TECHNOLOGY

The Cookie Crumbles

By banning online sales, are the Girl Scouts failing our daughters?

By Kurt Soller | Newsweek Web Exclusive
Mar 11, 2009

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  • Posted By: imari971 @ 04/10/2009 4:19:39 PM

    I'm not a girl scout and I have never been one all I know is that I like their cookies but not everyone has the luxury of having them knock on their door. If the girls scout are a non-profit organization and their cookies generate this much interest why not sell it on line and still allow the girls to sell it door to door that way its available to everyone. I see this as a win win solution. The girls still learn valuable lessons, the organization as a whole makes money and those of us who love their cookies but don't have a troop in their area is still able to purchase them. Seriously people grow up and enter the real world if sales are down this is a great way to boost sales like I stated earlier everyone wins.

  • Posted By: BGimbosi @ 04/02/2009 9:47:32 AM

    Is it just me or are the cookies getting smaller as the boxes get bigger?

  • Posted By: CookieBri @ 03/30/2009 11:48:48 PM

    I have sat back and watched the conflict of this over the last few weeks. I waited until the end of my areas cookie sales before I commented. First, I am a lifetime Girl Scout (not one that just paid one day a couple hundred dollars...I have been a Girl Scout since 1991 when I was in elementary school and am now my daughter's troop leader and Service Unit Manager.) I went to at least one week of camp every summer - free! I always sold over 1000 boxes. Now, I have passed those skills onto my daughter. Last year, as a first time cookie seller, she sold 700 boxes (her goal was 500). This year, she said she wanted to go to camp for free, which is 1000 boxes. She sold 1,764 boxes this year! We have no family near us (closest relative is 83 miles away). So family sales were only 4 boxes - and I am paying shipping! I am an accountant for a casino with only 6 people in my office. I did take the order form with me and sold 38 boxes for her total. The rest of her orders came from door-to-door (everyday after school for 2 weeks), and over 30 business locations (that she had to go in and speak to the owner/managers under my supervision and give a presentation on). After pre sale, she continued to take orders when we were at the doctor's office, school, and letters to distant relatives requesting their support by paying for donated boxes through the Gift of Caring Project (over 200 boxes were GOC alone). BTW, my daughter is in second grade. She also is helping lead her church group in collecting pennies for a fundraiser there (I am not leading that at all). She stayed within the rules and surpassed the 1000 boxes necessary for free camp. Had each girl given the energy and effort as my daughter did in this girl's troop, they would all be going to camp - and would have all earned it, not "piggy - backing on their sister girl scout's parent's web knowledge". It is still possible. It takes hard work. Determination. And while there are those that believe this girl will be my daughter's boss one day because she thinks outside the box and breaks rules, my daughter will remain honorable and can still be creative within the rules. Talent and ability do not lie within a cheater's next move. It lies within a pure heart. That is what I teach my daughter and the rest of my Girl Scout troop and leaders in my service unit. To be honorable while not breaking the rules. To be the best they can, and not be rewarded for someone else's efforts. To be a true Girl Scout, you have to be your best. I'm sure this girl is capable of much more than letting her dad set up a website. If she could use her creativity within the regulations that are set forth, she could be a great leader in the future. Unfortunately, I think some of the feedback she is receiving is teaching her that it is more important to have more money in the bank by any means possible than to do what is right and help other's do the same.

  • Posted By: CookieBri @ 03/30/2009 11:47:42 PM

    I have sat back and watched the conflict of this over the last few weeks. I waited until the end of my areas cookie sales before I commented. First, I am a lifetime Girl Scout (not one that just paid one day a couple hundred dollars...I have been a Girl Scout since 1991 when I was in elementary school and am now my daughter's troop leader and Service Unit Manager.) I went to at least one week of camp every summer - free! I always sold over 1000 boxes. Now, I have passed those skills onto my daughter. Last year, as a first time cookie seller, she sold 700 boxes (her goal was 500). This year, she said she wanted to go to camp for free, which is 1000 boxes. She sold 1,764 boxes this year! We have no family near us (closest relative is 83 miles away). So family sales were only 4 boxes - and I am paying shipping! I am an accountant for a casino with only 6 people in my office. I did take the order form with me and sold 38 boxes for her total. The rest of her orders came from door-to-door (everyday after school for 2 weeks), and over 30 business locations (that she had to go in and speak to the owner/managers under my supervision and give a presentation on). After pre sale, she continued to take orders when we were at the doctor's office, school, and letters to distant relatives requesting their support by paying for donated boxes through the Gift of Caring Project (over 200 boxes were GOC alone). BTW, my daughter is in second grade. She also is helping lead her church group in collecting pennies for a fundraiser there (I am not leading that at all). She stayed within the rules and surpassed the 1000 boxes necessary for free camp. Had each girl given the energy and effort as my daughter did in this girl's troop, they would all be going to camp - and would have all earned it, not "piggy - backing on their sister girl scout's parent's web knowledge". It is still possible. It takes hard work. Determination. And while there are those that believe this girl will be my daughter's boss one day because she thinks outside the box and breaks rules, my daughter will remain honorable and can still be creative within the rules. Talent and ability do not lie within a cheater's next move. It lies within a pure heart. That is what I teach my daughter and the rest of my Girl Scout troop and leaders in my service unit. To be honorable while not breaking the rules. To be the best they can, and not be rewarded for someone else's efforts. To be a true Girl Scout, you have to be your best. I'm sure this girl is capable of much more than letting her dad set up a website. If she could use her creativity within the regulations that are set forth, she could be a great leader in the future. Unfortunately, I think some of the feedback she is receiving is teaching her that it is more important to have more money in the bank by any means possible than to do what is right and help other's do the same.

