Johnny Depp, Amber Heard Trial Day 9: Officer Determined No Crime Occurred

Live Updates
Depp in court
Johnny Depp listens in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, for his defamation trial, on April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

Live Updates Have Ended.

Court Has Adjourned

Court adjourned shortly before 5:30 p.m. EST Tuesday afternoon.

Testimonies today included: Tara Roberts, Depp's estate manager on his island in the Bahamas, clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry and LAPD Officer Melissa Saenz. Roberts and Saenz participated remotely.

Court is scheduled to reconvene Wednesday morning at 10 a.m. EST.

Tara Roberts
Law & Crime/YouTube
Dr. Curry
Clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry, testifies in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Court in Fairfax, Va., Tuesday, April 26, 2022. Brendan Smialowski/Pool Photo via AP
Saenz remote testimony
Officer Melissa Saenz testifies virtually during the trial at the Fairfax County Circuit Court in Fairfax, Va., Tuesday, April 26, 2022. Brendan Smialowski/Pool Photo via AP

Officer Determined No Crime, Domestic Violence Occurred

Depp's counsel began questioning LAPD Officer Melissa Saenz late Tuesday. Saenz said she did not see or hear anything that indicated a crime or act of domestic violence had occurred at the LA penthouse in May of 2016.

"I determined there was no crime," Saenz answered. "There was no probable cause of any sort of crime."

Saenz again reiterated that she did not see any sign of injury on Heard or anything property damage within the penthouse. Heard did not ask Saenz to file a report that night and Saenz said she had no cause to file a report, per LAPD protocol, as she determined that no crime had occurred. If she did determine an act of domestic violence had occurred, protocol requires a report.

Saenz said she was not wearing any bodycams at the scene that night.

Saenz remote testimony
Officer Melissa Saenz testifies virtually in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

Officer Recalls Heard Crying, But Did Not See Injuries

Heard's attorney Elaine Bredehoft continued to question LAPD Officer Melissa Saenz regarding the domestic violence call at the downtown LA penthouse on May 21, 2016.

During testimony Tuesday, Saenz said she does not recall seeing any injuries on Heard or damaged property in the penthouse that night. Either would require a police report.

When Saenz responded on scene, she saw Heard crying and she "looked upset" but wouldn't make eye contact with the officer. Bredehoft showed pictures from that night of Heard, asking Saenz if she appeared injured. Saenz said it looked consistent with someone who had been crying, as her face was "flush." Bredehoft then showed a photo of the carpet with discoloration on one side and asked if it appeared like a wine stain, Saenz said it "could be, yes."

Neither Heard nor anyone else in the penthouse at the time would speak with Saenz. "All parties were uncooperative," she said Tuesday, saying no one provided their name. Bredehoft questioned if that was unusual, Saenz replied, "no it's not, a lot of people don't like us."

Saenz conducted a sweep of the penthouse, and does not recall seeing any property damage, disarray or "anything of the ordinary."

Saenz left her business card that night and advised Heard to contact her at any time if she wanted to "speak to us and cooperate." Saenz was in the penthouse for approximately 15 minutes. She was not aware of the identities of any party involved at the time.

Officer Saenz testimony
Officer Melissa Saenz testifies virtually during the trial at the Fairfax County Circuit Court in Fairfax, Va., Tuesday, April 26, 2022. Brendan Smialowski/Pool Photo via AP

Office Did Not Identify Head as Domestic Violence Victim

In the recorded disposition, Officer Saenz was asked by Amber Heard's counsel about the Los Angeles Police Department protocol for dealing with domestic violence.

This includes collecting witness statements, documenting evidence and surveying any damage or disarray at the location of the incident. Officers are also supposed to ask questions about previous reported or unreported abuse and any history of substance or alcohol abuse to get a background on the relationship.

Saenz said there is a pamphlet officers give to domestic violence victims.

