Autism And Education

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  • Posted By: teacher_in_WI @ 03/03/2009 9:05:56 PM

    As a teacher of those students serviced by NCLB, I try very hard to understand the issue faced by Lindsley and other parents with 'gifted' children. I too excelled in school and loved every minute of it. However, my brother was in the special education program, as my parents only two children, I often wonder how they balanced their expectations for us. My brother and I were in the same grade (being only 11 months apart it made sense). Never once would I have wished that some of his teachers working with him on strategies would be pulled so that I may not be so 'bored' in my own studies. I service students who may have low expectations placed upon them, to have self-care skills, hold a job, and live independently. However, without special education support, some students may not be able to accomplish even this. These students need a very different course of education...specialized. In the end, if the gifted student wishes to excel, they will and their abilities will give them endless opportunities. For those with identified disabilities, they will need support in some form or another for the rest of their lives, no matter how good our instruction is. True, I hope my students will excel and follow their dreams, but the deck is dealt differently for them. My brother graduated high school, and works full time at Wal-Mart, where he will probably work for the rest of his life. I went to college, earned a teaching degree and am looking at a graduate program. Now where is so-called 'fairness'? Where is the support he needs? If your child is gifted, be thankful and encourage the classroom teacher to differentiate their education as much as possible. However, it is wrong to ask that the supports for students with disabilities is taken away, not matter how large or small the amount. The truth is, it isn't enough now, and probably never will be. I don't know many parents who would honestly wish that their child were in a disabled student's position. Count your blessings as they come :)

  • Posted By: dengland @ 03/04/2009 12:06:25 AM

    I know that without the specialized help children with disabilities would not even to be able to achieve even the simplest of goals. However, the question should not be either or. It should be both. Gifted children do not make it on their own. They do well if they have parents who are able to challenge their thinking, but this mother is correct in thinking that her daughter would soar even higher if she had a quarter of the help that her son does. As a parent of two gifted children, one has done extremely well and one could have used the extra attention that GATE gave him in elementary school, but was laking in junior high and high school. He has a bachelor's degree, but is capable of so much more. I know he will figure it out sooner or later, however, he would have figured it out sooner if more individualization had been available to him.

  • Posted By: animecrazedfool @ 03/03/2009 9:01:16 PM

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  • Posted By: Sandy_in_USA @ 03/03/2009 12:05:27 PM

    It doesn't seem like gifted kids have any problems with tests scores so they should have no problem getting into the college of their choice. College kids do come from high school, they ALL come from high school and it isn't only the gifted kids that have that chance to go, based on their gifts. The point is giving ALL kids that same apportunity. My niece is not a gifted child at all, worked hard for her grades and got scholarships to a variety of great colleges. Many kids in special ed are good with grades, just not so good socially, and they too go to college. Many people with ASD have grown up to be great people and contribute wonderful things. All one needs to do is look up famous people with autism.
    The idea that doors only open (or better phrased should only open) for those who are gifted or bright is single-mindedness and prejudice. Doors should open for everyone.

    • Posted By: jason's mom @ 03/03/2009 6:48:10 PM

      You obviously did not get the point of the article. The writer wants to open the door to students on both ends of the educational spectrum as well as those in between.

      • Posted By: Sandy_in_USA @ 03/03/2009 6:56:27 PM

        You didn't get the point of the story- she wants to open those doors at the expense of NCLB. The point of the story was whining about what a more advantage kid doesn't get as opposed to less advantaged kid.

  • Posted By: jason's mom @ 03/03/2009 6:43:47 PM

    Finally someone has put on paper what I have thought for years. I have two gifted sons, my oldest in particular is brilliant. Rather than challenge him beyond the one hour per week in the third grade, his teacher suggested that we might want to put him in a private school. We did when he turned eighteen! He is now a second semester junior at Carnegie Mellon University studying mechanical engineering, participating in a varsity sport, swimming, and still getting straight A's. I often wonder how not being challenged by the public school system affected him. His kindergarten teacher recognized his talent and yet there was never the money available to the gifted students.

    We live in an affluent community where people move so that their learning disabled children will get the services they need. It is a compliment to our school system, however, it is also a shame that we are not also known for how we challenge our gifted students. One friend with a child with learning disabilities told me during elementary school that her son would miss out when he reached high school and mine would be so much better off. That was simply not true-- he breezed through so called AP and Honors courses and her son still received the attention he needed and deserved.

