Birth, The American Way

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  • Posted By: AVAnd @ 01/31/2008 10:41:26 AM

    Very interesting topic.

    I had my first daughter a month ago. I was dead set on having her with no interventions - not even an IV. I am so thankful that my midwife drilled it into my head that trying to control my labor would not be productive and that having interventions was not a horrible thing. I ended up laboring at home (and at work) for 33 hours before going to the hospital. I had not slept and was so tired that I was losing my mental strength. I asked for nubain(spelled right?) to help me rest but it did little for me. Finally, after being at the hospital for about 3 hours, I asked for an epidural. When it finally kicked in, I was already at 10 cm! But it gave me moments to rest, which I desperately needed. The epidural was not what I imagined: I could still move my legs and feel parts of my lower body. Luckily I had practiced relaxation and focus techniques so that I could push her effectively. As my brilliant midwife had explained to me, my labor and the birth was not at all what I expected and I am so thankful that she helped me open my mind to interventions that helped me give birth to my daughter.

    I wonder what would have happened had I not been mentally preparing myself for a birth without intervention? While I did have the epidural, I relied on my "training" to help me give birth. Towards the end, the doctor on duty came in and introduced herself and explained that we may need to do a C-section. My midwife (who was with me the entire time) advocated for me to have the chance to try pushing and with her guidance, we delivered a healthy baby (I'm doing well too!). Without having "trained" for a birth without intervention, I suspect I would have been afraid and given up.

    Birth is overwhelming no matter the circumstances. Feeling powerful and surrendering were very important for me to have a vaginal birth - but those feelings were not possible without being surrounded by people who believed in me and who I trusted.

    Just another thought: no one asked me if I was excited to give birth when I was pregnant. However, I was asked if I was scared, told to have an epidural, and patronized for wishing to do it with no intervention. It is almost as if our culture has devalued women's wisdom and the sisterhood of our experiences in birth.

  • Posted By: AVAnd @ 01/31/2008 10:40:40 AM

    Very interesting topic.

    I had my first daughter a month ago. I was dead set on having her with no interventions - not even an IV. I am so thankful that my midwife drilled it into my head that trying to control my labor would not be productive and that having interventions was not a horrible thing. I ended up laboring at home (and at work) for 33 hours before going to the hospital. I had not slept and was so tired that I was losing my mental strength. I asked for nubain(spelled right?) to help me rest but it did little for me. Finally, after being at the hospital for about 3 hours, I asked for an epidural. When it finally kicked in, I was already at 10 cm! But it gave me moments to rest, which I desperately needed. The epidural was not what I imagined: I could still move my legs and feel parts of my lower body. Luckily I had practiced relaxation and focus techniques so that I could push her effectively. As my brilliant midwife had explained to me, my labor and the birth was not at all what I expected and I am so thankful that she helped me open my mind to interventions that helped me give birth to my daughter.

    I wonder what would have happened had I not been mentally preparing myself for a birth without intervention? While I did have the epidural, I relied on my "training" to help me give birth. Towards the end, the doctor on duty came in and introduced herself and explained that we may need to do a C-section. My midwife (who was with me the entire time) advocated for me to have the chance to try pushing and with her guidance, we delivered a healthy baby (I'm doing well too!). Without having "trained" for a birth without intervention, I suspect I would have been afraid and given up.

    Birth is overwhelming no matter the circumstances. Feeling powerful and surrendering were very important for me to have a vaginal birth - but those feelings were not possible without being surrounded by people who believed in me and who I trusted.

    Just another thought: no one asked me if I was excited to give birth when I was pregnant. However, I was asked if I was scared, told to have an epidural, and patronized for wishing to do it with no intervention. It is almost as if our culture has devalued women's wisdom and the sisterhood of our experiences in birth.

  • Posted By: bryanv82 @ 01/29/2008 3:31:18 PM

    Personally I much prefer women that don't have kids but if they feel the need to have kids they should at least have a c-section. C-sections help to save the tightness of the vagina and I love tight vaginas!

