The Ghosts We Think We See

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  • Posted By: skelly123 @ 10/31/2007 6:12:30 PM

    It's always hilarious to hear what people believe about "the after life" when they've never even SEEN the other side and wouldn't know JACK about it...for instance, psychics and paranormal investigators...Christ, on the other hand, did come from "the other side" and is in fact THE OWNER of it. And because He's the one and only witness who has ever actually been there, maybe we ought to listen to Him when He speaks. In Luke Chapter 16 He clearly stated that once we die, we go to one of two places. And once we go there, we are not allowed to "astro travel" back and forth, not even to pay your relatives one last visit, or to "watch over them". So, what are all these ghosts and apparitions that people are seeing all over the world? Christ and the Prophets of the Bible clearly identified them as Satan, the devil. Because his origins come from Eternity, Satan has limited information on EVERYONE ALIVE. And that means he has the ability to take on the likeness and apparition of dead people. It wasn't your Aunt Martha that showed up at your house in the middle of the night...it was a demon who took on her likeness. Oh, and just so you know, demons do not have to obey to "Catholic Priests". When you call on priests to "cleanse your house" you're taking your life into your own hands because you have NO CLUE what dark and scary habits they get into when no one's looking behind closed doors (know what I mean?). And that's why demons usually stomp on those priests and send them packing. If you have demon activity in your house, run to your nearest non-denominational, Bible-teaching church and get help from them. And isn't it funny, how many times these ghosts start as "little children"...but before too long they scratch you to shreds and almost destroy your house. This should serve as a warning to you...DO NOT ROMANTICIZE these creatures as former living beings. They are nothing of the sort. You need to deal with them for what they are. Demons from hell. If anyone needs help, contact me at skelly007@juno.com.

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 4:32:33 PM

      I think that's a rather mistaken and, to be honest, dangerously arrogant argument. You know, it's quite possible you're wrong? For example--what about when Moses and Elijah appeared on the Mount of Transfiguration with Jesus? Where do you classify that one?

      And let's not be so quick to condemn the Catholic Church and denominational churches. They might not have it all right, but neither do we. Overconfidence in one's own rectitude has led to some pretty ugly behavior on all sides, you know.

      I'm not saying you're wrong in what you say. I am saying you shouldn't be so dogmatic about things that are not that clear to us.

  • Posted By: mygreybear @ 10/31/2007 6:16:28 PM

    And it's always hilarious when people who can't prove jack about it NOT existing try to make it a fact.

    • Posted By: John Igo @ 10/31/2007 6:25:57 PM

      Yo, you cant prove jack about it existing, and just because it cant be disproven dosn't meen i should believe it! You cant disproove the existance of the toothfairy and i bet you don't believe that

      sincerly
      a skeptic

      • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 4:24:28 PM

        I believe the point is, science by definition is incapable of proving or disproving the existence of the supernatural. Science studies the natural world through the senses. The supernatural, by definition, is not part of the natural, and cannot be studied with the senses or repeated through experiment. Hence, scientific evidence is completely irrelevant. I would think that's a pretty clear logical argument.

    • Posted By: yogibear1979 @ 10/31/2007 8:47:33 PM

      You can't prove jack about the purple dinosaur who lives in my garage not existing. Therefore scientists must consider it a possibility. They can't prove jack, yo. So awesome that the burden of proof doesn't lie on the person making a claim. We can make our own little fantasy world that people just have to accept.

  • Posted By: lilbz76 @ 10/31/2007 6:23:02 PM

    So many options to choose from, science, god, right, wrong, and everone thinking they have the answer. Well lets start with God, the big cheese, the head honcho. From God we were created, but who created the creator, and that creator, and so on... Science, our self-deluded way of explaning the unexplainable. Look, the only reason that a tree is a tree is cause someone called it that, thats what we know it as, so thats what we call it. But to think that we even come close to having ANY answers to whats REALLY going on in this world or the next, please.... We are a world of billions of INDIVIUALS, single beings, although we are all connected, one giant organism,that is part of our problem. Everyone wants to be right, no one wants to be wrong, so we struggle against each other, we destroy our home with no thought of later, worry about other peoples lives( and I dont mean in a good way). Personally, I know Ive been here before, that Ive lived other lives and had many experinces other than this one, for the simple fact that I know it takes more than one time to get most things right. You think you can get life right in just one pass, HA! Look we all have opinions and ideas, and thats one of the great things about free will. I think we were put here for a reason, that there is a creator, cause the system is way too perfect to be coincidental. But I am also not so sure as to say I believe that is the absolute truth, and will argue with anyone on the point cause I just really dont know, but Im willing to take the ride to find out.! Peace and love to everyone and eveything, enjoy the ride!