    I hope that someday we will recognize our bright and talented children as national treasures. How about it President Obama-- you and Michelle certainly fell into that category.

  • Posted By: tzretusn @ 03/03/2009 6:37:50 PM

    Stephanie Lindsley's heartfelt comments beg a somewhat simple solution. If her school system had a voucher program she could have her daughter at a school that challenged her and truly helped her realize her potential. At the same time her son could be in a school that provided him the best care and offered him the best opportunity to achieve as much as he could. Individual programs for each child as Stephanie sees fit.

  • Posted By: Fedupwithfools @ 03/03/2009 6:17:27 PM

    hlbeck3 Thank you for your comments. Although I have kept my kids in public school and I???ve spent a fortune on Tier One and Ivies, you speak to an issue that gets overlooked, how alone gifted kids feel when they are forced to interact with kids who just don't get them. This day after day grind for at least the first 9 years in school is a horrible price they pay. It is no wonder people think of them as anti-social dorks. At first I felt like a pushy mother advocating for my children. I learned better when they finally attended a public school with a great GATE program. All of the social issues went away. They had friends, wildly, weirdly, wonderful interested and interesting friends. But those years in the wilderness took a toll on them that it took until college to overcome.

    With my last child, I don't care what the school, teachers or even the school board thinks. I can't be intimidated. I know my kids. I know that they are happiest, screaming along at warp speed academically with like-minded friends.

    In the end, I am tired of their being used by the schools. They are used to keep teachers happy who other wise would be stuck with a class of badly behaved plodders. They are used as aides in the classroom to support instruction. These kids should be our national treasures???you can only pray that they survive this process to grow up to be the inventive, wildly wonderful people they were when they entered this world. Or you can be like me, a fierce and unyielding advocate for my children in a sea of mediocrity.

  • Posted By: hlbeck3 @ 03/03/2009 5:21:12 PM

    Stephanie Lindsley???s article, Autism and Education, is brave, eloquent, and profound. While all parenting is difficult, the challenges Ms. Lindsley must face must be enormous. Her argument that schools should spend more on gifted education is correct and timely. While no one would take funding away from special-needs children, the gifted children in our country are the ones who have been ???left behind.???
    I have two highly-gifted boys. The energy output, the constant questions, the push for more information, and the ???drama??? can be overwhelming at times. We are fortunate to live in a region of the country where there are 4 private schools devoted to educating gifted children. While there is a ???gifted??? program in our public school, we chose to send our boys to a private school where they can be with other children like them. They learn science from real science teachers, and have drama, art, music, library instruction, and languages (Chinese and French). While it is extremely expensive, we hope to give our children the education they need and deserve. It is a myth that gifted children learn by themselves. We are not wealthy and it is a huge financial drain to send them to this school.
    While some countries consider their gifted children as national treasures to be cherished, the U.S. labels gifted education as ???elitist.??? According to the National Research Center on Gifted and Talented, gifted elementary school students already know between 40 and 50% of the material covered in class before it is taught, but these students are forced to spend at least 80% of their time in a regular classroom. The toll taken on the country???s gifted children due to the lack of appropriate gifted education and support is staggering. Between 18 and 25% of gifted and talented students drop out of school. It is also suspected that suicide rates are higher among the gifted.
    By the time my oldest son was three years old, I knew that he couldn???t attend public school. He would talk to other children on the playground, planning complicated imaginative play scenarios, only to have them stare at him as if he were from Mars. Once, on a play date with other children from their gifted school, the children???s conversation included talk of books they had read and a discussion about whether the number google (not the company) was really a number at all.
    I for one am tired of feeling apologetic for the brightness of my children. I delight in their intelligence and I want for them the same access to services that other parents expect and receive for their children. I hope that my children will contribute in wonderful and creative ways to the future of the planet, regardless of what they choose to do as adults. I want them to be happy, content, and comfortable with who they are and not feel apologetic for their abilities, sensitivities, and intelligence.