    • Posted By: elisa32 @ 01/31/2008 7:31:58 AM

      You have no place here, your opinion is irrelevant.

    • Posted By: mrsavizdrav @ 01/29/2008 4:13:57 PM

      You are sick!

  • Posted By: valspring @ 01/29/2008 7:30:59 PM

    Do any of these documentaries or studies take into account the fact that insurance companies won't allow you to give birth vaginally if you've already had a c-section? I had an emergency c-section due to hypertention with my first pregnancy. This was to save both me and my son. He did end up with respiratory problems which were quickly resolved. Elective c-sections aren't always truly elective. I will be having another c-section in three weeks. I scheduled the date less than a week before my due date. I'm hoping to make it that far. I'm not a selfish mother who schedules my life away. I am a stay-at-home. I get angrier and angrier every time I am critisized, along with so many other women, for having c-sections. Most of us would not choose to go through major surgery or the long, horrible recovery. One more thing: The "birthing experience" is not what is important. It is having the baby. Real mothers don't go through pregnacy for the experience. They go through it to have a child.

    • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/30/2008 2:45:34 PM

      No matter what sort of care giver you have (Nurse-Midwife or Physician), if your care-giver indicates a particular course of action and your insurance company threatens not to cover you when the procedure is covered (vaginal or C-section), there are really only two things to do: report them to the insurance commissioner of your state for breach-of-contract and practicing medicine without a license (a crime), and get a good lawyer to sue them for the same. This goes for any recommended medical treatment, not just OB. It is not the insurance company's job to assess your state of health, but your OB/GYN or Midwife, and some pencil-pushing pinhead can (and they have) go to jail for practicing medicine. Insurance companies have -much- deeper pockets than Physicians, and of those I know who have done this (including my Mom for an emergency surgery to repair a brain aneurysm the insurance folk said was -elective- surgery), the threat was all it took.

  • Posted By: simon22 @ 01/29/2008 10:41:41 PM

    Nice article from Rikki and the nations top insurance executives. My son is 6 years old and has spastic quadripligia. Even though my wife would have preferred a C-section, she didnt get one. She pushed valiantly for 7hours and 15 minutes fully dialated. He had massive seizures the next day....he still gets them. He is a little fighter but has very little quality of life. There is nothing wrong with natural childbirth but overhyping it is irresponsible

    • Posted By: shanonmom @ 01/30/2008 11:04:13 AM

      I'm sorry you had malpractice and a bad care provider. I hope you won your lawsuit. However, this doesn't make homebirth unsafe. What would have happened in a homebirth situation in many cases would have been appropriate transfer when they realized something was not working. If the doctors were ethical, they would have then given your wife a cesarean. However, we can't stop unethical doctors from practicting in many cases. Your situation is a great indicator of why women need care providers trained to actually understand pregnancy rather than surgeons who are too busy to give time and appropriate care.

  • Posted By: akp714 @ 01/29/2008 8:25:25 PM

    As a future doctor, I am disheartened to see some of the comments here. Your doctor's are working in your baby's and your own best interests. If anything is working againsts that, it's likely due to the years of lawsuits brought against obstetricians from pursuing vaginal deliveries. If doctors wanted to be in the business of making money, they would have gone into business.

    • Posted By: shanonmom @ 01/30/2008 11:01:03 AM

      I read this and couldn't help but wonder how long you will make it in medicine if this is your attitude. Doctors DID go into business, which is why VBAC's are being banned across the country. It's easier to do a repeat cesarean than it is to sit next to a woman's bedside. Just ask them.

    • Posted By: mightymse17 @ 01/29/2008 10:05:17 PM

      Don't you think that is a slight hasty generalization? While the doctors you may come in contact with in your pre-medical or medical studies may be nearly altruistic, evidence suggests otherwise. i do admire your attitude though, don't let that go no matter how much your mortgage payment is.

