The Lost Shepherd

"There would be no need for churches if there were no sinners."

If there were no CHURCHES there would be no SINNERS.

Ted Haggard was a highly paid pimp for a bunch of mind-control cults that have severely damaged the lives of millions of people, to say nothing of the hideous effects they have had on the domestic and foreign policies of this country. The nutcases he represented are right about one thing, however. He deserves to burn.

DUKE613:

Your common and stereotypically false claims based on cultural mythology are 100% contradicted by the actual documented and verified overwhelming scholarship and history, based upon manuscript evidence and the cannon:

The actual facts of the Council of Nicea, Constantine, dating, origin, and authorship of the gospels/epistles and 95 to 99% verification to our oldest extant manuscripts compared to current translations (w/the differences only in variations in spelling/translation, grammar, etc, not effecting the content and meaning), along with the unprecedented numbers, etc.; anthropology/archeology and other science; predictive prophecy; eyewitness testifmony; the science of statistical probability; hostile historical verification--Pliny the Younger, Seutonius, Heroditus, Josephus, etc.--and much more.

If you actually did even a legitimate and open-minded cursory study on any of the facts of Christianity and the Bible, you'd be stunned and disturbed in your falsely and truly blind-faith based beliefs which would be turned upside-down, as mine were and I was. No other belief system can claim anywhere near the same. Mainstream scholars and lay students of all of this know these facts and merely roll our eyes or shake our heads at the age-old claims against, many simply repackaged in different forms now.

It has never ceased to amaze me that the longer a lie is propagated the more it is accepted as fact. THEIR IS NOT ONE SHRED OF SCIENTIFIC DATA TO SUPPORT THAT A PERSON IS BORN HOMOSEXUAL OR LESBIAN!!! IT IS A FACT THAT IT IS A CHOICE - A CHOICE TO DISOBEY GOD AND WHAT HE HE HAS ESTABLISHED AND DECREED - "YOU SHALL NOT LAY WITH MAN AS YOU DO WITH WOMAN; IT IS ABOMINATION" ...."NEITHER SHALL A WOMAN LAY WITH A WOMAN AS WITH A MAN"......."NOR SHALL YOU LAY WITH BEASTS; IT IS WICKEDNESS".

When people love their sin they will inevitably pull others into that same sin to justify what they want to perpetuate. Truly did Paul tell Timothy, "For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but AFTER THEIR OWN LUSTS will they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears

WE SHALL ALL SEE VERY SOON HOW GOD DEALS WITH WILFUL DISOBEDIENCE AND OPEN REBELLION ................... September 11, 2001 was just a sample of how God will use a heathen nation to judge those that He called - but they refused.

No matter what someone has done, their church should be there for them. Fundamentalist churches especially seem to be overfond of preaching Jesus Christ, and then conveniently forgetting Christ's admonition to love one another, and instead, use the Apostle Paul to punish someone who has sinned. They'd stone people if the law in America let them get away with it. Abuse is love, they say. Separation is love, they say. God is not a God of separation; he is a God of union. What Ted Haggard did wasn't right, according to ethics or secular law, but he deserves to be forgiven. He should have been allowed to stay in church, where he could have gotten real spiritual help, instead of being tossed out to deal with things on his own. Christ said he came to the sick, not the well, yet the church seems obsessed with keeping the sick out of the congregation in order not to spread "spiritual infection." This only forces the congregation to drive real problems underground, so they don't get thrown out too.
Churches need to stop being afraid of humanity's weaknesses, and HELP people instead of judging them. When Katrina and AIDS happened, the churches were the first ones to judge and condemn. It makes me angry to no end to see "Christians" use their religion to separate people, rather than being willing to dig in and get their hands dirty and I don't know, actually acknowledging sin as a weakness in man and HELPING people become better. Most fundamentalist Christians are arrogant, self centered, judgmental, hard, unloving and unkind. this is the antithesis of the fruits of the spirit that Christians should be showing (not broadcasting) to the world.

Repent, Christians, and maybe more people will be moved by your example to Christ. Christ judges those Christians who discourage others away from Him by their words and actions. What does judge not, lest ye be judged mean anyway? You don't have to be part of the person's sins, but that doesn't mean you don't help them. Helping people by booting them out of church is not help. It's condemnation, and doesn't make those who sin repent. Christ didn't boot people out--he got down and dirty and helped them on their level.



Jeremiah 23: 1 Woe be unto the pastors that destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture! saith the LORD. 2 Therefore thus saith the LORD God of Israel against the pastors that feed my people; Ye have scattered my flock, and driven them away, and have not visited them: behold, I will visit upon you the evil of your doings, saith the LORD. 3 And I will gather the remnant of my flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase. 4 And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the LORD.

cpipkins wrote -- It seems to me that everyone in the U.S. has rights EXCEPT GOD (or His children) all because a segment of this society doesn't want any of His divine laws in their lives.


Again, not be argumentative, you have the right to believe anything you like -- be it a camp story, fairy tale, or the bible -- just as I have the right not to believe what you believe, nor have what you believe legislated into the law of the United States of America.

What you suggest is totally un-American, is un-Constitutional, but your right to believe.

he like many others are preaching for mucks, and it makes no difference what they believe in ,they preach what will make the most money and scare the people into giving more. He was young and cute and had a glib talk, but didn't believe in what he was saying, should you trust him again,? not unless he becomes a gay preacher for Jesus...

cpipkins @ 01/10/2009 2:53:31 PMYou haven't answered my question, nor have you any proof as to what will happen when you die since you are so learned."

No one can say for sure but I do know what God isn't. He/she isn't neurotic, childish, evious, or angry. These are human faults and failings. He/she does not exist to monitor bedrooms.

Concerning Christianity a real truth seeker will find inconsistencies in the Gospel of Matthew that suggest the image of God it portrays is based partially on expectations of the people living at the time. Matthews depiction of the life of Jesus was influenced by Hebrew expectations. ( I have many detailed examples too long for here).

Thought Matthew gives Jesus the status of Son od God, to the Jews of Jesus's time ALL prophets were called sons of God. A titled that did not imply virgin birth but because Matthew wanted to "sell" Jesus's messianic stature to the Roman people that he portrayed Jesus as the child of a god, just as the deities of the Hellenistic world were children of gods. Matthew fulfilled the expectations of the religious and political leaders of his day.

I could go on for hours. Always seek truth.