When she responded to the incident involving Heard and Depp on May 21, 2016, Saenz said she did not give Heard the pamphlet.

"I did not identify her as a victim of domestic violence," Saenz said of Heard during the deposition.

According to the incident report from that day, someone called the police to report that their friend "Amber" was assaulted by her boyfriend "Johnny."

Saenz said she met with the victim, checked the location and determined that the husband was not there. She said the victim, Heard, told her that there was an argument but would not give the officers any more details. Saenz said she did not identify a crime but gave Heard her business card if she wanted to cooperate later.

Incident Report
Incident report from a domestic abuse call on May 21, 2016 in Los Angeles, California. This report was presented as evidence during Johnny Depp's defamation trail against Amber Heard. Law & Crime/YouTube

LAPD Officer Begins Testimony

Los Angeles Police Department (LAPD) Officer Melissa Saenz began her witness testimony Tuesday afternoon from a remote location. Heard's defense began with its examination, Depp's counsel will follow.

Saenz is being questioned regarding a domestic disturbance at the Eastern Columbia penthouse in downtown Los Angeles on May 21, 2016. She and Officer Tyler Hadden responded to the incident involving Depp, according to the Hollywood Reporter. Saenz has been a police officer for 12 years.

Her testimony follows clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry's approximate three-hour testimony.

Saenz remote testimony
Actress Amber Heard listens in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

Defense Presses Curry on Reports That Heard Was a Victim on Abuse

Bredehoft continued to ask Dr. Curry about the notes, testimonies and depositions of Heard's doctors and therapists during the cross-examination.

Bredehoft pointed out that Curry's opinions and diagnosis do not align with what Heard's doctors reported.

Previous doctors had reported Heard disclosed to them that she experienced domestic violence at the hands of Depp multiple times.

Curry could recall some of the testimonies but could not remember every specific detail or incident Bredehoft asked her about.

Curry also said she reviewed Depp's medical and psychological records. She said she did not give Depp a diagnosis because it was not relevant to her task. But Curry said that Depp's records did not show if he had a personality disorder.

Women With BPD Often the 'Perpetrator' of Violence

Following a lunch break, the defense began its cross-examination of clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry. Heard's attorney Elaine Bredehoft asked further questions about Curry's opinions on Heard's mental state.

Curry explained that women with Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) tend to have a higher prevalence of being involved with intimate partner violence and being the "perpetrator" of violence. Curry diagnosed Heard with BPD and Histrionic Personality Disorder, in her expert opinion.

Bredehoft also asked if most individuals diagnosed with BPD have suffered childhood trauma. Curry answered some do and some do not have childhood trauma, adding the same can be said of most mental health issues in general.

Bredehoft repeatedly questioned Curry about her interview process as Depp's legal team considered retaining the psychologist for the case. Curry had dinner where "drinks were served" at Depp's home where the actor's legal team interviewed Curry for several hours. Depp was also present.

During questioning, Curry verified that she is not board-certified.

Curry cross-examination
Clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry (L) testifies in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

Heard Does Not Have PTSD, Doctor Testifies

Before the lunch break, Dr. Curry discussed her assessment of whether Heard suffered from Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD).

Heard claims that she suffers from PTSD as a result of alleged abuse she faced from Depp.

Curry explained that PTSD is a mental illness that develops after exposure to certain traumatic events, such as a life-threatening situation, sexual assault or from being a first-responder. She added that PTSD is easy to fake or exaggerate.

Using a Cap 5 test, Curry determined the Heard does not have PTSD. Curry said there was evidence that Heard was "significantly exaggerating" symptoms based on the questions asked in the evaluations.

Curry said that those familiar with PTSD are aware of nuances of the disorder and symptoms and can easily indicate when a person is faking, exaggerating or giving a genuine response during a test.

The test requires a subject to describe their symptoms in detail, including what they look like, where they show up and how often they occur. This allows doctors to determine if someone is giving vague or stereotyped accounts.

