Just Say Maybe

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  • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 12/06/2007 2:58:15 PM

    "Abstinence-only sex education" is a contradiction in terms. Only when the government stops trying to force its "morality" on everyone by forcing ignorance on the population will this unfortunate trend begin to reverse. Putting young girls in a position where they lack crucial information, and end up pregnant as a result, does all of us a disservice. Ignorance is NEVER the answer; FACTS are. I choose to educate my children, but I'm very sad for those kids whose parents lack the information, the time, the ability or the rational viewpoint necessary to impart facts instead of religious dogma. We can fix this, but only if we keep religion out of the public sphere. Flame on!

    • Posted By: marketwatcher16 @ 12/07/2007 4:06:19 PM

      yes yes yes and YES! Amen - you are right on!!!!!

  • Posted By: marketwatcher16 @ 12/07/2007 4:03:33 PM

    Gee, let me think... not teaching birth control methods doesn't help control birth...hmm. Who'da thunk it?

  • Posted By: CorbinB2 @ 12/07/2007 2:49:35 PM

    Well there is quite the variety of opinions, although the strongest ones are the typical bury your head in the sand types. Let's face facts, young people are going to have sex whether we tell them they can or can't. The fact is THEY will choose to do it less if they are informed and even if they still do anyway, they will be far more likely to do so 'protected' if they are informed.

    Wouldn't it be interesting to know from these young people themselves, why they actually had sex? My guess is that at least half of them would answer something to the effect of 'because I wanted to know what it was like'. Education is the key and that means the good and the bad. When YOU decide to educate your child in this manner is up to you, but sooner is always better than later and pretending it won't or isn't happening on some level already is certainly not the answer.

    Whatever your position on abortion is, ignorance about the reason for abortion is not going to do anyone any good. Having an open relationship with your kids is important as well in all of this and that can start today if it hasn't already. Be blunt and ask your kids if they have heard about, are having or knwo of other kids having sex. Wouldn't you rather know? Let them know they can talk to you about it and then wait for them to do so and they will. Telling kids no didn't work in the days of old and has only proven to make them do it anyway.

  • Posted By: Notafool @ 12/07/2007 2:26:46 PM

    Throughout history the teaching of abstinence, the outright ordering of it, has always met with the direct opposite effect. Humans have always rejected this manner of control, - even priests can???t do it, and abuse children.

    Somewhere common sense has to step in and tell the so-called ???moral??? groups that if you cant get your ???values??? force fed into people at church, then maybe your ways of doing things is NOT the smarter way of slowing the rate of teen pregnancies and abortions. Further diluting public schools with more religious junk will only serve to drive the USA further away from being the smartest country on earth.
    Fear never works, ignorance never works, control never works, and ???abstinence only??? no matter how much resources and money you throw at it will ever work ether.

    If you listen to any of the people on here who talk ???morals??? on here, it???s not about stopping the pregnancies or abortions; it???s the furthering of THEIR religion, its teachings, and its control is ALL they truly want.

  • Posted By: Notafool @ 12/07/2007 2:14:01 PM

    Throughout history the teaching of abstinence, the outright ordering of it, has always met with the direct opposite effect. Humans have always rejected this manner of control, - even priests can???t do it, and abuse children. Somewhere common sense has to step in and tell the so-called ???moral??? groups that if you cant get your ???values??? force fed into people at church, then maybe your ways of doing things is NOT the smarter way of slowing the rate of teen pregnancies. Further diluting public schools with religious will only serve to drive the USA further away from being the smartest country on earth.
    Fear never works, ignorance never works, control never works, and ???abstinence only??? no matter how much resources and money you throw at it will ever work ether.

  • Posted By: pinget @ 12/07/2007 9:52:47 AM

    People have sex. They like it alot and consider it fun. This is a normal healthy part of human nature. Let's work with that instead of against it.

