A Plan of Attack For Peace

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  • Posted By: jirvin @ 01/04/2009 11:34:09 PM

    It is crucial that one has her/his facts straight about Israel???s war on Gaza. What events brought about this dreadful situation? What needs to be done to make it stop? These questions will be answered in the content of this article, using concrete facts from a variety of news sources.

    Let???s first investigate the recent cease-fire between Israel and Hamas. The cease-fire began in June 2008. The terms were as follows:

    1. Israel would drastically reduce its military blockade of Gaza.
    2. Israel would halt all military incursions into Gaza.
    3. Hamas would halt all rocket attacks into Israel.

    From the outset of the cease-fire, Israel did little to ease its military blockade. As a result, Gazans continued to suffer from a lack of food, fuel, financial aid, electricity, clean water, medical supplies, and more. This has been, inarguably, an attack on innocent Palestinian civilians.

    ??? Gaza faces a humanitarian "catastrophe" if Israel continues to prevent aid reaching the territory by blocking crossing points, the head of the main UN aid agency for the Palestinians said on Friday??? Israel had restricted goods into Gaza despite the truce, which calls on militants to halt rocket attacks in return for Israel easing its embargo on the territory??? Israel also held up deliveries of European Union-funded fuel for the power plant, which generates about a third of the electricity consumed by Gazans... Ailments associated with insufficient food were surfacing among the impoverished coastal strip's 1.5 million population, including growing malnutrition.
    --Haaretz Israel News, Nov. 21, 2008 [1]

    ??? A former UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, Mary Robinson, has told the BBC she was taken aback by the "terrible" conditions in Gaza on a recent visit. Mrs Robinson said it was "almost unbelievable" that the world did not care about what she called "a shocking violation of so many human rights"??? Israel tightened a blockade on Gaza after Hamas took control there in 2007??? "Their whole civilisation has been destroyed, I'm not exaggerating," said Mrs Robinson???Israel says the blockade, under which it has allowed little more than basic humanitarian aid into Gaza, is needed to isolate the militant group and stop it and other militants from firing rockets into Israel. Israel came to a truce with Palestinian groups in June this year, but Mrs Robinson said this had had little effect on people's lives and "just brought a bitter taste in the mouth".
    --BBC News, Nov. 4, 2008 [2]

    • Posted By: newtral @ 01/05/2009 7:29:48 AM

      jirvin: Well explained and factual.

  • Posted By: aniseed @ 01/05/2009 5:52:17 AM

    All seems well and there is Peace in sleep.. no posts since 2:53.. that says it all.. very valid points have been discussed from the comfort of our homes with our heating/cooling, education, food, etc. None of us can imagine what a mother in that territory must go through to give birth and then observe.. If God were a woman, her womb would indeed tear apart!

  • Posted By: Lascoma @ 01/05/2009 2:53:49 AM

    It is more like a turkey shoot in a barrel Dick Cheney Style. Most likely with his and Bush blessing the Israelis are just doing that and Obama is just being practical. On the other hand, there is not much that he can do. Then end result is that as has been the status quo the poor Palestinians are expendable, as they have been for the last 50 years.

  • Posted By: headdown @ 01/05/2009 2:29:16 AM

    It's the religion, stupid. When people who have access to modern weapons also are strong believers in living their lives according to the writings of barely literate sheep - herders of thousands of years ago, the results are pretty predictable. With one foot still in the dark, superstitious cave of religion, the people of the middle - east shouldn't even have access to sharp sticks, let alone modern weaponry. The disease of religion ensures that the horrors between the Israelis and Palestinians will continue, and modern technology ensures ever worsening destruction potential for the future. Praise the lord. Isn't faith wonderful?

  • Posted By: topsider @ 01/05/2009 1:02:03 AM

    Good night all-

    Don Quixoti

  • Posted By: aschreiber1 @ 01/05/2009 12:53:45 AM

    ATTENTION Omaar:

    CAN WE ALL AGREE THAT MAKING POSTS LIKE THIS IS

    REALLY

    REALLY

    ANNOYING?

    LET'S STOP DOING THIS. THANKS.