Heard initially said she had 19 of the 20 PTSD symptoms. But Curry said upon further study, Heard only had three symptoms. Those included sleep disturbances and frequent nightmares and "startled response," which means Heard stays in a "hyper-startled" mode when surprised, making it difficult for her to calm down.

While this can be consistent with PTSD, Curry said they are also related to childhood trauma of being abused or neglected.

She also determined that the symptoms of that early trauma and her Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) were consistent with "life-long" disorders, not caused by a specific event or harm later in life.

Heard claims her PTSD and anxiety is from her relationship with Depp, but Curry concluded that, based on Heard's scores and previous medical records, she experienced these issues before meeting Depp. Curry also said Heard will tend to be anxious regardless of life events, not due to a specific incident.

Court Takes Lunch Break

The court has taken its one-hour lunch break.

The trial will resume at 1:50 p.m. ET.

Heard's Disorder Can Result in Playing a 'Victim' Role

Dr. Curry provided further explanation of Heard's mental health assessments during testimony Tuesday, explaining the impact of her diagnosed disorders on intimate relationships and personal identity.

In her expert opinion, Curry diagnosed Heard with Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD) and Histrionic Personality Disorder (HPD) which she called "two sides of the same coin."

Instability is a main characteristic of someone with BPD, Curry said. A main goal is avoiding abandonment, and that need can present itself by the individual being "needy" to an "avenger for justice," she explained. Curry called Heard's temper and charm "really characteristic" of BPD. Heard told Dr. Curry that she has cut her arm in the past, which Curry calls a "typical" reaction for someone with BPD.

Those with BPD are described as "dramatic, erratic, emotional," Curry explained, saying both disorders are very similar.

In comparison, drama and shallowness are main characteristics of HPD. The goal of someone with this disorder is to seek and maintain "constant" attention to validate one's worth, Curry said. When the individual does not feel like they are the center of attention, it can cause extreme discomfort and "strange reactions," such as taking on a "princess" role, she explained. The individual may "bolster" a victim role or make up stories as they seek to secure attention.

Individuals with HPD are also "very, very interested in looks," Curry said, and utilize their appearance to obtain attention and respect.

Curry called Heard "very likable" following testing, her assessment was based off the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory-2 (MMPI-2) test. Some with the disorder are more "sophisticated," and can be more "calculated and destructive." Following her assessment, Curry explained that Heard "very sophisticated" and minimized problems in a way that is "very difficult to detect."

Amber Heard
Actress Amber Heard talks to her attorney in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

The impact of BPD in intimate relationships:

The impact of BPD is largely seen in intimate relationships due to constant interaction and desire for one's partner to meet all needs. Relationships start very "intensely," and present a pattern of idealization -- a "perfect" soulmate or friend. The individual with BPD is "very charming" initially, so the relationship initially seems great.

As the relationship progresses, the individual has a difficult time viewing the other as a "whole." Because the individual thinks in extremes, they go from idealizing the relationship to "dumpster," and feel devalued, Curry explained. For example, if something goes "wrong," they may feel that their partner or friend no longer cares about them. The disorder frequently results in many inconsistent relationships of various types over time.

Curry explained an individual with BPD would be more sensitive, feel distress more strongly and for a longer period time of time. Therefore, "blow-ups" can go on "forever and are very cyclic," she explained. Those reactions can wear down the other partner, which can result in the individual with BPD acting violently to prevent the other from leaving them.

This explanation follows testimony Depp provided the day prior, when he explained he would do whatever was necessary to avoid "confrontation" with Heard, especially as he was detoxing from drugs like Oxycodone.

Dr. Curry
Clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry, testifies in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Court in Fairfax, Va., Tuesday, April 26, 2022. Brendan Smialowski/Pool Photo via AP Photo

Doctor Says Heard Can be Angry, Cruel, Judgmental

Dr. Curry gave a more in-depth analysis of her psychological evaluation of Heard.