    • Posted By: John Igo @ 10/31/2007 6:36:02 PM

      it is not a simple "god made us" or it is all chance! natural selection explains the extreme bio-diversity, look it up before you start talking about it! and phisics is on the verge of discovering, and explaining, the theroy of everything. we are not all one conected being! your points are absurd! your logic is laughable!

      sincerly
      a skeptic

      • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 4:21:19 PM

        Let me ask you this; where did you get the mind that allows you to think logically about all these things? If everything can be explained by science, you got it from evolution, which was a random process of natural selection. So, basically, every thought you think is the result of some micro-organism way, way back billions of years ago that managed not to be eaten by some other micro-organism. You think the thoughts you do because it was naturally inevitable that you do so. In which case, how can anybody say whether anything they think makes any sense beyond themselves? If we are nothing more than a freak result of evolution, the same goes for everything you think. All of human logic becomes nothing more than a byproduct of evolution. Monkeys eat bananas, lions hunt antelope, and humans think. By relying on science to explain your existence, you destroy the very logic that makes it possible for you to think about such things! If your thinking is just the result of evolution, why should you ever suspect that it might really mean something? You've just self-destructed. Now what?

      • Posted By: lilbz76 @ 10/31/2007 10:46:33 PM

        When physics learns the truth about everything, you be sure to let me know, then contact me again in three months when they change their minds, K. This time im out for good.

      • Posted By: lilbz76 @ 10/31/2007 10:20:14 PM

        If you would have read correctly you would know that i wasnt trying to make a point, theres no point in it. It was just boredom and a way to pass the time, I dont really get into debates, cause they end up going no where. Tah- tah

  • Posted By: harlequin @ 10/31/2007 6:28:10 PM

    Hmmm I'm not sure what to believe. I was raised Christian, but that ended when I turned 13. So I don't believe in a Heaven nor Hell, as for ghost's, I am a skeptic, meaning I'll believe one when I see one, however I believe to see something, you have to want to. Which I don't (want to see a ghost) because if theres one thing I remember from the bible it was that getting a visit from an angel or a spirt was a bad thing(more specificly a warning that something needs to change). However now angels are seen as cute. Very odd and confusing for me when I was a child. Well now a days I tend to believe more in science than anything else, but I still know that science can't and will never be able to explain everything, so instead of fighting or speading time thinking up theorys on lifes greatest mysterys I just sit back and say," Ah what a crazy yet wonderful world we live in." And if I do ever seea ghost well I'll just add it to all of my life experiences,and if there is an after-life and I do go to Heaven or Hell then I'll just add it to my after-life experiences.

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 4:12:48 PM

      Not so (about the angel visits, I mean). The two major angel visitations in the Bible are to Joseph, warning him not to divorce Mary, and to Mary, announcing she was going to give birth to the Messiah. Frightening, I'm sure, but hardly bad things. Other visitations--to Abraham before the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah (the point of which was to reaffirm Abraham's faith in God's, and so was not a bad thing), to the prophets (for the purposes of revealing God's word, which can be seen either way), to Zechariah (regarding the birth of his son John, another good thing), and so on. The only outright negative apparition of a spirit, as far as I can recall, was to Saul (who was consulting a witch at the time, so what else would you expect...)

      If you're open to the possibility of the supernatural, as it appears you are, I'd suggest you read Miracles by C.S. Lewis. It's a very good explanation of the logical and philosophical reasons Christians have for believing in the supernatural. I do warn you, it's pretty intense reasoning to follow, but if you take time to follow along and think it through Lewis makes some very good sense. At the very least, it would be a good mental exercise.

  • Posted By: Mil820 @ 10/31/2007 7:54:25 PM

    First of all...tanita..."made in the image of God" is not literal. God is omnipresent therefore he cannot be flesh and bones. Second of all, what you all are calling ghosts are demons messing with your head. Demons I believe are very real, the Bible talks alot about demons. There is no mention of ghosts, only references to peoples souls/spirits, but only in reference to going to heaven or hell, not staying on the earth. When someone dies, their spirit doesn't stick around to freak people out or whatever. I understand people grasping for those things when someone dies, but it's nothing more than a feeling and feelings are unreliable. Our feelings our irrational and they change. No direspect, you are all entitled to your opinions. The world would be a boring place if we all believed in the same things.