  • Posted By: shanarn @ 01/30/2008 3:28:02 AM

    I am not saying there is anything wrong with having a natural childbirth. Power to the mothers who want to have their babies that way. However, as a Labor and Delivery nurse, I know that sometimes a cesarean section is necessary. Most doctors and nurses are truly looking out for the best interests of the mothers and babies, contrary to what this article is stating. Many different factors can lead to a c-section, such as severe preeclampsia, shoulder dystocia, pelvic disproportion, maternal fever, fetal tachycardia or bradycardia, cord prolapse, HELLP Syndrome, placental abruption, uterine rupture, breech presentation, placenta previa, etc, etc, etc. The list goes on and on. Doctors and Nurses are educated to be aware of these potential life-threatening problems. The lay person is not! Like I said before, I am all for a natural delivery. However, it is not always in the mothers or babies best interest. It is very dangerous for people to suggest otherwise. I have a friend who decided to deliver her fourth baby at home. You could ask her what she thinks of home delivery now. Her baby died during childbirth and she came very close to dying herself. Oh, wait, but home delivery is just as safe or safter as hospital deliveries according to many of the people who have written in. Whatever.

    • Posted By: shanonmom @ 01/30/2008 10:57:39 AM

      You can compare apples to apples. I know women who died in childbirth or their babies were lost in a hospital setting during a "normal" delivery or what would have been a normal delivery. So many factors that "could" lead to a cesarean simply don't when care is managed appropriately. One of the most frustrating moments I have is when women are told they have to induce or have to have a cesarean because I see comments like an RN commenting on possibly INDICATED (and possibly iatrogenic) cesareans and simply ignoring the massive amount of unnecessary medical intervention going on in this country. We're speaking different languages because hospitals don't understand low risk care or appropriate transfer. I'm sorry your friend lost her child but it makes me wonder what the circumstances were and if the loss was due to the care she received. Appropriate investigation and comment rather than "babies die at homebirths" because honestly, the woman who had an unnecessary induction at St Joseph's Hospital in Tampa and died earlier this year probably wouldn't think much of hospital birth, either.

  • Posted By: akp714 @ 01/29/2008 8:18:27 PM

    As a future doctor, I am so disheartened by the uneducated, inaccurate comments made here. Bottom line: Doctors are working for your's and your baby's best interests. If it's anything less, it's likely do to avoidance of a lawsuit, malpractice insurance co., and lawyers who have disrupted the process. And when someone has an epidural or surgery, the patient must consent. I know no doctor that would do a c-section if it wasn't right for the patient. If doctors were in the business of making money, they would have gone into business.

    • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/29/2008 8:30:36 PM

      I'll bite: why does our nation have the highest neonatal death rate and maternal death rate in the industrialized world if medicalizing a natural process which required no doctors for 100,000's years? I also refer you, Sir, to the CIA World Factbook entry on the United States - I certainly trust them better than the AMA - the CIA is not into obstetrics for the money.

      • Posted By: akp714 @ 01/29/2008 9:38:10 PM

        First of all, I'm not a sir.

        Secondly, I stand by the fact that doctors only attempt to optimize patient care.

        • Posted By: Kbudds7 @ 01/29/2008 11:33:31 PM

          It is really naive of you to think such things- If they haven't informed you in med school yet, being a doctor is a business! Women need a service and doctors provide that. Funny how you preach about people being uneducated- look 'business' up in the dictionary! And by the way, not all people are good- including doctors.

          • Posted By: anonymo @ 01/30/2008 12:59:45 AM

            As a doctor, I can tell you that there is a business of medicine, but doctors are not taught the "business of medicine" in medical school, or in residency. They are taught the "profession" of medicine, which binds them to the many altruistic principals. The business of medicine convolutes this issue, as insurance and government continurally squeeze reimbursements, and attorneys and juries award huge awards, some doctors have trouble seeing the business and the profession and allow themselves to do what's right for the patient. As we get more technologically advanced, decision-making itself becomes more and more difficult, and "right" and "wrong" are not the only answers to most medical situations. It is the assimilation of much information the doctor must do to decide what is "best" in each circumstance, and the patients have more and more input, as they supposedly get more informed through the internet and media.

            • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/30/2008 3:08:47 AM

              The ones that don't pay attention to business go out of business, just like a restaurant or auto shop. In this country if a physician is not in it for the $$$, they will not be in it at all. Just fill in a new patient form, where one of the first questions asked is "What is your insurance company?"

        • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/30/2008 2:34:43 AM

          My apologies . . . I stand by the fact mothers aren't patients. Pregnancy and birth aren't diseases, and if humans needed phydsicians in the normal course of evolution, we'd've been extinct long ago. The majority of births progress fine without intervention, and obstetrics is an over-manned (or womaned) field . . . as is law, and they are both driven by the same thing - $$$

  • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/30/2008 2:45:24 AM

    I'll bet there isn't a record of a single cabbie anywhere in this countr that has lost a baby, -or a mother-, through a C-section, a major surgery with all the complications of an appendectomy.

  • Posted By: anonymo @ 01/29/2008 8:55:15 PM

    We consider more premature children "children", than in the other countries. Our infant morality rate is higher because we consider more prematurely born fetuses children, whereas in other countries, a second trimester birth is considered a "spontaneous abortion", and medical technology is not utilized to try to save the premature infant. It is not because of c-sections that we have a higher infant mortality rate, it is because our our definition of the word "infant" .

    • Posted By: akp714 @ 01/29/2008 9:40:15 PM

      Exactly.

      • Posted By: anonymo @ 01/30/2008 12:52:29 AM

        NO, what I was implying is that in other countries the premature children born can't be saved, they don't have the technology to do so. Medical personnel don't consider their lives savable enough because they don't have extra intensive care unit supplies, nurses, ECMO, special ventilators, among other things. We are pushing the limits of technology and mother nature keeping extreme premies alive. I don't think those births are considered live, viable humans in other countries and don't get counted as part of the infant mortaility rate, they are considered to all be mortal.

    • Posted By: Kbudds @ 01/29/2008 11:17:50 PM

      So after that baby was born - YOU would be able to kill it, calling it abortion??? Wow!

    • Posted By: Kbudds @ 01/29/2008 11:14:59 PM

      So after that baby was born - YOU would be able to kill it, calling it abortion??? Wow!

  • Posted By: Farmmomof4 @ 01/26/2008 10:13:33 AM

    Why as women do we feel the need to critize the choices of other women is it so we can feel better about the choices we ourselves have made. There is always going to be discussion as to which is better Natural Birth vs C-Section, Breast fed vs. Bottle fed, Stay at home mom vs. working mom. I support anyone who is couragous enough to want to jump into parenthood because in the end it doesn't matter if I gave birth vaginally, through c-section or even adoption its about the wonderful smile of a child first thing in the morning, hearing a childs laughter in the back yard on a summer day, or hearing a child say I love you at bedtime. So Thank God that your one of the luck parents that have a wonderful child in your life.

    • Posted By: Kbudds7 @ 01/29/2008 11:49:16 PM

      Absolutely beautifully put!!!

  • Posted By: einaled @ 01/29/2008 9:16:44 AM

    I had my daughter by vaginal birth without drugs. Was it painful? Of course. It's called LABOR. It's also finite, it doesn't last forever. Would I do it again? Absolutely. I felt and remember every bit of my labor and delivery and feel that made it much more of a personal experience between me and my child.
    When people ask me how it was, I tell them. I have never "pushed" my opinion on anyone. I also tell people to talk to friends that have delivered by C-section or vaginal w/epidural. If there are no medical complications in the equation, women should draw their own conclusions on what would be best for them and their situation.
    As far as the woman who commented that people like me are "crazy natural birth granola psychos", I am sorry that her kids have a role model who resorts to juvenile name calling to those that have an opinion different from hers.

    • Posted By: licard @ 01/29/2008 10:26:31 PM

      How dare you comment on me as a role model for my children. This is not about you-I am referring to people who have told me that I did something wrong by having a C-section-if you are not pushing your views on people thne i am not referring to you personally. Put your ego in check and realize that I am referring to people that I have personally had experience with.