According to Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory-2 (MMPI-2) test Heard took, Curry outlined a series of traits Heard has. Curry said Heard's scores were consistent with others who had similar scores who showed similar traits.

Curry said Heard had a very sophisticated way of minimize personal problems and externalizing blame. She said Heard had a lot of inter hostility and anger and was very self righteous. This means Heard would judge others "very critically" against her own high moral standards.

People with these scores tend to be passive aggressive, self-indulgent, self-centered, needy for approval and attention and often use manipulative tactics, Curry said.

Curry added these people tend to distance themselves from those close to them but are very charming and "socially sophisticated." They can offer some faults to which others can relate in order to appear fair and balances but are really judgmental and unaware of their problems.

Based on this test, Curry said Heard has a 3-6 code type. This means she is very concerned with her image, can be cruel, is prone to externalizing blame and unable to admit she has responsibility.

Curry said 3-6 types can be especially cruel to subordinates and coworkers and have issues with close relationships.

People with Borderline Personality Disorder (BPD), like Heard, tend to have a fear of abandonment that could lead them to make "desperate attempts" to prevent that from happening, including getting physical, making threats and self-harming, Curry said.

Curry also said people with BPD have a lot of anger and can "read into things" and see them as a slight towards them" that leads them to "exaggerate and explode" and react in a "heightened manner" which can be "exhausting" for their partner. Their partners can often feel like a punching bag and think they are help, but ultimately get overwhelmed, Curry said.

Doctor Diagnoses Heard With Two Personality Disorders

Dr. Curry testified that Amber Heard has two personality disorders.

After being contacted by Johnny Depp's legal team in 2021 to review this case, Curry provided a psychological evaluation of Heard.

Curry reviewed case documents, medical records, mental health treatments, and audio and video records. She also and met with Heard twice directly in December 2021.

In her expert opinion, Curry diagnosed Heard with Borderline Personality Disorder and Histrionic Personality Disorder.

A personality is the traits and characteristics that make up the way one feels, thinks and acts, essentially what "makes us who we are," Curry said.

A personality disorder, Curry said, is a disfunction of those enduring traits. She said these disorders are disturbances in areas visible in all facets of one's life.

Amber Heard
Actress Amber Heard listens in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. - Actor Johnny Depp sued his ex-wife Amber Heard for libel in Fairfax County Circuit Court after she wrote an op-ed piece in The Washington Post in 2018 referring to herself as a "public figure representing domestic abuse." BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/POOL/AFP via Getty Images

Psychologist Dr. Curry Takes Stand

Clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry took the witness stand Tuesday morning following Depp's Bahamas island estate manager. She has worked in the field for about 15 years and about half of her practice focuses on couple's therapy.

Depp's attorney reached out to Curry to provide expert opinion in the case. Her role was to review case materials to determine if there was evidence on "intimate partner violence" between Depp and Heard. Intimate partner violence could include physical or psychological abuse.

Dr. Curry
Clinical and forensic psychologist Dr. Shannon Curry testifies in the courtroom at the Fairfax County Circuit Courthouse in Fairfax, Virginia, April 26, 2022. BRENDAN SMIALOWSKI/AFP via Getty Images

Island Manager Recalls Depp With Nose Injury After Argument

During her testimony, Tara Roberts discussed times when Depp and Heard visited their island house in the Bahamas.

She said Depp came to the island about two or three times a year and said she was there during Depp's detox and Depp and Heard's wedding in 2015.

Roberts said she was given a specific schedule and detailed plan for the rehearsal dinner and wedding ceremony that included "dinner, dancing, drugs, music."

She added that everyone was drinking at the wedding, but at the time, Depp was only drinking Dr. Pepper and sugar-free Red Bull.

During a trip to the island in December 2015, Roberts recalled an argument between Depp and Heard.

