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Diesel vs. Hybrid

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While carmakers lament their overflowing lots full of unsold cars, slow demand isn't a problem for Volkswagen's 2009 Jetta TDI, the first passenger car with a clean-diesel engine that gets 40 miles per gallon on the highway. "We're selling every one we get," said Jim Gill, a spokesman for Volkswagen Group of America. The performance-oriented and fuel-efficient engines are also making their way into the company's Rabbit and its Touareg SUV.

Diesels aren't exactly new. They've been widely popular in Europe where they secured 50 percent of the overall market last year. But they've been slow to catch on in the United States, capturing only 2.3 percent of the market. That's despite the fact that some new diesel engines offer roughly 25 to 30 percent better fuel economy than hybrids and have a cheaper price premium—$1,000 to $2,000 instead of $4,000 to $5,000. Another added benefit: diesel's pep. "You get great fuel economy gains without sacrificing performance," says Rob Moran, a spokesperson for Mercedes-Benz, which recently introduced its BlueTec clean-diesel engine in several models sold in America. "People are starting to see that diesel is another option that's out there."

Automakers do have reason to be optimistic about diesel's future. J. D. Power and Associates predicts that by the year 2015, they will slightly outsell hybrids, 1.5 million to 1.45 million. But to fulfill that prediction, diesels will have to overcome their environmentally unfriendly image. For decades, it was tough for car manufacturers to meet tighter U.S. emission standards for pollutants—specifically nitrogen oxides, or NOx. But technological advances have made some performance diesels like the Jetta run almost as cleanly as some unleaded cars.

Still, perception is a huge drawback, says John DiCicco, a senior fellow for automotive strategies at the Environmental Defense Fund. Diesels still get a bad rap from consumers who remember the engines as loud, dirty and smoky, while hybrids "have won the perception war," he said.

Then there's the issue of falling fuel prices. Unleaded may have topped $4 a gallon during the summer of 2008, but prices have more than halved in much of the country. Even though the up-front costs for a diesel engine are less than for a hybrid vehicle, the current price disparity between the types of fuels (diesel is currently about 40 to 70 cents more per gallon than regular gasoline) could cancel out much of the financial benefits of buying a diesel car.

"Until the price of the two fuels gets in line with each other, the acceptance of diesel in the U.S. will be limited," says Chuck Schifsky, a spokesman for American Honda Motor Co. In the short term, Honda will be investing in hybrid technology, not diesel engines, as the key way to get better fuel economy and environmental benefits. That's the same reasoning used at GM and Ford, both of which are focusing their future efforts on hybrids.

That's fine for companies like Volkswagen, which will offer even more diesel models next year. "We're confident they'll do well," says VW's Gill. That kind of optimism is rare among automakers. But if VW's sales remain strong, the rest of the industry might just have to rethink how it gets its motors running.

© 2009

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  • Posted By: DRendar1978 @ 02/11/2009 8:34:54 AM

    @Harrylogy
    "The attitude of lecturing"
    Er, that wasn't a lecture. it was information, if you can't tell the difference go back to school.

    "especially Americans"
    Oh, I'm sorry, you're American! That means you're right and the rest of the PLANET is wrong! Damn I forgot about that...

    "Apart from that,the concept of high tech motors installed in Mickey mouse cars,like the Golf,is comitragic."
    Wow! The arrogance! You really aren't doing the American stereotype any favours are you?
    What the hell does "Comitragic" mean anyway? Go and buy a dictionary for crying out loud.
    I'll assume you mean "Silly" or "Comical" or something like that?
    The fact is that what you consider a "Mickey Mouse" car, is actually VW's best selling car and the 2nd best selling car in Europe overall.
    http://cars.uk.msn.com/News/Top_ten_article.aspx?cp-documentid=7319152

    The Golf is widely accepted as one of THE cars to own if you are a driving enthusiast. (The Golf GTi range is legendary). It isn't even a very small car - there are at least two VW's that are smaller (the Lupo and the Polo). The Golf is about the same size as the Ford Focus, which I believe is pretty popular in the US (Although thankfully the ones we get in Europe have completely different Engines, suspension and transmission - judging by the one I hired when visiting the US). So ours are pretty fun.

