Better Prevention or Changing Attitudes?

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  • Posted By: dlynne14 @ 01/17/2008 4:53:41 PM

    Great news, abortion has hit a 34 year low. For those that believe that abstinence is the only way, WAKE UP!
    Do you realize that a person is considered an adult at 18? So, do we wait until our children ( better discribed as young adults) are of age before we give them any information about sex? Get real. Teenagers have been having sex since time began. Sex before marriage is not something that happened snice the 60's. Abortion has been around since time began.
    #1 post, JOANNEROY, Do you really blieve that being sexually active is the same as using illegal drugs?
    "That's no different than saying teenagers can't be taught to abstain from drugs" We are all sexual beings. SEX IS NORMAL. Drug abuse/addiction is a disease, Of course young people can be told that drugs are bad, Do you really think that an adult can just tell a courious, hormone raging young person that they should wait to have sex until adulthood or marriage and they are going to say, "Okay" and turn off their feelings? Of course they aren't. Therefore, it is up to us, as adults to educate them about everything that has to do with sex, sexual transmitted diseases, contraception, self esteem, parenthood, etc, etc.
    No education breads ingnorance, ingnorance breads, poor choices. The better educated you are as a teenager, the longer they will wait to have sex, and the partners they chose will be more resepctful and
    mature. This is especially true with young girls. I guide my teenagers to be educated in order to make the right decisions, not keep information from them so they don't know what to do if they are confronted with a situation they don't know how to handle. Believe me, there is nothing anyone can do if a teenager decides they want to have sex.

    • Posted By: joanneroy @ 01/17/2008 5:19:39 PM

      I am not saying we should keep information from our children. Clearly, kids need to know how their body works, what sexuality is about, how babies are made, STD's. I am saying lets tell them what the smartest, most responsible decision is, such as waiting until they are at a much more mature age before having sex. We tell our children all the time what is bad for them, smoking, drinking, drugs. We don't tell them "drugs are bad, but in case you use them, here's a clean needle." What is so wrong with saying "sex at this age isn't a good idea, it can be damaging to your self-esteem, can give you a permanent disease, can create another human being you aren't ready to care for, so it really is just best you avoid it for now. It's not a necessity to have sex, yes, it's great, but not necessary at the age of 15." Again, I go back to my analogy, do we teach kids the art of dodging cars and putting on protective gear, or do we tell them to stay the heck off of the freeway?? We don't have to simply say "stay off the freeway", but include an explanation- it's dangerous, it's deadly and downright foolish. My teenagers will not be uneducated on the topic of sex, they will have the necessary information, but I'm not going to send them mixed messages by saying "it's best you wait" as I hand them a condom.

      • Posted By: Logical_Thinker @ 01/17/2008 5:35:44 PM

        And how many kids do you know who are going to just take it on faith and then not partake in sex because their parents said it was bad for them. Whether it be because they are rebelious, or because they find the concept of them being too immature insulting, or for one of numerous other reasons, simply telling your kids sex isn't right for them at this age and they shouldn't do it isn't going to fly. I was raised in a house of overprotective Christians who told me exactly what you said. However, thanks to the internet I learn more and after being fully informed I made the decision to wait until I was older. What you have to realize is some peoples drives are higher than others and they are going to partake regardless if it "is not in their best interest".

        • Posted By: joanneroy @ 01/19/2008 9:15:11 AM

          But isn't that what we tell kids about drugs, alcohol, drinking and driving, cheating on tests..... We tell our kids all the time what they shouldn't and should do, so why is sex any different. Why is it so wrong to tell your kids not to partake in something that can create consequences that they aren't ready for. If they were to get pregnant, whether they choose adoption, abortion or to parent, they will still feel consequences they aren't mature enough to deal with. They will still be profoundly affected by their decision and shouldn't we simply be telling our kids, you shouldn't partake in activities that involve consequences you simply are equipped to handle at this age. Yes, we were given sexuality and it is a beautiful thing, but it can be tainted by immaturity and irresponsibility. Again, educate your children b/c clearly silence is dangerous, but don't give them mixed messages by telling them all of the very negative consequences of a behavior as you hand them a condom, which doesn't offer complete protection from all the negative consequences. They do break, STD's are still on the rise even though anyone can get contraceptives and most importantly, they don't protect your emotional well being.

          • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 01/19/2008 3:21:45 PM

            I think the approach of "telling kids what not to do" is inherently defective. My kids are little, yet, but I think it's less effective just to tell them "don't do ____" than it is to give them the facts they need to recognize and understand, not only the reasons WHY some things are prohibited, but what people need to do to protect themselves if they do find themselves in the situation. In the ***/early teen years, that means NO alcohol, pot, sex, etc., because there's no way to do them safely (same with drinking and driving at any age, "hard" drugs, e.g. heroin, cocaine, many prescription meds). On into high school, the focus should shift to risks and prevention (contraception, moderation, designated drivers, etc.). In other words, parents should focus on the actual dangers of risky activities, not on their own moral outrage about them. Just to be clear, I'm definitely not saying parents should *permit* dangerous activities - rules need to be set and enforced strictly - but prohibition without education puts parents' "morals" ahead of kids' safety. If more people thought this way, I believe the net result would be, among a great many other positive outcomes, a drastic reduction in abortion (through a drastic reduction in unwanted pregnancies).

  • Posted By: Logical_Thinker @ 01/18/2008 11:38:10 AM

    One thing that the abortion debate has shown me is that he parties are both being hypocritical when it comes to certain social issues. Republicans run on the platform of staying the heck out of people???s lives, yet when it comes to Gay Rights and Abortion they are all about controlling the general population decisions. Where as Democrats run on the platform of big government yet when it comes to social issues such as Gay Rights and Abortion Rights they are for freedom of choice. It is sad too because the Republicans would have it right if they just stopped letting Jesus run their party.

    • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 01/19/2008 11:06:22 AM

      Not so logical, there. "Democrats run on the platform of big government?" I have yet to hear that term, or that position, espoused by anyone but the /critics/ of the Democrats. Then you say that Democrats abandon "big government" by acknowledging the rights of women and gays? How should "big government" restrict those people's rights, in your view? I think Democrats really ARE for freedom of choice; Republicans are for freedom of /markets/ (meaning the rich guy wins).

  • Posted By: jamesboy72 @ 01/19/2008 10:36:16 AM

    it's called the morning after pill. who wouldn't prefer to pay $40.00 instead of a few hundred

  • Posted By: jamesboy72 @ 01/19/2008 10:35:29 AM

    it's called the morning after pill. who wouldn't prefer to pay $40.00 instead of a few hundred.

  • Posted By: peace and love @ 01/17/2008 7:15:44 PM

    Of course we all remember JUST SAY NO. That was the very successful program from Nancy Reagan and the Reagan administration. Reagan's answer to end the drug problem. Good job conservatives. It didn't work then and it wont work now. Just say no...........lol.

    • Posted By: Dave in NM @ 01/18/2008 10:42:08 PM

      The "war on drugs" has much the same effect as the war on sex. They both assure the result they claim to be seeking - more drugs, more unintended pregnancies - because if drugs and unplanned pregnancy actually stopped being problems, the Republicans would lose their means of hoodwinking poor people to vote for them (all that would be left to fight is homosexuality, which they can't affect either way.

  • Posted By: peace and love @ 01/18/2008 8:58:48 PM

    That's a wonderful idea to adopt. If you are so inclined to do so, don't forget about the older kids who spend many years in foster and not ever adopted. Do you only have compassion and desire for babies? Does your love not reach to all unwanted children? There are many older children longing for a permanent home.

