A Torture Report Could Spell Big Trouble For Bush Lawyers

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  • Posted By: History 101 @ 02/16/2009 1:49:18 PM

    j.cam I was talking about a comment that was left from "Osama Bin Login" . Sorry I should have quoted him. Anyways ok then our enemies should be able to waterboard our soldiers right. Yet, just go ask your grandpa about his friends that were tortured in a war.

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 4:00:44 PM

      Why do you want to reduce us to the level of savages? Do you hate America and American principles? Should we base our actions on the amoral and sociopathic mores of our most barbaric enemies?

      • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/16/2009 5:49:14 PM

        Osama Bin Login,

        What in the world are you talking about? Since when do our barbaric enemies practice water boarding? They target innocent people, blow them up, or chop off their heads. So what are you talking about?

    • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/16/2009 5:15:54 PM

      History 101

      Wow. You may fool others, but you don???t fool me. I understand that this insane and irrational moral relativity espoused by liberals is just an act. Liberals are moral absolutists. Anyone who stands in the way of liberalism is either stupid or evil and must be destroyed. That is why you pretend to be against water boarding and torture when it is clear you are not. As I have pointed out many times, none of you are outraged over Bill Clinton???s policy of rendition, which is far worse than water boarding. Therefore, it is clear that you are not outraged by torture or waterboarding-- you just want to jail Republicans because they stand in the way of liberalism domestically.

      Now I???ll humor your irrational and silly morally relative question. Since terrorists and Ba???athists are morally wrong, whatever they do in pursuit there cause is wrong, especially water boarding, torture, and blowing people up.
      You have already shown us that you believe water boarding under Bush is worse than torture under Bill Clinton or Barak Obama (who has not ended the policy of rendition), and now you are pretending you can???t see the difference between America using water boarding to save innocent lives and Al Kaeda using water boarding to destroy innocent lives.

      Would you agree that being blown up is far worse than being water boarded?

  • Posted By: pmeagre @ 02/16/2009 5:10:15 PM

    Don't those idiots understand that when the pressure is the worst it's the most important to retain one's moorings?

  • Posted By: floridavoice @ 02/16/2009 4:17:10 PM

    Let's no Protect OURSELVES!! - Let just give it up now that we can and forget the people that are willing to put everything on the line for our protection!!!!!!!

  • Posted By: floridavoice @ 02/16/2009 4:19:01 PM

    IS THIS FOR REAL???????

    If America wants this - Lots of people need to switch sides to the ENEMY!!!

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 4:49:37 PM

      Don't let us stop you, Dave.

    • Posted By: Mark Thieme @ 02/16/2009 4:30:23 PM

      They may not have become the "enemy," so put, but they are true secessionists.

      People who want to live somewhere else.

      The Old Confederacy is as Red as China already and would be a good place for them to move as soon as possible. Of, course the good folks in Dixie would have to be given fair warning and a chance to move before their states, to be known in the future as Red America, becomes a toxic swamp once and for all.

      These people go by many names, but most just call themselves "Republicans."


      They may not be the "enemy," but they do hate America.

  • Posted By: Mark Thieme @ 02/16/2009 4:45:23 PM

    John Galt... I am over and out,

    but it is fun to see the Republican twinkies run for cover, squealing like small animals, when they get the Rush back in their face!

    Difference being, we are saying it like it is. like it is!

  • Posted By: floridavoice @ 02/16/2009 4:22:58 PM

    To "Mark Thieme - Republicans flirted all too seriously with totalitarianism over the past 8 years: the so-called "unitary executive" charade."

    If Republicans flirted with Totalitarianism They they would have made it a law to abolish the TWO term limit like HUGO CHAVEZ just did democratically through a VOTE yesterday!

  • Posted By: Gnorra @ 02/16/2009 2:45:32 PM

    Should we be amused or incensed by the self-righteous pronouncements of the apoplectic Bush haters filling this comment page with their teeth-gnashing? Leahy's threatened "truth commission" cries are to be expected from someone who must find himself running out of better things to cry about. But where it gets dangerous is when the true believers go overboard and mistake a merely cynical political fishing expedition for a pure-hearted pursuit of evil in the Bush administration. Talk about useful idiots.