  • Posted By: teamdirtdogs @ 01/04/2009 11:53:40 PM

    4 Israelis dead in Hamas missile attacks, over 500 Palestinians dead and counting. Over 100 dead reported to be children, 30% of the casualties (dead and wounded) kids according to the volunteer doc from Norway. Is the life of a Palestinian child worth less than an Israeli child, worth less than Jett Travolta (no disrespect to the Travoltas, who deserve our heartfelt sympathy for their loss). The Israelis have blockaded humanitarian aid of food, medical supplies bc they don't care about the Palestinian lives, be it the ones they kill directly or indirectly thru blocking aid. Why do we as Americans support this and think that allying ourselves with this brutality somehow either benefits us or is the "right thing to do"? Do we somehow think that this oppression and senseless slaughter is justified and that these Palestinians are somehow less human bc W labels them "terrorists" and so this is deserved, even the suffering and slaughter of little kids? Israel lost its moral and ethical imperative with their longtime oppression of these people, and by supporting them the US will follow suit.

    • Posted By: pinkpanther87413 @ 01/05/2009 12:36:30 AM

      so very well put honest no insult..

    • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/05/2009 12:01:28 AM

      100 children, so very tragic. I can only imagine the pain the parents endure having to bury them.

  • Posted By: topsider @ 01/05/2009 12:35:33 AM

    Noone is trying to do anything but justify why one side is worse than the other. It's not important. What kind of world our we building for our children? Solve a problem, quit pointing fingers.

  • Posted By: haroldfox @ 01/05/2009 12:25:49 AM

    Do not forget that Israel resettled Jews who were deported from Arab countries after the 1948 war. The number of refugees at that time was about the same. Israel fully and promptly integrated all the Jewish refugees into their society.The Arab refugees who ended up in Arab countries and those who remained in Gaza or the West Bank are still in refugee camps. The oil-rich Arab countries should have done what the Jews did - taken them in and gave them citizens of their countries, where they could become productive citizens. Indeed, Arabs who remained in Israel after 1948 were given citizenship in Israel. They have more rights in Israel than most Arabs have in Arab countries. If there is any compensation to be given it should be paid for by the Arab countries, both to the Arab refugees and to the Jews who were forcibly thrown out with only the clothes on their backs.

  • Posted By: topsider @ 01/05/2009 12:02:10 AM

    Why does noone seem to get it? It is far less important to be "right" than it is to stop the violence. What has happened has happened. It cannot be changed. What are we going to do tomorrow? thats ALL that matters. I want my children living in a stable society. You cannot justify taking lives on either side. STOP IT. Is it always "us" vs "them"? We're all on this planet only onlce for a short time. It's all us. We're just too ignorant to wake up.

    • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/05/2009 12:06:14 AM

      I I get it but when I post that I do, no one likes to hear it.

      • Posted By: topsider @ 01/05/2009 12:08:59 AM

        Let's start holding our political and religious leaders accountable for the peace and stability they bring to our lives above all.

  • Posted By: 40YearR @ 01/04/2009 11:25:06 PM

    dari, Who could ever say who really has the best claim to what in this region?

    The object is peace for all. If that would do it, one could choose to see it that no one 'gave' anyone anything. Peace would be good for all, and it would be worth much.

    The dilemma is how to get everyone to agree how to cooperate and get along.

    Right or wrong has no answer.

    • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/04/2009 11:33:02 PM

      Hi 40YearR. Good to read you.

      • Posted By: 40YearR @ 01/04/2009 11:44:04 PM

        Hi there. Saw your posts about just making peace to people who insist someone is right. Nice going.

  • Posted By: topsider @ 01/04/2009 11:38:05 PM

    The dilemna can only be solved by inspired leadership within the poltical and religious organizations. Politicians blow with the wind and will take whatever course they perceive to be popular enough to keep them in power, even at the cost of lives. True religious leaders need to negotiate, be even handed, and implore their members to stop the violence, period. Then there is no doubt as to intentions. Accept the reality of the region once and for all, abandon tribalism, and work out somethiong everyone can live with. The respect for each other which is the critical element will only come when all religions live up to their true peaceful nature.

