The Afghan Puzzle

and oh yes, one more thing. Pakistanis seem too stupid to real the damage that the bombay attacks have done to Pakistan and how, perversely, they have been great for India.

Obama was talking about involving the US in settling the Kashmir dispute. He had been influenced by the thinking of Ahmed Rashid, and was planning to put serious pressure on India. It was starting to look like Indo-US relations would be headed downhill very rapidly and the party for India would be over, and that Indians would soon be shown that they are not as important or relevant as they think they are, that the US doesn't need good relations with India at the cost of good relations with Pakistan and China.

THings were looking bad for India.

Then the Pakistanis attacked Bombay and the whole situation flipped on its head. All talk of envoys and US mediation disappeared. the pro-India, anti-pakistan sentiment in the US public soared.

THere is now no question of any US mediation on Kashmir, and Pakistan can forget about getting any of the coddling Obama might have given it. This event has exposed to Obama that islamic terrorists operate openly in pakistan, that they are aided by the military and intelligence, that they are trained by ex military and intelligence, that the military and intelligence has no intention of reigning them in, that the civilian government has no power,and that these terrorists and the pakistani military's involvement for them will remain, even if Kashmir is solved.

And even if Obama does think about US mediation, the bombay attacks have given India the resolve to tell him to go to hell for siding with islamic terrorists.

In short, the bombay attacks have ended any chance of Obama getting involved on Kashmir.

Put that in your pipe and smoke it. and keep dancing about whatever diplomatic initiative you've won. At the end of the day, Pakistan is still the one with the begging bowl out and no sympathy anywhere.

Its funny. Some Saudi prince took a harsh message to Pakistan about getting itself in order, and sorting out its messes, and along with that message he included platitudes like how pakistan is the hope of the muslim world. the stupid pakistanis didn't hear the demand of change and reform. they only heard the praise.

and thats another thing. The pakistanis are like the pet dogs of the Saudis and Chinese. THey are always depsperate for good words from the Saudis and the Chinese, and when they get them, they turn silly with pleasure and joy. I suppose like many muslims, they regard the Saudis as the best muslims and the praise of the best muslims is like praise to a servant. And the chinese, it is almost embarrasing to see the Pakistanis grovelling in front of the Chinese.An alliance is one thing, but the Pakistanis forget all their pride and dignity when it comes to the chinese. their tails start wagging and they roll over and submit to the chinese every time.

Its funny to see pakistanis spin every event in some way that pleases their own ego. If anything can be at all avoided from being viewed as a setback, it will be spun into a victory for Pakistan. And the best part is, they believe their own nonsense. It was hilarious to watch people on Pakistani television unable to contain their pride that the bombay killers were able to hold for 3 days, and at the same time absolutely livid at the accusation that they came from Pakistan.

The Pakistanis KNOW that the terrorists in Bombaby were pakistanis, they are proud of what they did, the pakistanis were happy to see India getting a bloody nose, they were proud that "only 10 boys" were able to hold off the indian commandos for 10 days, but at the same time, they didn't want the whole world accusing Pakistanis of loving and supporting terrorism.

So, every aspect of the bombay attack was spun to make it look good for pakistan, except the various spins don't synch with each other.

THe pakistanis are stupidly feeling proud about something they believe is the success of their diplomatic initiative after the bombay attacks. there is no question that the terrorists and their master planners in the ISI and pakistani military played a fantastic hand. they did something that would either leave india unable to respond because of american pressure, or India would respond and that would get Pakistan from out of undere the American's thumb. IT was certainly well played.

But at the end of the day, it was just one play, Pakistasnis are screaming their heads off about "indian terrorism", but nobody is listening to them. The whole world views Pakistan as ground zero of islamic terrorism. It is pakistan that is under the American boot, not India.