    Go ahead, disagree strongly with the past administration; that's your right and privilege. But please drop the pretense of arguing from a position of legal absolutism. Democrats Pelosi, Harman, Rockefeller and Graham were briefed on "enhanced interrogation" and did not object until they were far enough away from Sept. 11 to put their political reputations and fan bases above their concern for U.S. security. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/12/08/AR2007120801664_pf.html

    Leave it to Newsweek to use "Torture Report" in the headline, though this "dog bites man" story says nothing of a torture report at all. Isikoff's credibility was wrecked with the "Koran flushed down the toilet" hoax, which caused riots in the itchy-trigger-finger capitols of the world. I'd suggest "Newsweek lied/People died" bumper stickers, but that would simply further the myth that fanaticism and anti-Americanism are caused by specific Western behavior, and not simply by cultural defects.

    "Torture" is cast about in this debate to get attention, because it evokes bone crushing, fingernail pulling, and other methods for inflicting physical damage. But that's like using the term "Baby Killing" every time you talk about stem-cell research. When police and SWAT teams try to flush out a holed-up hostage taker, they shine bright lights and play loud music to cause sleep deprivation and weaken defenses. When they interrogate a rape or murder suspect, they shout, they isolate, they try to humiliate. Should we subject those law enforcement people and police interrogators to truth commissions?

    Agreed: pouring water over someone's head to create a fear of drowning wouldn't seem to make much sense when you're trying to get reliable information out of a demented sociopath. But the three detainees who we know were subjected to it have been given myriad opportunities to recant now that the American left is driving hard for their testimony to be thrown out. Nothing doing -- they're proud of what they did and ready to meet their maker and chill out with their virgins. How does that justify the self-perpetuating hysteria over Bush "crimes??? that now must produce rolling heads to placate Huffington Post subscribers?

    There???s room for reasonable people to discuss what we did and what we should and do in the future regarding interrogation and counter-terrorism in general

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 3:57:44 PM

      "Go ahead, disagree strongly with the past administration; that's your right and privilege. But please drop the pretense of arguing from a position of legal absolutism. Democrats Pelosi, Harman, Rockefeller and Graham were briefed on "enhanced interrogation" and did not object until they were far enough away from Sept. 11 to put their political reputations and fan bases above their concern for U.S. security."

      Then charge them, too. Round them all up, and drag them into the light of day.

  • Posted By: Gnorra @ 02/16/2009 2:31:21 PM

    Take heart: there is help for the Bush haters gathering here. Just repeat the following to yourself, until you're lulled back into the peaceful fantasy state in which you obviously prefer to live your lives:

    1. America's standing in the world is not affected by whether or not Islamists love and respect us.

    2. Terrorists are not seeking our sympathy and understanding; they are seeking our annihilation.

    3. Claiming that our supposed violations of the Geneva Convention expose our military personnel to torture has no relevance when we're talking about terrorists and jihadists who don't observe any international conventions, Geneva or otherwise, in the first place.

    4. Whatever Bush, Cheney, et al did in the heat of battle in the first months and years after 9/11, they were not power-mad sadists. They did what they did to protect Americans. We can debate methods, but don't invent motives just because you hate Republicans.

  • Posted By: Daphne Kenward @ 02/16/2009 8:01:22 AM

    Politics has become the dirtiest business on earth, where laws are ignored, politicans can kill their own people and blame war on terror. George Bush was the worst war criminal since Adolph Hitler, these people should be held accountable.

    One only has to look at whar Israel is doing, war crimes against a defenceless population of Gaza. If politics is not cleaned up it will create civil wars all across the globe as people lose interest in politics, and politicans.

    The UN is just a farce, stands for nothing what so ever, and has no credibility.

    • Posted By: Constitution Lover @ 02/16/2009 8:25:00 AM

      "One only has to look at whar Israel is doing, war crimes against a defenceless population of Gaza."

      That's a laugh. Although Israel has made some mistakes that real war-crimes are perpetrated by Hamas inusing civilinas a shileds for thier rocket attacks. The Palestinain people knowingly elected a violent and corrupt organization like Hamas and got exactly what they asked for. Beign used as human shileds so that Hamas could try to win propaganda points and have mouthpices like you spread their lies. At least Israel does its bet to gest rid off its corrupt politicians and actually investigates accusations of both war-crimes and improper actions by its military, Hamas is corrupt through and through and and both celebrates and rewards its war criminals.
      If politics is not cleaned up it will create civil wars all across the globe as people lose interest in politics, and politicans.