  • Posted By: Kingsman @ 01/18/2008 8:22:03 PM

    Did anyone who was writing the above stop to think that the reason for the decreasing rates of abortions might be that it has become obvious that these are not just clumps of tissue. The Latin word "Fetus" means baby, and the research over the last thirty-four years has proven that this is so. Further, it has also become obvious that abortions have destroyed almost a whole generation.of Americans. It is also true that if we realize that we were once babies ourselves, would we have chosen to be aborted. The woman might have freedom of choice in many areas, but is it just possible that we are realizing that our children must also be given freedom of choice here. Suicide is a crime against the law. Finally, there are any number of couples here that would love to have children, but cannot do so. I and my wife are among them. My nephew and his wife also fit in this group. I went into fostering and fostered children for over 30 years. One of ours fit in the group of single moms who could not afford to have another child. She gve her new baby to a wonderful couple who had been trying to have a child for years. It's proved to be a wonderful thing as an open adoption!

  • Posted By: pcdir443 @ 01/18/2008 7:52:55 PM

    As a pc director, it is evident that youth and younger women do fully acknowledge that abortion ends a life, and they are not comfortable with that as an option. We also see among our clients who have experienced abortion, they are not choosing to do it again regardless of their current view on abortion. There is also a growing number of pregnancy help centers across the US. Abortion does not constitute a pregnancy "help".

  • Posted By: pcdir443 @ 01/18/2008 7:50:20 PM

    as a pc director, one thing that Is evident in our center is our youth and younger women fully recognize that abortion ends a life; stops a beating heart, and they are not comfortable with making that decision. We also see among our clients that those who have previously aborted, even though they say they are "for" abortion, do not choose it again. The number pregnancy help centers is increasing. Abortion is not a pregnancy help.

  • Posted By: BadgerGrad99 @ 01/18/2008 7:29:33 PM

    Is it possible that the drop in the abortion rate has to do with society's increased acceptance of single moms? It used to be extremely shameful to have a child out of wedlock, but today it is relatively common. Many couples choose not to marry and many single women choose to have children. Maybe by getting rid of the stigma, we are not driving women to abortions.

  • Posted By: gradstudent @ 01/17/2008 9:45:59 PM

    I would like to thank Planned Parenthood for being around when I was 23 and decided to have an abortion. No, women don't decide to have abortions the same way they decide to go to the mall or decide to buy a new car---to paraphrase a well-known feminist scholar, "A women chooses an abortion like an animal in a trap chooses to chew off its own leg." Since I had my abortion four years ago, I've taken advantage of incredible educational opportunities, and I know that when I am ready to have a child, I will be better prepared and better able to care for him or her in the manner s/he deserves. I am not proud of my abortion, nor of decisions I made that led up to the need for it, but I am very grateful that I was able to put off childbearing for the chance to complete a graduate degree. Pro-life folks, if you really want to make a difference, please commit your time to supporting young single mothers! I think that a main reason that women choose abortion is because of a perceived lack of social support, and if pro-life people put all the time and energy that they put into picketing and lobbying into forming organizations to provide low-cost, quality childcare for young single mothers, they will have found a much more effective deterrent to abortion.

    • Posted By: blue_rylie @ 01/18/2008 7:10:05 AM

      I am so relieved you had a choice and that the choice was safe and legal! I have two pre-teen daughters, and the hope is that they will never face that choice but...this is the real world. Should either of them face an unintended pregnancy, I want every available option open to them and I want them to know that regardless of their choice I will support them. Thank you for sharing your story, I wish you the very best in your life. And good for you for making the choice that was right for you!

      • Posted By: jenlars3 @ 01/18/2008 7:11:13 PM

        I don't think there is any pro-life or church based group in the country that would turn away anyone who asked for their help. Most people who are pro-life advocates, also advocate for things that make completing a pregnancy possible.

    • Posted By: CIAmom007 @ 01/17/2008 10:26:36 PM

      Amen to that. You made a choice and it was right for you.

  • Posted By: drgnfly555 @ 01/17/2008 11:07:45 AM

    I think it is the woman's intrinsic right to control her own body..however having said that I do not beleive that abortion is a method of birth control. I do beleive that women come into situations that are scary and uncontrollable and adverse and abortion may well be the only recourse they have. Try to tell me that the child I was pregnant with from a vicious rape should have been carried full term...walk a mile baby...walk a mile

    • Posted By: christianbennett @ 01/18/2008 4:59:55 PM

      Abortion should only be an option when both lives will be lost due to the continued pregnancy.