  • Posted By: topsider @ 01/04/2009 11:13:52 PM

    Say what you want about the United States and our real problems and issues, we have a unique blend of tolerance, diversity, spirit, and strength that exisits nowhere else. People on all sides need to look at their children and decide, what kind of future do I want for them? Some homogenous fantasy state where ethnically "pure" likeminded people perpetuate tribal rituals based on the celebration of ignorance? Or a tolerant, truly peace loving, DIVERSE, society where one's religion is no more important than what football team they like?

  • Posted By: perrin @ 01/04/2009 7:29:47 PM

    When the planes flew into the twin towers, interspersed with the horrific scenes of human suffering and dispair, the Palestinians were dancing in the streets in celebrations that went on for days if not weeks. They chant "Death to America" and will do so until they draw their last breath. This is not what God had in mind. Hama's jab and run tactics of lobbing rockets into Israel to incite them into defending their people will have to stop before any peace can be had. There will also come a time when neither side can look to big brother and plead "help us, look at the mess we've made". That time may be here today. God help all of you and your suffering children. Put your history books down right now and forget about the past mistakes of "All" of you. You will write history from this day forward with your actions. Put the gun down, go home and hug your children. Tell them killing is wrong. Your idealogy and faith is known by God, you don't have to prove it in blood. He will remember those who set the first example of love, and reward you beyond your wildest dreams here, now, today. Anyone can pick up a gun, real courage is putting it down. No matter how bad it gets, the one thing that can never be taken from any of us is dignity and respect for human life. If that's the predictible answer, so be it. It's all we have as humans.


    • Posted By: pinkpanther87413 @ 01/04/2009 9:37:35 PM

      On 9/11 EVERYONE in the ENTIRE MIDDLE-EAST DANCED,,,EVERYONE INCLUDING ISREAL AND IRAQ.....

      • Posted By: Forty4 @ 01/04/2009 9:57:18 PM

        Israel did not "dance in the streets" after 9/11 dumbass.

        • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/04/2009 10:18:59 PM

          Forty-perrin's said that it was the Palestinians who were dancing in the street. It was.

          Nice to see you again, I hope you had a wonderful New Year celebration.

          • Posted By: Forty4 @ 01/04/2009 10:25:26 PM

            Hi there Pia,

            Actually it was pinkpanther that said everyone in the middle east, including Israel. Of course he's wrong about that.

            Nice to see you again too!

            • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/04/2009 10:53:29 PM

              Hi Forty-yes, you're right pinkpanther did say it was Israel....perrin said it was the Palestinians.

              Forty-I'm glad to see you here. Although you only post occasionally, I hope you don't stop posting altogether.

      • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/04/2009 10:22:50 PM

        It was the Palestinians who danced in the street, not the Israeli.

    • Posted By: Pia1981 @ 01/04/2009 7:56:12 PM

      Perrin, your comments are absolutely astounding. Thank you for them. I read another one of your comments below..I'm very sorry for your tragedy.

  • Posted By: RoyNavy @ 01/04/2009 9:09:23 PM

    Omar and his ilk are just so upset that Israelis have the "gall" to defend themselves........those idiotic Zionist pigs should never be allowed to defend themselves.......here......hold this apple while I shoot this arrow at it sitting on your head. Talk about being a moron.......I for one think Israeli should not worry about the rest of the Arab world......(which believe it or not...do not care about Israel's survival....(I know big surprise there)......)..............Oh by the way Omar......."The Reason" why western Europe cares so much is there own embittered "non integrated" Islamic populations are present there.........

    • Posted By: Omaar @ 01/04/2009 10:46:11 PM

      Love Live Mass Murder in Your EYES

      Its Your ILK, that leads People to Destruction & Damnation...

      All in the name of God.

      God is far from YOU

      If he exist at all.