      • Posted By: Vigilance @ 02/16/2009 8:55:11 AM

        Two wrongs don't make a right, and indeed the modern Israeli right is NO better than Hamas - if anything, the undeclared and MASSIVE nuclear arsenal Israel has makes them one of the biggest dangers to human life everywhere on Earth. I lose sleep sometimes thinking about the fact that Israel has about 400 MIRVed warheads and a SHITTY international-relations attitude to boot.

        Stop making excuses for the violence and bloodthirst of that country, which has not acted with any kind of honor in that conflict either.

        • Posted By: Constitution Lover @ 02/16/2009 1:56:33 PM

          ""the fact that Israel has about 400 MIRVed warheads"

          Actually that is not a fact. At most they have 200. And like the US, that arsenal and the fact that they have refused to cofirm it has kept many of their neighboring nations from attacking them in recent years. Unfortunately Hamas is not one of those neighbors because they do not care iftheir people are destroyed, they only care about murdering Jews.

          and a SHITTY international-relations attitude to boot.

        • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 9:23:11 AM

          " I lose sleep sometimes thinking about the fact that Israel has about 400 MIRVed warheads "

          What? LOL.

  • Posted By: theprissypatriot @ 02/15/2009 1:16:36 PM

    j cam read the US Army War college materials before you go shooting off your mouth. Its not a political issue-its an intelligence issue. Study after study has proved torture does not provide reliable information or actionable intelligence. The tortured will say whatever they can to make the torture stop. Maybe if you had experienced it personally, you would know this. By the way, we executed Japanese sailors who waterboarded American soldiers in WWII. Wow, I hope you are never in a government position to make any important decisions regarding our national security. Torture endangers our own soldiers-wake up and act like an American.

    • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/15/2009 9:33:20 PM

      Theprissypatriot,

      Why are you mad at me? I didn???t create and implement the policy of rendition, Bill Clinton did. Why aren???t you calling for his arrest? Does torture suddenly work when Democrats do it?

      Anyway, thank you for parroting the specious argument that only appeared during Bush???s presidency that though torture has been practiced for thousands of years, no one has ever gotten reliable information from it, and that no one breaks under torture. Of course the actual facts are different. Not only does torture work, but so does waterboarding, and it has saved many innocent lives. Here is one case:

      ???I thought of that this week when John Kiriakou, a former CIA interrogator, went public with the story of how U.S. officials dealt with Abu Zubaydah, the logistical chief of al Qaeda and a top planner of Sept. 11.

      ???Kiriakou told his story to ABC News???s Brian Ross, and the network posted the full, unedited text of the interview on its website.

      ???Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in 2002. Shot three times before being caught, his life was saved by U.S. doctors. When he recovered, Kiriakou was among the first to speak to him.

      ???Zubaydah was talkative, but he gave the CIA no usable intelligence.

      ???CIA interrogators tried a variety of techniques of escalating severity on Zubaydah. Each one had to be specifically authorized in advance at the highest levels of the CIA.

      ???Still, Zubaydah resisted. Finally the interrogation worked its way up to waterboarding.

      ??????Was it used on Zubaydah???? Ross asked Kiriakou.

      ??????It was.???

      ??????And was it successful????

      ??????It was.???

      ???After the waterboarding session, Zubaydah was a different man. ???He told his interrogator that Allah had visited him in his cell during the night,??? Kiriakou said, ???and told him to cooperate because his cooperation would make it easier on the other brothers who had been captured.???

      ???U.S. interrogators, fearing another major attack ??? remember, this was just months after 9/11 ??? worked fast. According to Kiriakou, Zubaydah provided information that helped stop a number of al Qaeda actions.??? http://thehill.com/byron-york/when-waterboarding-works-2007-12-13.html

      • Posted By: pjfe @ 02/15/2009 10:12:34 PM

        http://www.thecarpetbaggerreport.com/archives/13880.html

        • Posted By: theprissypatriot @ 02/16/2009 12:00:03 AM

          jcam You can act like an American and take the high road or act like a terrorist and take the low road. I think most of us see which one you support. John McCain broke under torture-sooner or later everyone does. Spare me your "ticking time bomb" theory. Your arguments are old, worn and work as well as the rest of the Bush administration policies. I'm not a fan of Bill Clinton, who sold our super computers to China either...but perhaps that's new news to you. I don't parrot anyone, I go with the facts-its my profession. Do your own homework like I did and you may come to the same conclusion. Ciao

          • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/16/2009 1:45:22 PM

            I said nothing about John McCain. I'm advocating waterboarding terrorists and you are advocating blowing up innocent people. I'm acting like the American and you are acting like an ally of the terrorists.