    • Posted By: thereal yeti @ 10/31/2007 10:17:42 PM

      Just curious...

      Where does it say in the bible, that god is omnipresent, and all knowing? Both attributes are thrown at god by "believers" but there isn't even scriptual "proof" for this

      • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 3:58:57 PM

        As for God's omnipresence, here's a couple of scriptural references:

        "And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." (Matthew 28:20b)

        A somewhat less positive spin on it:

        "Though they dig down to the depths of the grave, from there my hand will take them. Though they climb up to the heavens, from there I will bring them down. Though they hide themselves on the top of Carmel, there I will hunt them down and seize them. Though they hide from me at the bottom of the sea, there I will command the serpent to bite them. Though they are driven into exile by their enemies, there will I command the sword to slay them." (Amos 9:2-4)

        Also this one:

        "Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee from your presence? If I go up to the heavens, you are there; if I make my bed in the depths you are there. If I rise on the wings of the dawn, if I settle on the far side of the sea, even there your hand will guide me, your right hand will hold me fast." (Psalm 139: 7-10)

        From these and other similar verses, theologians deduce the Christian doctrine of God's omnipresence. As for God's all-knowingness (or omniscience), this is firstly a logical deduction. If God created the universe, it stands to reason that God would know everything about it. Who understood lightbulbs better than Thomas Edison? Who would know more about what Plato wrote than Plato? But besides it being logical, there is also scriptural proof.

        "But the LORD said to Samuel, 'Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The LORD does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart.'" (1 Samuel 16:7)

        "O LORD, you have searched me and you know me. You know when I sit and when I rise; you perceive my thoughts from afar. You discern my going out and my lying down; you are familiar with all my ways. Before a word is on my tongue you know it completely, O LORD." (Psalm 139: 1-4)

        These are just some examples of relevant passages. The doctrines of God's omnipresence and omniscience are synthesized from all such passages to be found in the Bible. I can look up some more for you if you're interested.

  • Posted By: josephjohnson55555 @ 10/31/2007 8:12:45 PM

    If you are oppressed or possesed by a demon or demons, you need to go to a Catholic Priest, who will initially help you and if needed he will refer you to an exoricist priest assigned by the Bishop of your particular Diocese. The Catholic Church was instituted by Jesus and commissioned by Him, and has been around for 2000 years. Since the Catholic Church was founded by Jesus, it alone has the authority given by Christ to expel demons. While Protestant "Bible" churches may help in some cases by invoking the holy name of Jesus in prayer, thet lack the Saramental authority of the Catholic excorcist priests who work under the commision and authority of a Bishop, the successors of the Apostles.

    • Posted By: etepen @ 10/31/2007 8:30:17 PM

      Why does God allow innocent people to become possessed by demons?

      • Posted By: Jsnyder6@students.depaul.edu @ 10/31/2007 8:45:32 PM

        An innocent person or a faith believing person? What do you consider innocent? We all have sinned under God, but, an innocent person to you can be an unbelieving person, that defies God.

        • Posted By: etepen @ 10/31/2007 8:53:19 PM

          Good point. Let me clarify. What about small children?

          • Posted By: josephjohnson55555 @ 10/31/2007 9:24:44 PM

            Noone is completely innocent. We are all born with original sin. But your point is a 4 year old is without personal sin. Problem with this example is that I have read seceral books and many articles on exorcisms and posessions, and the youngest person who was possesed or oppresed by demions that I ever read was 13 years old, which is well after the age of 7, which is the commonly accepted age of reason whereby one could sin. Irregardless if you read into the subject you will fiond that some people are "innocent" in that they did nothing to bring the demonic possesion onto themselves. (ie like oujia boards, necromancy, or the like. In theses cases it is supposed that God allows it for His greater glory in that along with the exorcist priest, many people will pray and intercede for the person, and the person is eventually "freed" . The person is the stakes. The battle is between God, His angels and the Saints, and Satan and the fallen angels (demons). It is quite a LESSON for those who have seen or experienced it. And regarding innocence, Jesus was completely innocent and without sin. Yet He suffered for all of humanity. Likewise the relatively "innocent" may too suffer at times, for the sake of others. In the end, God allows it to manifest His power and to convert the doubting Thomases.