  • Posted By: hlbeck3 @ 03/03/2009 5:20:30 PM

    Stephanie Lindsley???s article, Autism and Education, is brave, eloquent, and profound. While all parenting is difficult, the challenges Ms. Lindsley must face must be enormous. Her argument that schools should spend more on gifted education is correct and timely. While no one would take funding away from special-needs children, the gifted children in our country are the ones who have been ???left behind.???
    I have two highly-gifted boys. The energy output, the constant questions, the push for more information, and the ???drama??? can be overwhelming at times. We are fortunate to live in a region of the country where there are 4 private schools devoted to educating gifted children. While there is a ???gifted??? program in our public school, we chose to send our boys to a private school where they can be with other children like them. They learn science from real science teachers, and have drama, art, music, library instruction, and languages (Chinese and French). While it is extremely expensive, we hope to give our children the education they need and deserve. It is a myth that gifted children learn by themselves. We are not wealthy and it is a huge financial drain to send them to this school.
    While some countries consider their gifted children as national treasures to be cherished, the U.S. labels gifted education as ???elitist.??? According to the National Research Center on Gifted and Talented, gifted elementary school students already know between 40 and 50% of the material covered in class before it is taught, but these students are forced to spend at least 80% of their time in a regular classroom. The toll taken on the country???s gifted children due to the lack of appropriate gifted education and support is staggering. Between 18 and 25% of gifted and talented students drop out of school. It is also suspected that suicide rates are higher among the gifted.
    By the time my oldest son was three years old, I knew that he couldn???t attend public school. He would talk to other children on the playground, planning complicated imaginative play scenarios, only to have them stare at him as if he were from Mars. Once, on a play date with other children from their gifted school, the children???s conversation included talk of books they had read and a discussion about whether the number google (not the company) was really a number at all.
    I for one am tired of feeling apologetic for the brightness of my children. I delight in their intelligence and I want for them the same access to services that other parents expect and receive for their children. I hope that my children will contribute in wonderful and creative ways to the future of the planet, regardless of what they choose to do as adults. I want them to be happy, content, and comfortable with who they are and not feel apologetic for their abilities, sensitivities, and intelligence.


  • Posted By: rkrakow @ 02/28/2009 2:31:20 PM

    To the Editor:

    ALL children deserve the same opportunities for a decent life and an appropriate education.I have a 9 year old who cannot speak and a 15 year old who achieves the best grades in her high school.

    To favor one child over the other is a barbaric concept or worse. If our society - with its ever-richer elite and its billion dollar end of year bonus funds - cannot accommodate both children then our morals have fallen to a new low. The logic that would justify cheating those children most in need to benefit those most capable is the same reasoning used by those in our nation who advocated eugenics during the 20th century.

    This kind of logic is much worse than cultural elitism and will lead us to the same place eugenics took the Nazis. No child's life or welfare should be valued more highly by the state over another child.

    We can learn just as much from those children who have disabilities as we can learn from those who children excel. When it comes to the welfare of children we should not favor one class of child over another. ???The test of the morality of a society is what it does for its children.???Dietrich Bonhoeffer 1906-1945

    Sincerely,

    Robert J. Krakow, Esq.
    Chairman of the Board, Lifespire, Inc.
    Lifespire, Inc. (formerly Association for Children with Retarded Mental Development) is a 60 year old NYC not-for-profit that serves more than 6000 intellectually disabled adults and children every day in residences, schools, day centers and health clinics.

    • Posted By: toby123 @ 03/03/2009 4:01:42 PM

      Way to miss the point. The autistic child is being massively favored by funding and support. It is the gifted child who is getting shafted. Well, so are all the rest of the students in the class who lost funding to both the special needs and gifted programs, but that's another article.

  • Posted By: CodysMOM @ 03/03/2009 1:58:24 PM

    I recomend the writer read a book called Different like me my book of Autism heros and they she will see why its important to the effort into her disabled child as well as her gifted child

  • Posted By: Sandy_in_USA @ 03/03/2009 11:35:44 AM

    Key thing to the public educational system: Free And Appropriate Education (FAPE) if you except more than that, for any child, you're looking at the wrong educational setting. The future leaders of government, business, and education doesn't come from the public education system, that comes from college. Partly why NCLB was created, typical kids well below the basic academic standard wouldn't get into college.

    • Posted By: summer4077 @ 03/03/2009 11:46:46 AM

      True, but college kids come from high schools. Bright kids are much more likely to be accepted into a better college if they have better test scores and competitive grades to allow them to receive scholarships and admission. Better test scores come from well-prepared kids. An AP or honors kid is going to be more challenged than one in normal classes and will probably perform much better on standardized testing.

