The Lost Shepherd

« Return to Article

Discuss

Member Comments

  • Posted By: Thomas Mc @ 01/10/2009 2:49:42 PM

    He isn't much of a salesman, he recently told the Colorado Springs Gazette that he hasn't sold a single insurance policy. It's hard to trust someone who won't even admit the truth about himself.

  • Posted By: TheGardener @ 01/10/2009 2:49:10 PM

    In the name of a god/allah, man justifies the most atrocious behavior. When will the followers use their brains and question the rubbish the preacher man sells? Exempt from paying taxes, shouting morality, Religion is a fraud: selling an afterlife insurance they cannot pay out. Fear of the Unknown is the tool theologians use to control the populace: the wicked in control to deceive their fellow man.

    "Theology: The Sublime Degree awarded by/to the pompous arrogant ignorant who claims to know what he doesn't know. They even invented a PH.D. in this Delusional Grandeur"

    Lets stop the tax exempt treatment of these con man. The Religions Institutions are at the bottom of the dirt. All they care about is control and power. ???The more you investigate what we think we understand, where we came from, how we evolved, and who we are, the more you see how much we have been lied to by every Religious institution.

    Religion is the Natural Selection to gather together the mediocre brains." The reason organized religion merits outright hostility is that, unlike belief in Russell's teapot, religion is powerful, influential, tax-exempt and systematically passed on to children too young to defend themselves.

  • Posted By: duke613 @ 01/10/2009 2:44:26 PM

    The latest biological research shows an acutal difference in brain structure between gay men, women, and straight people. This has been shown before regarding the hypothalmus region of the brain but now even more diffrences are being found.

  • Posted By: olddognewtricks @ 01/10/2009 2:29:48 PM

    Posted By: goldpointe @ 01/10/2009 2:18:59 PM

    If you know the facts, you won't be making false statements about homosexuality being a "choice".

    Not to be argumentative, but did you read what you wrote before posting?

    You claim is isn't a "choice," then claim that "genes" are involved -- quite illogical. What business it of mine, or yours what consensual adults do in the privacy of their own homes?

    • Posted By: goldpointe @ 01/10/2009 2:42:04 PM

      I have no idea what you are arguing. I do not believe in bedroom police, nor do I believe that homosexuality is a choice. It is a biologically-driven (thus, "natural") condition. Science has shown that it is probably caused by some combination of genetics, immune changes in the mother, and perhaps some environmental impacts in the womb or in very early infancy. My point is that the argument by Christians that it is a choice, just doesn not bear any resemblance to facts. They can argue religiously, since anyone can believe in any fairy tale they want to in America, but anyone who is trying to come to a real understanding of the issue based on evidence instead of bigotry might be able to see some reality instead of blindly agreeing with those who parrot the phrase "Homosexuality is a choice."

      So, what was your point, again?

  • Posted By: christ0p @ 01/10/2009 2:11:52 PM

    is this really news... oh and cpipkins i am just glad you have seen the light and will be saving all of us. i can tell you are an altruistic person of high moral fiber. i hope you enjoy your pearly gates, angels and unicorns. it must be nice to have everything figured out. you know there are a few other choice quotes in the good book of yours... something about throwing stones (shrug) i forget...

    • Posted By: cpipkins @ 01/10/2009 2:28:16 PM

      Not throwing stones; simply making a statement of fact. Over the past decade their has been a surge of rebellion against God and His word including pornography, murder, taking bribes, abortion, lying, cheating, lust of money, gluttony, and worst of all we have pushed Him out of EVERY aspect of life in America.

      It is unconscionable to me that we have take the very one who instituted law out of the courthouse.........think about it for a moment. If He had not said "Thou shalt not kill" then killing, which would be fun for some, should be allowed by their standard.

      It seems to me that everyone in the U.S. has rights EXCEPT GOD (or His children) all because a segment of this society doesn't want any of His divine laws in their lives.

  • Posted By: vstillwell @ 01/10/2009 2:26:18 PM

    I'm sick of these rock star preachers who are only in it for money, power and a special place at the GOP table of greed and stupidity. You would have to be a fool to follow these idiots.

  • Posted By: olddognewtricks @ 01/10/2009 2:20:41 PM

    Posted By: cpipkins @ 01/10/2009 2:15:33 PM

    If you truly understood what Jesus said, then you would understand. He said, "FIRST take the beam out of your own eye and then you will be able to remove the speck out of your brother's eye." The intent here is to live a life of CONSTANT repentance to help others toward repentance.

    Everyone, including myself, must repent daily.


    Why would a "superior being" demand such of a being it created, one that was given "free will?"

  • Posted By: olddognewtricks @ 01/10/2009 2:18:41 PM

    So not one shred, cpipkins...

    So if you decided to have a homosexual relationship, because you chose to, you could perform? How sad and shallow of you don't have that ability.