            • Posted By: thereal yeti @ 10/31/2007 10:15:53 PM

              original sin=

              God still made about what some primitive man and woman did...

              How would they know about evil, and that defying god was bad before they ate from that tree of knowledge?

              Why is god so pity that he is still mad at me for something i did not do?

              • Posted By: wox337 @ 10/31/2007 10:38:39 PM

                Well I think (I'm Christian but not very spiritually mature) that God already warned Adam and Eve to NOT eat the fruit from the tree. It was a direct order and so forth.
                That's why we go to church, attend fellowships and study the bible.. to learn more about God and strengthen our faith.
                It's really hard for Christians to try and "preach" the religion online..
                And those who run around screaming "repent or burn in hell" don't help either.

                • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 3:42:32 PM

                  "And those who run around screaming "repent or burn in hell" don't help either.

                  I commiserate, my friend. :) Stuck between Scylla and Charybdis.

              • Posted By: josephjohnson55555 @ 10/31/2007 10:29:19 PM

                Firstly God told Adam and Eve not to eat of that particular tree.....they had to be able to use the free will that He gave them...they had to choose to obey God or not.
                Secondly He is not "mad" at us for something we did not do. It is simply the cionsequences of the original sins of the first persons with a soul.....hence the "original sin". Anyway, He Himself hung on a Cross so we can be reconciled with Him. Now that is Love and that is forgiveness.

  • Posted By: palealeduck @ 10/31/2007 8:55:54 PM

    Science is quite unlike religion. Religions don't allow you to change your mind based on further evidence, or at least in theory they are supposed to be absolute (which they clearly are not). Science is never absolute; it is an ongoing process. As some one already pointed out, it does not function to "explain things away". The word "prove" is never found in peer reviewed scientific literature; only mathematics. Science is a conjecture of a given subject based on observable evidence. Where's the evidence?... One of the best treatments on this subject is given by Dr. Carl Sagan in his book, "Demon Haunted World". Here is a quote, which may apply to our current era sometime in the future:

    "Microbiology and meterology now explain what only a few centuries ago was considered sufficient cause to burn women to death."

    And those executions were sanctioned by your churches.

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 3:37:35 PM

      No, science doesn't serve to explain things away. Which is why when articles like this use it do so, you shouldn't take it all that seriously.

      Religion, properly handled, certainly should permit you to change your mind based on further evidence. That some people refuse to be flexible is not a case against religion itself, anymore than some people's mistreatment of science should be a case against science.

  • Posted By: Willie J @ 10/31/2007 9:01:01 PM

    Several reigions believe that the univers is nothing more than a dream of a god. That god must have eaten one hell of a nasty burrito before dreaming up this universe!

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 3:34:46 PM

      Well, thank God we're not just a dream, ladies and gentlemen. :) Much more significant than that.

    • Posted By: Cap'n Rita @ 10/31/2007 9:14:15 PM

      Too funny! I love it-explains a very great deal!

  • Posted By: vancecrofoot @ 10/31/2007 9:49:09 PM

    That's a weak argument tpandtp.
    Many religions make you life a life in a way that is not natral to us human mammals. My grandfather told me on his deathbed that he wished he wouldn't have lived a 'boring religious life'.
    Remember, the bible was written by man. Use guilt and rewards (everlasting life) and you can control millions (and take their money in the process!)

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 3:08:32 PM

      Speaking of weak arguments...

      Let's consider just what motives man might have had in writing the Bible. Moses, traditional author of the first five books, gave up a royal life in the world's greatest civilization at the time to lead a ragtag band of complaining, disorderly, uncivilized hooligans through a desert. I bet he wasn't too concerned with money. The prophets were abused, insulted, disbelieved, detested, imprisoned, and murdered. The authors of the Gospels, with one exception, were persecuted, imprisoned, and executed for what they wrote and preached, as was Paul, who wrote most of the New Testament. Since then, men have been tortured and murdered for the Bible. Selfish people bent on power and material wealth do not put themselves through this kind of emotional and physical agony, and they certainly don't die for it. If you're going to object to the validity of the Bible, you're going to have to come up with a more credible argument than that.