  • Posted By: jdfister @ 03/03/2009 10:34:01 AM

    I believe this well-written article highlights the issues with education as it exists in America. The focus seems to be on getting children of any certain age to achieve an average. Where a given child is behind, then the focus is to get him or her to the average level. Where the child is ahead... well, good on ya', kid. I have no argument with getting children to be self-supporting over their period in education. I do have concerns about the future of this company when we don't have the capability in the system to focus on our future leaders of government, business, and education. We're running as fast as we can to 'average.' Parents can be there to mentor and support their children, though most aren't equipped to lead them beyond the system that failed the parents themselves.

    Moderate disclaimer: I know the parents in this article from college (Hi, Steph!), though I've never met the kids. Oh, and for the people who picked on the trampoiline, get a little adventure in life.

  • Posted By: Sandy_in_USA @ 03/03/2009 10:13:52 AM

    The mother who wrote the article made it very confusing brining up her child with autism and her gifted child when she was directing attention to the funds provided for NCLB. Special ed kids get no extra funds from NCLB. This mother wasn't talking about taking away from special ed, she was talking about NCLB and taking away from the general student body and the funds given to schools to ensure every child is learning and staying at their academic age level. Gifted children are already above that level. What is offensive is how this mother would suggest taking funds from the general student body that ensures they have that education. She suggests a Para for her child, a smaller class, all of which no parent really wants and it will effect that child socially, more so since she's not a disabled child.

    It's clear society thinks little of those who need help and highly of those who may have an easier time. Some of you should do a web search on disabled kids and who they grew up to be. Many of them are not baggers and the school system is there to teach all kids, not just the ones it comes easy to. Stop comparing what other kids get, which is what they needed, and start advocating for your own child's needs aside from taking away from others. This is not a special ed/ gifted child issue. It is a NCLB issue. It is however sickening how this mother so easily sets her own disabled child's potential as being very low. If that child is one of the children on that trampoline, he looks to me like he can grow up to be much more than a bagger. How sad that society can pick and choose who to throw away and who to forget about. A gifted child can easily hit the teen years, become rebellious and get into drugs just as any child could and grow up to be in rehab for years. They can become pregnant and the only thing great they end up being is a parent.

  • Posted By: GracieM @ 03/01/2009 11:13:59 PM

    It is true in a perfect world both children and all children would receive exactly what they needed in education. And it should not be a Sophie's Choice delimna either. One post mentions that the time and money spent with the disabled child save society time and money in the future, and I agree. We should not take money away from the children with disabilities.
    Someone else mentioned that maybe the solution for the daughter would be to let her skip a grade. This sometimes works but what these children usually need instead of harder work is to expand on what they are already learning. Skipping a grade poses the same risks and problems that detaining a child a grade causes.
    Instead the curriculm should offer expansions on the subject. The more advanced children should be doing additional research and projects that will extend their knowledge base.
    Now to the mother, I have two daughters the oldest is 30 the youngest is 15 years old (yes a bit of spacing between the two LOL) Both daughters are in the gifted catagory and they can be as much of a challenge to raise as any other child. Seeing as how the school is taking care of your sons educational needs YOU need to take care of your daughter's. And some of it can include both children.
    Now how do you do this? I can tell you it's easier now than when my oldest was in grade school. Museums, concerts, plays, ballet, the symphony. One daughter was interested in dinosaurs, the local museum had classes, she went. Take what she is learning in school and learn more about it with her, discuss it, research it on the computer, get books. Before my daughters started middle school they had been exposed to Shakespeare, Stienbeck, e.e. cummings and more. There is so much that you can do and should. And we should stop expecting schools to provide our children with everything.
    Find out what your daughter's interested in and help her develop those interests. My oldest wasn't athletic, she did take dance classes and she played the flute. My youngest is a member of a drum corps, colorguard at school, plays the flute and clarinet, has played soccer, volleyball and now she's trying tennis. Listen to your daughter and she will guide you to where she needs and wants to be, follow her and support her. But stop expecting the school to do it all, she's your child do what needs to be done. Rather simple in the end. A lot of hard work to be sure but that's your job as a parent.

    • Posted By: summer4077 @ 03/03/2009 9:28:26 AM

      Again--why is it the school's responsibility to teach autistic kids and take care of their needs, but not gifted kids? Gifted kids will serve us far far better in the future. I'm sorry if that offends you, but it is entirely true. It is absolutely not fair for you to expect the school to take care of your autistic child, yet expect Stephanie to provide the educational outlets and challenges for her daughter. In fact, the reverse should be true. It's much easier for you to provide creative activities for your autistic child than it is for a gifted child. Gifted children often accelerate at an amazing rate, quickly surpassing the intellect of their parents. They need tailored programs that challenge them. Unfortunately, as others have said, that money and effort is being wasted on kids who will probably always need assistance and/or live in group homes. Very unfortunate that Americans undervalue education so much.