  • Posted By: ctompkins @ 03/21/2009 10:54:58 AM

    Sounds like the girls scouts should do a fundraiser to get a computer in a library in "rural N. Carolina" (if they have a library!?) so that all could have access to this new technological device!

  • Posted By: ctompkins @ 03/21/2009 10:53:26 AM

    sounds like the girl scouts should do a fundraiser to get a computer in a library in "rural N. Carolina" so that all can have access! (Duh...)

  • Posted By: mwill @ 03/19/2009 7:53:58 PM

    Here's another huge issue:

    I thought it wasn't about the cookies but it was about the dad. And it is! Very inappropriate of him to use his daughter this way and weird too. Newsweek, you sure missed this part of the story.

    Here's the PR on the dad's website:


    TopFloorStudio Chief Operating Officer receives national spotlight over online Girl Scout cookie campaign

    TopFloorStudio COO Bryan Freeborn received national press coverage over an online marketing campaign he launched with CEO Ty Hallock. TopFloor started the campaign to promote Girl Scout cookie sales for Freeborn???s daughter Wild . Newsweek reporter Kurt Soller wrote about the campaign after some parents criticized it for violating Girl Scouts policy. The Newsweek coverage has drawn local and national attention to the debate.

    The story began when Freeborn and Hallock taught a new media seminar at the University of North Carolina Asheville. The assignment was to create an online campaign to help Freeborn???s daughter sell 12,000 boxes of cookies, enough to send Wild???s entire troop to summer camp in Brevard, NC. The UNCA students created a Facebook page called ???Help one girl sell 12,000 Girl Scout cookies in Asheville!??? which linked to an online pre-order form on TopFloorStudio???s website. To further the viral spread the campaign utilized Twitter, and Freeborn uploaded a 36-second video to YouTube, which starred the eight-year-old touting the benefits of buying the cookies.

    Within two weeks the online form generated over 700 online pre-orders, and 200 people became members of the Facebook page. As word spread on the social networking site, some people sparked a debate on the page???s discussion board, accusing the campaign of breaking the organization???s rules. After Girl Scout officials were notified, the local chapter requested removal of the video, with which Freeborn complied, but did not ask him to remove the form.

    After Newsweek reported the story, readers left over 1,000 comments on the website. Since then Freeborn and his daughter appeared on WLOS and WSPA and have also held televised interviews with CNN, The Today Show,FOX News and MSNBC which aired on March 13. Bloggers are also weighing in on the debate, including The Big Money, Jezebel and Launch Squad.

  • Posted By: mwill @ 03/19/2009 7:43:32 PM

    Girl Scouts aren't a cookie selling business, but non-profit organization for girl children. Is "all is fair in sales" and "the early bird catches the worm" the message to send to 8 year old children. Well, considering the recent financial mess we're in I'd say so. I don't thing the two issues are unrelated.

    This 8 year old girl's dad reminds me of the "classic" Little League parents who are way overinvested in the lives of their children to compensate for their own inadequacies.

  • Posted By: tmtx @ 03/18/2009 11:00:05 AM

    I am not in your area, however I will tell you that absolutly no Girl Scouts came to my door to sell cookies. If Wild was able to set up an account that only targeted the region in which she lives then I believe it is all fair in sales. What a smart young girl to try to sell cookies in a new way and think outside of the box!!! I have several friends that were unable to buy cookies at all this year because they were not selling door to door. When I did see the booths set up in front of Wal-Mart or other grocery stores, the parents were peddling the cookies not the girls. I would have purchased from the booth sales, but I am not going to buy from a parent. This is a learning opportunity for the GIRLS not the parents. I was a Girl Scout and so was my daughter (many years ago) and I think Wild should be commended, not just told to take the site down. With the way the world it today, it seems safer for the sales to come to her and then her parents can help deliver the cookies. I have seen too many young girls selling with out the support of the parents being there. I do mean "support" not just doing it for them. Way to go Wild!!!

  • Posted By: litara @ 03/17/2009 7:54:37 PM

    Wild's online cookie sales, while practical and ambitious, are completely unfair to other troops in her area! The reason you can't sell cookies online is that it limits the cookie sale in an area to one girl and her troop. Wild's Junior troop may make an immense profit from this strategy, but the Brownie, Cadet and Senior troops in her area (the latter two being the names for teen girl scouts) are going to make a very meager profit from what has always been our most successful sale. They won't be able to compete with the online cookie sales and would not make the profit they normally would with the tried and true cookie selling methods.
    I would also like to point out that yes, I'm sure it's easy for Brownie girls to visit three websites, and for Junior girls to send an email. I agree that it might be to easy for them to earn patches, but they are what? 6-10 years old. It's supposed to be relatively easy for girls their age to earn patches. If you looked at the Inerest Projects (teen girl scout patches) set for Cadets and Seniors however, you would see that not only are there many more opportunities for us to earn technology related patches, but that the requirements for earning them are much harder and more numerous.