After wrapping up dinner, Roberts said Depp came up to her office and was "agitated" and pacing. Heard came up moments later saying she was sorry and asking Depp to return to the main house.

Roberts said Depp was "reluctant" to go back with Heard. When Depp got in his vehicle, Heard stood in front of it so he could drive away.

Heard repeated that she was sorry and asked Depp to come back. She then got in the vehicle with Depp and they drove back to the house.

Robert said her and another staff member, CJ, went to the main house moments later to make sure everything was alright.

When they got to the house, Robert said they heard yelling. She said Heard told Depp he was a "washed up actor" who would die a "lonely, fat old man." Robert then said she heard Depp say "you hit me with a can."

Then Depp came down stairs followed by Heard with a bottle in her hand. She said they were both shocked to see her there. Depp went outside and Heard asked him again to come back inside.

She said Depp was sitting in his vehicle and Heard was kissing and hugging him, saying "I love you," but Depp did not react.

When Depp got out of the vehicle, Roberts said Heard was grabbing his clothes and hair yelling at him to get back to the house.

She said it "wasn't a pleasant situation," recalling Heard was angry while Depp had no reaction.

"He stood there with his arms by his side," she said. "He didn't do anything."

Roberts said she thought it "was best to remove Depp" from that situation, so she told CJ to take Heard back to the house while she walked Depp down to a cafe that she said was about 30 seconds away.

At the cafe, Roberts said Depp had a mark on the bridge of his nose. She got a bag of ice for him to put on it to reduce swelling and left Depp to sleep on the couch in the cafe.

The next morning, Robert said she didn't notice any injuries on Heard. She said the couple left in the afternoon after their guests left.

When cleaning up the house, Robert said she saw a bottle of mineral spirits leaked onto the deck and there was art supplies, including paint brushes and paint, in the bushes.

Depp's Bahamas Island Manager Takes Stand

Court resumed Tuesday morning with new witness testimony after Johnny Depp was questioned all Monday.

Tara Roberts, Depp's estate manager on his island in the Bahamas, took the witness stand remotely Tuesday. Roberts managed the island for about 15 years. She is seen via video link in the courtroom, describing interactions between Depp and Amber Heard on the island.

New Witnesses Set to Testify

Depp's testimony has drawn to an end and new witnesses will be called on this week.

Ahead of the trial, Depp and Heard both published a list of witnesses their teams may wish to call upon with a number of high profile celebrities expected to take to the stand

Celebrity witnesses such as Elon Musk, James Franco and Paul Bettany are expected to give testimony to the court.

Billionaire entrepreneur Musk, who was romantically linked to Heard, is one of the witnesses, along with actors Franco, Bettany and Ellen Barkin.

Bettany, star of WandaVision and a friend of Depp's, is expected to testify about text messages he exchanged with Depp about Heard.

Franco, meanwhile, is also expected to be asked about his former relationship with the actress.

James Franco
James Franco and Amber Heard attend the premiere of "The Adderall Diaries" at the 2015 Tribeca Film Festival at BMCC Tribeca PAC on April 16, 2015 in New York City. Franco is expected to testify for Heard in court. Taylor Hill/Getty/FilmMagic

Johnny Depp Ends 4 Days of Testimony: 'Yes, I Am' a Victim of Domestic Violence

Depp testified for the fourth day in the $50 million defamation trial on Monday (April 25) with the actor telling the courtroom he is "a victim of domestic violence."

The Pirates of the Caribbean actor told the court he was "a victim of domestic violence" as he concluded his evidence on day eight of the case amid recordings of the former couple's heated arguments.

An audio recording of Heard and Depp speaking about the end of their relationship in 2016 was played, in which the Aquaman star can be heard saying to her then-husband: "Tell the world, Johnny, tell them I Johnny Depp, a man, am a victim too of domestic violence".

Depp's lawyer Camille Vasquez asked him what he said in response to the assertation he was a victim of domestic abuse, and he answered: "Yes, I am."