  • Posted By: CodysMOM @ 03/02/2009 3:59:16 PM

    I agree with GracieM Its moms place to provide creative outlets for her Daughter We made sure my step daughter had outlets for all the things she wanted to do she played valley ball basketball soccer She hates to read and write but some how she managed to be an Honnor student She is confident in herself and well adjusted SR in high school graduating with a 3.75 GPA she took collage corses in the summer months shes taking collage corses now as a SR because she has all her requirements She did over 200 comunity service HRs from 5th grade to her Sr yr Our state requires this of all kids to get a deplomia INCLUDING MY AUTISTIC SON He reads to his to the disabled Eik class to earn his There are some things that we as parents cant provide speach OT motor and other therapies but it is our jobs to take care of our NT kids Our schools mold our childrens Identities as it is We sould parent our own kids as much as we can

    • Posted By: summer4077 @ 03/03/2009 9:25:41 AM

      So if it's a mother's place to provide a creative outlet for children, isn't it your place to take care of your autistic son and get him the help he needs? Why hold back the rest of the kids? Your logic goes both ways.

  • Posted By: CodysMOM @ 03/03/2009 7:56:43 AM

    My Autistic childs report card this past grade period consisted of 2 As 2Bs and a C the C was in writing because he hates it and his As were in Science and Social studies At the age of 6 the doctors told me 1 day he would have to be instatutionalized This child started out in special Ed and with help and services he gets THRU SCHOOL he has been weened out of those classes and yes he has an Aide but she dont do the work for him he does that . I am sorry this woman feels her son is a lost cause BUT I THANK GOD i didnt see mine as one Where would he be now if i had . And as for her daughter one day growing up to cure Autism That may be my sons Job one day Lets not for get some of the greatest minds in the world were On the Autism sepctrum This story was extreamly OFFENSIVE to me almost as offensive as when people ask me if my son is like Rainman when they here he is Autistic

  • Posted By: jpgeorgia @ 03/03/2009 3:59:42 AM

    I give kudos to this mother for caring the way she does about her children. However, I don't think she is a typical mother. American culture and its attitude towards education is not the same in the North as it is in the South, the East coast, and the Left Coast. Overall, education is as high a priority as it should be. That much is in common. Take a look at several measurements, including the rate of graduation, the physical condition of schools, and teacher salaries, just to name a few, and you'll realize that for the nation to be competitive in the modern world, this is unsustainable. It must change. Education needs to be a top priority instead of a source of rhetoric and scorn. Schools need to be revered institutions and teachers should be more highly respected and compensated for their hard work and dedication.

  • Posted By: whenhen @ 03/03/2009 3:56:23 AM

    I was in GATE in elementary school, and by the time I was done with fifth grade I was reading and writing at an eighth grade level and doing math at the ninth grade level (Algebra 1). I had to move, and when I entered middle school, there were no higher achievement courses, and every student, as long as they weren't developmentally disabled, was expected to fit into the cookie cutter model of the student with an IQ of 100. Essentially all three years of my core classes were just a review of fourth and fifth grade. I learned almost nothing about the English language or mathematics in that time, and I realized later through my participation in team academic competitions that almost no other gifted child got anything out of reviewing the same grammar concepts for the umpteenth time.

  • Posted By: GracieM @ 03/03/2009 1:45:30 AM

    In school sports players are hailed as hero's, smart kids as dorks and nerds. And this is learned from adults and parents. Students hate the kids who are smart and get straight A's because it's what their parents expect and they can't deliver. We all want our children to be smart, good looking, popular, etc. and to get those A's and yet for a lot of children that's unrealistic, remember the grade 'C' is average and yet that's not acceptable to the majority of parents we don't want 'average' children. So our children struggle and hate the kid who can accomplish what they cannot. And all the parents can think about is college and their child's future (which is good) but setting your child up for failure is not, and then they resent the children who can.

    Ok I'll get off the soapbox LOL Just remember to accept what your child can accomplish, help them strive to be the best they can be even if it is only average. Broaden their view of the world take them places let them be children and discover who they are and the world around them. And don't expect more than they can do and berate them when they fall short of your ideal.
    Sorry got long winded lol so it's a 3 parter

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