  • Posted By: nikfreckles @ 12/07/2007 9:47:47 AM

    first of all teens know what their doing when having sex. They think of the moment not the consequences. Also a lot of girls don't even respect themselves. I personally am a virgin (im 18 yrs. old) and i plan to stay that way til marriage. Its hard but I always think of the consequences like get an STD or getting pregnant. Also I know right now I am not ready for a child thats the main reason. If your not ready for a child you shouldn't be having sex anyway.

  • Posted By: chotii@oz.net @ 12/07/2007 1:11:59 AM

    There are a number of things I think about, when it comes to 'sex education'. If it doesn't include telling girls that many boys will push, and push, and push, and keep pushing until 'no' becomes 'yes'.....and if it doesn't tell girls that the closer they are to being fertile, the more sex will appeal to them.....and if it doesn't tell boys AND girls that the more aroused they get, the less they'll be able to THINK and make rational decisions rather than hormone-driven ones (not dissimilar to alcohol and drugs - add those in, and who has a chance of thinking that maybe this isn't a good idea right now?)......then it's doing the kids a disservice.

    If it doesn't say that lots and lots of ADULT women get pregnant despite using contraceptive methods, up to and including surgical sterilization, CORRECTLY.....then it's doing the kids a disservice. I think every "sex ed" class should have an OB/GYN come in and talk about cases he or she has seen - the couples who get pregnant despite both of them having been fixed, the couples who get pregnant despite using 2 or 3 contraceptive methods correctly and concurrently...the women with PCOS who have been told by some other doctor that they can't get pregnant,...and do.....the 49 year olds who should be well past fertility, and have a surprise just about the time their youngest child graduates HS.....Biology doesn't give a damn if a pregnancy is convenient. Biology wants us to reproduce, and will go to amazing lengths to make it happen. And that's despite efforts to avoid it. How much greater the risk to young, highly fertile people? An OB is the BEST person to explain these risks. Because folks, that's part of reality, and the OBs are in the trenches every day.

    The only way I found to avoid sex was to avoid the situations that would lead to it. Because once my hormones took over my brain...saying 'no' was the hardest thing I ever did. And it felt like self-punishment. Alas, how are you going to convince horny teenagers to avoid sexually-charged situations, when they WANT sex? And how can you convince them that yes, even properly-used contraceptives fail on a frighteningly regular basis? If you think saying "here, use a condom" is going to help....well, good luck to you.

  • Posted By: Mwalimu @ 12/07/2007 1:10:30 AM

    As a recently retired English teacher, and having taught for a nearly a quarter century in the same inner city high school in south Los Angeles I can only say a-men to Heather Boonstra's statement that students who are taught the ABC???s about sex (ABstain if you can, Condom if you can???t) are more likely to abstain or delay sex and less likely to get pregnant or spread STD's. Study after study proves the same thing. Since I was also the journalism advisor at my school, my students occasionally wanted to write about sex. I encouraged them to do so as long as the articles they published were accurate and professional. Without exception, I was proud of the mature, responsible, and intelligent way my students handled this topic. (A far cry from the typical stereotypes of inner city public schools, I might add.) I can only add the following advice. If you want teenagers to do the right thing, tell them truth. Armed with knowledge and nurtured with love and understanding, teenagers, for the most part, will not let you down.

  • Posted By: yomal @ 12/06/2007 9:47:58 PM

    Americans, use condoms. They work (if you use them right). STDs can make you infertile and worse. Abstinence is good but youth is about experimenting, so they will. The kids must be pretty confused by the mixed messages, from your over-sexualised media to your abstinence-only attitude towards them. Abortion is not good but neither is poverty.

