Avoiding Another Katrina

comment to dgu56: human intent/unintent......a dropped cigarette...intentional or unintentional...
but really unless we are there do we know who to blame..not blame...and in the end for victims....is that what matters? We are all human beings who deserve the same when it comes to disaster--whatever the disaster is. And jtphillips has valid note---there really is no comparison to the two different types of disasters.

it should be noted----both of these are different disasters----both which required different tactics to begin to tackle situation. I just dont think mayor of New Orleans should be knocked--we think he did everything in his power to get through red tape and the world seen the disasterous results. The Bush government isnt going to let that happen again.....though we cant help but think that a world famous movie star was able to cut through red tape in a lesser amount of time than what Louisiana was given. ANd when it gets right down to it...the only comparison to these disasters = human lives and the common sense to have assistance from the federal end of government.

Folks, you can not compare a flood to a fire. Put 20 feet of rushing water on teh ground outside Qualcom Stadium and the stinch and hysteria of people standing on roof tops and San Diego area residents would be acting in a similar fashion. They have done great in California, but please stop comparing. It's apples and oranges. Outdie of the stadium in San Diego it's a beautiful sunny day. Don't comapre that to ravaging flood waters.

The reason you really can't compare these two disasters is not politics or race but experience. CA has dealt with major wildfires every year for how many years now? And how many hurricanes have come through New Orleans in even the last century? Fact of the mater is that the local and state governments would have to be stone drunk to not know what to do and how to make the situation be as painless as possible. And the samegoes for the people of SOCAL. Kitrina (for those who have forgotten) was a hurrican, meaning that if you're neighbor was flooded out YOU were flooded out. Yes its grand that the people in SOCAL who th ires haven't touched are helping out, but if their houses were buring to the ground they would be running to the nearest hand out, be it government or a neighbor. And i'm sure if it was a wildfire in New Orleans people whose house didn't burn down would be helping those whose houses did. It is unbleivible to me to see people of SOCAL shooting their mouths off at the people in New Orleans. Don't you see the difference? Besides the acutual nature of the disater the money alone sets you apart. If you live in Mailbu you have no clue what life is like living in a sub 1000sq foot house living from pay check to pay check. When those people lost their home they don't have a nice summer home to run to, they didn't have just hundreds of thousands of dollars invested in their homes they had every thing invested in their homes it was (for most) the only investment they had. And so yes when someone is about to lose every thing (has as in watching it float down the street) they do stupid things(like looting and leaving older people to die). Is it right, no. Does it make it ok, no. Does it explain every one, no. Does it mean that people living in posh Malibu have any right to understand and judge what people in New Orleans were dealing with, no.

I live in SD, and my house is under threat from the Harris fire. I have been annoyed by the national media (it's not the local media) constantly comparing us to Katrina. For one thing, they say we've 'learned lessons' from Katrina, judging from the situation at Qualcomm. In truth, all they have do is go back to their file footage from the Cedar fire in 2003 (before Katrina) to see that we are always this organized in our response.

But they're not only shortchanging us in these glib exchanges, they're shortchanging all of Louisiana. The situations are entirely different. Yes, most of SD County is on fire, but we are mobile. People have cars and most roads are open. Most forms of public transportation are still operable (the fires are mostly in the backcountry or suburbs, where public transportation doesn't really exist).

The fire is continuous, just like the hurricane and flooding, but only in certain areas -- other areas of town are open for business and to evacuees. The weather is sunny and dry, not raining and with hurricane force gales. There is no flooding. There is a police presence at evacuee centers.

Now, as with the Cedar fire of 2003, the unaffected people are coming forth in droves to volunteer their time, services, money, supplies -- but we can do this because we are not on fire. In Katrina, no one could do this because *everybody* was flooded. In 2003 (Cedar) and now, the mood at Qualcomm was relatively upbeat. But they're not being rained on or flooded and they feel safe. Insurance companies and FEMA showed up at Qualcomm within days after the Cedar fire; the same thing is happening now. And, not everyone fled to Qualcomm -- they didn't have to. Many had friends and family to go to, some chose hotels, some went to smaller shelters, and many chose public parks near the ocean. Right now, Mission Bay is filled with evacuees who decided they might as well hang out in a pretty spot with grass and access to the water, etc. And they are also getting aid (donated water, etc.).