Well well well, another U turn by India- Their Foreign Minster has accepted that Pakistan will take care of the so called alleged LeT Kashmir fighters. As I next step, they will also realize that the attacks were planned in India by some Col Srikant prohit wana bees- an Indian Army officer who is responsible and found guilty by Indian courts for Samjohta express carnage, where more than 50 Pakistanis were burnt alive in the train. This is what we call ineffective diplomacy. Whats more, British foreign secretary after President elect Obama is highlighting the need to resolve Kashmir issue. India is now rightly in a spot of bother. The world is recognizing the human rights abuse my Indian military in Kashmir and looking to address it.

In the USA the homicide rate is closer to 14K than 40K/yr, and many of those are not taken to court. America as a whole may be 40K/yr or higher, but that includes 2 continents. I do note that US drug laws, ignoring the experience of Prohibition in the 1920s, cause a large fraction of these murders, so that they are intentional on the part of the US government. Not intended, except by a few psychopaths and other maniacs, but intended in the sense they are an "acceptable" consequence for the lawmakers.

Talking about India's poor suffering while India spends money on defence is another favorite Pakistani tack against India.

Firstly, at least India has the cash to spend, unlike pakistan which has the begging bowl out in front of the "friends of pakistan". See, when India's economic model failed and it ran into an economic crisis and the IMF imposed conditions on India, India adopted those conditions, which lead to the economic liberalization that has caused India's economy to explode and has greatly increased its standing in the world. Pakistanis on the other hand, when they go broke, instead of adopting the IMF's conditions, they curse the IMF, the refuse the reforms the IMF demands, they refuse to hold their military and civilian governments accountable for good management of the economy, and so Pakistan has to keep going back to the IMF again and again, and each time it fails to implement the corrections that the iMF requires.

Pakistanis should stop worrying about India's poor and how much money India spends on defence. They should worry instead about the fixes they need in their own country that wille stablish the economy stability and prosperity they need to stop having to begging to the IMF again and again.

But thats just it. Pakistanis are unable or unwilling to create the reform in their own country that will be needed for economic stability and prosperity. THey are only obsessed with India and Kashmir. THe path to economic prosperity would have to include making peace with India, setting up free trade .relations with India, downsizing the military, de-islamicising the politics of Pakistan, establishing stable democracy, establishing universities that are world class centers of learning, free of the influence of islamists, curbing the freedom of the likes of Lashkar-e-Toiba.

But Pakistanis don't want to do that. Any of it. So they will not gain the economic stability and prosperity they should have.

So they will continue to waste their energies being angry and jealous of India's economic success and trying to point out how India spends so much money on defence while it is so poor. THe truth is that Pakistanis don't care about India's poor. THey are just angry and jealous that they can't match India's military spending.

This comment is for Indian naive educationist Mr. aarkay- who is just like Indian government in a State of Denial. Gentleman, following lines are from your own journalist M. K. Bhadrakumar who writes at Asia times. Should I share more???


M. K. Bhadrakumar writes at Asia Times Online:

"By gently holding out the threat to the U.S. that the Afghan operations would grievously suffer unless Washington restrained Delhi from precipitating any tensions on the India-Pakistan border, Islamabad seems to have neatly pole-vaulted over Rice to appeal straight to the Pentagon, where there is abiding camaraderie towards the Pakistani generals.

With Pakistan's recalcitrance and Mullen's veiled threat of reopening the Kashmir file, a sense of frustration is gripping Delhi. Pakistan has ignored India's tough posturing. The faltering Indian security agencies, which have been in a state of appalling decline in recent years, seem to have failed to put together any hard evidence of a Pakistani involvement in the Mumbai attacks.

All indications are that Pakistan is not impressed by the Indian rhetoric. It seems to think Indian politicians are grandstanding in an election year. But, just in case Delhi may spring a surprise, Pakistani army chief General Ashfaq Kayani has warned that the armed forces would give an equal response "within few minutes" if India carried out any surgical military strikes. "The armed forces are fully prepared to meet any eventuality, and the men are ready to sacrifice for their country," he reportedly said.

Just as we predicted, an all out war seems to have been averted and Indian media and officials are admitting defeat.

