government. This country was not created as a theocracy - and there is no official "Church:" of any kind. I suggest you choose another "Church" which doesn't engage in advocating treason.

  • Posted By: NeldaDee @ 12/07/2008 10:31:43 AM

    Who in their right mind (or left) would try to indoctrinate a child to become something that they are not? When schools teach ABOUT families, we describe the many types of families. Some children have a single mother. Some children live with their uncle and aunt. Some with their grandparents. Some with two mommies or two daddies. We also teach about different cultures, races, genders, and we teach how everyone is created equally. We are not teaching children HOW to be a single mother. Or HOW to be a grandparent. The DYSfunctional behavior some of you are describing is not up to you to help make laws against. I may find your behavior of being a Jello wrestler kinda weird, but in this land of the free, knock yourself out. Just because YOU find something repulsive doesn't mean there should be a law against it. If that were the case, eating pickled pigs feet would probably not be legal. I don't know many people who are pickled pigs feet eaters. The constitution of this great nation ENSURES our rights and liberties. It does not take them away. Our constitution was created to make sure that the majority (51% ?) cannot dictate over the minority (49%). Take a civics class and learn something, people.

  • Posted By: jfranksocal @ 12/07/2008 8:47:04 AM

    Prop 8 only passed by 4% and that was only because the black community voted for a change. If the circumstances were different in that election and we had a white candidate running I guarantee we wouldn't be having this conversation.

    • Posted By: Camm_s @ 12/07/2008 10:31:35 AM

      So who are you blaming? Black people (as usual) or Obama (same thing)?

  • Posted By: luckylarry @ 12/07/2008 10:30:33 AM

    Gays are pushing their twisted, and abnormal lifestyle choices on the rest of us. It is because of these choices that they do not enjoy the rights afforded to families. It is their choice, and the rest of us should not have to bear the burdens they present. They will not stop their twisted agendas, they are already pushing for adoption, how could any decent person allow a child to grow up in such a sick environment? What do I say to my child when they come home from school, and ask if they can have a stay over at their friends house? That I can call their parents Ralph and Joe? If you choose to be gay, don't expect the rest of us to support it.

  • Posted By: joesanchez52 @ 12/07/2008 9:27:11 AM

    i dont understand why black people voted for prop 8. ever heard of civil rights? black people who voted for prop 8 have a lot in common with the kkk.

    • Posted By: Camm_s @ 12/07/2008 10:26:07 AM

      I wonder if you would say that BS out loud to a black person..... You wouldn't so don't hide behind this blog with your stupidity.

  • Posted By: timebomb123 @ 12/07/2008 10:19:58 AM

    An an African-American, I am appalled, that sodomites (i.e. gays) would even compare their lifestyle issues to that of blacks during the civil rights movement. A homosexual can come out of that lifestyle, as many have, but I challenge any black to decide that he or she is no longer going to be black. And I'm not a "homophobe". I don't have a fear of any homosexual, I just don't agree with homosexuality and neither does nature.
    nature

    • Posted By: mcgun @ 12/07/2008 10:23:52 AM

      at least you are true to your username...surely not for your comments on this posting....

Reply

Report Abuse

Enter comments if any for reporting abuse