  • Posted By: litara @ 03/17/2009 7:40:27 PM

    Wild's online cookie orders, while practical and ambitious, are completely unfair! She is dominating the cookie sales in her area with the online forms, effectively shutting out the opportunities for girls in other troops in her area to sell cookies. What happens when another girl from a different age level goes door to door or works at a cookie booth, and is told by her potential customers "I already bought a bunch from that girl online." It limits the sales of cookies in an area to one girl and her troop, and leaves everyone else behind. Wild's Junior troop may profit immensly from this sales technique. But what about the Brownies, and the Cadets and Seniors? (the latter two are the names for teen girl scouts) If Wild sells cookies online then everyone else is going to make very little profit from what has always been our most successful sale!
    I would also like to point out that yes, it is easy for Brownie girls to visit three websites, and for Juniors to send an email. Maybe too easy to get the patch or badge. These girls are what? 6-10 years old! their in girl scouts to have fun. The patches are supposed to be relatively easy to get at that age. Did you think about the Cadet and Senior girls? Most of them are commited to living up to the girl scout ideals of being great leaders. Our patches (which are called interest projects) are much harder to earn. We also have a lot more opportunities to earn technology related Interest Projects than our younger sister girl scouts. My point is that you can't assume that girl scouts have lower than par requirements for tech related patches, and few opportunities to earn them, based on the standards set for Brownies and Juniors.

  • Posted By: marc1141 @ 03/12/2009 1:25:39 PM

    What are we talking about here? It sounds to me that the complaining parties are conserned about how their daughters will fare in some kind of competition. Isn't the point to raise money for a common cause? Shouldn't these people just be grateful that Wild is doing such a great job for their troop?

    • Posted By: billcarm @ 03/12/2009 3:08:31 PM

      Yes, cookie time is about making money for activities, but it's so much more. It's about teaching the girls team and individual goal setting and achievement, interacting with others, honesty, planning, handling disappointment (we get lots of NO's), service (troops are encouraged to collect for overseas troops and local food pantries and many also use part of proceeds combined with a service project), and more.

      It seems to me that those not in GS's is asking why we are all so concerned about the fairness of it all. Those leaders who have responded seem to be talking about promoting and building character in our girls. Those are two different things.

      As for doing a great job for her troop - the area probably has multiple troops. However, as a leader of GS's, one of the first things I wondered was why Wild is trying to sell 12,000 boxes to take her troop to camp. Noble goal for Wild, but where is the rest of the troop? What are they learning if another girl in the troop does most or all the work?

      • Posted By: Pennagirl65 @ 03/13/2009 4:47:06 PM

        Another thing the individual girl earns "cookie dollars" not actual money. The cookie dollars are to be used for GS activities, GS uniform items, GS etc. The cookie dollars are not normally transferable unless it is your own sibling. The troop earns a part of every box sold.. so if this were 60 cents per box (depending on the council) Wild is raising $7200 dollars for the troop via the troops cut. How is that teaching the remainder of the troop anything about teamwork? Secondly I think "cookie dollars" are around 40 cent per box ($4800) she would never be able to spend that amount using her cookie dollars which cannot be transfered to anyone besides a sibling. Cookie sales are VOLUNTARY, not mandatory.

        • Posted By: jolee @ 03/17/2009 3:13:45 PM

          Our cookies are $4 a box with troop proceeds .65 a box. They get prizes up to 275 boxes, then 300-700 they get $5 "cookie dough" ever 50 boxes for use of the individual girl for GS activities or the GS council shop. The ONLY way I would think that she would be able to have her troop go to camp would be to have the 200+ per girl troop average based on the final order. We've had 12-17 the past 3years and been able to make that average with some of the girls just making 100 and only 2 of the girls selling over 500 and adding in cookie booths.

        • Posted By: jolee @ 03/17/2009 3:13:11 PM

          Our cookies are $4 a box with troop proceeds .65 a box. They get prizes up to 275 boxes, then 300-700 they get $5 "cookie dough" ever 50 boxes for use of the individual girl for GS activities or the GS council shop. The ONLY way I would think that she would be able to have her troop go to camp would be to have the 200+ per girl troop average based on the final order. We've had 12-17 the past 3years and been able to make that average with some of the girls just making 100 and only 2 of the girls selling over 500 and adding in cookie booths.

        • Posted By: bennettab @ 03/13/2009 4:55:30 PM

          I think this might vary by council. Our troop earns actual money, which we put in our troop checking account. Girls can choose to earn incentive prizes (stuffed animals and the like), or instead of prizes they can choose "Cookie Dough" which are like gift certificates that can be spent on summer resident or day camp, many council sponsored programs, or in the scout shop, or the girls can choose to forgo both prizes and dough and earn extra profit per box. Currently our council sets troop profit at .50 per box if the troop receives prizes or dough, and .60 per box if they don't, and our cookies are priced at $3 a box.

          • Posted By: teekay @ 03/16/2009 4:27:25 PM

            It does vary by council. In GSRI we earn both a money profit for our troop and the girls also earn cookie credits of $ .25 box that can go towards the cost of camp sessions.

  • Posted By: Pennagirl65 @ 03/13/2009 4:11:16 PM

    Apparently daddy loves to stir up controversary...there are people from their hometown that have said HE likes to buck the rules. Freeborn (was this name picked out for a reason???) anyhow is a articulate 8-year old?? How about coached by daddy. He apparently can't follow the rules and again. In order for GSUSA to maintain non-profit status, the cookie sales cannot be more that 40% of the incoming budget...not at National levels, council levels. That is the basic reason for the internet sales ban. The other reason is fair. If this child and her family cannot be moral and ethical instead of ignoring the Girl Scout principles that have been in place for near 90 years...then LEAVE.

    • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 4:21:21 PM

      GSUSA makes hundreds of millions a year with their child labor. I wrote an article about it. Check it out:

      NOT SO CUTE AFTERALL: HOW GIRL SCOUTS OF AMERICA USES CHILD LABOR TO GIVE YOU DIABETES

      http://www.magnuschronicle.com/girlscouts.html

      I think you'll find it funny, but sadly true.

      Enjoy!!!

      Magnus

      www.magnuschronicle.com


      • Posted By: bennettab @ 03/13/2009 4:39:28 PM

        You mean your article that is an uninformed rant? Spend some time reading the annual reports of councils and see how much cookie revenue actually brings in. Stop insulting troops who do, in fact, earn money from this sale. My troop paid for a weekend at our council's horseback riding camp, all the supplies for their Bronze Award project (renovating the butterfly garden at our council's environmental studies center), plus the supplies for another service project for their school (a do-it-yourself picnic table they painted like a rainbow, part of the school logo), and also paid for a camping trip in the fall. Our troop financial reports are open to our parents and we submit financial reports to our field executives twice a year, including complete copies of bank statements, and we're required to have documentation for every expenditure. Leaders who take cookie profits for themselves are thieves, plain and simple, and are prosecuted as such. Unfortunately, rotten people show up everywhere, if you'll take a moment to remember the origin of the phrase "going postal."

        If you care to document your "story" you could actually do something credible, but as there's NO supporting documentation, just the completely flawed assertions of someone who apparently has no research skills, you do nothing to actually present a useful point of view in the discussion.

        • Posted By: teekay @ 03/13/2009 4:54:07 PM

          I am standing on my chair applauding your post!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

          • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 5:20:30 PM

            Thank you. My point is not to bash hard working little girls for trying to raise money for their pursuits. My issue is with fiendishly greedy corporations and closed-minded ,starbicks drinking, IKEA shopping, ME ME ME, soccer moms that push their agenda off the innocence of children. I think that kids would be better served making their own cookies. But that would be too hard here in America, as it's taboo here to make something on our,own so instead we'll just get from one corpoarate monster deemed too big to fail, like GSUSA or Walmart. Besides, if parents teach their kids how to cook their own meals and how to manage a business, we might have a self sufficient society, and who would want that?;)

            • Posted By: billcarm @ 03/13/2009 6:48:29 PM

              You are just really cracking me up today.

              I'm one of those "closed-minded ,starbicks drinking, IKEA shopping, ME ME ME, soccer moms that push their agenda off the innocence of children". I'll break this apart. Looking at your website, you and I probably think more alike than either one of us is comfortable with. I don't like coffee. There's no IKEA near me. ME ME ME - don't I wish - my family comes first. My kids don't play soccer, but I do take karate with them. Do I push my agenda? Sure, but not about GS. That's not my agenda. Every year, I hope my daughter doesn't want to participate in GS because I don't know how to say NO when it comes to being a leader or a cookie manager. However, I do it because my daughter has made some good friendships and GS builds character in and promotes girls. So much in this society ignores character and tears people down for being different, whether it's gender, race, being too tall or too short, being overweight, being hyper, whatever. What's my agenda? Accept others, pay attention to the world around you, form your own opinions, don't let yourself be a doormat, and soooo much more. Some of these seem to be your website's agenda too.

              I guess the bottom line is that those of us involved in GS do so because we believe the organization benefits our girls. Your anger is not going to change this for us. I doubt we'll change your mind either. However, I hope that by responding to your misinformation, we'll keep others from believing your work of fiction.

              • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 8:24:36 PM

                If you're not one of those "soccer mom" types, then you have nothing to worry about. As for hatred, I have none for anyone. I just stating my opinion on the subject, as this is a comments sections. I also posted a link to my article, as it was related. I'm not here to attack you. If you were to be critical of an organization that I were a part of, I wouldn't get all butthurt about it and accuse you of being "angry at the world." I'd instead explain to you why I'm in it (although I might add in some humor) You've managed to do that, albeit with a little bit of illusory ranting.

                I've asked the same question to someone else on here: What about teaching our girls to bake and sell their own cookies? It teaches culinary skills, all of the business skills mention by GSUSA, and they get all of the profits. More importantly, there is NO middle man. I'm not here to change your mind eiither, you are entitled to believe in whatever you like, just like I am entitled to criticize that, and your entitled to retort. If my article is such a "work of fiction," why do you acknowledge the pushy office drones selling their kids cookies? Weren't you the same person that wanted police reports from me, for the troop leaders that allegedly stole money? Do you refuse to acknowledge that during a certain time of the year across America you will find many of these pushy adults having their girls stand outside in a grocery store parking lot , pushing the product.

                • Posted By: billcarm @ 03/13/2009 10:10:42 PM

                  Oh, but I never said I wasn't one of those soccer moms. I just said we do karate instead, I don't happen to like coffee, and there's no IKEA nearby. I am definitely one of those women you are writing about. I just think you are off the mark about our motives and what we do with the money (no new dining set here).

                  To answer your various comments: I'm not worried, you didn't hurt my feelings, I have explained why I'm involved in GSs and why we do cookie sales, I have seen that you posted your website - again and again and again - and you do seem hateful/angry. You do not just attack the GS organization. You do indeed attack people. You used several vivid descriptions meant to demean. I've read your posts and your website like you suggested, and you definitely sound hostile to me. A person doesn't attack others the way you do without having some hostilities in there.