  • Posted By: kimike @ 12/06/2007 8:30:02 PM

    come on people I can not even believe this is an article. does anyone know what your kids are doing..."oh not my johny or jane" come on people open your eyes, ive already typed this once and it didnt post so im going to be short, i guess that is best cause im heated over this. lets start, what are your kids seeing with their own eyes, "BRATZ" come on, those toys belong in the local porn store, not on a shelf with an age group posting on them, hollywood, dont get me startes, (britney, hilton, lohan and gang) are sure making a good example for our children with the whole look my baby is my new chiwawa step. why is this article questioning birthrates up? I am no PRUDE, I am a parent, my children are young, not teenagers, and I am the "father" not the mother. Was i sexually active at 15, sure was, and so were my friends, and so were you. think, is your child home by themselve without you? does your child go to their friends house? do they go to the movies with boys/girls? come on, you all did it, sexually active doesnt start with the "ACT" it starts way before that...oh thats right, the "lewinsky" isnt really sex anymore is it? does it spread desease? sure does. worse does it lead to the little game "LEST JUST PUT IN THE TIP". you all know exactly what Im talking about, the issue, no one wants to really grow up and say the truth, and say, Jane your not going to dress like a slut anymore, you might as well not even wear anything if your going to wear so little. Johny, that teen mag i bought you that shows women in their undies and less, im not going to get that for you anymore because "ITS NOT GOOOOOOOD". you all know it is going on, have you been outside lately? been to the mall lately? most of the "young girls" look like they belong in a porn magazine, and if you say that im stretching it, your blind and should be slapped!!! and let me guess the next word, "people should be able to dress anyway they want without being looked at like a piece of meat" UNTRUE. has NEVER BEEN TRUE and NEVER WILL BE TRUE, we are just as much animal as we are human, and for you woman who dont belive that and think their daughter should wear what ever they want, try walking behind them in the mall about 20 feet, and see what happens!!! and then think about walking about 20 feet behind them pushing a stroller. poeple need to grow up and get a backbone. again, sex starts before the act, we all know it, we all did it. blame something, blame yourself.

  • Posted By: kimike @ 12/06/2007 8:15:11 PM

    I tell you what, has anyone seen TV lately, has anyone seen the "BRATZ", Hollywood (Britney, Hilton, Lohan, and the gang), the baby is the new chiwawa to these people. Can you blame the kids, or the bush administration? should we blame society? cellphones, myspace, facebook...there is no control here, the average parent doesnt know how to control the internet let alone block content and if they would they would be ridiculed for it. Who says there are "very few" 15 year olds that are sexually active. I think not, I think the "lewinsky" is not though of so much as being "sexually active" anymore. and lets not talk about TV shows, they have games on them now, Desperate house wives, dirty sexy money, las vegas, anything on VH1, and most of the rest of the crap, Im not a prude, I dont have older kids, I am not even a woman, I am a man, a father of 2 soon to be 3 children, and i think most of the "entertainment" in this country is crap. The actors (male and female) are crap, the toys are worse, Im not getting my child a bratz doll which belongs in the prostitute section of an adult shop. was I sexually active at 15? sure was, as well as most of my friends, were we having "SEX" not that many of us, but once again, this article is about having children right, lets not forget that the act starts way before the "ACT", having your kids in a situation of being alone, of the "lets just put it in game", i mean come on, we all know this stuff, this is terrible we are even reading that this is an issue. have we seen the stuff that our kids are wearing to school? Has anyone been to the mall lately and tried not to notice that the young, and im talking young girls look like they should be in a porn mag. and i guess the parents should work on that, they sure should....im finished and fed up, the fact that this is an issue and we dont know what to do, .... come on.!!!

  • Posted By: caf_florida @ 12/06/2007 8:11:18 PM

    25 years ago I became a single parent. The "man" who assisted me wasn't interested in parenthood or me once I began showing and had no interest in an abortion. I was on birth control but there wasn't as much advertised about the impact of antibiotics on birth control back then. My family though upset about my single status supported my decision to keep my child. I had a good job, some college education and health insurance. I would not wish the life of a single parent on anyone from the point of the stress, the attitudes of people (because if you were a single mother 25 yrs ago - it was obviously because you were lacking in morals). I made the decision I was not going to be a label and that was NOT going to define me. I spent 25 years providing love, security, stability and discipline for that child, now a young woman who has a great career and brought me endless pride. I stayed near my family so she had her extended family around her, I was a girl scout leader, a sunday school teacher (yes they let me back in the church), a member of the PTA board and at all times a supportive parent. Being a single parent is alot about sacrifice. If you are not willing to make sacrifices and put your child first, you have no business having and keeping a child.