    "We Americans have real cars ( > 16ft ) & we want to see those cars equipped with diesels..."
    'Real Cars'? So you drive a 'real' car and everyone else on the planet is driving around in a mickey mouse car? What are you...10 years old? ("My cars bigger than your car! neer! neer!")
    A 16ft vehicle isn't a car, its a boat with wheels (And handles about as well)

    Sales of SUVs in the US are falling faster than hell, your vehicle manufacturers are going out of business and having to be saved with YOUR tax dollars, and you still insist that you're right?



    I apologise to anyone who I have offended with this - I'm not Anti-American, but moronic comments like the ones left by this person don't do anyone any good.

  • Posted By: DRendar1978 @ 02/10/2009 9:48:23 AM

    It still amazes me that most people over in the US have this blinkered view of diesel vehicles as being dirty, slow or polluting. You really don't know what you're missing out on.

    I live in the UK, and drive a 2003 VW Golf, which has a 1.9L PD TDi engine.
    It outputs a little over 100BHP, and I regularly get 50-60MPG (42-50 US).
    I actually got 65MPG (54 US) average once on a 400Mile trip, as I kept the speed below 70MPH (I usually drive at 85-90MPH and get 55ish (46 US)).

    This is in a car that is nearly 6 Years old!!

    The new MK6 VW Golf Bluemotion, which gets released this year gets 74.3MPG (63.4 US) on the combined cycle - so you're looking at over 80MPG (68 US) on the motorway / highway. All this and it's slightly more powerful that the one I have now at 103BHP.

    The way forward is Diesel Hybrid. Stick a 1.3L Diesel generator in a Volt or other Hybrid vehicle and you're looking at 150-200MPG easy. Probably get over 100 even when the batteries are flat.

  • Posted By: chadsuitts @ 02/09/2009 12:51:10 AM

    Actually, the price difference for diesel came within the last decade, as personal diesel vehicle fell by the wayside from the bad rap the fuel had received. After this disparagement, the only users of the diesel fuels were shipping and transportation companies. The US government felt they were losing a lot of possible tax income in these industries, so they increased the tax percentage to indirectly profit from their work. This caused consumers to looki away from the fuel even more than before. Soon, Americans were purchasing so many SUV's and Hummers getting 8-12 mpg that the fuel industry knew the could raise prices and the average American couldn't do a thing about it but keep pouring money from their wallets to feed their coffers (even with lower gas prices starting mid-2008, ExxonMobile just listed worldwide record profits exceeding $42 billion...profit, not gross!)

    Diesel, in the meantime was being used in Europe almost as much as unleaded, but America wouldn't allow them into the US. BMW has multiple diesel vehicles but the UAW wouldn't allow those engines into the US, citing lose of work for the Auto Workers. They were able to convince the US government to force BMW to ship their vehicles to the US with either temporary engines or no engine at all so that BMW would have to contract US auto workers to place American unleaded engines in the car. (My father used to work int he auto industry along with many uncles and other relatives. I have heard all about the work they did.)

    With huge advancements, mainly from the European market, diesel now runs up to 20% cleaner than unleaded, gets 20-20% better fuel efficiency, and as is harrylogy states, it is cheaper to produce. Not only that, but the wear and tear on the diesel engine is less (also those engines are typically made much more durable) and don't tend to need an overhaul or to be replaced until well over 200,000 miles of use. Add to that the fact that biodiesel can be produced from almost a hundred different sources (soybeans, sunflower seeds, animal fat, and many more) and any diesel engine can run on biodiesel fuels with very minor adjustments to the engine (fuel hoses need to be replaced for more durable matter than standard rubber hosing). Even if your diesel auto is running on bio-diesel and you cannot get to another source of bio-diesel, such as made in your garage, you can mix stadard non-bio diesel from the pump without damaging the engine.

    DIesel is very effective and efficient. A diesel-hybrid would relieve much of the impact on our society, economy and environment until even more efficient types of fuels become available. Until that happens, look into the diesel vehicles now being released into the US. There will be at least 7 models released (until this year, only the VW Jetta was permitted to be imported into the US) and write your congressman to release the tax penalties on diesel fuel so it becomes more economical to the average consumer.

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