  • Posted By: mightymse17 @ 01/29/2008 9:54:48 PM

    The author of this Newsweek article seems to misconstrue and misrepresent study information, propagating the misleading data discussed in the journal. Go to: http://www.bmj.com/cgi/eletters/bmj.39363.706956.55v1 to read professional, peer responses; http://www.bmj.com/cgi/content/full/bmj.39363.706956.55v1 for the actual journal article. It is a shame that so many people will be dumber for reading Newsweek.

  • Posted By: anacristina @ 01/29/2008 7:05:50 PM

    my daughter was delivered by c-section in 1991 because the placenta was "getting too old" and my baby was "overdue" 3 weeks. they induced the labor in the a.m. and i had the terrible contractions during the day. since i wasn't dilating past 3or 4 cm, they gave me an epidural and waited til night for a doctor to see me. when he came, he broke my water bag and i remained like that til the next morning when they took me in for surgery. 5 years later, pregnant w/my second baby my dr. said that since i had a history of not dilating,and my baby was already over 8 lbs.(too big for my 5' 1" ht.), i should consider c- section. remembering the trauma of induced labor pain, i ceded. my labor wasn't induced and i went straight to surgery. now, 10 yrs. later expecting my third baby, a new o.b. told me on my first prenatal care visit that i will have to have a c-section. he has yet to explain exactly why. he happens to be a high-risk pregnancy o.b. (a fact i wasn't aware of) and seemed to suggest that although i have no medical problems(high b.p., diabetes, etc.) my obesity is the main deciding factor. i'm unsure i really need the c-section.

    • Posted By: akp714 @ 01/29/2008 8:29:21 PM

      After a c-section, a woman has a 5% chance of her uterus rupturing during labor in the next pregnancy. Well it's, yes, just 5%, if it does happen the baby likely dies and the mother also has a very high likelihood of dying. Why? Because you will lose an immense amount of blood.

      • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/29/2008 8:45:56 PM

        Disregarding the fact the majority of C-sections in this country are caused by intervention as opposed to letting a normal process proceed normally, what recent credible large studies can you cite to support this figure?

  • Posted By: kelp33 @ 01/29/2008 4:07:30 PM

    I question the very statistics quoted in the report ...

    "The risk of death for infants delivered via C-section???who are more likely to have a low birth weight???was double that of vaginal births, and C-section babies were more likely to have respiratory problems. "

    Is the risk of death higher simply because babies born via C-section are more likely to be premature, breach or have other risk factors. My son was born 2 months early via C-section and weighed just over 4lbs. He would certainly fit those catagories but he was breech, in distress and wouldn't have survived if he wasn't born C-section.

    The study findings prompt more questions than answers.

    • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/29/2008 8:26:49 PM

      These statistics might get your attention then. According to the Central Ingtelligency Agency "World Fact Book 2007" ( http://www.odci.gov ) The United States has the highest infant mortality rate in the industrialized world, and is the only industrial country not to have a State-supported midwifery system.

      Some statistics from the World Fact Book: deaths per 1000: USA: 6.37, United Kingdom 5.01, Denmark 4.45, Iceland 3.12 - the numbers march on. Premature babies die more often, and C-sections are routinely scheduled prematurely. Our own Federal government's figures show the medical system for women in this country is really a sham, yet they continue to allow MEN to tell them there is something wrong with their bodies and allow themselves to be lead to the OR - the doc gets paid by your insurance whether you live through the surgery or not.

  • Posted By: Anymouse @ 01/29/2008 7:50:34 PM

    My son was born at home in 1988 in Virginia Beach. At the time I was in the Navy. My wife and I had requested health statistics from the Commonwealth of Virginia on maternal/neonatal death rates for all facilities in Tidewater. The Naval Hospital was worst, Va Beach Gen. was most expensive. Of thousands of births the midwifery clinic had recorded 0/0 deaths, and were least expensive.