    • Posted By: roselking @ 10/31/2007 10:39:31 PM

      I'm sure the Jews of 2-4 thousand years ago are really concerned with taking your money.

  • Posted By: littlelady @ 11/01/2007 12:54:56 PM

    My mother always told me of a time in her childhood when she moved to Colorado for a yr or so with her aunt, uncle and cousins. They would be working there ad as part of the contract hy were given a house to live in during their stay. From the moment they arrived the man who was giving them the keys to the house, warned them in a joking way about how they house was suppose to be haunted after a family was murdered there.I scared them a little, but the huge house with the enormous yard around it took that all away.As a matter of fact, the property was so big that the next house may have been about a mile away.To make the long story short, during their stay they began to experience things.One night someone knocked on the girls' door, when they looked under the door to see whose feet where there, th saw nothing as they continued to hear the knock. As soon as the adults of the house were gone, these creepy things continued to happen. One day while the children were alone in a restroom underground doing chores, they heard the dishes moving from upstairs and the radio turning on and off. You see, they wanted to do their chores asap every time they were alone so that they could then run out of the house and wait for their parents there.It was just too scary being in there alone. Well the day that they were in the underground restroom it only got worse.They heard footsteps coming down the stairs..and soon someone trying to go in. They yelled and screamed, crying and waling as far back as they could from that door. Before you know it they were all huddled in a tub chanting "cross cross, let the devil leave and Jesus come".. repeatedly they said this and suddenly..it stopped.For months my mom and her cousins experienced things similar to this, and of course her aunt never believed them. That is until the day they packed and left. Ill have u know my mother and her cousin wore clothes they found boxes in the attic.. boys and girls clothes.. maybe thats why they were upset...haha jk... ANYWAY.. they were driving away from the house excited they were leaving this horrific place.. my mom's aunt was sitting with the children in the back of a truck with a camper over it.. the kid began to wave at the house saying"bye house. we'll never see you again"...suddenly four figures appeared at the window.two adults and two children..they were white glary figures that just stood there and waved at them.This is when the aunt believed and knocked on the window so her husband would stop and go back... but they never did. Till this day, when my mother watches
    horror movies with "ghost" figures...she gets goosebumps...she swears that is exactly like the ghosts she saw. Either way... I feel this wasn???t a family who still hung around... just the devil wanting us to believe that.

  • Posted By: littlelady @ 11/01/2007 12:54:37 PM

    now..this article makes sense in my opinion and I can see how it can make sense in many cases, The thing is that it is not in all cases. While I dont believe that one can linger around on earth after death, I do believe there are evil spirits who can sometimes deceive us into believing we have seen a loved one for example. In the bible there is a story of a king who visited a medium to speak to a dead friend in order to get info....story goes that in the end he discovers that he had really spoke to a demon disguised as his friend. I believe this is so even today.It is the devil's job to make us believe in the things God does not want us to believe.. in this case God is clear about what happens to our conscious when we die... it ceases until judgment day. This things we experience are part of the devil's strategies to get us to believe and sometimes even trust these spirits. How many cases have we seen where people commit the most horrible crimes or suicides based on hearing voices that say the should do it for the glory of God?..........continued

  • Posted By: Shirleymoates @ 11/01/2007 9:55:36 AM

    Posted in answer to: frodogenic???s comment @ 10/31/2007 11:41:49 PM that (That which does not belong to the natural world cannot be understood by studying the natural world)
    I used to agree with you butllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;;by the help of some other expositors of the Bible I know this is Not quite true???because The Principles of the Spiritual world were understood by the centurion by the things which he observed in the physical world???in that he was able to give orders and they were obeyed in the realm of his authority ???so he extrapolated??? from that that things ought to operate in the spiritual world like they do in the physical world. ie???if I give an order in the natural world it is obeyed because I am the absolute boss of 100 soldiers so I deduct /deduce from that that if you Jesus, whom I have heard by report to be obviously the absolute boss of things unseeable and untouchable, give an order to these invisible minions, they will obey you??? just as my soldiers obey me. So???only say the word he said???and I believe my servant shall be healed!!???
    ??? Matthew 8:7 And Jesus said unto him [the centurion], I will come and heal him.
    8 [He] answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that You should come under my roof???: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
    9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goes and to another, Come, and he comes; and to my servant, Do this, and he does it.