        • Posted By: theprissypatriot @ 02/16/2009 12:00:27 AM

          jcam You can act like an American and take the high road or act like a terrorist and take the low road. I think most of us see which one you support. John McCain broke under torture-sooner or later everyone does. Spare me your "ticking time bomb" theory. Your arguments are old, worn and work as well as the rest of the Bush administration policies. I'm not a fan of Bill Clinton, who sold our super computers to China either...but perhaps that's new news to you. I don't parrot anyone, I go with the facts-its my profession. Do your own homework like I did and you may come to the same conclusion. Ciao

          • Posted By: theprissypatriot @ 02/16/2009 12:05:32 AM

            PS Thanks PJFE

            For jcam "Abu Zubaydah was captured in Pakistan in March 2002. The White House has identified him as al Queda???s chief of operations. Ron Suskind reported, however, that Zubaydah turned out to be mentally ill. We were torturing a man who was, in effect, retarded."

            Again, DO YOUR HOMEWORK because you make yourself look silly and unAmerican.

            • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/16/2009 2:01:34 AM

              theprissypatriot

              I didn't quote the White House. I quoted a member of the CIA who is far more credible than the liberal journalists like Ron Suskind, with whom you brainwash yourself.

              I guess now you are claiming that the terrorist leaders are the epitome of mental health and some crazy lunatic cannot be a terrorist leader. Silly argument.

              You liberals are quick to claim anyone criticizing you is calling you un-American, yet you are quick to call anyone who disagrees with you un-American. Why is that?

              Why did you say ???AGAIN do your homework??? when you never told me to do my homework before? Do you liberals ever get sick of these childish rhetorical games? Is there any other fact I brought up that some liberal journalist with a book deal refutes? Or are you just trying to make it seem that way?

              Finally, you did not address the fact that you are partisan with your outrage over torture; therefore, your ???outrage??? cannot be taken seriously.

              • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 1:10:30 PM

                "I quoted a member of the CIA who is far more credible "

                LOL/

              • Posted By: joe_mama @ 02/16/2009 3:49:19 AM

                " I quoted a member of the CIA who is far more credible than the liberal journalists like Ron Suskind, with whom you brainwash yourself."

                BTW-- brainwashing doesn't work either...just ask the North Koreans

                Love,
                JM

          • Posted By: j.cam @ 02/16/2009 1:36:10 AM

            the prissypatriot,

            I think the high road is to get information from these terrorists and save innocent lives. I think the low road is to ally yourselves with these terrorists and define torture down to water boarding because you hate Republicans. We know you have nothing against real torture because you only call for the arrest of Republicans and not Democrats, even though Bill Clinton began rendition and Barrak Obama hasn't ended it yet. You can say what you want, but as long as your outrage over torture is partisan, it is clear that you are not sincere.

            • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 1:09:58 PM

              "I think the high road is to get information from these terrorists and save innocent lives. "

              Likewise, the high road is to get criminals off the street. Let's torture them until they confess.

              How does that sound? I mean, if the ends justify the means, let's break out the blowtorches and pliers, right?

  • Posted By: History 101 @ 02/16/2009 1:15:27 PM

    Yea lets take out the blowtorches and pliers to American soldiers being tortured by terrorist because in their eyes "if the ends justify the means"

  • Posted By: Texas Jake @ 02/15/2009 11:15:54 AM

    This is a set-up! Bush, Cheney, Rice, Rumsfeld will all go free. A few "rogue lawyers" will be disbarred. The question is, will that be enough self-justice to appease the world, and restore USA's moral authority?

    One
    Big
    Azz
    Mistake
    America

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 1:11:50 PM

      Texas? That's where bad government is made. Who the hell needs advice from Texas?

    • Posted By: Vigilance @ 02/15/2009 2:28:38 PM

      You're a disgrace to your state, much in the way Bush was and remains.

