The Case for Walking Away

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  • Posted By: Mad as H like Howard Beale @ 01/04/2009 3:54:20 PM

    Why is no one commenting on the debtors' hell of student loans? They cannot be bankrupted, hardships are very hard to obtain, no one will answer questions such as "who may I talk to about this debt," and they have the average American trapped with no possible way out. I am almost 60 years old. I went back to school to become an educator in the hope of helping others. I took out student loans because my husband expected me to pay my portion of our expenses--even though I was not working. I planned to repay my student loan within 5 years, based on the expectation of resuming dual income status upon graduation. Didn't happen. Husband left, ripped me off, I had almost nothing left, and I had to start over in late midlife. I have struggled ever since and no one will assist with the student loan. I live in a modest condo (cost less than $100,000), drive a used car, maintain health insurance, and have average-to-moderate consumer debt. I have no problem paying my bills, including a renegotiated student loan payment if I could get one. But no one will talk to me. They threaten to contact your employer, garnish wages, and they attach your bank account. The consumer has absolutely NO rights in these loans. My loan payment is almost $500 per month -- more than my mortgage payment. This leaves me with less than $200 per month for personal expenses, groceries, gas/car maintenance, and any emergencies that arise. I shop on consignment but do not even have the funds for used clothes any longer. And no attorney will help because they say there is nothing that can be done. I don't need to declare bankruptcy because I am thankfully employed and can pay all of my bills except for the massive student loan. I've begged for a renegotiated payment of $200, which I could manage. No frills, but I could pay my bills and breathe a bit. I have no hope for the future, no retirement due to the late career start, and I have two options. One is suicide, the other is to become an expat and live/work in another country. At my age and with little energy left to fight, the former seems increasingly attractive. In fact, if you read the student loan chat sites, there are people who have committed suicide over student loan nightmares. Still, I'm inclined to try to live, and I am researching expat life. But here's the deal. My country needs educated people and teachers. I teach and try to make a difference. My country bails out big shots, Wall Street, poorly run industries, and idiots who took out mortgages they knew they couldn't afford. I have to subsidize all that and I'm left with nothing? If I were a public school teacher, my loans would have been almost forgiven at this point. But because I teach at the college level (teaching the public school teachers and social workers whose loans will be forgiven) I get no loan forgiveness for public service. This is my country at work for me. And this Atlas is about to Shrug (A. Rand).

    Signed,
    Fed up, giving up, angry American

    • Posted By: fedup_with_private_studentloans @ 01/04/2009 5:24:31 PM

      I agree, why is nobody talking about the student loan crisis, specifically the private loan industry? While in graduate school, I lost my job and had to take out numerous "easy' private loans just to survive. All I cared about at the time was putting food on the table for my family and the only way I could do that was to stay in school and take out loans. My 100k in private loan debt has skyrocketed to over 200k in a matter of a few years. My private loan payments are over $1800 a month...more than my mortgage. At least with my mortgage, I have a fixed 6% rate, whereas with my private student loans my rates are all the way up to 14%. I have been robbing Paul to pay Peter for months now and even wiped out my 401k to catch up on student loan payments. If they would renogotiate the interest rate, let me consolidate or something I might be able to afford my payments along with all my other bills. I have made the decision that I will most likely have to default on my private student loans and file for bankruptcy this year and find a good lawyer that is willing to help me get these outrageous, unsecured, high interest personal loans that were classified as student loans discharged! When is the government going to help us??? They keep giving billions of dollars to the companies who put us all in this mess. I am so fed up.

      • Posted By: Condoleeza @ 01/04/2009 7:26:17 PM

        I too took out some of these private "student loan" to get me through while in school. Is it even possible to an attorney to get these discharged in a chapter 7 bankruptcy? Thanks for you thoughts.

        In debt to my eyeballs

        • Posted By: Mad as H like Howard Beale @ 01/05/2009 2:45:09 AM

          Student loans cannot be bankrupted and the consumer has essentially no recourse. If you search the web about the problems people are having with the student loan industry, you will be amazed at the horror stories. No other lending industry enjoys the protections of this racket. The sad thing about it is that the people most hurt by this are hard-working teachers, public servants, and middle income people. We play by the rules, work hard, and then if we find ourselves in need of help ... it is not there. Write your legislators, please.