    • Posted By: frodogenic @ 11/01/2007 12:46:11 PM

      Quite true. I wasn't saying that the supernatural can't be understand on the basis of some things we observe in the physical world. If you look into it, we think of everything in terms of the physical world. Things we can't see, we understand by comparing them to things we can see. This, however, is not science. This is logic. By study of the natural world, I meant empirical science. What the centurion is doing in the passage you cited is comparing things he can't see/experience to things he has seen/experienced. That's a connection of meaning; it's a strictly logical operation, and it's how we come by the whole idea of meaning. You could hardly understand the supernatural in any other way at all, if you couldn't compare it to things you saw and experienced. Science isn't a comparison, however; science is a direct investigation of something based on the five natural senses (which may augmented with various devices). The centurion didn't see Jesus interacting with the spirit world, didn't hear it, smell it, touch it, taste it. He thought about it and a made a deduction, purely on logic and comparison.

      The point I'm trying to make is, strict empirical science can neither prove nor disprove supernatural things, because it has no method of observing the data--just like science can't prove a historical fact. A scientific truth must be observable and repeatable in experimentation. Neither of those things is true for historical fact, yet we are no less certain that there really was a Julius Caesar or a Genghis Khan, right? It's the same way with the supernatural. You've got to have other types of evidence for it. Enter experience and reason, both of which are illustrated in action in the passage you cited.

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 12:18:37 PM

    Cont'd...

    The Celtic order of Druids worshiped Samhain, lord of the dead, as well as a sun-god to whom the horse was sacred. Using a lunar calendar, the Celts divided the year into two seasons???the dark winter months and the light summer months. On the full moon nearest Nov 1, the Celts celebrated the festival of Samhain, meaning ???Summer???s End.???
    It was believed that on the festival of Samhain, the veil between the human and the supernatural worlds was parted and spirits, both good and evil, roamed the earth. The souls of the dead were thought to return to their homes, and families would put out food and drink for their ghostly visitors in hopes of appeasing them and warding off misfortune. Thus, today when children dressed as ghosts or witches go from house to house demanding a Halloween treat or threatening a mischievous trick, they unwittingly perpetuate the ancient rituals of Samhain. Jean Markale comments in his book Halloween, histoire et traditions (Halloween???History and Traditions): ???In receiving something in their hands, they establish, on a symbolic level that they do not understand, a brotherly exchange between the visible and the invisible worlds. That is why the Halloween masquerades . . . are in fact sacred ceremonies.???

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 12:00:06 PM

    Cont'd...

    Since people believed that the barriers between the physical and supernatural realms were down, they thought that humans were able to cross over into the spirit world with ease. Samhain was therefore a particularly auspicious time to unlock the secrets of the future. Apples or hazelnuts, both viewed as products of sacred trees, were used to divine information concerning marriage, sickness, and death. For example, apples with identifying marks were placed in a tub of water. By seizing an apple using only the mouth, a young man or woman was supposed to be able to identify his or her future spouse. This divination practice survives today in the Halloween game of bobbing for apples.
    Samhain was also characterized by drunken revelry and a casting aside of inhibitions. ???Traditional values, if not flouted, were reversed,??? states Markale. ???What was forbidden was allowed, and what was allowed was forbidden.??? Halloween still reflects this spirit today, which no doubt accounts to a great extent for its increasing popularity. Commenting on this, The Encyclopedia of Religion describes Halloween nowadays as ???a time when adults can also cross cultural boundaries and shed their identities by indulging in an uninhibited evening of frivolity. Thus, the basic Celtic quality of the festival as an evening of annual escape from normal realities and expectations has remained into the twentieth century.???

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 11:58:47 AM

    Cont'd...
    Samhain was also characterized by drunken revelry and a casting aside of inhibitions. ???Traditional values, if not flouted, were reversed,??? states Markale. ???What was forbidden was allowed, and what was allowed was forbidden.??? Halloween still reflects this spirit today, which no doubt accounts to a great extent for its increasing popularity. Commenting on this, The Encyclopedia of Religion describes Halloween nowadays as ???a time when adults can also cross cultural boundaries and shed their identities by indulging in an uninhibited evening of frivolity. Thus, the basic Celtic quality of the festival as an evening of annual escape from normal realities and expectations has remained into the twentieth century.???
    Following the potato famine in the 19th century, Irish immigrants took Halloween and its customs to the United States. From there it has returned to Europe in the past few years.
    Church representatives in France have expressed concern over the decline of these traditional Catholic holidays in favor of Halloween, seeing it as a sign of the ???paganization of society.??? For Stanislas Lalanne, spokesman for France???s Conference of Catholic Bishops, Halloween ???distorts the meaning of life and death.??? The bishop of Nice, Jean Bonfils, stated that ???this festival and its rituals have nothing to do with our Mediterranean and Christian culture,??? and he warned Catholics against ???the most important festival of Satanists the world over.???