                  You suggest that we should bake cookies and sell them. Why should we? You are the one with the problems with cookie sales, not us. GS has given us a mechanism to make money for our troop activities. You don't have to buy them. Troops that want to take big trips often do supplement cookie sales with bake sales, gift wrapping, car washes, and other fund raisers. That's up to them.

                  As for asking for the police reports for those women who stole the troop money to buy those new dining sets, I thought you might like to try to prove that your fiction is, in fact, factual. Haven't seen those police reports yet.

                  Your last point - I do not refuse to acknowledge that for a month each year, GS stand at store entrances to sell cookies. I'm sure some are pushy, but most are not. I suppose this is another area where you and I disagree. I tend not to be able to walk past any fundraiser that looks worthwhile without donating money. You also mention in another post that your niece and nephew pass clothes out to the homeless and that there are other ways to be of service without being in GS. We all know that. I'd be surprised to find many GS leaders who don't donate money and/or time to other organizations. Most I've met want to do more. However, ONE way we've chosen is through GS.

                  • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/16/2009 8:46:18 PM

                    By the way, I was watching the news today, and look what I stumbled across:

                    http://www.nbcsandiego.com/news/local/Mom-Admits-Stealing-From-Girl-Scouts-.html

                    There's your police report, plus a little verification from the main stream media. Looks like somebody got caught with their hand in the proverbial "cookie jar." Way to own your self. HAHAHAAHAHHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

                    Enjoy!!!

                    Magnus

                  • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 11:00:50 PM

                    Why should you not support the corporate monster? The same reason why we shouldn't shop at Walmart. It contributes to monopolies, promotes bad labor policies, and generally makes for a crappy product. But look, no one should be forced to not shop somewhere or be part of GSUSA for that matter. I'm just telling you why I wouldn't do it, just like you are telling me you would.

                    You say that I'm mean spirited and that I aim to hurt in my descritions. I base those descriptions of fof real world encounters, just like you base your generalization that other parents in GSUSA would willingly donate to other organizations and charities off of real world encounters. Since neither of us has the mind reading power of a Madame Cleo, we go off of our personal experiences, hence my descriiptions of these pushy moms. I'll let you know when I see otherwise.

        • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 5:01:06 PM

          First, this is straight from your almighty bible of a website:

          Q: What portion of the cookie revenue is shared with the group selling cookies?

          A: That decision is made by each local Girl Scout council, so the portion varies from one council to another. Nationwide, an individual group receives from 12-17% of the purchase price of each box sold. The group holds the money earned in its treasury, and its girl members vote on how to use that money.

          Source: http://www.girlscouts.org/program/gs_cookies/faqs.asp#money_where

          Secondly, do I need to poll every office worker in America to show how many morons are trying to guilt them into buying these glucose grenades? Most of the time, they just put up a list by the water cooler. How are our girls supposed to learn "essential values" and such this way?

          Thirdly, do you really want to debate the merits of girl scout cookies being healthy? At least with a hot dog, I know I'm eating processed entrails.

          4 thin mints (ABC bakers) are 160 calories, with 8 grams of fat, and 11 grams of sugar.

          Let's see the ingredients:

          Enriched flour (wheat flour, niacin, reduced iron, thiamine mononitrate, riboflavin, folic acid), sugar, vegetable shortening (palm and/or partially hydrogenated palm kernal oils), coco (processed with alkali), caramel color, high fructose corn syrup, whey, salt, leavening (sodium bicarbonate), soy lecethin, natural and artificial flavor, peppermint oil.

          Yeah, looks really healthy. No wonder we're the fattest country on Earth. Why don't we just have peddling bacon milkshakes while we're at it?

          Source: http://www.abcsmartcookies.com/cookies_nutrition.asp?id=3E0EFBA9-B2F7-42B6-94B4-AD7CE646C0E1

          Congratulations, you just got owned. I'll give a couple more supporting sources a little later.

          Magnus

          www.magnuschronicle.com

          • Posted By: bennettab @ 03/13/2009 6:01:08 PM

            I never suggested cookies are a "healthy" food -- if your beef with cookies is their nutritional value, then rewrite the "article" to accurately reflect that. Yep, you're right, our country has a problem with obesity. Girl Scout cookies are hardly solely at fault; McDonalds, Taco Bell, Kentucky Fried Chicken, potato chips, huge restaurant portions -- poor choices everywhere, everyday. No one is force feeding America. Have you written an "article" on McDonald's? They have a significantly larger impact on the nation's eating habits than cookies sold once a year. What about grocery stores who are pushing boxes of ice cream and bags of chips? Perhaps you should write an "article" about that. If you don't want cookies in your diet, fine with me. Don't buy them.

            The percentage you quote is in fact how much the individual troop receives from the sale. The REST of the money does not all go to the local council OR to GSUSA. In fact, NONE of the money raised by cookie sales goes to GSUSA. GSUSA receives a royalty from the baker out of their profit for the use of logos, photos, and other licensed content. In my council, approximately 50% of the $3 a box stays at council, earmarked for camps, council sponsored girl programs, and leader development and training. It's girl focused money, not AIG-style executive money. This varies by council, as each one negotiates their own contract with the baker and sets the price in their area. Selling cookies helps the council run and maintain our camp facilities and provide programs for the troops. This is wrong how? Look closely and find out just what percentage of a council's annual budget comes from cookies. Some councils are as high as 50%, while others are lower, 40% or below. Much of their funding comes from United Way and other community support.