As for overall civility...The fact that areas of town are functional also frees up the police somewhat (and they called in all the off-duty and reserve forces.) My brother lost his home in the Cedar fire. The cops were there right away, enforcing evacuations, looking for looters, allowing only residents back afterward. This is a function of the nature of the disasters. They are entirely different. My point is, we are as organized now as we were before Katrina (so stop saying we learned lessons from Katrina), but also that the two disasters are wholly unequal and undeserving of comparisons. It's unfair and unjust to compare them.

New Orleans- the poor, the sick, living in low lying areas versus California-the wealthy, the affluent, living in mountainous area---is there really a comparison? One was a act of nature, the other a act of what is usually human intent/unintent. I watched the mayor of New Orleans begging for help from a system that was not listening--yes the governor was asleep at her nice dry home, but the mayor----he was there....Now comparing to California, a movie star governor (wheres the mayor?) Is there really a comparison? It all is dollars and sense.

Patricia, I used to live in New Orleans and still have relatives there. What's interesting is the attitude the people there are still mired in; i.e., everything is someone else's fault. You did it yourself when your wrote: We've had a 100 year flood and it was caused by the failure of the federal government to build the proper protection for this area, not directly by the storm. The thing is, everybody in New Orleans still believes all that. My relatives won't even speak to me if I dare bring up any of the things the people there might have done to prevent the tradegy. It's always someone else's fault. Always.

wow...a lot of people getting really emotional and angry here. well i have to say, that i don't believe that the comparison is being made about the disaster itself. fires and hurricanes are indeed different, but both have devastating effects....also there's no way for anybody outside of their respective regions to truly understand whats going on within, since you don't really get the full story unless you're actually there. the fires have been devastating, over 500,000 people have been under mandatory evacuation and another 12,000 under voluntary evacuation and thousands of acres of land has be destroyed in san diego county alone. the difference between the so cal fires and katrina has been the response. no body is waiting for things to go really bad to do something, everything has been done ahead of time. we are very fortunate to have government officials that are looking at the things done in katrina and not making the same mistakes, thats why things are getting done more effeciently here in california. transportation is being provided for those without it, evacuation centers are being set up everywhere (there are 3 with 1 mile of my home), people are being evacuated way ahead of the fires, there is 24 hour coverage of all fires, the military, local governments, and local media outlets are all working together, the government has stepped in way ahead of time and sought out help from every corner they can find it in, and the community has really come together. if these fires are anything like they were in 2003 (and so far they're worse) they'll hopefully be fully contained by november 1st/2nd. and hopefully the emergency responce will keep its pace until then. but this isnt to say that everything is going perfectly....if the winds kick up again(and its that time of year, so they may) the fires will rage on, and we do not have enough resourses to fight all these fires, rescue people who chose not to evacuate, and police the region, and the fires keep effecting the major highways/freeways of the region (the 2 major freeways in and out of san diego county, the 5 and 15, have both been closed in both directions at different times during the week).
both disasters are different, but hopefully the victims of the southern california wild fires do not go through the additional heart aches the katrina victims faced in the aftermath of their disaster.

Tis is really disturbing, I can not believe that, you all could not see who was most responsible for the management disaster during katrina, take note on how the head of the state of cal is taking responsibility for his state.

The following is posted on the site regarding losses in the fires but is appropriate here;
The people of New Orleans are watching with understanding and compassion as the people of Southern California go through this horrendous time! I suspect that as after our disaster, the NYC firemen came to our aid, there are probably Gulf Coast firemen wishing they could help if not actually doing so. This is really the strength of our country. I heard some at a meeting I attended yesterday who had lost everything two years ago say that they much prefer a flood to fire!

