A Matter of Honor

Harley Is Here maybe knows Vietnam was cause of high youth protest, Harvard Students ALREADY WERE ENLIGHTENED and cared about this country and the international scene....I attended Harvard Summer School, and knew of MIT's Noam Chomsky and that he was anti-Vietnam war, and that the supposed enlightened consensus was the corrupt corporate military industrial complex...and the "establishment"... My ex, who was the same class year as Al Gore, (Al Gore served in the military as a journalist), was totally upset by the entire thing and took pass/fail his senior year, an option for All Harvard students...DUE TO THE DRAFT...students were sent overseas to fight a war they did not want by the thousands, and killed by the thousands...my brother hoped his number would be missed, although he took the ROTC test and was told he could get four years of guaranteed "office" work, he preferred his chances and got drafted, front lines on the "rice patties" in Vietnam, and his best friend, a junior from Colgate University, Chemistry major, was shot dead, and he had to carry him, and said his body was like lead, surprisingly heavier than when alive....The DRAFT got removed, and that, to my hindsight is all that was accomplished (not the establishment corrupt military buildup)...the Harvard students protested in the streets and the cops used tear gas against them, the students "stormed the bastille" namely they entered the Administration Building and took it over, put out the "adults".
In September 2008, I posted for Boston University at the law school library and got no response, urging them to pick up Nader's suggestion, that they could debate the ACTUAL CANDIDATES REAL TIME and get youth input for presidential candidate's political agendas....Nader admonished the students then, December 2006 (he was not a candidate at the time), that IF either of the two frontrunners of the two parties were elected, there would be a draft..I posted a flyer that was "Carpe Diem" to the law school students, but no replies... Nader was trying to offer the BEST ADVICE....he told the students to consider WHO ARE YOU and not labels, and then figure what electoral questions are important. Students should look at this article and these comments and figure how a "status report" of their view of Obama and the election and that he said he wanted to do this, DO THE STUDENTS? Are they going to go voluntarially, or will they expect the "idiots" who don't know anything, and did not have the opportunity to know, to go for them, and think they will watch and not fight? Fight?!!! What is the fight? That is the key question in my view. there is no fight to fight, except to force our own country to behave. Uninformed voters for Obama and NOT his wars? How did that happen? Surely it has.

BEFORE the election Obama, the DEMOCRAT (I call it the anti-democracy party, because they refused the Nader on stage challenge for three elections with the media's enthusiastic fierce corrupt endorsement of the two party corrupt tyranny against the people, it is no wonder the people don't understand why the military keeps increasing when THEY did not do it...it is corruption, and the ballot box is supposed to be ultimate power...I DID NOT VOTE FOR THE TWO PARTY INCUMBENT TYRANNY, I voted for change and freedom, and am still encouraging Americans they do not have to take this result of offensives of military increases entirely UNWANTED BY THE MAJORITY and that fact, refused by the media, including Newsweek...)I voted for Nader and am suggesting 50 states' legislatures could serious review voiding the election of railroaded military corrupt incumbents only as the only two choices, and force the honest truth of the nation and see if the UNCORRUPTING of America can indeed happen and the government CAN be FOR the people, BY the people, and OF the people...declare the 2008 election not valid until//unless all SIX candidates are fairly and objectively presented nationally to the people and a debate required...OH YES...the entire thing could be forced done by the FEDERAL BUDGET TAXES current, NOW not later....yes, the Tenth Amendement invoked by the people's outrage against Obama and his intent to invade and occupy Afghanistan and increase military red ink spending and only use taxes for corporate use, entirely against the obvious proper balanced budget of taxes for public interest services for honest nationally needed services for the people, NOT private war corporations profits while soldiers come home in coffins for NO REASON killing people they do not hate, and who have NOT offended this country and do not even want to...only Obama and Bush are the ones who are doing improper policy and military offensives, and the entire picture is corruption of the incumbents, the people can demand a void, and new SIX not TWO of the honest truth that was on the ballot and refused by the media, let the taxes pay for the new election and the truth of informed voters proving majority rules for honest use of taxes for good and honest government. Look at the current new headline...17,000 troops "approved" Obama said before elected, he wanted 90,000...who is ready, which way do you want to go, for a new election and backing a true agenda, or continued corruption and offensives and increased red ink military? Write your governors, make it happen, get SIX not TWO and make Obama and McCain face Peace Candidates.

17,000 more troops to Afganistan. you have to ask yourself if Obama would have been president when 911 occurred, if the war against Terror wouldn't have been won by now. without the assets ans Troops going to the phony war cooked up by the Bush/Cheney gang it may have been a done deal. i only hope it's not too late to recover from their evilness.

Just had to comment on the constant bickering between sides. Been watching this post because I am curious of other's opinions. First Floridave, you're really not helping with the senseless political bashing. As for everyone else bashing the Bush Admin, it wasn't the best in the world, what has been done is done, we have a new President, so get over it, stop looking at the past and focus on the present and future. The issue is not political, it should not be used as political gain. when it comes down to it, it is about how each individual soldier feels about this issue. I believe families should be given the choice.