    If I am not physically capable of sexual performance with another unless that person is a person I find physical attractive and have established a psychological bond with. I'm not suggesting I don't find certain people attractive, or that I believe that I might find several people that meet that criteria at the same time, those are my unique criteria in sexual relationships.

    these criteria have been with me since childhood if not birth, and I could no more change that than eye or skin color.

  • Posted By: christ0p @ 01/10/2009 2:10:22 PM

    is this really news... oh and pipkins i am just glad you have seen the light and will be saving all of us. i can tell you are an altruistic person of high moral fiber. i hope you enjoy your pearly gates, angels and unicorns. it must be nice to have everything figured out. you know there are a few other choice quotes in the good book of yours... something about throwing stones (shrug) i forget...

    • Posted By: cpipkins @ 01/10/2009 2:15:33 PM

      If you truly understood what Jesus said, then you would understand. He said, "FIRST take the beam out of your own eye and then you will be able to remove the speck out of your brother's eye." The intent here is to live a life of CONSTANT repentance to help others toward repentance.

      Everyone, including myself, must repent daily.

  • Posted By: Ally4Christ @ 01/10/2009 2:15:27 PM

    I love you with the love of Jesus. And I pray that you will see the truth and light, just as I have. LOVE Ya!!!

  • Posted By: emergingkurt @ 01/10/2009 2:15:12 PM

    The power that comes with a pastoral position can corrupt a man as surely as the power that comes with a corporate leadership position. When churches focus on piety and judgment instead of love and understanding they create these kind of situations. What is a man in a position of Church power who finally discovers he doesn't agree with every point of church doctrine supposed to do? Most church structures are set up under the assumption that this couldn't happen, but it does and it causes many to become liars to keep their paychecks, status, and health insurance.

  • Posted By: Ally4Christ @ 01/10/2009 2:13:29 PM

    Ally_4 Cchrist,
    First of all I do know and believe that God has made every human bieng a man or a woman. God is God and he is Perfect and Holy and we are not. God can not error nor will he error, because he is not human. We are created in his image and by him. We can not change our physical or sexual prefernce, even if we want to or try. Our organs, DNA, and desires are soley made by God, to be who He has made us to me and created.. God did created us with choices, choices that can better our lieves or damage our life. Are we perfect "No". For we All Sin and come short to God's Golry. Does that mean we can't ask Christ for forgiveness and repent. "Surely", that is why Christ died for our sins, to ask for forgiveness and repent. Which repentance means to trun away from that which one has commited wrong.
    Homosexuallty is a sin; just like lieing, stealing, adultery and so forth. Yes God loves us as sinners, but he hates sin. "Why", again, because he is a Holy God and can not allow sin. That is why we must ask Christ to forgive us our sin and repent. And seek the Lord with all our Heart, Mind and Soul. We can fall from grace. But, we can ask forgiveness and God will surely forgive us (through Christ). Once we accept Christ as our Lord and Savior and live for him. That is where God gives us His Holy Spirit to guide us, teach us and help us live a good and pure life for him. Do we get tempted of cours, so did Christ. "But" we have a choice to call on God's Spirit to help us and lead us not into the temptation, but deliver us from it.. And I know that I know that He will. So the choice is yours and mine to make. Serve Christ with all our hearts and gain eternal life in Heaven with God, or choice sin (death) and live in eternal damnation with Satan, who is the father of all lies and hatered towards God. Satan wants us not only to reject Christ, as our Lord and Saivor. But to deny his (God) existence. So dear friends, let me ask you. Do you rather choice Hell or Eternal Salvation with God? Which will be your choice today? Lots of Love, a true child of God.

  • Posted By: Heartlight3 @ 01/10/2009 2:09:35 PM

    For all of you who think being gay is a choice, tell me one thing. Why would someone choose a life where they would be treated the way gay people are treated?

  • Posted By: Christfollower1965 @ 01/10/2009 11:06:46 AM

    I am shocked and saddened that Pastor Haggard was "banished" from his own church. The Church has failed miserably, how many of his parrishners have committed adultery, fornication? How many of his board members that made him sign such a terrible agreement looked at a female in the church and had lust in thier hearts? He sinned as we all do and his struggle was public. I sure do not want my sin public. No wonder true Christians do not go to church much anymore, such shameful behaviors are happeing all in the name of my Lord and Savior....Maybe you should read Mathew 7:21.

    • Posted By: willem1 @ 01/10/2009 2:07:48 PM

      darling pleeze you havent committed any sin, ok perhaps one and that is attending church!

  • Posted By: kmchez @ 01/10/2009 11:12:39 AM

    As a pastor myself, I do feel the shame that should be evident in all those involved. Yes, I do think Ted was overly punished, but shouldn't it be that way? This was a man a great influence over many. Ted understood the responsiblity he faced. Not only did he have the responisbility to his own family, he was intrusted with the faith of thousands. These kinds of morals failures happen everyday to many people, not just pastors, but they most often don;t make news!