China, Saudi Arabia and Iran have come out strongly in the last couple of days which saw an intense diplomatic effort by all parties to make it clear to India that they not only remain unconvinced of Delhi's allegations, but also that any attack could have serious consequences for India and the region as a whole.

Pranab Mukherjee was made to do an embarrassing u-turn on India's previous stance previously, admitting that terrorism - a global issue and not a bilateral one - should be fought jointly.
The Indian officials have also been made to backtrack from their earlier claims of deploying troops along the border with Pakistan.

waa7
no valid argument has passed my eyes in this anti islamic diatribe with pak iran taleban and hamas being the target of just abuse and blind hatred
without a single shred of any evidence at all
i am sure that the majority of even americans are not as ignorant or absurd muslim haters as i know from experience and this is a admin policy which the press and some foul mouthed pseudo identities are pursuing for a failed economic giant trying to find any scapegoats
tho they have learnt their lesson in last six years and it seems mr obama will be more discreet and sensible as he is at least so far refrained from lying publicly at least
regards

This is a very lame response Mr. Aarkay. It is easy to cover your head in dust and pretend nothing is wrong than come up with some hard evidence to negate the facts

This is a message for the pakistani propagandist Mr. Kamran Mooen writers like him make a career out of writing fiction - stop fooling your self. Get real. Perhaps he has not heard the famous saying - You can fool some people sometimes but not all the people all the time.

This is a message for the pakistani propagandist Mr. Kamran Mooen writers like him make a career out of writing fiction - stop fooling your self. Get real. Perhaps he has not heard the famous saying - You can fool some people sometimes but not all the people all the time.

It is very weird to see India spending billions of dollars acquiring weapons of mass destruction, while millions of Indians are forced to live on the streets, thanks to the extreme poverty. According to some estimates this number is almost similar to the population of Pakistan. This is mind boggling and begs the question why- If they could give half of this money to their own people, they would have been just fine. But the state of denial in which India is now a days, one wonders it is not forthcoming any time soon.

Another interesting thing to look at is even after acquiring weapons of mass destruction, Indian military on ground lacks penetration, zeal and to a larger extent professionalism. A case in point is recent hold up in the Mander sector of the Indian occupied Kashmir. Only eight Kashmirs freedom fighters managed to hold the entire Indian armed forces brigade for almost a month. Honestly, what a shame for the entire country. The icing on the cake was the public press conference by the Indian chief of Army Staff, threatening (as usual) to attack Pakistan. Good Lord, the entire brigade could not face 8 men and there a senior army officer is threatening to attack a nuclear Armed state. One can only describe it as Laughable.

Let me also share a recent incident when Indian air force violated Pakistan air space. Adm. Mike Mullen asked Pakistan for a guarantee that Pakistan Air Force will not respond to Indian surgical strikes. General Kayani is said to have responded with showing Mullen a photograph of an IAF Mirage-2000 locked by Pakistan Air Forces' F-16 taken on December 13. 'Next time, we'll bring it down', Mullen was told. To make sure the message was loud and clear, Pakistan Air Force jets started patrolling the skies in hot mode and a red-alert was issued throughout the country. The Indian war rhetoric has failed to impress Pakistan. Instead, the focus is now shifting to Indian intelligence agencies' failure to put together credible evidence implicating Pakistan in the Mumbai attacks.

The reason for tensions in South Asia is because of Pakistan???s use of terrorism as an instrument of state policy.

Japan and China have disputes, but China does not send in terrorists to a Tokyo train station to shoot at unarmed civilians. Malaysia and Singapore have disputes but Malaysia does not send in terrorists to Singapore to bomb shopping malls. Yet this is exactly what Pakistan does.

Both India and Afghanistan are very frustrated with Pakistan???s use of terrorism.

So far the US has been trying to discourage Pakistan through backdoor diplomacy, but there are no signs Pakistan wants to change course.

Current huge media exposure of Pakistan as the sponsor of Mumbai terrorist attack has escalated the costs for Pakistan. But this is hardly sufficient.

