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  • Posted By: TheEngineer4 @ 12/18/2008 4:05:21 PM

    Infrastructure projects, done wisely, will provide short term benefits like providing jobs, as well as, long term benefits like improving the efficiency of the tax base which means more tax revenue at the same tax rates or lower, certainly a plus in my book. However, there are so many pitfalls to throwing money at infrastructure projects. Allow me to list some of them.

    1. The problem with federal and state funded infrastructure projects in certain areas of the country is that they face headlong corruption and bureaucracy problems as a result of the government getting involved. Take for instance the Big Dig and Deer Island Projects in Boston. Both had cost overruns in excess of 50%. Now that is not a lot when you are talking $1.00, but when you are talking $10,000,000,000.00 (in the case of the Big Dig) that is another $5-6 billion. So a $1 trillion plan now costs our country north of $1.5 trillion. The reasons for these overruns are immense:
    a. Forcing projects to be closed shop, if they are closed shop allowing the government to negotiate the contracts with the unions instead of the contractors. Unions need to learn to be competitive and run themselves like a business instead of a government agency. I have seen union contractors and subcontractors be competitive with nonunion ones, but they are actually more efficient and ???bring it??? to a jobsite, but these are few and far between. On those projects in Boston, 1 in 4 union workers were necessary for the project and of the 3 out of 4 that were, they only operated at 60-75% efficiency. Thus providing a major reason for cost overruns and a drain on our taxpayer dollars.
    b. Design and then Build instead of Design/Build. If you look at the most major successful projects that have been done in the country over the course of the last 10-15 years (such as I-15 Corridor in Salt Lake City, T-Rex in Denver, etc.) they were design/build jobs, where the design was done by private companies that were under the umbrella of the contractor responsible for building the work improving constructability, reducing change orders an streamlining the process, with only government oversight to assure quality. They were successful and the companies made money and the states got their projects usually well ahead of time and at their budget, unlike the two Boston projects which were first Design, then Build.
    c. Corruption was rampant in Boston. From contractors, to unions, to suppliers, to government officials. Expediting infrastructure projects to get the economy kick-started, heightens the level of corruption such that it is harder to clamp down on, because things are moving so quickly. Corruption almost always breeds cost overruns, quality issues and safety problems
    d. I have used large heavy/civil projects as examples, but the same applies to smaller projects, like museums and schools just the same.

    Continued???

    • Posted By: ocodan @ 12/21/2008 12:32:17 AM

      I agree with this poster for the most part. I agree about the unions/corruption and shoddy work on the Big Dig. I also agree with contracting practices even if no contractor in his right mind would take a fixed contract to do larger projects. There needs to be government oversight with transparent bidding. We do not need another $100's of billions of dollars ripped off from the cost plus, no-bid contracts used in the Iraq war.

    • Posted By: TheEngineer4 @ 12/18/2008 4:19:17 PM

      Double post. My apologies, please remove if you can.

  • Posted By: greatmidwest @ 12/18/2008 3:38:55 PM

    Governor Schwarzenegger is on the right track both literally and figuratively. America's infrastructure has needed a major overhaul for decades. We see stark examples of this in our interstate roadways and bridges, clogged airports, but mostly in our archaic railroad system.

    Republican Rep. Raymond Lahood has demostrated a bipartisan style that should bode well for the incoming Obama administration. He has been a strong advocate national transportation, but he too, will need to take a close hard look at this past support of an outdated, money-burning and federally funded national railroad known as Amtrak.

    Amtrak is like the Big 3 automakers. Amtrak has received billion dollar subsidies from the federal government for years now, and has FAILED to show any ability to become financially independent, nor profitable. Amtrak is out-of-date corporate structure-wise, is not finanancially stable, and is yet another example where re-negotiation of more reasonable union contracts is warranted in order for Amtrak to become fiscally sound.

    I hope the Obama administration PRIVATIZES many of Amtrak's unprofitable money-losing routes, and retains ownership of more routes that have shown high levels of ridership and can potentially be transformed into high speed railroad (possibly bullet train) routes between major urban areas which need improved means of public transportation. Europe and Asia have has bullet trains for years, yet there is not a single bullet train in the USA. Just plain pathetic! Go Arnold !!!

    • Posted By: ocodan @ 12/21/2008 12:27:41 AM

      I totally agree with this poster.

