Tiananmen In Tehran

All the clerics can do is crush the protests, then introduce reforms. But it may be too late.

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  • Posted By: Iam3rd @ 06/22/2009 1:15:04 PM

    While I don't disagree with the article, I think naming sources within Iran and espousing about all of the awesome infomration gained while visiting is probably dangerous. At the least, it is reckless. I am sure the regime knows what western reporters do while in Iran and they know who the reformist opposition is and what they think of the system. It just seems that the WAY this article is written give them another tool to use against reformers, western media, and us: the CItizens of the Great Satan.....with our meddling reporters/CIA operatives and their co-conspirators within Iran.

  • Posted By: coolmujra @ 06/20/2009 7:11:33 AM

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  • Posted By: undeadbydawn @ 06/18/2009 10:12:54 PM

    To quote an Iranian commenter "president obama is doing fine, if he says anything in direct support of us, gov will translate it as Evil US is trying to destroy Iran

    What about this to Obama critics NOT understand?

    ANYTHING Obama says in support of the protesters will be immediately launched on by the Iranian Government as proof of American hostility, and as further reason to crush the rebellion.

    Obama is not that stupid. He has already proven this by getting elected as an outside bet and taking on several clearly established runners, including the presumed next President herself

    ALSO: Try to remember this because it is important - This is about Iran and Iranians, not America and Obama.

  • Posted By: I'm all in @ 06/18/2009 5:20:40 PM

    Republican want to cite failures in courage. How about Dick cheney, actively pursued a deferment from the veit nam Draft. and got it. After he was approved for duty, he applied 5 times before he successfuly ducked sevice. I wonder who died for him? Ole rushbo asked for and got a medical defferment. Do you think it was possible that he could have served his country in some respect. Clerical, stores, motor pool/ George bush, joined the Air force but hid behind his daddy and stayed stateside. didn't even both to show up fo training. While i'm hot let me add Bill Clinton. he got an educational defferment. Should anyone be sent in harms way so someone else can go to college. These are cowards. These are the "feckless". when one of you GOP supporters condemn these jerks, then maybe your words about Obama may have some credence. Otherwise, shut your pie holes.

  • Posted By: DrewCAENG @ 06/18/2009 5:17:37 PM

    PauleJb, I see where you are coming from, Obama should choose a side in Iran right? Well, thats actually the wosrt thing he could possibly do! They already blame us for meddeling in their affairs and if he chooses a side (which ever that may be) all that does is turn his choice into a "puppet for the Americans" as the Iranians so lovingly refer to anyone backed by the west. Your analysis is a typical closed-minded "Western" one. FIGHT EVIL, EVIL is BAD! We are GOOD! well my simple minded friend it is sadly more complicated than that! A very very small % of Americans know what we did to Iran in the 50's, BUT almost everyone in Iran knows what happened in the 50's. If you need a history lesson we basicaly removed their eleceted leader and replaced him with a dictator because we didnt like his leftist economics. Maybe meddeling is what we should try to do least? Sometimes the best action is to do nothing, get that?...Maybe not.

  • Posted By: I'm all in @ 06/18/2009 4:21:50 PM

    President obama doesn't have courage. That's what the GOP would want to sell you. They ignore his phased withdrawl from iraq, where most democrats want an immediate withdrawl. He is bombarded with this everyday. They ignore his willingness to fire missles into pakistan and join with their Army in routing the Talibamn against democrat opposition. He is succeeding where Bush failed in taking it to the Taliban. when the taliban falls, Bin ladens small terrorist gang will be destroyed because it is the Taliban that gives him safe harbor. He has decided to withhold and protect the torture photos which would embarrass the GOP, if that's possible, but would also steel our enemies against our troops. The Democrats are having a heart attack on that one.

    the problem the GOP has with President Obama is a political one. He has tossed them out of power and they will do anything to get it back including selling our country down the tubes. Would the democrats do the same if the roles were reversed? Well hell yeah. At least I'm one Dem who isn't afraid to tall it like it is. The "feckless" cowards here don't have the courage to admit that they are pissed because they're power is gone and their party is fading fast, so they attack Obama.