            I DISCOURAGE parents selling for the girls. If parents and girls want to work together to contact the network of people the parent knows, they can come up with something that works for them. I think parents shouldn't do the work for their daughter, nor should they pressure sell in their workplace. If they want to let others around them know, that's one thing -- pushing the sale isn't cool. I emphasize the goals of the sale, the skills the girls can learn, from planning a sale, planning a budget for an outing or a service project, building strategies to meet their troop goals, down to the personal achievements such as learning to handle transactions quickly and accurately, speaking confidently to strangers, and effectively communicating their troop goals to potential customers. They learn a lot.

            • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 8:04:58 PM

              Does the title of the article not mention DIABETES? Therefore, health part of the argument.

              Regardless, everyone knows that fast food, cookies, and a host of other things are fattening. My issue is not that. I don't see little girls going door-to-door selling big macs to raise money for their activities, do you? McDonalds is a known for-profit food company. Look, the whole point of the article is to demonstrate that GSUSA has an agenda that doesn't necesarily flow with it's alleged wholesome image. I understand that you take some of this personally, being involved with this organization, but I'm not attacking you, just the organization's policies. But agian, I must ask, don't you think that it would be better to just teach the girls to bake and sell cookies. Like I've stated before, it would teach culinary skills, and small business skills. I'm not just arbitrarily bashing GSUSA for the hell of it. My niece used to be involved with that program. Eventually, she got out (she was not huge on the religion issue, nor the "salesyness" of it) and began selling cookies on her own (after we taught her how to bake them). She's not Bill Gates rich, but she enjoys it, and learned from it. That is what is most important.

          • Posted By: billcarm @ 03/13/2009 6:32:04 PM

            Hello, these are cookies. By whose definition is a cookie healthy. I don't think I've ever read any claim that GS cookies are healthy. I don't think Nabisco claims that either.

            Your assumption that since 12-17% of cookie sales goes to the local troop, the rest must go to the national organization is faulty. All profits stay local to support the girls. None goes to the national council. Less than a dollar per box pays the bakery. The remaining amount pays to maintain the local organization - the private camp grounds, the horses and stables, the local council offices, the local events, etc. That means it all goes back to support the girls.

            I will not debate the office worker issue with you. I'm sure you're half correct on that issue. I know many people take the order forms into the office. I'm sure some people use pressure tactics to sell at the office, though I don't remember ever meeting people like that in my many years (I am middle aged after all).

            I wonder why you are so interested in all of this. You come across as one who has no connection to GS except the occasional cookie booth. Yet, you seem to have a lot of hatred towards GS.

      • Posted By: scoutmomgogirlscouts @ 03/14/2009 1:40:30 PM

        Ugh, did your group not met quota or are you always so negative? Get a grip, scouts are all about teaching and learning. What is the "moral and ethical" mess coming from? I would much rather have my children to strive for exellence and to be high achievers rather than just followers. We would not have any of our wonderful technology if everyone just sat back and did not try new things. get with the times!

      • Posted By: Pennagirl65 @ 03/13/2009 4:57:17 PM

        Magnus
        YOu can stop your SPAM posting...it is abusive and you don't have any facts...it is a rant.

        • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 5:11:08 PM

          Did you see my reply to your comments in regards to my "rant?" It's not spam if it's pertinent and proves my point. I don't debate that my article is an opinion piece, but if you look below at my response, it has some sources for you. Let's get to the point. Don't you thin it would be better for girls to just bake and sell their own cookies. learning to cook, and to manage YOUR OWN business is something that any child or parent should be proud of, as opposed to feeding a corpoarte giant.

          • Posted By: billcarm @ 03/13/2009 6:04:40 PM

            You don't "prove" anything though. You have no supporting documentation. I saw no reference material. I'd like to see the police report on all of those middle-aged, slave-driving troop leaders who bought the new dining sets with their troops' money. Do you have those police reports? If so, post the url.

            • Posted By: Magnus The Luchador @ 03/13/2009 7:53:13 PM

              Police reports??? Sure let me go dig that up, along with the internal memo that I never going to get from GSUSA that discusses their "marketing strategy." Some of you guys take this stuff so personally. Stop drinking the Kool-Aid. Answer me this, would GSUSA be able to sell this stuff as well with out the "cuteness factor" that comes with having kids sell their products? I aplaud the fact that girls want to raise money to accomplish goals, however the method and monster behind it are flawed and corrupt.

          • Posted By: bennettab @ 03/13/2009 6:03:41 PM

            Senor Luchador, you meant me.

  • Posted By: Daynnightdreamer @ 03/12/2009 10:49:31 AM

    I was a girl scout and did the girl scout cookie thing every year. Instead of putting down what she did they should encourage the other girls to do this kind of thing. How many of these girls will have posted something completely pointless to Youtube before they even get 18? She stayed within a local area so she could deliver the cookies when they arrived. The girl is willing to deliver ALL those cookies then she should be able to sell them online! They should be using this opportunity to teach the girls how to do this and do it as safely as possible. They even could have had this girl help teach them and exp;ain what she did. The fact that the Girl Scouts have not anticipated this kind of thing nor do they have something in place for it does not speak well for the Girl Scouts. Regardless, all I can say is GOOD JOB & GO WILD!!!!!!

    • Posted By: bc23 @ 03/12/2009 9:04:23 PM

      So, for those of you whom never attended a girl scout meeting before, here is some light reading material of things that I had learned as I was going through from daisy until cadette...