  • Posted By: ocodan @ 12/21/2008 12:14:14 AM

    Great article Arnold. And I've traveled and totally agree. A french TGV train or commuter trains like the ones in Japan would be like grease on the wheels of the economy, combined with the jobs it would provide. See? Obama and you are not so far apart.... and you are Republican and he is a Democrat. That's leadership. That's what we need more of. And I'm a liberal "pro business (ethical)" Democrat and proud of it.
    Cheers

  • Posted By: sevakandi @ 12/20/2008 10:58:06 PM

    Does no one stop to wonder why the initiatives and programs that benefit ALL of the people are the first to get axed and the last to get funded? In any fiscal crunch, education, police/fire, hospitals, libraries, road maintenance/construction and every other program that government SHOULD be providing all get their budgets slashed. Why is it that my local fire station is feverishly trying to figure out how to get a grant for a new fire engine, when funding for emergency services should be at the top of the spending list, behind every social program there is? If the people were to go line by line through any local/state/federal budget, they would be appalled by the amount of money spent on programs that benefit a scant few people, that waste or give away money on functions that no government should be involved in. The purpose of government is to govern, not to provide some vast safety net against every problem anyone could ever encounter in life. Our roads fall apart and our economy tanks because "the people" have voted themselves entitlements over the basic infrastructure that would allow them to lift themselves up. Now suddenly "public works" projects are in vogue, when they should have been the first thing on the list all along. Unbelievable.

  • Posted By: Jim Bush @ 12/20/2008 9:38:20 PM

    We have an infrastructure crisis because of CARRING SOCIALISM -- the subsidized and near totalitarian use of cars. The subsidized car has enormous infrastructure requirments -- some 4000 square of pavement per car.

    We have Soviet-style pricing of roads. The Soviets underpriced food and got lineups in food stores. We underprice roads and get lineups at stop lights.

    The motor fuel taxes and license fees do not come close to paying for the roads.

    At the local level, roads in subdivisions, office parks, etc. are usually provided by the developer. Road maintenance is often funded by property taxes.

    All that pavement means that rainwater runs off very fast, which means huge drainage problems. Drainage systems are usually built with tax-free municipal bonds (an indirect federal subsidy). If that surge of stormwater causes downstream flooding in a major waterway, the US Corps of Engineers steps in.

    Roads are unthinkable without traffic cops. In a suburban jurisdiction, carring accounts for roughly 1/3 of the police work. Yet, the departments are paid for by property taxes and maybe some share of the state's income tax or sales tax.

    We need to raise motor fuel taxes at the federal and state levels to cover ALL the costs of roads. Otherwise, the infrastructure crisis is perpetual. CARRING SHOULD PAY ITS OWN WAY!

    In addition, there should be a federal motor fuel tax that is countercyclical -- high when oil prices are low and low when oil prices are high. This will give carbuyers a consistent market signal and carmakers a market that is predictable.

    God Bless America!

  • Posted By: Jim Bush @ 12/20/2008 9:00:07 PM

    America has an infrastructure crisis, because we are too much given over to CARRING SOCIALISM -- the subsidized use of cars. Cars have huge infrastructure requirements -- about 4000 square feet of pavement for each car.

    We have soviet-style pricing of roads. The Soviets underpriced food and got lineups in food stores. We underprice roads and get lineups at stop lights.

    At the national level and in every state the motor fuel tax is considerably below the cost of providing, maintaining and policing roads. At the local level, roads in and around subdivisions and developments are usually provided by the developers. And, property taxes are often used to build and maintain roads.

    Roads cause huge drainage problems, because they cause rainwater to run off quickly. Car-oriented suburban devlopment causes gigantic drainage problems. However, drains are usually provided by tax-free municipal bonds (an indirect federal subsidy). Flooding in a river due to a surge of stormwater off all that pavement is often dealt with by the US Corps of Engineers.

    Roads are unthinkable with traffic cops. Yet, very few traffic cops are paid for from motor fuel taxes or license fees. In suburban jurisdictions, traffic and car problems account for about 1/3 of police budgets.

    We should take advantage of the temporary decrease in oil prices to enact a 2 part increase in motor fuel taxes. The first part should grow steadily until it covers ALL the costs of roads.

    The second part should be countercyclical in that it is high when the oil price is low and low when the oil price is high. This countercyclical feature would help give more consistent market signal to car buyers and car makers.

    Both the Soviet food experience and our infrastructure crisis show that Soviet-style pricing begets major problems. We should MAKE CARRING PAY ITS OWN WAY!

    God Bless America!