    • Posted By: Ithink4myself @ 01/17/2008 11:34:56 AM

      Sorry to hear that someone forced themselves on you, and caused a pregnancy to happen. That was a violent act. And no one can put themselves in your shoes. How is destroying an innocent life not another violent act. Just watch the old film "The Silent Scream". Do you think that ripping that life apart justifies a women's right to choose? I dare any pro-choicer to watch that film and say that it's a woman's body.

  • Posted By: DUMPLIN @ 01/17/2008 11:02:25 AM

    GOD SAYS ABORTION IS MURDER, SAYING YOU DON''T BELIEVE DOES NOT MAKE IT TRUE. GOD'S LAWS APPLY TO ALL OF US, WE DO HAVE FREEDOM OF CHOICE BUT THERE ARE CONSEQUENCES TO BE ANSWERED TO AT SOME POINT IN TIME. THERE IS A DAY OF RECKONING THAT WILL ANSWER ALL THESE QUESTIONS. YOUR ANGER AND CONTEMPT SEEM TO SAY YOU KNOW YOU ARE WRONG BUT YOU DON'T WANT TO ADMIT IT

    • Posted By: monicarae @ 01/17/2008 11:29:37 AM

      No, I'm angry because ya'll are trying to force your way of life onto me, dear. If you don't believe in abortions, then don't have them. But do NOT force me and other women to do the same.

      • Posted By: christianbennett @ 01/18/2008 4:56:42 PM

        And if I want to break into your house and steal your possesions, don't stop me because that is my perogative Right. I'm sorry, but at somepoint there is a line as to what is good in society and what isn't. I'm sorry if my beliefs and voting privilages interfere with your way of life, but that's the point of a democracy; voting for what we believe is right and wrong.

    • Posted By: angelus1967 @ 01/18/2008 1:15:37 PM

      god's law does not apply to me as I do not believe in your god. There will be no "day of reckoning" for any of us. You will die and be plakced in a hole in the ground. Ashes to ashes and all of that.....

  • Posted By: christianbennett @ 01/17/2008 11:02:09 AM

    "I think that it is quite scary that the radical Chrisitan Right is trying to force their beliefs on the rest of us. Who made them the moral police?" posted by Tontabillies
    Welcome to Democracy my dear, if the majority of America is Christian, and the Christian principals that they live by states that abortion is wrong, guess what? They are going to vote to make abortion illegal, due to their beleif system. To the "Christian Right "I say "good job". Your voting with your principals and beliefs in tact, something that too many people are afraid to do because their afraid that they might offend someone else. I beleive in God, and I will vote according to my beliefs.

    • Posted By: Benaround @ 01/17/2008 11:34:12 AM

      I suppose Mr "christianbennett" thinks that the wrongness of the holocaust and the genetic cleansing that has taken place in our world is just the imagination of radical right wing Christians. Over 40 million babies are murdered worldwide every year. Science can not argue that fetuses are just tissue, they are living organisms and that is exacrtly what a human being is. Let's get real about the "radical Christian views" balogna and call the truth for what it is. Abortion is murder and it is wrong.

      • Posted By: christianbennett @ 01/18/2008 4:52:16 PM

        Maybe you misunderstand, my stance. I am 100% against abortion, and I will vote to end abortion every chance I get. My Comment was to the person that is challenging christians on forcing others to be subject to their belief system. I hope my vote helps to end abortion, and consequentlly others will have to live with the fact that abortion is no longer an option for them. The added part to that statement which is truelly my point, is that is how a Democracy functions. We all vote, and as a society we collectively come to legal decisions as to what should be legal and illegal.