      The girl scout pledge, which was recited at the beginning of every meeting:

      "on my honor, I will try, to serve God, and my country... to help people at all times, and to live by the girl scout law."

      Ohhh, and I find this particularly swell.. the girl scout honor:

      "I will do my best to be HONEST AND FAIR, friendly and helpful, considerate and caring, courageous and strong, and responsible for what I say and do, and to respect myself and others, RESPECT AUTHORITY, use resources wisely, make the world a better place, and be a sister to every Girl Scout."

      So, if you indeed use 'resources wisely' by disrespecting authority (said: GSUSA and their laws) and not being honest or fair to your other "sister" girl scouts by having your parents help you use resources that an 8 year old girl should not be associated with (said: facebook, myspace, youtube), then you, my friend, have indeed violated not only the pledge, but the girl scout honor.

      I think this whole article is focusing on the wrong thing. Girls scouts are not about cookie sales. Girl scouts is about shaping young girls into young women that can be proud of their accomplishments. Hey, I can sell crack as a side hustle if my focus is money, but it doesn't make it right because it is ILLEGAL to the government. I can sell cookies on ebay and mark up the price 50 cents a box if I want to go canoeing, but again, ILLEGAL to the government of the association's whose cookies you are selling. You are teaching your children the wrong things by not abiding by rules that are set. If we encourage the fact that "rules are meant to be broken" then we would have a society full of young teenagers who steal and get pregnant, and young adults who max out credit cards and ruin their credit before the ink is dry on the back of the card because self gratification is oh-so-much better than using common sense and having self respect for following rules. Oh, wait.. that's right. I guess is is 2009. We've had such a socio-economic downfall of our country. I suppose GSUSA should change their code of honor, their pledge, and their way of selling cookies, because apparently that hasn't been working for the past 97 years.

    • Posted By: bc23 @ 03/12/2009 9:00:39 PM

      So, for those of you whom never attended a girl scout meeting before, here is some light reading material of things that I had learned as I was going through from daisy until cadette...

      The girl scout pledge, which was recited at the beginning of every meeting:

      "on my honor, I will try, to serve God, and my country... to help people at all times, and to live by the girl scout law."

      Ohhh, and I find this particularly swell.. the girl scout honor:

      "I will do my best to be HONEST AND FAIR, friendly and helpful, considerate and caring, courageous and strong, and responsible for what I say and do, and to respect myself and others, RESPECT AUTHORITY, use resources wisely, make the world a better place, and be a sister to every Girl Scout."

      So, if you indeed use 'resources wisely' by disrespecting authority (said: GSUSA and their laws) and not being honest or fair to your other "sister" girl scouts by having your parents help you use resources that an 8 year old girl should not be associated with (said: facebook, myspace, youtube), then you, my friend, have indeed violated not only the pledge, but the girl scout honor.

      I think this whole article is focusing on the wrong thing. Girls scouts are not about cookie sales. Girl scouts is about shaping young girls into young women that can be proud of their accomplishments. Hey, I can sell crack as a side hustle if my focus is money, but it doesn't make it right because it is ILLEGAL to the government. I can sell cookies on ebay and mark up the price 50 cents a box if I want to go canoeing, but again, ILLEGAL to the government of the association's whose cookies you are selling. You are teaching your children the wrong things by not abiding by rules that are set. If we encourage the fact that "rules are meant to be broken" then we would have a society full of young teenagers who steal and get pregnant, and young adults who max out credit cards and ruin their credit before the ink is dry on the back of the card because self gratification is oh-so-much better than using common sense and having self respect for following rules. Oh, wait.. that's right. I guess is is 2009. GSUSA should change their code of honor, their pledge, and their way of selling cookies, because apparently that hasn't been working for the past 97 years.

  • Posted By: metootoo @ 03/15/2009 6:42:50 PM

    The girl scouts have always been behind the times. They were promoting Suzy Homemaker skills like sewing and cooking when nobody did that any longer. GS is run by a bunch of techophobes that are clueless about how the Internet works. I think the way her father did it was MORE than fair only taking local orders. AND safer as I'm sure he accompanied her to deliver the packages. How safe is knocking on pedophile doors? Get with the times Girl Scouts...personally I can't see why anyone would want to BE a girl scout these days...but then my girls were quite computer literate and thought the Girl Scouts were incredibly lame. I felt all there were learning was cookie-pushing (a la drug cartel). My girls are much better off for NOT being scouts - one's in college now for video game design and the other computer programming...

    • Posted By: teekay @ 03/16/2009 4:11:50 PM

      Who knew no one cooked anymore! Will someone please tell my family so they won't expect dinner anymore? LOL.

      This post annoys me for several reasons:
      1. The false blanket statement about GSA being technophobes - all councils have websites and most service units as well. You can find where we will be at booth sales or have the area Serv. Unit Mgr notified of your interest in cookies with a simple google search of Girl Scouts and your state.

      2. Poster says we should sell online for safety reasons but then goes on to say the girl would be delivering the cookies with her father. The home where the pedophile lives is the same one whether the order was taken online or in person. A parent should be accompanying any child during order taking or delivery to ensure the safety of our kids.

      3. Poster can't see why anyone would even want to be a Girl Scout......it is SO lame going rock climbing, horseback riding, camping, going on trips to water parks, getting to stay overnight at museums and aquariums as well as learning about community service and giving back to others.

      4. Poster said her kids were only learning was cookie pushing..... if you weren't happy with your troops activies and focus then you could have become a leader, co-leader or cookie mom.