  • Posted By: theQ @ 12/06/2007 7:20:58 PM

    Most of the births are what people would lable minorities...and most of them came from other countries..and as in the countries from whence they came, those countries are overpopulated. They bring their uneducated habbits to the US and will overpopulate this country into poverty....stupid breeds stupid...so just keep letting them in. So stop with your "physco" babel on trying to figure it out

    • Posted By: Isabo @ 12/06/2007 8:03:18 PM

      You are right - stupid breeds stupid. Why don't you learn how to spell (habbits? physco??) before you accuse other people of being stupid. You have illustrated your own point.

  • Posted By: theQ @ 12/06/2007 7:13:56 PM

    its all really easy to see "why" look at the ethnic group having most of the babies...and you'll see that the country that most of these people come from have no sence in birth control..overpopulate and wonder why they dont have enuff to eat.Stupid breeds stupid..and facts are facts whether you like them not...so quit with all your nonsence trying to figure it out.

    • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 12/06/2007 7:50:59 PM

      Wow. Just wow. I'm amazed that you can see the keyboard through the holes in your white sheet. Looked at the pregnancy rates among white red-state Christian teens lately? The article said that the highest increases are among blacks - what country do you think they came from? (Oh - that's right - it's not about nationality, is it?)

  • Posted By: temple @ 12/06/2007 2:59:58 PM

    Have any adults been to a high school/middle high lately. Do you see the clothes these girls wear? do you think maybe MTV/VHI might have something to do with it? Or lets talk about the sitcom shows as well. The parents on these sitcoms, which is viewed by a lot of teens, are not good examples. It is too hard for these kids to follow abstinence education when they are bombarded with sex on comercials, television shows, movies and music. Maybe we should start blaming the parents for not monitoring the television, movies and music these kids listen too. As parents we should have a right to have the option to send our kids to an abstinence education class. Obvioulsy the CONDOMS that eveyone seems to want to shove in the kids face still are not working--why? Because you are dealing with kids not mature enough to be responsible with them. But laws are being passed that give these kids options that only adults should be making. What are we thinking?????

    • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 12/06/2007 3:07:31 PM

      "temple," you are part of the problem. Kids will find one another attractive, not because of what they wear, but because, like the rest of us, they're primates. Sexual maturity comes about regardless of what kids are or are not allowed to watch, and the condoms aren't working because, where they are available, they aren't accompanied by any meaningful education. You did say one thing I agree with: parents should have the option to indoctrinate their children about the myth of "abstinence only," but only as an adjunct to the comprehensive, reality-based sex education that should be given to all children.

      • Posted By: dckitty7 @ 12/06/2007 4:51:44 PM

        I hope you're not saying this "reality-based sex education" should be taught to all children, but that you meant it should be offered to all children. I, for one, don't want you or the government choosing how my children should be educated about sex. I would prefer the government stay out of it altogether, but they have to be involved what's wrong with offering both choices to parents? By the way, this "reality-based sex ed" should include all the gory pictures of stds and abortions and statistics regarding low birth-weight, how often the fathers stick around, etc. along with the teaching of anatomy.

        • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 12/06/2007 5:33:25 PM

          No, I meant that comprehensive sex education should be taught to all children, just as evolution and the Crusades should be taught to ALL children. Parents can spend their evenings indoctrinating their children in hate, lies and fantasy, but we have an obligation to ourselves as a society to provide our children - ALL our children - with facts. In general principles, I don't oppose the teaching of the social BS that goes along with sex (e.g. absentee sperm donors, and the recriminations of narrow-minded puritans), but the bit about "gory abortions" is a little hysterical. Leave that for "Hell House" at the local Baptist megachurch. Unless, that is, you want to be REALLY comprehensive, and teach the Kama Sutra as well...