  • Posted By: nsx98 @ 01/05/2009 2:19:41 AM

    I think It"s a great idea..... In fact I'm going to call a BK Attorney in the morning. Cheers

  • Posted By: nsx98 @ 01/05/2009 2:18:28 AM

    I think It's a great idea...... In fact I'm going to call a BK attorney tomorrow!!! Cheers

  • Posted By: tonka6655 @ 01/05/2009 1:55:27 AM

    Horrible advice. Selfish and self serving. If you cause debt, you should repay it. This mentality is what will create a recession. Unbelievable.

  • Posted By: levaughn777 @ 01/05/2009 1:44:57 AM

    I would only consider this as a last resort. Five years ago I filled for BK protection due to a divorce, loss of job and a severe medical condition at the same time. Before the BK, I held high level positions in sales management with a six figure income. Since most of my savings was distroyed by a greedy ex and her attorney, I really did not have any other choices. When I applied for new positions, I could not pass a background check due to the BK and was forced to accept positions that payed 30% of what I used to make. Employers do not seem to care about what happen.

    Hopefully, this letter will help someone along the way.

  • Posted By: Believe09 @ 01/05/2009 1:42:22 AM

    BK laws need to change, those who take advantage of the system need to pay back the system. We cannot point at all that is wrong to justify our lack of responsibility. There is only one face looking back from the mirror, be proud, do everything possible before pushing your mistakes onto others. Don't point, don't make excuses, and let's change the BK laws to make it fair! Newsweek needs to stop reinforcing the easy way out!

  • Posted By: jmss36 @ 01/05/2009 1:42:14 AM

    I fully agree with loyal129. Yet, no, bankruptcy should never be used by each and every individual in this country. Yet, it is also a self-respecting tool as a financial clean up. My bankruptcy gave me the dignity through 4 years to realize that I could complete and clean the financial mess that myself, and many other factors created. Think of all routes before considering, as well as find a trusting lawyer. Be aware that there is a light in that tunnel. From ceditors viewpoints, too bad that 100% of Americans are not, and will never perfect through their lives.Be strong. Thank you Temma Ehrenfeld.

  • Posted By: jmss36 @ 01/05/2009 1:30:55 AM

    Agrees fully with loyal129
    No, bankruptcy should never be abused and overworked by the moral majority. But, since life occurs, and a mere MANY of us are not perfect, it is a respectful way to 'clean up'. My chapter 13 is complete, and it has given me the self respect and dignity to know that there is light at that tunnel. Think hard though before attempting, and find a trusting lawyer.

  • Posted By: summerwind187* @ 01/05/2009 1:20:00 AM

    I would have to agree with the author on this one. The economy sucks right now. As much as I believe in paying your bills, I have had too file once before myself. My reason: Identity theft. Even with the protection nowadays, it's a little easier for them to track people down and what not. I had this happen to me over 10 years ago- before I was 18 years old. I didn't find out about everything until about 2-3 years later. These people got and apartment in my name, defulted on the lease, cell phones, utilities, etc. I found out when I moved out of home. When they ran my credit- all of the people wanted to collect for something I hadn't done. Can't file a police report 2 years after the fact... Try it...The police look at you like your stupid. After nearly four years still trying to figure out everything and trying to pay everything back that I didn't owe in the first place. It got old. I was engaged, in college, and was wanting to get my own house. Can't even do that when your credit sucks. I was even being harrassed by creditors at work. How embarrasing eh?! I needed a fresh start. I felt like bankruptcy was the only option, and at that time it really was. So- I did it and I don't regret doing it at all. I was able to rebuild my credit afterwards fairly quickly. It gave me a chance at life again. No ore busting my ass at the expense of someone else...just for myself and my family!