My husband and I are not so much residents of New Orleans as we are ???missionaries??? here (he is a pastor) and as such, I feel the need to ask the following questions on behalf of so many wonderful people we care about who do call this place home. As the people of southern CA. watch their homes burn or go back to visit the charred remains, will they hear leaders of their country and other Americans question whether southern CA should be rebuilt? Will there be major publications with special issues questioning their right to live in the woods? Will they have to fight their insurance companies to convince them that this devastation is covered in their policies (this one is possible though I certainly hope not)? I could go on but I think you get the drift.

Forest fires are a yearly occurrence in southern California. We've had a 100 year flood and it was caused by the failure of the federal government to build the proper protection for this area, not directly by the storm. So, please, show compassion for the folks out west and do what you can to help them, but the next time you hear a derogatory remark about the situation here, keep these facts in mind.
P. S. Much has been made of corruption and debauchery here (as if that is a reason not to help good people) but I think southern Ca. could compete with us on this anytime!! -Patricia Hinds

You know what would be nice? A training day for some of our more leadership challenged mayors. Perhaps Ray Nagin could be flown out here for some hands-on? He could take notes and stuff. Things like: 1) don't wait till last second. 2) Inspect levees BEFORE storm. 3) watch weather report. 4) install porti-potti or two at Superdome. 5) move buses to higher ground

Please realize that the reason people are making racial comparisons between Katrina and the SOCAL fires is because of what is seen on the evening news. In Katrina 98% of the pictures seen where of poor black Americans unable to leave their homes. In SOCAL the sound bites we see are of John Travolta and Brittany Spears being scared that their houses will be next to burn. Some people don't look past that and they make judgements. That is sad because many of the people affected by the fires are hard-working middle-class families (and really what does it matter how much money you make when everything you've ever worked for goes up in flames).

I am a black female democrat and I can truly say that I believe that the difference between NO and the SOCAL fires is effective leadership. It was because of the ineffective and sometimes arrogant leadership of Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagin that NO became hell on earth that 1st week after Katrina. And it is because of Gov. Schwarzenegger that the SOCAL fire situation is being handled so well. Thank God Gov. Schwarzenegger is not waiting for permission to do all of what needs to be done. He is acting as a leader should... not from the comfort of his office or a plane... he is standing with the people affected making sure that needs are met. I was never a huge Schwarzenegger fan, but I am now!!

My Thanks go out to Arnold and the Many people who have come to his aid. We are all praying for the people of California. Our thanks to the Fire Fighters and may you be safe.- from PA

I sure hope the mayor of New Orleans and the governor of Louisiana are taking note on how to effectively and efficiently manage a disaster.

I hope the Mayor of New Orleans and the Governor of Louisiana are taking note on how to effectively and efficiently manage a disaster

To Pinkpanther: please don't type in all caps-it looks like you are shouting. And second, this is part of a Washington Post article written in 2005:

Since Katrina struck, Congress has already spent $62.3 billion, dwarfing the inflation-adjusted $17.8 billion that Congress spent on hurricanes Andrew, Iniki and Omar, which struck in 1992, and the $15.2 billion emergency appropriation for the Northridge, Calif., earthquake of 1994.

I mean, come on, Katrina spending dwarfed anything before and since. And they still botched everything up down there. It wasn't an issue of aid, just mismanagement at the local and state level.

This is simply a matter of effective leadership. I am a black female democrat, but the Katrina disaster of New Orleans (and other cities along the Gulf Coast) became a horrific ordeal because of the ineffective and sometimes arrogant leadership of Gov. Blanco and Mayor Nagin. Many have already listed what both did to make the Katrina situation so horrible. Gov. Schwarzenegger is showing us what a real leader does. You don't wait for someone to give you permission for everything... Some things you get on the phone and you do. You also don't do it from the comfort of an office, plane or even a car. You go to where the people are suffering the most, stand with them and make sure they are taken care of. I was never a huge Schwarzenegger fan before, but I am now!! This is real leadership at work. GOOD FOR HIM!

Enter Your Comment

To Rationaltime20: the reason Katrina is being mentioned here is because that was what the article was about? Get it? Avoiding another Katrina...OK, now, back to business. Another huge difference between the two disasters is the police and fire response. In San Diego the police and fire are heroes. In New Orleans about one-third of the police force disappeared. Some were caught on tape stealing.