  • Posted By: Tracker500 @ 01/17/2008 2:34:03 PM

    To all the people who say that Planned Parenthood is just like any other business and is entitled to making as much money as they can, I agree with you. But, I don't want to hear any more complains about paying $3 for a gallon of gas and the greedy oil companies.

    • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/18/2008 3:25:18 PM

      Apples and oranges.....every doctor and doctor's office make a profit, if they didn't then they would not be in business. One of the reasons that many hospitals in this country have financial issues, is that they bill patients after they recieve care, and due to the high cost of hospital care, many bills are left unpaid, especially if the patient was without insurance (and not because they're a bad person or a deadbeat....but just because the cost of hospital care is astronomical if you don't have insurance). Private offices and clinics typically make a much larger profit because patients are required to pay for service up front, before they ever see the doctor.

  • Posted By: CIAmom007 @ 01/17/2008 12:55:04 PM

    Here is a direct copy and paste in regards to IUD's "How does an IUD work?
    Both types of IUDs work primarily by preventing sperm from fertilizing an egg. They do this in a few different ways. First, they stimulate an inflammatory response in the uterus, causing changes that damage or kill sperm and that may damage an egg as well. In the unlikely event that an egg does get fertilized and survives, an IUD makes it harder for it to implant in the uterus.
    The progestin IUD may also thicken cervical mucus, making it more difficult for the sperm to enter the uterus. In addition, the progestin may keep some women from ovulating."

    As you can see, using an IUD isn't MURDER!! It is very unlikely that an egg will get the chance to be fertilized. Reasearch about it before you spew GeorgiaJay!! I had one for 9.5yrs and it was the best. I never had a problem with my periods at all as was claimed by GeorgiaJayHawk.

    • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/18/2008 3:13:55 PM

      Hey CIAmom007, I think you misunderstood me.....I never said the IUD was a bad thing, I have one and I love it....I was refuting another posters comment regarding IUDs. For some women, the ParaGard IUD can cause heavier cycles, unfortunately I can speak form personal experience...but it's a good trade off for not being pumped full of hormomes.

    • Posted By: luciefreddie @ 01/17/2008 2:21:13 PM

      Either way, it is still POSSIBLE (low chance) that the sperm and egg could join...you still haven't negated the fact that there is a chance of conception.

      • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/17/2008 2:58:15 PM

        the ParaGuard can cause heavier flow and worsened cramping, per the literature I recieved from my OBGYN when I was trying to decide what I wanted to do.

        http://www.paragard.com/custom/q-and-a

        • Posted By: luciefreddie @ 01/17/2008 6:34:44 PM

          again, you are referring to literature from a drug company....not so wise. Look at all of the drug companies tied up in lawsuits because they failed to give consumers all of the facts. Give me something a little more credible. Go to a local college and speak with a biology professor....

          • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/18/2008 3:08:31 PM

            I'm a microbiologist with the creditials to be Biology professor, luciefreddie...so I don't need to "go to college and talk to a professor". Seriously though, Its unreasonable to condemn people for using the pill (by the way the pill prevents the release of eggs from the ovaries, thus there is no opportunity for conception) and getting IUD's in an attempt to prevent pregnancies. Oh, and condoms (which you had said where the only option you found to be acceptable) have a much hgher failure rate than the pill, shot, and IUD...so good luck with that.

      • Posted By: luciefreddie @ 01/17/2008 2:36:39 PM

        I apologize if this series of responses comes across as harsh. The truth is no one who is pro life (or not) would ever want to admit that there is a chance that they killed their child. No one who currently has or has ever had an IUD for the comfort of knowing that it will prevent them from having a child will want to admit that there is a possibility that they unknowingly killed their child. The facts are still there. With ANY form of birth control, there is a CHANCE (sometimes small, sometimes mediocre) that you will concieve. If you do concieve, that fetus will NOT survive because of the unstable environment your uterus now has as a result of the birth control. Therefore, your birth control has done exactly what the RU486 pill does. Wrap your head around it, because the truth is there, you just don't want to see it.

        • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/17/2008 2:54:44 PM

          I'm dissappointed lucciefreddie...I was hoping to have an intelligent debate, but unfortunately you are an idiot.

    • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/17/2008 1:18:15 PM

      THANK YOU! I appreciate someone else laying down the tuth about how the IUD works. I was really getting kind of irritated with people insinuating that I'm a murderer.....I've had a ParaGuard for a couple of years now, and its the best. I get to enjoy my marriage, without being stressed out that we'll start a family before we're ready to, and I don't have to deal with any of the side effects of birth control pills.

  • Posted By: kenewton @ 01/17/2008 3:41:22 PM

    Georgia......religious people are given a command and that is to advance the Kingdom of God. Religious people see this as a religious issue because it is viewed as 'murder'. If there are no PP clinics, then there is no problem. Yes, freedom does allow for piercings, shacking up, purple hair, etc. The reality part is that it is really no one's business what another does as long as it does not cause undo pain or misery to another human. Abortion then becomes the issue of the fetus. Is it human or not? Pro life folks think so. Obviously, pro choice folks think not. What is truly upsetting is that the religious folks are interpreting the teachings in their own way as usual, and throw in scriptures to back them up. Jesus was all about love. Many christians today have a downright hatred for anything and anyone that does not conform to their beliefs. It's sad. We have folks like Jerry Falwell to thank for that.

    • Posted By: GeorgiaJayhawk @ 01/18/2008 2:40:32 PM

      PP is not the problem....PP provides multiple services, not just abortion services. Even if every Planned Parenthood in world closed there doors tomorrow, abortions would still happen, so I think it's pretty narrow minded to continously single out and point the finger at PP, as if they are the only reason that abortions happen.

  • Posted By: blue_rylie @ 01/18/2008 12:32:36 PM

    When it comes down to it, the abortion debate is really quite simple. Do we have the authority to force a woman to risk her health and life for a pregancy or not. I think not. Pregnancy IS a risk to a woman's health, and it's easy to sit on the sideline and say "yes you should give birth" without ever putting yourself at risk. Being the one that is at risk, and being told you must take that risk regardless of your own wishes, would be a terrible place to land. I understand that many women enjoy their pregnancy, see it as a beautiful thing, and view birth as a pain well worth enduring. Not all feel that way, and not all are so lucky as to have a simple (i use that word loosely) pregnancy or birth. At the end of the day, the woman has to decide what risks she is willing to take.

  • Posted By: telicity @ 01/17/2008 10:20:31 AM

    Yes abortion is both a political and religious issue, but it should be basic human instinct not to kill your own child. From the moment a baby is conceived he is on a very fast track to life. I saw my son???s heartbeat at 6 weeks, so tell me he wasn???t alive. From the very moment you conceive you no longer get the luxury of being selfish. When I hear people say, ???nobody better tell me what to do with my body??? I think of a selfish brat being completely inconsiderate of the growing life inside them. Let???s also remember the lovely partial birth abortion that Clinton signed off. Now we can abort babies all the way up until birth. Ron Paul told a story about a woman whose boyfriend broke up with her so she decided to get an abortion at 8 months; the baby survived the abortion so the doctor had to drown the baby. That doctor got charged with murder, so tell me the difference. You tell me it is ok to pull a baby out of the womb at 6,7,8,9 months while still moving and very much alive, put a large needle in its head to kill him, then pull him out after he has died. You seriously tell me that is ok!

    • Posted By: angelus1967 @ 01/18/2008 12:16:59 PM

      The story that Ron Paul told is an urban myth that has been around for a long time. No doctor drowned a baby due to a failed abortion. Of course even as I write this I know there are some people who will believe that story anyway because they want to and it fits with what they choose to believe!

  • Posted By: peace and love @ 01/18/2008 11:47:18 AM

    That's correct. While Jesus is exciting to some, it's a complete turn off and completely irrelevant to others. When that kind of crazy talk comes into politics and government, it's not a winning view. Certainly not after the 8 horriific years we have had with a man who speaks to Jesus. What a mess!

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