As a 100% disabled veteran, in truth it was Reagan that really began the dismantling of the VA system, forcing many vets from the rolls by creating so many hoops to hop thru, co pays, restrictions, reducing budgets, making it almost impossible to get any treatment. Clinton helped some, but GW Bush left us out to dry; he killed us thru ignorance, at least until the embarrassment of the Walter Reed incident which finally brought attention to the whole screwed up VA system so that he and the congress was forced to recognize and deal with how truly inept the VA was at caring for all those in need. He left office with the Mission Unaccomplished, with a hell of a lot of Vets riding in his wake, after placing them in harms way for his ego and arrogance. The terrorists haven't needed to attack us because GW did it for them by waging this unjustified war, helping cause us and the world to fail financially. First lie was WMD, then remove Sadam, then freedom, then a democratic way, now for peace or so they say anyway, changing it to fit his lie of the time that would make him look like he knew what he was doing, but along the way GW kind of forgot where we were actually supposed to be going, Afghanistan and Bin Laden. He gave us post-traumatic stress, traumatic brain injury, repeated tours, an undermaning problem created by lack of personnel, depleting the National Guard of men and equipment, causing substandard recruitment requirements. We were so ineptly unprepared for what we had planned to do and what really happened, it cost a hell of a lot of lives for naught and wasted billions of dollars, yet it goes on. And the Vets still wait to be taken care of, at the tail-end of line. While the great John McCain who claimed to us that he knew how to get Bin Laden, but he still seems to be keeping it all to himself, if it is true or was true he should have shared it by now I would think anyway, since it was supposed to be Country First by his claim. I just think it was a bunch of BS elect me talk, because he sure is trying his best to follow the same route as GW was before the election. The VA should be a direct part of the defense budget where a percentage of it automatically goes directly to Veterans care, so when we need to go to war we are already prepared to take care of those who serve, more importantly perhaps it will also help make those who vote for such measures think about what the consequences really are! But today; I salute all vets, for what they have given for me and all!

As a that disabled veteran from the Vietnam Era, I have long held that the policy implemented by the GW Bush administration of hiding those bodies of the brave men and women who have died for their country when they arrive back home in a flag draped coffin, is an affront to every veteran. Doing so after the fact that he used their service as a marketing/promotional/propaganda tool! I am ashamed by the fact that this has been going on! I have stood by all these years from childhood until now, having learned to honor and respect those who have given their lives in service. This is such a form of disgrace, while their sacrifices are being hidden in such an overt way by the very government that placed them in harms way to have them die in the first place. It is that very reason, that of transparency as the word being talked about of late, that of showing their sacrifices to the nation, which helps and guides us to see the reality of what our government is doing! The reason I as a veteran am ashamed of this policy is that it greatly diminishes those sacrifices that have been made by thousands of men and women. How was this or is this allowed? I don't know, but it should be looked into so that it cannot happen anymore, the people of this country should be able to see, realize and be able to judge what is going on! I have heard this privacy ploy being used, but it isn't a good one, it's for the government's privacy not those who have died. Yes, dignity is required, but they should not be hidden from the citizens! I have to think and believe that most people would not worry that their son or daughter is recognized for their service to their country, at least respectfully, I have never heard of it in my lifetime anyway.

All you liver flukes that think that it is disrespectful for the nation that sent these soldiers to die in their name should not have to face the results of that decision are aiding propaganda not stopping it. Every American voter should HAVE to view the caskets coming home. No names on the coffins, just the knowledge that here is another dead soldier that WE sent to offer up the ultimate sacrifice. Doing so might finally sink into some of these chickenhawk parasites that it ain't no game of chess and the costs are real. Bush, Cheney and his entire cabinet were deferments when it was their time to offer up the sacrifice but have no problems sending other to do the dying for their war of choice. Filming a dignified military escort of the coffins off the plane shows no disrespect but it puts the sacrifice made out there where those that continue to ask for that sacrifice never forget what it is they are asking for. The very idea that some of the gutworms on this post don't want that dignity to be shown but would rather continue to sneak the bodies back into the states under the cover of darkness shows that the idea behind doing it that way is so that people don't want to stop the war. Showing the flag-draped coffins of returning soldiers is its own anti-war statement without any help. For you pizzant hawks that believe that the dying has to continue for some lofty ideal that Rash Lamebrain or o'Really gave you then it won't change your mind but many Americans need to see what is being done in their name.

I appreciate the author's sensitivity to, and respect for, the fallen soldiers and their families. I also think he has some good ideas--especially the one about some version of Canada's Highway of Heroes, here at home. I see no reason, however, why such a respectful tribute could not begin at the point where the honor guards take the flag-draped caskets off the plane. If my Army Ranger son were to be among the fallen(please God forbid) I probably could not afford to be present, but it would do my heart and soul a world of good to know that he would be so honored, whether I was there or not. His life means a lot to me. I would hope it means something to his fellow Americans and his governent. I would want them to have the opportunity to pause publically, and consider the value of his liife.

I'm not worried too much about whether public displays of flag-draped caskets are respectful or disrespectful. That's up to the people who view the--or not. Society's full of rude, disrespectful people. They reflect badly on only themselves. Let's not give them the power to make the rest of us feel that we can't publicly honor and respect our war dead. After all, whether we agree or disagree with the war and its costs, it's for all of us that our soldiers die.

"MISSION ACCOMPLISHED"