Spooked By the New Guy

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  • Posted By: PReed1962 @ 01/10/2009 2:45:52 PM

    Torture does not work. It is a scientific fact:
    you can get anyone to confess to anything.
    Is this usefull information? No. Is it wrong? Yes.

    • Posted By: bobcat4424 @ 01/10/2009 7:33:54 PM

      I was a senior intelligence analyst for a number of years (North Korea as a specialty) and I was always trained that intelligence reports gained by coercion had only one use --- to keep coffee stains off the bottom of your waste basket.

  • Posted By: bobcat4424 @ 01/10/2009 7:21:54 PM

    During the Bush administration intelligence managers and analysts were "required" to either support coercive interrogation methods and wiretapping of American citizens without warrant or to "get out of Dodge." Their training had unequivocally told them that both activities were wrong and, in themselves constituted criminal acts. Many quit. They call it the Cheney Purge. A similar thing happened when President Carter took office. Many analysts and managers felt that the Russians were poorly trained and equipped and could not match us in sustained operations. (Think Russian-trained and equipped Republican Guards in Iraq.) The military-industrial complex and Carter himself advocated a huge military presence and this stance undercut that. Basically, intelligence analysts who saw a Rustbucket Army instead of a Russian Army were shown the door. It was called the Carter Purge. In both cases the United States cost its taxpayers billions upon billions of dollars because they got rid of intelligence people who did not go along with the "party line." Neither Bush nor Carter had any source of trustworthy intelligence during their terms --- only "yes" men who told them what they wanted to hear. The choice of an outsider instead of someone from inside the intelligence system who prostituted his craft to keep his job is a wise one. I know. I was there. I was one of those who quit before the Carter Purge.

  • Posted By: Spacer @ 01/10/2009 7:21:15 PM

    Liberal activists are frothing
    ---------------------------------------
    You can tell by that line by itself how the corporate media is spinning this story. How many articles have been written in Newsweek about conservative activists "frothing" -- something they do routinely, and they've been doing a lot more of it now that Barack Obama is going to be our president.

  • Posted By: chuckycheese @ 01/10/2009 2:38:30 PM

    Whether "enhanced interrogation" actually works is a good question. The only person answering that question is Dick Cheney who says it has worked and that Obama's team should really look into it before changing tactics. With Cheney's track record of lying we have no reason to believe him but these techniques may "work" at times. Unfortunately they also work to lower the integrity of democracy in the United States and in the eyes of the world. I hope Obama knows what he's doing by letting the roosters in with the chickens.

    Carl

    • Posted By: midnight05 @ 01/10/2009 7:02:39 PM

      We need to get back to a closer relationship between what we say we are as a nation and what we really are. We say we don't torture so lets not do it and lets not send people to countries where they do. Our justice system was able to try and sentence the Blind Sheikh to life using a jury and lawyers. We can do it again.

  • Posted By: midnight05 @ 01/10/2009 6:59:22 PM

    Panetta had nothing to do with torture and has gone on record against it. k If the CIA wants to redeem its reputation after being used as a punching bag by Rummy, Cheney and company, it needs a totally clean start.

  • Posted By: morphex @ 01/10/2009 5:03:38 PM

    i WOULD ADD TO CHUCKYCHEESE'S REMARKS THAT TORTURE, BY ANY NAME, THOUGH IT MIAY WORK AT TIMES, MORE OFTEN YIELDS FALSE INFORMATION WHEN THEN CONFORMS TO THE PRECONCEPTIONS OF THE TORTURERS AND PAYMASTERS.

  • Posted By: RobertDavidSTEELEVivas @ 01/10/2009 3:31:32 PM

    What planet are you on? Here on Earth, guys like me that have been spies and gone on to champion intelligence reform think Panetta is a superb candidate. He is the first DCI of substance since Bill Casey (meaning that unlike those before him since Casey, he will not be bamboozled by insiders or bullied by Congress), and as a former Chief of Staff at the White House AND Director of OMB, could not possibly be better prepared to understand all that is BAD about CIA"s crummy support to Presidential decision-making and its non-existent support to all others (Cabinet, Assistant Secretaries, action officers, and Congressional jurisdiction providing oversight of the Executive). By the same token, he is uniquely qualified to know what the President, D/OMB, and the Cabinet and Congress "need to know," most of which is NOT classified and NOT available from CIA.

    Forget about the witch hunt. I was there, a junior unindicted member of the Central American "games" when we were all told to get our own lawyer. If the Republic is not willing to impeach Dick Cheney for 25 documented imeachable offensses and 935 documented lies to the public and Congress, I hardly think the President-elect is gong to be concerned with the drolling left that knows nothing of intelligence (pun intended).

    Panetta is 70 and a power in his own right. I have no idea what his plans and intentions are, but I do know this: if he chooses to create the Open Source Agency recommended by the 9-11 Commission, with someone like Genera Powell or Senator Hagel in charge, ultimately spending $3 billion a year (taken away from the technical collection empire that is rotten to the core), then in one stroke, he can create a Smart Nation, migrate funds to education and research (both of which are "dual use" as a foundation for classified), and go from there to provide the President--AND Everybody Else--with decision support. I have an Op-Ed and a White Paper at www.oss.net/HILL.

    Please, stop listening to the whiners at CIA that realize the joy ride is over, and pay attention to the basics. You can start by looking at the long list of failures as DCI, many of whom served less thatn 3, 2, even 1 year. Panetta could--possibly--be a transformative figure for the Republic, and the first substantive DCI in the 21st Century. That is change I for one can believe in.

    Robert Steele
    CIA KR-594 (EOD 09/79)

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