  • Posted By: thearch @ 06/18/2009 3:36:02 PM

    All Iranians,
    What help are you looking for other than moral help (which is already there in abundance)? Material help is farfetched at this stage. Any intervention from outside will be used to the advantage of incumbent president and your fight will be downplayed simply as antinational and pro-western. So fight it out on your own, for now. Believe me, entire world is watching very closely and searching for any info that comes out of Iran. All of us want to know why Iran cannot become a free democracy when many other countries are enjoying the fruits of democracy. Thorough introspection is needed by you all.
    Iranians expect change without ever initiating a national dialogue on core issues weighing down their governance. Open debates criticizing fundamentalist oriented mindset of Teheran establishment is necessary. If the mullahs/ayatollahs continue to wield veto power and run the country thru parallel governance, the elected parliamentarians and president function just like an extended arms of the sepah, Basij or other outfits serving the theocracy. So long as the law makers (parliamentarians) do not function fearlessly and without restrictions on their powers, as you see in Japan, India, France and US no single leader (in this case Mousavi) can bring in freedom for Iranians.

    Separate first the religion from politics. Having lived in Iran from 1985 to 90, I can say it is not possible. Simply Iranians cannot make a Gandhi out of Khomini. My sympathies and good wishes.

  • Posted By: I'm all in @ 06/18/2009 2:34:54 PM

    One day the Republicans are calling obama a terrorist and the next a coward. If president Obama fired a missle directly into the heart of Iran's President, the GOP would say too little too late.. The Republican define, thinking before one acts, as cowardly. this is why they had no problem with the Bush Administration dummying up evidence to enable the attack on iraq. As long as it's violent and racist, they can't get enough of it. The Republicans on the NW blogs have always said a good Arab is a dead arab and called them ragheads and camel jockeys. Now they want us to believe they want to have a candlelight dinner with them. I realize we're on the blogs to mess with each other, but the GOP has nothing to offer except racist hate. let me make it clear that some republicans want desperately to move the party away from the Southern hateful influence, but there is absolutely no chance of that ever happening. The ones that defend it are just a bunch of losers.

  • Posted By: OutsideLookInside @ 06/18/2009 12:58:21 PM

    Yeah..you guys didn't see the fall of shah coming so why I am not surprised ;)

  • Posted By: MChieco @ 06/17/2009 11:11:49 PM

    I believe The Iranian clerics should threaten the people that if they dont stop protesting , they will make George Bush the Iranian President. You think Mahmood is bad , Bush believes in end times.

  • Posted By: I'm all in @ 06/17/2009 8:40:24 PM

    Today Iran accused president obama of undermining the election and backing the opposition. tomorrow the GOP will say Obama shouldn't have meddled in the election. Yesterday he should have tomorrow he shouldn't have. Just more desparate crap out of the Party of no. It's all they have to offer. How embarrassing it must be for a Republican reformer to be held hostage by an out of touch racist base.

  • Posted By: Greg the Third @ 06/16/2009 4:37:31 PM

    It is a good sign that they are calling for a recount. Only a full recount with observers from both candidates will fully resolve the tension. Ayatollah Khameni does appear weakened by backtracking towards allowing a recount, but by no means is he out of power. There may be a shakeup amongst the ruling clerics if confidence in his decisions and actions is further weakened by mis-steps. The growing rallies of Mousavi supporters in the cites is doing just that, however and they may have enough clout to demand and get a full recount. How far the growing Mousavi supporters are willing to go to push change within or outside the government framework is an interesting question and depends on a number of things including how many more people show up and what they decide they want from the government. It does look like the Ahmadinejad rallies have died down or become irrelevant. The clerics would do well to counter with equally large rallies supporting Ahmadinejad and keep them as far apart as possible. Any comment on how purported actions of individual muslims reflect badly on Islam in general are unacceptably ignorant, bigoted, and childish. If an individual Christian commits a sin does that mean the Christian religion is deceitful as well?

    • Posted By: John Dough @ 06/17/2009 10:59:51 AM

      You must be a democrat or a dreamer do you think the phony recount is going to change anything? The Clerics want their man back in charge _ Mousavi does not stand a chance. He was actually told to prepare a victory speeech only to find he supposedly lost by a 2 to 1 Margin. Al Franken must have gone over to help count the votes!!!

      • Posted By: Greg the Third @ 06/17/2009 8:00:45 PM

        Try actually reading my statement before delivering thoughtless predetermined comments based on your take on the subject. Your attempt to label someone is a sign of hostility, concrete thinking, and a closed mind. Please leave partisan/bigoted thoughts to yourself, they do not belong in public discourse. A full recount with both sides observing would diffuse the tension. I agree that a partial recount would not, but that should be implicitly understood from my first statement. I do not think this will be offered, but it happens then it is a good sign that the results were accurate. It is entirely possible that Ahmadinejad won, but that his supporters are not ethusiastic enough to go into the streets and make a fuss. If the minority group is sufficiently vocal, well organized and motivated and the majoirty group is apathetic then the minority group can still seize power. In my owm view the purported minority view is more right and better for Iran's future, but if you believe in democracy and the vote was honest enough then should one not cede the election to the will of the people and try harder next time? Only a full recount with observers from both sides can set things straight, otherwise it comes down to which side has more will and that contest is being won by the reformers.