  • Posted By: RoyNavy @ 01/04/2009 9:14:16 PM

    Omar and his ilk will always use the "victimization" card as there reason to defend Hamas and there rocket throwing ways......They will never agree in any way shape or form Israel's right to use even a "water pistol" to defend themselves.......they're solemn belief is that the "Zionist pigs" should just stand there.......with an apple on their heads ....and wait for them to shoot an arrow at them.......in fact......the best analogy would be Hamas the simliarity to Hitler's 3rd Reich (albeit without the military capability).........just imagine if Hamas had a "PROPORTIONAL" ability to launch attacks......oh wouldnt that be GREAT OMAR.........I just wish a katusha / kasim rocket......could fly up your ass.......YOU PIG

    • Posted By: Froggie76 @ 01/04/2009 10:35:16 PM

      I guess Hamas would have far less of a reason to attack Israel if it wasn't to force the Israelis to lift the blockade of Gaza ... or to let Hamas run Gaza in peace without trying to destabilize their elected government.
      I mean, when you corn your opponent, isn't it predictable he'll use whatever means at his disposal to take back the advantage ? in hte present case of impoverished Gaza and Palestine, the human card is all they got left to fight for themselves ...
      Arab governments are too much corrupt or self-interested to help them significantly.
      The Arab street is mostly powerless and too easily coerced
      the US government is shamelessly one-sided (ie: pro-israel)... and the US media is mostly pro-Israelis (when was the last time you had a Hamas spokesman or official being interviewed to refute 24/7 Israelis assertions of "we are doing our best ot limit human csualties", "Hamas started it", "Hamas refuse to negotiate", "there is no humanitarian crisis")
      Only Europe and the rest of the Muslim world (like Indonesia and Africa) care a bit

    • Posted By: Omaar @ 01/04/2009 10:34:44 PM

      You and Your ILK Remember this.....

      God is Bigger than race & Religion...Period..End of Discussion

      God cannot be Defined by Man Man Religion.

      Christianity, Judaism & Islam are the Abomination to World and..

      All Those that Follow or Subscribe to any of the Teachings of those 3 Known Religions are the Abomination.

      Life is in Cycles, Phases and Stages, no Country is Favored by God.

      God Favors All that he has Created.

      The Bible, Torah & Quran are Man's WORDS...

      Not God's Words


      Those Three [Novels] the Bible, Torah & Quran are an Abomination to Humanity.

      They are Justification for those Nation's that follow them, to Claim Favoritism by God...

      What a JOKE !!!


      God is Laughing At All of You who Subscribe to those 3 known Religions noted above...

      If God Exist at All !!


      Christianity, Judaism & Islam are all used to make certain Nations THINK they are FAVORED by GOD...

      When they are NOT.

      The Books of Christianity, Judaism & Islam are NOVELS, used to Justify EVIL ACTIONS these

      Those [3 Insane Nations] use to these Novels to Justify their EVIL BEHAVIOR towards OTHERS.

      I'm convinced that Man is unable to Co-Exist Peacefully with Others, Different from Themselves...

      I'm Doubly Convinced, that Man has NEVER Co-Existed with Others Different than themselves, an even with their Own Kind !!

      I will be Glad when God through [Nature] Makes a Stand, if God Exist ?

      I Hope God, through [Nature] Rids the Earth of Humans...

      Through Massive Climate Change...

      Alien Take Over, if they Exist ?

      I Hope they Reveal Themselves, because Mankind cannot Co-Exist Peacefully with One Another...

      So let the Massive Meteoric Down Pouring Begin, from Outer Space, Massive Earth Quakes, Hurricanes, Tsunami's, Volcanic Eruptions, Massive Tidal Waves, Massive Global Warming, Massive World Famine, let it begin.

      It is mankind that Seems to Enjoy Carnage, It seems the More Murdering & Mayhem , The Merrier !!

      Mankind is indeed Hopeless and Reckless as well as Heartless to his Fellow Man & Woman..

      Not just in the Middle East, But in Asia & Africa as well as North America.

      If Aliens do Exist, what are they waiting for...

      Man is Not Worthy of Grace.

      It Breaks My Heart to See such Senseless, Meaningless Barbaric Rage exacted on other Human Beings, without any Remorse or Concern.

      Man is Devoid of a True Heart and that's All Over the Damn Globe.

      If God Exist, I Know, he does Not Favor Any Nation or Human, Over the Other.

      God Created All of Us and We are All LOVED by the Creator, if he EXIST ?