  • Posted By: brucen@sierratel.com @ 12/20/2008 8:50:59 PM

    There are concerns in this blog about Arnold's suggestions smacking of socialism, big government, etc. I understand the reactionary concern, and I myself would be categorically against any permanent moves toward government ownership of big enterprise. However, now, just as the years following the 30's, we have an opportunity; we have a lot of folks who need work, who will do so cheaper than in an expansion period, and we do need massive infrastructure improvements. For those who don't need the work, the improved safety, speed, and just general esthetics of the good ole' US of A's presentation will lift our spirits, and help make us prouder of who we really are. Another reason we should do it is... we can. We have the strength, the intelligence, the ability, we only need the will. Maybe this lousy economy will give us that again. Since we're gonna leave our progeny with huge bills, at least it would be nice to give them a nice place to live in. When the economy bounces back (which it will, in the years to come) private enterprise will be the recipient of all the new infrastructure. Good ideas, Arnold. (Oh, and by the way, I'm a committed Republican capitalist, who just sees the common sense in all this.)

  • Posted By: kjmwright @ 12/20/2008 6:34:02 PM

    All I can add to this conversation is: The USA deserves the governmen it votes in. If have a free country and a government based on the will of the electorate, then I say move to the countries which are abounding in the bucks and have improved their infrastructures already. Find out if they feel as free and unbound as we do ourselves in this country. Are they free to criticize their government. Do they fear stepping outside their door not because of traffic or gridlock or even poor infrastructure but because someone with a tank will come and shot them if they do? Or because their neighbor has the freedom of their religion to kill another and themselves and they and all their relatives have eternal positions in heaven, nirvana or any other place that exists after we die? This country was founded on the Bill of Rights and the Constitution of the United States of America and, if that is no guarantee of a chicken in every pot but rather more of the guarantee that you can at least try to honestly find or get a chicken in the pot on your stove in the kitchen, then one should go to the part of the world that appeals to you economically. In this country, leaving is not a problem, it's getting back in that is.

  • Posted By: hokiepoke2010 @ 12/20/2008 5:43:32 PM

    thank god the ones with the potential for good are not the same ones incessantly feeling the need to rip on anything "liberal" simply because the word has been demonized. investing in our country's future is the ONLY logical step to be undertaken. i wont even bother telling any of you ignoramuses out there to "wake up", rather why dont you just expatriate if youre so unhappy with our situation? leave it to those who are motivated and hopeful for tomorrow. this country was not discovered, founded, or improved by people who gave up easily. the state of the intelligence of the general population is frightening and i believe a re-vamped education system is the only true long-term solution. however in the short term it is true that almost all roads, bridges, ports, govt. buildings, housing projects, etc. are in such bad shape it is to be expected that fatal accidents, national catastrophes, and widespread ignorance are to result. STOP GOING TO WAR AND KEEP THE MONEY HOME! no one will be able to go fight once they are needed by their families to hunt/farm their food and keep the vandals and homeless at bay in our own country

  • Posted By: nickgr @ 12/20/2008 5:16:12 PM

    CA problems r deep & structural,no one person can solve them...

    I hope his next article in Newsweek is written indeed by him personally...

  • Posted By: mbessearch @ 12/20/2008 5:04:43 PM

    Arnold wants to screw-up to rest of the country the way he's screw-up CA (with the democrats help).

    Only Michigan is in worse shape (so where does Obama look for leadership?)

    Government will ALWAYS screw up anything they control.

  • Posted By: Les Heywood @ 12/20/2008 3:53:57 PM

    I am a former owner of a steel placing business and all of this talk is great about building America's infrastructure my only concern is are all of these jobs that this creates going to go to Americans that spend there money here or are they going to go to the illegals that pay the least amount of taxes as possible and send there money back to Mexico ? Thank you , Les Heywood

  • Posted By: nickgr @ 12/20/2008 2:35:12 PM

    It is sad that an Arnold's article does not get the quality comments it deserves...

    Arnold is the most recognised person globally,apart from religious leaders,like the Pope...

    He is a hero for the average person,a poor immigrant who serves & strengthens USA,,much more American than many " Americans "

    We must change the Constitution so that he can become President.

    He can stand at the political center,bridge the Right & the Left & bring glory to America.

    As for bitter comments about his governorship,CA is an undisputed mess & probably "ungovernable " by anyone...

  • Posted By: Diggerdan @ 12/20/2008 1:57:33 PM

    People who believe, that spending money on cars, toys, food, and travel is the only way to stimulate the economy, you people need to wake up, from your fantasy life! Weather you are a Dem or a Repub, understand this, without infrastructure in place, like water, sewer, surface water management, roads bridges, that supply the route to your malls and houses you will be living like they did in the 1800's is that the way you really want to live? Going potty in the outhouse? Burning wood for heat, cooking with wood fires? Growing your own food? Canning your own vegetables? Dipping water out of the well? Traveling by horse and buggy? Infrastructure is the way it has to be, not by choice, but by the demand of modern civilization. On top of growth for new infrastructure, we in this inconvenient world need to keep what we have working for the cry babies out there who take going to the mall and getting a bite to eat, and using the public restrooms for granted as if they just appeared one day for your personal convenience.