          • Posted By: dckitty7 @ 12/06/2007 5:43:40 PM

            Talk about narrow-minded. I don't know why you think I'm some kind of puritan, but I would be open to teaching from the Kama Sutra, Song of Solomon, Joy of Sex, etc. While you are for compelling the teaching of such sex education, I simply want parents to be the ones to choose what their children are taught as far as sex concerned. I'm for more choice, not less, as you seem to be.

            • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 12/06/2007 7:47:57 PM

              I'm for more choice, too - just not the ability of parents to choose ignorance for their children, who did nothing to deserve such a disservice.

  • Posted By: trying to teach @ 12/06/2007 5:06:20 PM

    Ok, here are my two cents. I am a high school teacher, in our highschool we do not have a sex ed class in our highschool, we service a small southwest community where there are all levels of socioeconomic classes I watch these young people all day long, I overhear thier conversations, see what they think is "cool" and actually talk to them to see exactly what they are thinking...not just about this subject but all areas of life. I have had many a pregnant young lady in my classroom, some of the fathers are around some arent. What I have found is that society makes alot of this permisable unless a strong parent figure interceeds. What I mean by this is that I have had students come up and ask if they can throw the mom to be a baby shower in my room, or I have recieved invitations to baby showers thrown by the happy grandma, aunite, god mother to be. We have made having a baby look easy and fun, they get to wear cute maternity clothes, everyone gets excited and when the baby finally arrives reality sets in and many drop-out. When I was in high-school (Im not that old-only out of HS 20 years)a pregnant teen was still considered shocking, the girl would leave school before she showed and it was still a rare occurance. We had sex-ed classes back then and while they may not have been the best those classes in conjunction with guidance from home and a fear of a "bad" reputaion were enough to keep many of us saying "NO." I have taken note that many of my pregnant teens come from generation upon generation of teen parents so therefore it a norm for them. Thier parents, grandparents, and even great-grandparents had minimal or no education and so therefore these girls are coming from environments where they were taking care of thier siblings from a young age....they then figure if i have to be taking care of a baby it might as well be my own.
    Another big big problem....beleive it or not is still the fact that teens are misinformed. They don't really understand the physical aspects of "how it really happens" and still beleive the myths like "you can't get pregnant if you do it in water" etc. W
    We need to educate our youth, follow through year after year and stop allowing our children to do as they please because the latest pop star is doing it.........

  • Posted By: justanote @ 12/06/2007 2:30:08 PM

    To Looking forward;

    Who took care of your child while you were out getting a great education? A parent? The government? Get real, it's hard, and for many impossible. I became a mom at 19 I'm now 47 and still working on my education. No government handouts no parent support. That's the reality for most.

  • Posted By: jp_negri @ 12/06/2007 4:37:35 PM

    Here's an article from MSNBC a few weeks ago. It shows that premarital sex is NOT a new phenomenon caused be MTV and sexy clothing.
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/16287113/?GT1=8816
    People have ALWAYS engaged in premarital sex. The wise thing to do is to encourage abstinence, but also teach contraception because premarital sex WILL occurr, no matter what children are taught. If you believe we can actually train an entire generation of randy teenagers to abstain from sex, you've been watching too many Andy Griffith reruns.

  • Posted By: t2tim @ 12/06/2007 4:31:46 PM

    I have spoken with your teen girls over the years and have ask the question, why did you get pregnant? Tow answer always came back, 1. I was curious, and 2. I just wanted a baby. It had nothing to do with abstinence, they were aware of birth control. Another question I would ask was this, "why didn't you wait until you were marriage"? The answer came back I though I was going to lose him, I didn't want to go through a divorce, I wanted someone to love me. We keep looking under a rock and the answer is right in front of us. It is this: We do not have time for children. We have them but do not love them enough to teach them a value system that will protect them throughout life. We have become a very selfish people and children do not fit into the plan.

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