    The Bible is very clear in the methods to be used for forgiveness and restoration and for the most part, it has been done in this case. It is a bit harsher for Ted, but because of the influence he carried, his circumstances and the way church discipline is carried out still has the ability to shape Christian world views in the eyes of others.

    I guess I should consider myself lucky, and so should every average Joe in this life, because if we should fall, it is doubtful my story would warrant the news, but I would still expect my church to react in very much the same way. Anytime that a pastor gets caught up in moral failure, regardless of gay or straight or embezellment or whatever, the first course of action should be to remove him from the pulpit.

    Then very carefully, the church should take strides to forgive and restore this man. Ted understood the choices before he made them, and for a brief period of pleasure, he chose to sacrifice his faith, his family and quite possibly his church.

    Because of the great media attention given to this case, we may never know, how far reaching this story goes, and how much more damage and already shaky world view of Christianity will sustain, but how this church deals with it will reverberate for years to come.

    Ted's punishent was harsh, but deservably so, but the church still has a responsibility to forgive and restore this man. Although, I would question any churches decision to put him back in a pulpit, he does and his family does deserve to be brought back into the fellowship of the church and loved unconditionally as the Bible teaches.

    • Posted By: willem1 @ 01/10/2009 2:04:50 PM

      oh jezus maria pastor pleeze you wrote:"a brief period of pleasure" he was after the guys 9 inch weenie for several years!!
      GO TED GO.

  • Posted By: Bacchus1 @ 01/10/2009 1:37:06 PM

    I disagree, Duke. People always have choices, and if you feel that you don't, it doesn't speak for anyone but you (any more than a sampling of people I associate with can speak for everyone). I also 'knew' since I was 6 that I was going to be an eagle someday, and my mother was so convinced at one point that I was gay that she asked me. (She 'knew'? Which, if she happened to be correct, could be retroactively applied as evidence.) A study using the Australian Twin Registry that showed only 20% of identical twins showed homosexual inclinations. And I do agree, that I believe bisexuality is much more prevalent than people believe, but the attitude of "If you're bi, you're closeted" is unfortunately common. But like I said, hard science will tell, someday. :-) And this article isn't even about that. Back to the point:

    Maybe I should read more about Haggard, if his lies encompassed more than this? I thought this was an article about prevailing over derision, but someone made a good point. If he believes in God, shouldn't he have faith that this was for the best, somehow? Newsweek does have a slanted view, a lot of the time. ^_^ And I should actually go get some sun, away from the computer. It's a beautiful day out. Peace out, all!

    • Posted By: duke613 @ 01/10/2009 2:04:28 PM

      You disagee because you are not living it. There is absolutely no choice involved. Your comment just demonstrates that you do not understand what "being gay" is. I'm not talking of just myself. I am speaking about the gay experience. Can you choose your skin color or eye color? No it is the same with being gay. It is decided at birth. No amount of therapy or scripture reading will ever change that.

      More and more research is coming out every year on the biological studies of this subject. It is just proving something that gay people have always known. In fact Newsweek just published an artlcle a few months ago titled "The Gay Brain" which detailed the lastest research.

      There is a difference between being gay and being bisexual. They are not the same thing.

      It amazes me the amount of straight people that will tell you that "you were not born that way"....are they living in our shoes? We are TELLING you we are born that way....and yes it is natural and our relationships are just as important.

  • Posted By: perrin @ 01/10/2009 12:00:15 PM

    I was walking down the street at lunchtime one day and there were two people getting paid to hold up a sign that said SHAME, SHAME. SHAME. They didn't know anything about it other than the fact that they were getting paid to hold it up. they handed me a flyer that condemed trade unions or something to that effect. The point is they didn't rally care what it said, they just wanted the cash.
    Then I ran across an article on the web about Dr.Charles Roselli, a genetic research scientist from The Oregon Health and Science University studying the mating habits of sheep, and a light bulb went off in my head. Ok, now stop laughing, I'm trying to be serious here.
    P.E.T.A. as we all know by now as People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals is objecting to the research. Why? well, it seems that Roselli's research has uncovered some interesting facts about the rams in the herd. About 8 percent of the rams aren't interested in mating with the opposite sex sheep, the rams are gay, and P.E.T.A. was really quick to pounce on the fact that Roselli was euthanizing sheep and looking at their brain tissue to understand why. Not exactly catch and release kind of research. Roselli uses about 18 sheep a year in his research, a far cry from the 4 million or so cultivated wordwide for food and wool.