  • Posted By: Diggerdan @ 12/20/2008 1:56:50 PM

    People who believe, that spending money on cars, toys, food, and travel is the only way to stimulate the economy, you people need to wake up, from your fantasy life! Weather you are a Dem or a Repub, understand this, without infrastructure in place, like water, sewer, surface water management, roads bridges, that supply the route to your malls and houses you will be living like they did in the 1800's is that the way you really want to live? Going potty in the outhouse? Burning wood for heat, cooking with wood fires? Growing your own food? Canning your own vegetables? Dipping water out of the well? Traveling by horse and buggy? Infrastructure is the way it has to be, not by choice, but by the demand of modern civilization. On top of growth for new infrastructure, we in this inconvenient world need to keep what we have working for the cry babies out there who take going to the mall and getting a bite to eat, and using the public restrooms for granted as if they just appeared one day for your personal convenience.

  • Posted By: Diggerdan @ 12/20/2008 1:56:04 PM

    people who believe, that spending money on cars, toys, food, and travel is the only way to stimulate the economy, you people need to wake up, from your fanatsy life! weather you are a dem or a repub, understand this, without infrastructure in place, like water,, sewer ,surface water mangement, roads bridges, that supply the route to your malls and houses you will be living like they did in the 1800's is that the way you really want to live? Going potty in the out house?, burning wood for heat, cooking with wood fire's? growing your own food? canning your own vegitalbles?, dipping water out of the well? traveling by horse and buggy? Infrastrucutre is the way it has to be, not by choice, but by the demand of modern civilization. On top of growth for new infrastructure, we in this inconvient world need to keep what we have working for the cry babies outthere who take going to the mall and geeting a bite to eat, and using the public restrooms for granted as if they just appeared one day for your personal convieience.

  • Posted By: Karenn1 @ 12/20/2008 12:00:50 PM

    Arnold is the WORST Governor in California history. He's a tool of Wall St whose job is to run up a debt. (Wall St gets rich from the interest payments on the debt.). At the same time he won't sign any budget unless there are DEEP cuts in K-12 education. The media won't say anything truthful about his Reign of Error because his wife is a Kennedy cousin who used to work in the media. I hope Obama and Congress give nothing to Arnold and send any stimulus money directly to the Mayors. Arnold would just give it all to his corporate campaign contributors.

    Arnold=The Dubya of the West.

  • Posted By: doctorfixit @ 12/18/2008 5:19:31 PM

    Infrastructure projects do not create any lasting jobs benefit. They should not be looked at as an economic stimulus. They should be occurring all the time, good times and bad. The reason that California and other radical liberal states ignore infrastructure is because they would rather throw their money away on socialist wealth transfers that reward non-productivity. California spends an outrageous amount of money on socialist programs. It needs to drastically reduce this spending, and significantly increase infrastructure, but not by raising taxes. One of the biggest problems that make infrastructure spending almost impossible to achieve is the environmental bureaucracies, the trail-lawyers, the ACLU, and all of the other crushing red-tape burdens that government has layered on over the decades since WWII. The object of most State bureaucrats is to STOP anything from happening. This is what makes Schwarzenegger's satements so laughable - he doesn't even realize that almost none of these projects will ever see the light of day - because of his own government obstructionism.

    • Posted By: jarcher1 @ 12/20/2008 9:33:09 AM

      There were no lasting job benefits to the construction of the interstate highway system?

  • Posted By: sunblocker @ 12/19/2008 6:22:57 PM

    hey arnold, good thinking there, a sane direction...............

  • Posted By: Dj_r @ 12/19/2008 4:36:43 PM

    LOL @ MartinCopernicus, classic!

    @ Narxist... please provide some empirical evidence... perhaps employment statistics of those increasingly rare engineers that already have their skills booked at 100% capacity. With the unemployment rates of what many are calling the worst economic recession since the Great Depression, I find it hard to believe that we are just fresh out of engineers.

    And as for those cushy air-conditioned jobs keeping laborers from working on these projects... I suppose you have a point, A/C and $8.50 an hour does sound like a sweet deal!! Forget making twice that much + benefits in the public sector, they don't have A/C! I would much rather work in a mall dealing with crappy customers than actually make some real income. Or maybe I would rather stand on my feet in a restaurant all day serving customers and hoping they leave a good tip because the hourly pay sure as hell sucks... or how about $8.50/hour to load/unload trucks in a warehouse all day. Sweet! Though they don't have A/C either- because it's a warehouse, you see.

    Kudos for that piss-poor argument.

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