    • Posted By: DoctorDavid @ 06/16/2009 4:53:57 PM

      Not an individual Christian, but what about the Pope? Here is the issue. The Theocratic rule in Iran should rule by Islamic Law. Is that Law to suppress political freedom and expression by death or imprisonment? Why is it that you think, Sistani wants religion out of political rule? It is for the reason that political changes occur with regularity, but Religious Law is more permanent, albeit interpretations of Law allow for some adaptation to societal progression. If the two are to closely aligned, than any faltering of political rule reflects poorly upon religious rule which reflects poorly on the religion itself. Islam allows itself to be used by terrorists, corrupt religious leaders, false governments, etc. That is a real problem that needs correcting. The place to start is with the clerics.

      • Posted By: Greg the Third @ 06/17/2009 6:48:20 AM

        Understood, but this is a western notion and this is an Eastern nation. Especially with Islam culture and religion are much more closely linked than in a country like the U.S. It can be truly difficult to separate the two, perhaps impossible. Your criticisms of this theocracy are accurate and apply to any theocracy. In Iran they are making a pretty honest and challenging attempt to make one work. As expected it is not working out so well and it is fascinating for me to see how this plays itself out.

  • Posted By: mas8baller @ 06/17/2009 3:26:11 PM

    Who cares Iran is what it is & until the people stand up as they did right or wrong against the shah even if it means lives losted then so be until then they'll still be a dictatorship. And at this point with lives already being lost they might as well make good on promises & make sure those lives and those affected by the deaths arent for not. As the crown prince and other leaders in similar spots have always said if its the will of the people then the people must speak & act for only they can change the government. Burn baby burn.

  • Posted By: thearch @ 06/17/2009 2:41:58 PM

    peace and love
    good luck iranians
    you andonly you can bring change

  • Posted By: kamakiriad @ 06/17/2009 2:01:00 PM

    My heart is with the reformists, but my cynical brain tells me they will be crushed mercilessly and much blood would need to be shed before the Mullahs let loose their grip on power. They have their own private army in the Republican Guard which has been trained to wage war against its own people.

  • Posted By: lovedeedee @ 06/17/2009 1:50:26 PM

    Peope are fed up with the religious zealots and clerics. These oppressors need to go !! Religion has been poisoning people's lives for too long !

  • Posted By: CloverNYC @ 06/16/2009 5:26:07 PM

    The people of Iran are waking up to the truth that it's not just Ahmadinejad who considers them 'dust," but all the religious clerics, the ones with limitless power and influence over their lives, who are sending out death squads to murder their own people.

    Babylon is falling.

    • Posted By: jackalgirl @ 06/17/2009 12:49:50 PM

      Babylon fell a long time ago. She's just waiting for someone to light a match.

  • Posted By: tired and old @ 06/16/2009 5:05:28 PM

    IRAN CAN BOTTLE UP RAGE; THEY HAVE SOLD IT FOR YEARS UNDER THE NAME " TERRORISM ".

    • Posted By: Braes @ 06/17/2009 12:28:29 PM

      and here we call it Republicanism...

  • Posted By: strummin @ 06/16/2009 6:05:54 PM

    kenfromilliniois:

    You sound like a typical Fox News-fan.

    The entire Islamic world is not in arms because, just like America, it is taking the wise approach of letting Iranians decide who they want to lead them. Plus, as you very well know, there were no international observers so nobody outside Iran can either prove/disprove these results.

    The second stupid assumption you make is that the entire Islamic world is responsible for what every Muslim does. If you knew anything about the Middle East, you'd know that the Iranian clerics are Shia and not Sunni. The rest of the Muslim world is predominantly (80%) Sunni. All Muslims are not the same ethnicity, do not speak the same languages, are not part of the same cultures and, believe me, practice Islam in many very different ways. Why should other Muslims be forced to apologize for actions by some in the name of Islam - simply because they share the same religion? I don't share my culture/language/ethnicity or even how I practice my religion with these Iranian clerics. They have almost nothing in common with me. Why do you then expect me to apologize for their actions?

    • Posted By: Braes @ 06/17/2009 12:26:14 PM

      Good job. Thank you for being informative. I hope the best for the Iranian people.

  • Posted By: Youssef A. @ 06/17/2009 8:19:56 AM

    "When I visited Iran two years ago this month"??
    Sorry, I don't get this.

    • Posted By: greymatter @ 06/17/2009 11:55:45 AM

      IT MEANS DURING JUNE TWO YEARS AGO. AKA: JUNE 2007

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