Delay of IMF, World Bank payments to Pakistan citing other reasons is welcome step. Additional punitive measures in diplomatic, military, and economic spheres are needed to further coerce Pakistan. That???s where the policy change needs to come. Afghanistan hopes India will send ground troops to Afghanistan.

Besides above, civilian government in Pakistan should be strengthened. The military hold should be weakened which also requires further weakening of its conventional force capabilities. Diversion of money meant for civilian development to conventional forces is going to be even more restricted and scrutinized.

Ettiquette,

yeah, thats the standard blather that the pakistanis spout against India, and indeed, india has to answer for the crimes its political parties and leaders have committed.

But if you believe that the magnitude, consequences, etc of what has happened in India, is approximately equivalent to what Pakistan has done, you're mistaken.If India is so anti muslim, why haven't Indian muslims gone to fight the jihad in Kashmir? Why don't they migrate to Pakistan or Indonesia or Egypt?

The fact is, vast majority of India's muslims, despite their troubles, have little interest or sympathy with Pakistan or with the cause of the Kashmiris. Pakistan's terrorists intelligence agencies of course keep trying to infiltrate India's muslim community and organize them against the state in the hope to destabilizing India, but they have very little success. Pakistanis have these stupid delusions that India is inherently unstable and god willing the pakistanis will cause it to break up and re-establish islamic rule all over India.

Unfortunately for them, most Indian muslims are not interested in being traitors to India, and all the terrorist ISI can do is reach a few angry radicalized misguided youths.

In the end, the power of India is that despite it being a nation of Hindus, the right wing hindu nationalists cannot secure control over India. The majority of India's hindus reject the far right extremism of the RSS and keep a check on the power of the RSS. But Pakistan has no such means or ability to keep a control on the islamic terrorist organizations that it has fostered and encouraged.

India or the US don't have to do anything to Pakistan. It is committing suicide itself. It should make peace with India, create a EU type south asia free trade union, incorporate itself into the world economy by trading with and through india. But the Pakistani ego is too big to make peace with India. THe pakistani hatred and bigotry against India is without limit and without shame.

Time will tell all. India is not perfect, and Pakistanis spend a lot of energy trying to show how its worse than Pakistan in every way, and how everything thats supposedly good about it is just a balloon of hot air. Fine. Time will tell all.

I predict that Pakistan future is very very grim. It lives by renting itself out to the Americans and the CHinese and Saudis. This prostition and its accompanying money makes the pakistanis think their country is in good shape.

But, like i said, time will reveal all.

I am absolutely amazed at how easily Mullen gives a thinbs up at everything that the Pakistan government and the military are doing. While I understand that a senior person like him has to be careful in what he needs to say, it's surprising that he has left no room for interpretation about Pakistan's actions and intentions. He also completely makes light of the fact that Pakistani officers are down right hostile to the US, by laying the blame entirely on the Pressler amendment. Unless, American recognizes "THE WRITING ON THE WALL" and call a "SPADE-A_SPADE" and act accordingly to protect itself, I fear America will never be safe from the global jihadist agenda of the Saudi and the Pakistani establishment.........Murali, Atlanta

Democracy in Pakistan has been a victim of US interests. The convenient stability of a dictatorial regime is too much to lose compared to not so stable first steps of a people towards democracy. The reconciliation/democracy has yet to establish itself, and the flash of a military rule in the garb of democracy, with General Musharraf at the helm, is being pushed, and it could materialize as soon as the end of 2009, when Musharraf completes his 2 years since retirement. US interest in building good relations with the Pakistan military always collides with Pakistans democracy and the Pakistani military officers trained in US would provide for another crop of military dictators in Pakistan, a country where poverty, unemployment, shortage of energy and lack of education and health has kept the people in utter misery for decades. The military consumes most of the resources of the country while the majority deals with abject poverty and the product the military builds include missiles, bombs, submarines, none of those could help alleviate the suffering of the people.