  • Posted By: History 101 @ 02/16/2009 12:02:33 PM

    Instead of asking "Is it wrong/ right to torture" why dont we ask our veterans of WWII, Korea, or Vietnam. The ones in the Japanese camps or people that were in the Unit 731. Or ask the Americans that got tortured in Korea or Vietnam. I would be willing to bet they would never want a humun to go throught what they did. Heck, Lets just ask Senator John McCain. The same same people that are saying "we need to torture" the terrorist are the same ones protesting when our troops are torture. Do unto others as you would want unto you. Wake up America, lets stop being Republican or Democrats, Liberals or Conservative. Lets be AMERICANS

  • Posted By: LinusToo @ 02/16/2009 11:51:46 AM

    The comment posted by JohnQDoe (02/16/2009 10:43:40 AM) is disgusting on so many levels where does one begin!? "Real Americans," indeed anyone resembling a HUMAN BEING, would be repulsed by it. Isn't it ironic that the ideals that set America apart from other countries are the very ideals that this so-called "real American" JohnQDoe disdains -- our Constitution, our freedom, our diversity, and our humanity. Doesn't JohnQ realize that once he makes America safe for "real Americans" like himself, it will no longer be America!

  • Posted By: veeve @ 02/16/2009 9:56:11 AM

    Right. The Justice Department's Office of Professional Responsibility is not competent to review Justice's attorneys. As if even lawyers from Liberty University can't tell by now that we are in a legalistic netherworld with a virtual abolishment of the 4th and 8th Amendments.

  • Posted By: ChicoCDM @ 02/16/2009 12:50:16 AM

    Who cares - torture these people. Heck do like FDR - during WWII FDR had secret military tribunals and all captured enemy combatants were executed within a year. THe failure of the Bush adminstration was to not follow this same path as FDR. It was quick, quiet and thereful left little scrutiny and detered the enemy. These idiots like Obama want to end war MAYBE THEY SHOULD ASK OUR ENEMMIES IF ITS OKAY FIRST!! IDIOTS!

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 9:24:46 AM

      "Who cares - torture these people."

      Why stop there? Let's torture any Americans that don't confess their crimes.

    • Posted By: joe_mama @ 02/16/2009 3:47:24 AM

      "Who cares - torture these people. Heck do like FDR - during WWII FDR had secret military tribunals and all captured enemy combatants were executed within a year."

      Hmm, would that be Nuremburg? Where the prisoners were tried PUBLICLY?

      Or perhaps you're referring to battlefield executions which were commonplace?

      Either way, evidence or a source for your inane comment would be nice.

      Love,
      JM

  • Posted By: NeoPoliticus @ 02/16/2009 1:15:34 AM

    What we need to do is start torturing Liberals. It won't accomplish anything, but it will be what they deserve.

    • Posted By: Osama Bin Login @ 02/16/2009 9:24:08 AM

      Sorry, Adolf, you're out of power. Maybe next time, you scumbag.

    • Posted By: Constitution Lover @ 02/16/2009 8:26:20 AM

      Well now we know where the ghost of Josef Mengele is. NeoPoliticus.

  • Posted By: absorbed @ 02/16/2009 8:25:32 AM

    Awesome! May they throw these torturing warmongers in jail, it's about time! And may they be thankful that their own treatments of prisoners will not be visited upon them as we are not barbarians nor do we seek to become what we despise. Human rights crimes must be punished.!!!! And besides, they tortured people to try to get information, meanwhile creating monsters that would now, surely, if they didn't before want to kill any or all Americans possible! Torture breeds terrorism, but then that's their business so it's not that surprising!

  • Posted By: absorbed @ 02/16/2009 8:16:15 AM

    Awesome! Throw these torturing warmongers in jail where they've belonged for at least the last ten years!! Amen!! It only makes sense that when you torture a prisoner, whether they have conspired against you or not, you are creating a monster that will come back to bite you or any U.S. soldier or U.S. civilian for that matter. May sanity prevail and may we punish our leaders who we know have been criminals, broken countless constitutional as well as human rights laws sinply because it was in their plan, and may they be thankful that their own treatment will not be visited upon them as we are not barbarians nor do we seek to become what we despise!!!!!

  • Posted By: katana0182 @ 02/16/2009 1:22:39 AM

    Yoo will hang for this.

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