  • Posted By: summerwind187* @ 01/05/2009 1:19:33 AM

    I would have to agree with the author on this one. The economy sucks right now. As much as I believe in paying your bills, I have had too file once before myself. My reason: Identity theft. Even with the protection nowadays, it's a little easier for them to track people down and what not. I had this happen to me over 10 years ago- before I was 18 years old. I didn't find out about everything until about 2-3 years later. These people got and apartment in my name, defulted on the lease, cell phones, utilities, etc. I found out when I moved out of home. When they ran my credit- all of the people wanted to collect for something I hadn't done. Can't file a police report 2 years after the fact... Try it...The police look at you like your stupid. After nearly four years still trying to figure out everything and trying to pay everything back that I didn't owe in the first place. It got old. I was engaged, in college, and was wanting to get my own house. Can't even do that when your credit sucks. I was even being harrassed by creditors at work. How embarrasing eh?! I needed a fresh start. I felt like bankruptcy was the only option, and at that time it really was. So- I did it and I don't regret doing it at all. I was able to rebuild my credit afterwards fairly quickly. It gave me a chance at life again. No ore busting my ass at the expense of someone else...just for myself and my family!

  • Posted By: cnaran36 @ 01/05/2009 1:06:38 AM

    Allseeingeyeball, this country needs more lawyers like you. We are the slaves of the elite and once the majority of the population realizes this i believe we will have another civil war where the little guy gets even with his abusers.

  • Posted By: dansque @ 01/05/2009 12:55:50 AM

    americanrebel...Do you know who initiated NAFTA??? George Herbert Walker Bush, NOT Bill Clinton. The republicans backed it, and so did the democrats. The only one who opposed it, was Ross Perot during the presidential debates. The Washington culture of greed and eliteism under G.W. Bush, and the out-sourcing of U.S. jobs in Asia and India by huge American corporations have nothing to do with NAFTA. Should we end NAFTA? Yes! But not for any of the reasons you have mistakenly sited. We should require by law, any American corporation to pay the same wages to workers overseas, as they would pay here in the U.S. Then it would not be profitable for them to outsource, and it would save American jobs.

  • Posted By: loyal129 @ 01/05/2009 12:54:41 AM

    Bankruptcy is used by Corporations with bif and fat boardmembers and C.E.O.'s making mutli-million dollar salaries. The Government taxes the American public to death to pay the corporations those hefty multi million dollar contracts and $1,000 toilet seats for the Pentagon, $5,000 flashlights for NASA, etc... The little guy should never feel bad for filing bankruptcy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The government and corporations are ran by the greediest of all human beings, After all over 95% of politicians have law degrees. They are worse than your regular blood sucking lawyer because they don't even work as hard to earn an income. DOn't be ashamed of filing for bankruptcy because the C.E.O.'s don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Posted By: loyal129 @ 01/05/2009 12:54:24 AM

    Bankruptcy is used by Corporations with bif and fat boardmembers and C.E.O.'s making mutli-million dollar salaries. The Government taxes the American public to death to pay the corporations those hefty multi million dollar contracts and $1,000 toilet seats for the Pentagon, $5,000 flashlights for NASA, etc... The little guy should never feel bad for filing bankruptcy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The government and corporations are ran by the greediest of all human beings, After all over 95% of politicians have law degrees. They are worse than your regular blood sucking lawyer because they don't even work as hard to earn an income. DOn't be ashamed of filing for bankruptcy because the C.E.O.'s don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Posted By: abc2you @ 01/05/2009 12:53:38 AM

    This is an article that needs to be known to the public. Sure it is wrong to max out bills and then go bankrupt. But, when your spouse is out of work and you make only enough for food, there has to be some relief for these people before they kill themself as many have chosen. Those that feel otherwise better be careful or bankruptcy could be knocking at their door. Be careful who you judge or you could be in their shoes. This article is great and brings relief to many that needed to see hope. You addressed it in the right way since you never stated anything about maxing out cards and then filing bankruptcy.