      Don't knock an organization that has done many wonderful things not just for our girls but for many others. Our girls have donated undergarments to the needy, personal care packages to homeless vets, care packages to our troops, food drives for our local food banks. I know my girls and me are better because of the Girl Scouts.

  • Posted By: luchauna @ 03/16/2009 3:24:13 PM

    My daughter is a girl scout and it states plainly right on the order form that, and I quote, " Girl Souts (or Girl Scout families) cannot sell cookies on the internet." Arguing that they did not take money over the internet and did make deliveries in person is splitting hairs. She had an unfair advantage over other Girls in her area and her parents are merely teaching her that her wishes are more important that playing fair. Girl Scouts promote service and learning skills that many kids are not given the opportunity to acquire. In a generation of self-centeredness run rampant, I applaud all those parents trying to teach their kids that it isn't always about them or their own circle friends.

  • Posted By: lostpyper @ 03/15/2009 10:19:06 AM

    This is insane techno-phobia. The mere act of mass advertising is now wrong and deceitful ??? Since when??? I wonder if we should stop allowing Girl Scouts to ride in their parents' cars when selling cookies. That is such an advanced technology over sneakers hittin' the pavement, isn't it an unfair advantage to those Girl Scouts whose parents don't have cars? NO .NO IT DOES NOT !!! We don't have to make everything communistic. We are not all the same, nor are our ideas and methods. Soon we'll be limiting Girls Scout cookie sales. Sorry little girl, you;ve already sold 10 boxes, we have to wait for all the other little girls to sell 10 boxes before you can sell an eleventh box. We have ti be fair after all..............The Freeborn family took advantage of an opportunity to use innovation for success. They did not take advantage of other Girl Scouts, society, or anything else......I'm still unsure where the problem is ?

    • Posted By: Jberel @ 03/16/2009 11:07:36 AM

      The problem is that this father is well known locally as someone who thinks the rules don't aply to him. In addition to being the Chief Operating Officer of his one man band "business" in Asheville, he's also a frequent candidate for the Asheville City Council.

      When he couldn't get elected, he got appointed for the remainder of one term and began an embarassing campaign to control local voting outcomes through partisan elections, all in the effort to manipulate an actual election for himself. As expected that failed completely, but not without a number or immature temper tantrums from him in the process. When he lost yet another local election, he whined repeatedly about the voting results and requested numerous recounts because he couldn't face facts.

      He is also infamous for defying local laws regulations that he feels don't apply to him. For example, when he was informed that the public street in his neighborhood didn't qualify or justify traffic calming, he proceeded to paint the public street himself. Then he had to get sued by the city for the cost of repairing the damage he caused. Only upon the pospect of getting a council appointment did he decide to pay the fines.

      The guy's a class act all the way, and it's very unfortunate that one small, arrogant, self important individual can stir up trouble like this for a organization devoted to helping children. It's a classic case of how the media can bend things unintentionally just by being less than thorough. I defy any of the media to really look into this man rather than promoting him and his business as he so gladly accepts.

  • Posted By: GS_ATL_Mom @ 03/15/2009 2:12:45 PM

    I'm pro-internet (make my living on it), and I'm a GS mom and GS Leader. I can see both sides of the coin, but what most people don't realize is that it's more complicated than this article represents for GS to allow online cookie sales. Many councils set their own prices based on their own local economy/cost of living. So say everyone in CA who usually pays maybe $5 a box finds someone in Atlanta selling cookies for $3.50 a box. People will stop buying from GS in CA. It's not right to punish kids because they live in a higher cost of living area. It's not right for the councils to compete with each other like that. And internet sales would open that can of worms and many more, because not all the councils DO the same things. Also, I'd be leery having my daughter out there in a video like that. Online child predators are very real, and their numbers grow. Online GS Cookie sale banning is not new news either. It's been a policy of GS for at least the last 5 years that I know, probably longer. They encourage girls to email people they "ALREADY KNOW" to mention they are selling cookies, and I think that's a great way to reach out into technology and stay safe at the same time and not make the differences in councils damaging to the entire organization.

  • Posted By: ConcernedGirlScoutMom @ 03/15/2009 1:46:38 PM

    I think people are overlooking 2 important points. Her father admitted he knew Internet Cookie sales were forbidden- yet he made the decision to do it anyway. Is that teaching right from wrong? Or teaching- you can do what you want and the rules don't matter? The 2nd point is 'girl safety'. Many predators patrol the Internet looking for children. Not only was Wild exposed - her location was freely provided. How would everyone feel if she was abducted and/or hurt because a predator saw her video?

  • Posted By: lostpyper @ 03/15/2009 10:20:06 AM

    This is insane techno-phobia. The mere act of mass advertising is now wrong and deceitful ??? Since when??? I wonder if we should stop allowing Girl Scouts to ride in their parents' cars when selling cookies. That is such an advanced technology over sneakers hittin' the pavement, isn't it an unfair advantage to those Girl Scouts whose parents don't have cars? NO .NO IT DOES NOT !!! We don't have to make everything communistic. We are not all the same, nor are our ideas and methods. Soon we'll be limiting Girls Scout cookie sales. Sorry little girl, you;ve already sold 10 boxes, we have to wait for all the other little girls to sell 10 boxes before you can sell an eleventh box. We have ti be fair after all..............The Freeborn family took advantage of an opportunity to use innovation for success. They did not take advantage of other Girl Scouts, society, or anything else......I'm still unsure where the problem is ?

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