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 11:46:23 AM

    Cont'd...

    Commenting on the French abandonment of Catholic traditions for such pagan festivals, Hippolyte Simon, bishop of Clermont-Ferrand, notes: ???It is as if French society were looking for a kind of civil religion capable of replacing Christian symbolism.??? He writes: ???At Halloween the dead are imitated and their ???ghosts??? come back to frighten us and threaten us with death. On All Saints??? Day, in contrast, we affirm that the departed are alive and that we are promised to rejoin them in the City of God.??????Vers une France pa??enne? (Toward a Pagan France?)
    In a similar vein, Carlo Maria Martini, cardinal of Milan, Italy, urged Italians not to abandon Catholic holidays, declaring that Halloween is ???alien to our tradition, which has immense value and must be continued. All Souls??? Day is a celebration that belongs to our history. It is the moment in which hope for eternal life unfolds, a moment in which the Lord makes us understand that there is more to life than that on earth.??? Many sincere Catholics no doubt feel the same way. Yet, is the distinction between Halloween and All Souls??? Day as clear-cut as these comments would lead us to believe? What does a close examination of the roots of these Catholic holidays reveal?

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 11:40:02 AM

    WHY CAN'T I POST THE REST OF MY COMMENT I STARTED EXPLAINING THE ORIGIN OF GHOSTS???

  • Posted By: Original Blondie @ 11/01/2007 11:35:42 AM

    Whay can't I post something????

  • Posted By: JadePersuasian @ 11/01/2007 10:50:03 AM

    For those interested in viewing a true life encounter......

    Discovery Channel - Series : A Haunting "Casa de los Muertos" - a documentary on one of Guitarist Eddie Benitez's hauntings in Arizona.
    Nov 17, 2007 Saturday - Disc Channel - 4pm EST
    Nov 27, 2007, Tuesday - Disc Channel - 2pm EST

    Gold Album Jazz "Mystery Man", Eddie Benitez; his first concert was at the Madison Square Garden in front of 20,000 fans of Latin/Jazz. Also, performing with such greats as Barry White, George Benson, and more... to be on Discovery Channel, premiering his extraordinary life.

    "Fans claiming to see angels on stage"...., Legendary guitarist Eddie Benitez played in a private show in Phoenix AZ, this was the topic of discussion by several people in attendance after the show in 2003.

    The mystery of Eddie Benitez started in 1976 when he signed with Fania/CBS records, with his first release "Nightlife" at age 14, 6 months later another hit, "Essence of Life", both went gold as he performed/mentored with legendary stars, Tito Puente, Mongo Santamaria and many others, throughout his young music career.

    His performing career came to a sudden halt when Eddie was diagnosed with Hodgkins at a young age of 23. This changed his life forever as he survived the cancer and took time off to reflect on life and spirituality. He continued to write music over the years. His music is a blend of Smooth Jazz, NewAge, and Latin written from his heart that filled with love, passion, and devotion. Throughout his life, Eddie has had many spiritual visions while overcoming a heart attack and an unexplained 3 day coma. Eddie was under investigation for massive healings in his Florida home. "There is no healer, but faith in God, Christ and in yourself" Eddie told the investigators.

    One of Eddie's spiritual hauntings was documented and recreated for the Discovery Channel series "A Haunting" - Casa de los Muertos". The special show will be featuring Eddie's music from past to present. Collaboration with Reknown guitarist, Paul "Sequence Ferguson" on a couple of Eddie's new tracks. His son, Julian Sosa will be portraying Eddie's oldest son in the show.

    Dec 2008, New CD "Lover's Never say Good-bye" to be released. The new hit single, "They Cry" available for download.

    Visit Eddie Benitez, Julian Sosa and Paul "Sequence" Ferguson at MySpace -

    http://myspace.com/eddiebenitez
    http://myspace.com/juliansosa
    http://myspace.com/paulquotsequencequotferguson

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