    Some elements in my command gave me pressure against the midwife, suggesting I was putting my wife at risk and threatening military legal action. CHAMPUS (now Tricare), military health insurance, pays for midwives as outpatient care (in accordance with the benefits manual) but the Tidewater area programme was overseen by an obstetrician who routinely refused claims for midwives, even though the average cost in Va Beach to the taxpayer (Champus is part of the Dept. of Defense) was 1/10th that of a regular delivery in a hospital.

    My wife gave birth in about seven hours, and retired to her own waterbed with her new son, to bond with him. It took a letter to Congress to get Champus to cough up their share of the bill. Midwives after all are a threat to obstetricians - their existence proves that medical intervention in birth is abnormal.

    He is now ninteen, and preparing for University. Supposing all those medications and interventions and insurance billing schemes were applied? Where would he be now? How much pain and suffering and waste of medical resources would be alliviated by letting a natural process be natural instead of treating it as a disorder? Is womanhood a disorder that needs to be treated on the altar of the AMA? Along with the occasional human sacrifice?

  • Posted By: unnamedmother @ 01/29/2008 7:35:44 PM

    my daughter was also born via c-section, yes i would have preferred an vaginal delivery, but i was prepared to do whatever was necessary to insure her health...the doctors recommended the c-section, and i will never regret it. its not as bad as it is put off to be, and it should not be your #1 concern when you're are pregnant, your baby's health should be! i don't know people make it such a big deal, having a c-section is not the end of the world!

  • Posted By: kokapellie @ 01/29/2008 3:45:11 PM

    this is about elective c-sections. 19 year old girls with no health problems and a healthy baby who simply dont want to attempt natural birth. in many cases, c-sections are necessary, and, as the article says, save lives. ten pound children probably shouldnt be delievered vaginally. twins it is probaby a good idea to go c-section. and they never said anything about children being born by c-section were bad, so i dont know where you would have come up with "i hope you dont mena they should not have been born?" that is a stupid, uneducated, hasty and reactionary reply. no need to get offensive because someone else thinks that maybe not cutting a baby out of his/her mother so abruptly is a bad idea.

    • Posted By: facmom @ 01/29/2008 6:57:12 PM

      for kokapellie: the comment about "should not have been born" was in reply to a previous comment made about God wanting us to have children naturally. If you can do it, go ahead, but don't expect everyone to think they can and should deliver vaginally and therby put ideas in 19 y/old heads about not wanting ot needing medical intervention when deemed necessary by circumstances. 19 year olds should be well versed on prevention rather than be having babies at such a young age.

    • Posted By: jwshowpigs @ 01/29/2008 4:02:18 PM

      I believe she was replying to a comment made, not the article.

  • Posted By: terra @ 01/29/2008 6:24:49 PM

    my daughter was born caesarian, but certainly not by my choice. she was fine. i went in because of decreased fetal movement. they monitored me for a few hours and told me she was fine. her heart beat was fine, she wasn't stressed, but they didn't let me go home. instead they kept telling me "better out, than in". i was by myself, my husband was at work. nurses were drawing blood and 3 doctors were in the room talking about surgery, i was young and scared. i couldn't tell you how i ended up in the operating room, only to know, after all was said and done, that i didnt need the c-section and she could have been a natural birth a month later. so i feel that part of the high caesarian rate is because of doctor's stressing out patients for unneeded procedures.

  • Posted By: terra @ 01/29/2008 6:18:48 PM

    my daughter was born caesarian, but certainly not by my choice. she was fine. i went in because of decreased fetal movement. they monitored me for a few hours and told me she was fine. her heart beat was fine, she wasn't stressed, but they didn't let me go home. instead they kept telling me "better out, than in". i was by myself, my husband was at work. nurses were drawing blood and 3 doctors were in the room talking about surgery, i was young and scared. i couldn't tell you how i ended up in the operating room, only to know, after all was said and done, that i didnt need the c-section and she could have been a natural birth a month later. so i feel that part of the high caesarian rate is because of doctor's stressing out patients for unneeded procedures.

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