  • Posted By: sufirhorse @ 01/05/2009 12:53:08 AM

    Sometimes life throws us more hard times then we can handle. I???ve repeatedly had to up my hours to cover shortfalls in my husband???s earnings as the manufacturing sector takes hit after hit which has made it all but impossible to maintain savings for any length of time. In 2007 I worked a full time job at a professional firm while still operating my business of one when my husband became suddenly ill and was on disability insurance for a year. Towards the end of that year I realized I was going to work myself to death if I kept up like that. I didn't want to uproot my family, or default on my creditors but what good would it do for me to work myself into an early grave? Still I forced myself to keep going. Just after my husband was cleared to work again but before he???d found a new job my body quit and I became quite ill I managed to keep my business running and just barely afloat as I battled a serious respiratory condition for over 4 months. Despite lingering health issues I have fought to keep our bills paid often pulling ridiculous hours to get jobs done just in time to pay my mortgage before it went 30 days late. I usually paid the price for my insane hours and became sick again. In mid October the economic slowdown hit my business with a vengeance when the turn around on my accounts receivable slowed way down. Since my business covers the majority of the bills we are in a dire position as we haven???t recovered yet from my husband???s disability and the associated costs. Like some other people out there I am also in a highly toxic relationship and I see the toll it is having on my children. My marriage is a joke and brings tremendous emotional pain on a daily basis, my spouse isn???t interested in therapy and I can???t fix it by myself. The truth is I should have left him years ago but didn???t because there wasn???t enough money to support two households (nothing fancy just the basics). It took the events of the last two years for me to finally come to the painful decision to declare bankruptcy and file for divorce. Some of the posters on this board are heartless and don???t seem to realize that people sometimes have to make a painful choice despite their best efforts to avoid it. I am an incredibly ethical person and usually I am proud of that but to honest I wish I had seen the cost to my family and made this painful choice years ago as it would have been less damaging to my children. When it comes down to it my kids are what really counts and I have to do what???s best for them. Please try to put aside your politics and the need to point fingers and try remember the importance of empathy. Many people are hurting try treating them with kindness which will brighten their day instead giving them a cold shoulder and adding to their hardship.

  • Posted By: loyal129 @ 01/05/2009 12:52:12 AM

    Bankruptcy is used by Corporations with bif and fat boardmembers and C.E.O.'s making mutli-million dollar salaries. The Government taxes the American public to death to pay the corporations those hefty multi million dollar contracts and $1,000 toilet seats for the Pentagon, $5,000 flashlights for NASA, etc... The little guy should never feel bad for filing bankruptcy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The government and corporations are ran by the greediest of all human beings, After all over 95% of politicians have law degrees. They are worse than your regular blood sucking lawyer because they don't even work as hard to earn an income. DOn't be ashamed of filing for bankruptcy because the C.E.O.'s don't!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Posted By: junnie @ 01/05/2009 12:50:58 AM

    4 dollars a gallon, taxes through the roof, credit card companies are legalized loan sharking, welfare the highest is ever been, I work 2 jobs and I am filing , and dont feel one bit guilty about it.

  • Posted By: junnie @ 01/05/2009 12:47:53 AM

    I have a real hard time feeling guilty about filing bankruptcy, gasolune companies pounded the working man with 4dollar a gallon prices, new york which has the highest welfare per capita in the country just put another 1000 new taxes on the working man, just to take care of the lazy man in the state, politicians all come out of office miiionares, credit card companies are nothing but legal loan sharks, and you think I am going to feel guilty about bankruptcy I think the entire working class should stop paying everything and start a trend .

  • Posted By: maxbianco @ 01/05/2009 12:43:44 AM

    one day my best friend took his son to get a check-up; and in 72 hrs his life changed forever! an otherwise healthy young man had a rare form of cancer. he looked and felt fine but in 14 months he was dead. it happened that fast. what did my friend lose?? everything! what was he left with? almost $200,000 in medical bills WITH INSURANCE! even with bankruptcy he still has a long way to go in rebuilding his life. all you people here pointing fingers with those "living within your means" ideals... you never know what hand you'll be dealt. the same thing could happen to you.

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