    Why would P.E.T.A. zero in on Roselli?. Maybe this will explain it better. P.E.T.A. asked its membership to write this letter to the university president. "I find it appalling that experimenters are cutting open and killing gay sheep in an attempt to 'cure' homosexual tendencies in animals. These experiments also carry the insidious implication that homosexuality in humans needs to be cured."

    Roselli's research is really more about understanding animal populations and saving endangered animals from extinction rather that trying to stir up the gay rights pot as P.E.T.A. apparently is. The Image of a fuzzy, helpless animal getting ripped apart by a mad scientist is a powerful one, and I guess P.E.T.A. needs more sheep stories to feed to its own sheep like followers.

    The Honorable R. Albert Mohler Jr, President of the Southern Baptist Seminary enters the room about this time, throws his card on the game table and spews out his version of the now infamous Roselli research.The plot thickens. Mr Mohler supports Rosseli"s research because he thinks it could lead to the ground breaking discovery that being gay could somehow be reversed before birth. And I thought the people holding the banner were weird. This guy has a whole flock of potential banner wielding sheep at his disposal if he can drum up a good enough argument and then "bang" before you know it we could have designer babies popping out all over the place. Just choose your colors and a sexual preference and its on its way in only nine short months.

    I guess I'm in the wrong business or something, sitting here at the computer while these brainiacs are pulling in boatloads of cash.

    • Posted By: willem1 @ 01/10/2009 1:52:12 PM

      i saw albert mohler the homophobic preacher on the larry king cnn tv show. whenever the word gay/lesbian came out of his face it was with total disgust!!! he showed so much hatred that it made me spit on the tv screen nd yes it made me feel better!! what those dudes dont understand is that they should concentrate on the poor and sick but ofcourse that doesnt help their anti gay/lesbian moneymaking jesus/god fraud! he is a total scam 24/7

  • Posted By: pokytrokyt @ 01/10/2009 1:51:57 PM

    There's is an ongoing scientific analysis to try to better understand the nature of human sexuality. To date, there is no evidence that indicates that sexual orientation is strictly nature, or nurture. But there have been peer reviewed studies that offer some clues:

    Studies of twins have shown a higher incidence of same sex orientation in one fraternal twin if the other twin is also homosexual. And the incidence is even greater in identical twins.

    Studies of intersexed children who were born with ambiguous genitalia also offer some insight on the nature vs nurture argument. Until recently, it was common practice for surgeons to convince parents to "fix" their childs genitalia soon after birth so they could be raised unambiguously as a single sex. But later studies of these children have shown the devastating effects of trying to "nurture" a child - even with supplemental hormone therapy - into a simple, single gender box.

    Yet that isn't proof that same sex orientation is strictly genetic, just that there may be some (or most? or all?) people born with a genetic predisposition to be attracted to the same sex. It's entirely possible that there are both genetic and in utero causes for same sex orientation and that nurture may have a role to play in all this as well.

    But I'd have to reject as illogical that nurture can be the sole cause of homosexual orientation. And as proof I think the best example is the so-called "ex gay" or "reparative therapy." Here we have people who are gay, but due to strong religious convictions do not want to be gay. They are so desperate to be straight that they try to fold, spindle and mutilate their gay bodies to fit into a straight mold. If nurture could make a person gay, then certainly the ex-gay therapy should be successful in making people with gay behavior into straight - right? But let's look at the stats: less than one percent of people who identify as gay or bisexual ever enter one of these programs voluntarily. And of those highly motivated individuals who enter the program, less than 10% are still "participating in their own recovery" ten years later. And even among those who are still participating, over half of those admit they are living as heterosexuals but still feel homosexual inclinations. With a success rate so low, the only proper description for ex-gay/reparative therapies is "quackery."

  • Posted By: C-Stoner @ 01/10/2009 11:01:36 AM

    God did not make Ted Haggard Gay/bi-sexual; just as he didn't makeRay Boltz Gay. God did not make Serial Killers the way they are to kill people; original sin did that! That's just a cheap rational reached in desperation by those looking for an excuse. God transforms lives. Yes he can use our sinful past to His glory, but that doesn't mean it was his plan. We all have choices/

    • Posted By: Ferdydurke @ 01/10/2009 1:49:59 PM

      Rev. Hagard is gay not because of his choice but because of the structure of his hypothalamus. He may chose to live a heterosexual life, but this will not alter the structure of this particular part of his brain. Further: Being gay is not equivalent to being a killer. On the other hand, being a homophob does drive people to murder, expecially if their homophobia is the result of attempts to suppress their own sexual orientation.

  • Posted By: jvkatzen @ 01/10/2009 1:48:37 PM

    I realize this guy made headlines. After all, attention-seeking is what he's all about. But how can he think his sexuality is any more important than that of my next door neighbor? Enough already! We need to drop all mention of the Haggards, the Palins, and their ilk. They are a social blight.

Reply

Report Abuse

Enter comments if any for reporting abuse