      It is Man that is the Seperatist who Causes Hate and Suffering...

      Not The Spiritual World..Not God, If he Exist at all ?

      It is Indeed Man and his [Religious Novels] the Bible, Torah & Quran...

      Contributing to Mankind's Demise on this Planet.

      I'm Convinced that Man and these 3 Major Religions, Christianity, Judaism & Islam are the Abomination to the World.

      I Hope I'm Wrong, But I know that I'm Right about Man and his Hateful, Hate

  • Posted By: fishoutofwater @ 01/04/2009 9:55:49 PM

    Good evening all. Where, oh where, to begin with all of this...In reference to an earlier post by 40, at one time the region was overrun with what were once known as Canaanites, Hittites, Sumerians, (no, not Samaritans), Babylonians, and if I remember correctly, there was even a Biblical reference to giants in the region at one time. As anyone who has come of age in the last half-century is well aware, tracing the historical habitation of the entire Middle East is of little value when searching for an acceptable solution to the widespread violence.

    Long story short...Pride is always an interminable factor when dealing with any regional/ethnic conflict. The Arab population as well as the Israelis wish to save face above all else, even to the point of extinction. We, as westeners, do not have this kill or be killed motivation instilled in us from the moment we first learn to hold an eating utensil other than a bottle. As such, any attempt on our part to broker some sort of peace loses some sense of validity for we do not truly understand the mindset of the participants whom we are trying to afford a sensible resolution.

    We may perhaps say that we understand the point of view of one side of the other, but I feel that is only true from a clinical point of view, and not a legitimate empathy. However, I feel it is imperative that we offer both sides an arena in which to air their grievances, provided they want such an opportunity, and are willing to stop the bloodshed long enough to engage in rational discourse.

    I feel somewhat confident that even our incoming President is going to step on his own toes somewhere down the line over this issue, and not from lack of ability or knowledge...rather from a simple lack of not being a naitve of the region(despite what most of the Obama detractors would wish us to believe). Arrived at this point in global evolution, it has become obvious that a stable Israel, and a stable Palestinian state are necessary and viable options. Perhaps our next tack should be something akin to this...Let us not tell the opposing sides what they must do, instead make it clear to them WHY they should settle their differeces(at least bring it down to a low roar), and afford them that chance to wald away with both heads held high.
    at this

  • Posted By: hiliftjack @ 01/04/2009 4:52:13 PM

    A while back, I was watching a filmed newscast of a verbal confrontation between some Palestinian farmers in the West Bank, who were trying to harvest their olives. Apparently some Jewish settlers from a nearby Jewish settlement had come over to harass them. I remember in particular a Jewish Rabbi pointing a finger in one of the farmer???s face saying, ??? This is our land! God gave us this land! Of course, the Muslim fundamentalists can be just as irrational.

    If you remember the story, Jacob and his tribe left that land voluntarily for better times in Egypt. Several hundred years later Mosses led them back saying he was commanded by God and with God???s ???promise??? that the land was to be given to the Jews. Of course this was done with a lot of bloodshed and destruction of the peoples then living there. Remember, Moses is said to have wrote the story (first 5 books of the Old Testament). Could it be a self serving story?

    Isn???t it Ironic, that in today???s age that same thing is being repeated and with the same illogical justification, and with the same reasoning (promised land) based on a story that is without validation of any sort!

    It is really sad that so much pain and destruction is being created, not only in Palestine but in the rest of the world because of religious stupidity and disorder.

    • Posted By: Rob in CO @ 01/04/2009 9:36:22 PM

      My sentiments exactly! Religious stupidity and zealously will be the demise of our entire world.

  • Posted By: FM24 @ 01/04/2009 9:20:55 PM

    it will probably never end unfortunately

  • Posted By: bighappy @ 01/04/2009 8:58:13 PM

    What a BS. Thos dovish Israeli leaders have only one purpose - survive the elections. If heads of Hamas had brain even half size of their camels' - they would have behaved for couple more months, even made some speaches about peace, to keep current Israely leaders in power. Then they could consider to fire few rockets a day without proper well-deserved punishment. Netanyahu is another issue, in a year of his rule Hamas will be eradicated.

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